QF LHR CC Base To Close...Rumour

[blackguard]

With the new CC EBA being approved it is now cheaper to employ Australians in Australia.The rumour doing the rounds suggests that an evaluation of the LHR base is underway.
There are a couple of LHR Base posters who will no doubt have something to say.
This is a rumour and this is a rumour network website.
The Howard government is gone.
The EBA was voted up by an overwhelming majority.
AO was closed(sadly)even though employees were told how fantastic things were.
Never say never.With QF anything is possible.

[packrat]

The establishment of the LHR base was as much about threat as it was about cost cutting.
The EBA has been voted up so the threat is no longer valid.
The exchange rate $ to pounds is weighted in Australias favour.The cost factor is also starting to lose validity.
The A380 will eventually service LHR and be crewed by QCCA making it even cheaper to have Oz based crew operate to London.
The LHR base`s days may be indeed be numbered.

[SkyScanner]

Even with the new EBA, LHR base cabin crew are still cheaper to operate. Furthermore, a reason for the starting the basing was to reduce the cost of the hotel and accommodation in London plus additional slip times in each port.

Sounds like wishful thinking to me...

[RedTBar]

SkyScanner,
Actually accom and allowances were only part of the deal.Not paying the required Australian Super contributions as well was a big part as well as more hours.

But,getting crew in OZ to work about 30% more for 30% less is a huge saving and Dixon himself said this would save around $41 million.

How much did the lhr base save last year?

It was around $20 million ? You work it out.

Maybe they will ask you guys to have a b scale.

[SkyScanner]

$41 mil on the london route alone or across the entire network?

[RedTBar]

$41 mil on the london route alone or across the entire network?

well,I imagine it is the current and anticipated work done by Australian crew.

So you can imagine how much extra they would save if they included the flying done by the lhr crews with the new eba.

[Keg]

Additional three 744 worth of crew in LHR is 45/day. They all stay two days at a time so there is an additional 90 crew in the hotel per day.

Accommodation. Last I heard, the crew rate was circa 84 quid at the millenium. Not sure what it is at the Forum so let's work on about 70. That is a cost of 6300 quid a day.....2,299,500 pound per annum.

Allowances. I'm not full bottle on the LHR rate but let's call it about 80 a day. That's another 7200 a day which is 2,628,000 per annum.

Five million pound per annum saved by having crew based in London. At current exchange rates that's still $10.7Million AUD. I don't think the savings made by cheap cabin crew in Australia will be able to offset that. :(

[raft rower]

If the LHR base was going to be closed, why would Qantas be establishing a CC training centre to eliminate the use of the BA facilities, and also have an A380 door trainer set up...just my humble opinion though. :)

[speedbirdhouse]

Given how things work at QF I'd suggest that that would almost prove the base was closing.........

[blackguard]

What did it cost to set the base up?
Managerial staff and wages:Administrative staff and wages;Rent/purchase of the building they work in?Office furniture,paperware,computers,council rates,insurance,maintenance of the building;Cost of training/interviewing.Cost of accommodation and allowances in BKK,SIN,HKG are highr due longer slips required when compared to Sydney Based Crew.What is sick leave like in LHR?Attrition rate and associated costs.
Lets be conservative.Lets say it costs 6 million pound a year to maintain the base.That reduces the savings to about four million.
Initial cost saving projections were 20 million pounds
They have missed their target by a long shot

[lowerlobe]

.....The smile on Darths face when he talked about the benefits of the new EBA.

As someone else said 30% more hours for 30% less pay....plus as the reduction of slip times in BKK,SIN and HKG.

The problem with this company has always been that the left hand does not know what the right hand is/has been doing.

Anything is possible and the one thing we know is there is no sentimentality as far as they are concerned.After Darth has left the new boy will want to make his mark and that could mean anything from closing LHR to opening another base.

[RedTBar]

keg,think about those 45 crew a day on the b scale pay and at more hours than the lhr base do.
then add to that the shorter slips in sin etc. because the crew from oz would have less like the fra trips north and south bound.not only that but the cost of running the base with their attrition rate ,management and training because we all know how expensive anything is in the uk.

Wait for the company to try and save more bucks by crew slipping in hotels near heathrow and you have some valid reasons to dump the base.if dixon asked the union if they would accept the slip near the airport in return for getting lhr back and I think they would say yes in the blink of an eye.
At the moment the base is dixons baby but we all know how much he likes to save a dollar or three.
this eba was just the start especially if he buys a stack of the 380's and the b scale crew for that are dedicated on type.
the interesting part is that dixon insisted on a dedicated crew to fly the 380 but he is not with the lhr based crew.to me that suggests that something is up with the base.

[stubby jumbo]

If we use the same premise as Management used with the PER base, ie:

"No, I can gaurantee categorically that the long haul base will not close.......'how could it ?" ( Mark Hassell Sep '04):rolleyes:

The LHR base is GONE-SKEES:oh:

[peanut pusher]

"It's the vibe" in LHR base.

Something is brewing but don't know what!!!:rolleyes:

Got a feeling a new stratagy is being looked at.

[lowerlobe]

Knowing this company and how they operate they are just as likely to close the LHR base and open a new base in Manchester......

[blackguard]

Peanut Pusher you are about to be taught a lesson you probably wont like.
Never ever trust QF management...they have 4 faces and three hearts.
What is gospel today is tomorrows re evaluation

[speedbirdhouse]

Peanut Pusher,

coming from you ?????

The LHR base's number one apologist. :ok:

[blackguard]

From the "vibe"the off shore bases have not lived up to expectations.The behaviour and customer service being offered by the AKL is causing concern.Particularly with a resurgent Air NZ.The BKK base has proved to be ineffcient with the number of paxing sectors required to build rosters.
The "spin"regarding the LHR base has never quite held water.
With this new EBA all the bases must surely be under scrutiny in regard to their viability.
It is very difficult to maintain control of a remote workforce.Hard enough if the workforce is based at home but extremely difficult if it is based off shore.
Off shore bases and Australian Airlines and the previous domestic EBA have been part of a strategy or threat to bring the LHCC community to heel.To a large degree it has worked.There have been casualities as the domestics are finding out.There are more casualities to follow.

[surfside6]

Its a matter of increasing crew numbers under the EBA.
Once the crew community has been right sized there are going to be some interesting developments.
Once the compensation for the late delviery of the 787s has been settled with Boeing there may be another VR offered.
The next 12 months are going to be full of surprises....some of them unforeseen.

[bonez]

So how will the LON CC get on when/if the rumoured A380 LHR-LAX starts??

Interesting times!!

Interesting also that the LON CC get more than their share of favourable comments from the pax!

[RedTBar]

Interesting also that the LON CC get more than their share of favourable comments from the pax!
thats what they said about the per base as well.

With the (again) rumour about lhr to lax trips there is nothing to say that a crew who have slipped in lax cannot do a lax/lhr sector and then home via sin/bkk or hkg?
the same can be true about crew operating to lhr from oz and then to lax and back to syd as the last sector.the company does not have to have crew based in lhr to be able to do those flights.
as I said before,why is dixon insisting on a dedicated oz based crew for the 380 but not in lhr?
I think he will have a dedicated crew based in oz to do all 380 flying.

[mrpaxing]

LON do get their favourable share of comments from pax. in y/c the boys/girls are bouncing around like tele tubbies, hardly any idea whats going on. gets a bit better in j/c,p/c bouncing around, happy, but NO F**k**g idea whats going on. time after time i get the feedback from punters & csm's.. do i care? not really as the mugs in sydney got told over and over again by numerous csm's. their reply "but the surveys dont indicate that". :*

[peanut pusher]

It goes both ways.

I know pax would say many things against both UK and Aus bases.

I also get the story that Aus crew are "old, tired, too many older males and very unfriendly" on a weekly basis.

Never realised age and looks played such a big part of customer preception of a airline.

But hear it alot as I'm getting on these days myself.

It makes me think that QF want to go for the "young spunky" gang and turn them over ever 5 years with QCCA.

One thing I know pax will say anything in a f/flyer survey and when onboard ask for the complete oposite.

J class amenity packs are a rusult of a "focus group" locked in a room saying "we don't use many of these things anyway" and "it's a huge waste".

One thing I'll say about LHR crew is they are easy to work with and you don't have the clashes over seniority, someone getting 5 minutes more during a break, constant complaints about every little detail of QF life, will always release the crew rest seats to any base crew trying to travel and they don't have a dobbing over petty little things culture.

If Aus crew don't remember to order something or no hand over or over / under order they just take it in their stride and don't write a report they just fix it if they can and move on to the job.

FYI
Reminds me of a nasty letter a UK crew member received in the OCS from a SYD crew member telling them in no uncertain terms how poor the ordering was of 7 galley roles in a hand over order and they must of been stupid to order 7 roles.

Yes this was a private letter not through official channels with info taken from the yellow order slip of name and staff no#.

It took 1 minute to realize Mr BKK catering supplier had misunderstood a 1 for a 7 and it was a mistake from the catering guys.

This crew member had been Aus crew since 2000 and was working in LHR and had completed many hand over orders before.

Over 70 airlines recruit in the UK so QF is not the top dog of flying like back home so they will always struggle to keep the top crew as BA know they are of the standard they also require.

I feel Uk base will need to attract more experianced AUS crew to go with the UK youth to stay viable.

[SkyScanner]

So how will the LON CC get on when/if the rumoured A380 LHR-LAX starts??


WADR Qf has buckleys chance of flying this route, the only airline that does is Air NZ.

Red Tbar last time I checked LHR base were doing 240 hr divisors and why on earth would you agree to slip at Heathrow?

Re 380 syd base, the first 6 A/C are doing Syd/ Mel to Lax. Don't need LHR crew to operate these sectors.

[veronica]

My God.

SYD LHCC think they are Gods gift to flight attending. Not only do you bag the domestics, but LHR/BKK/AKL bases as well. No one else can do the job except you guys it seems. You guys really don't need much to talk yourselves up and everybody else down!

Well maybe the QCCA is a good deal on second thoughts. It may just drop the average age of the LH SYD base down below about 60!! :sad:

Bring it on I say!

[blackguard]

68% of LH CC are female
The average age is around 36
The positive pax comments regarding crew are no better in LHR than they are anywhere else.
Older crew are not lazy.
Most crew who fell into category have taken VR.
There is very little whinging and bitching going on except in this forum
The crew that do fly to LHR(one/Day)want to do them and are enthusiastic about doing them.
Many are expat poms who still have family in the UK.
Overall satisfaction monitors are up across the network though Y/C is lagging a little.
Peanut Pusher knows alittle more than he is letting on

[surfside6]

Another Myth
The crew on the 31/32 mostly have seniority in the three and four thousand range...meaning they have seniority of less than twelve years.The crews are also a mix of male and female.
All this nonsense about older male crew on LHR trips is exactly that ...rubbish.
Pull up the crew lists on CIS and you will see that I'm right

[HZ123]

It so sounds just like BA and I thought QF were a slick outfit?

[peanut pusher]

I was refering to pax comments on QF1 SYD/BKK, QF9 & QF29 etc then handing over to me.

But it's not my opion and the pax comments about age is about QF L/H in general, just feedback from pax who say good and bad about both sides.

As I'm middle aged and a SYD L/H crew member it reflects me.

This is not a personal dig just an observation and recollection of the "off the cuff" pax comments.

I have worked in both L/H bases and have a better position to comment than others who have never worked out of LHR.

Over the last year our average age has gone from 26 to 33 and we currently have 71% female to male ratio as apposed to 91% in year 1.

[RedTBar]

Peanut Pusher,
we currently have 71% female to male ratio as apposed to 91% in year 1.

Is that because a lot have left after marrying or had to marry tech crew:E:E

[Southside747]

If it does happen it will be a while yet, until at least the 380 is operating a fair portion of the LHR flying. It is time for crew to look not at the rumours which sound good to them, but the facts that quite scare me at the moment.

For instance, the first 7 380's are going to be doing dedicated US flying. For us that means a lot less we get (unless we go to the 380 on its 'B' scale). Less long range and short trips. Some of the 400's will begin to retire in 2011 (some of the 400's are even older than some 767's flying around believe it or not).

I hope it (380) takes a lot of LHR flying and they close the base, but it won't happen much before the end of our EBA I suspect. And if they do close it, I suspect the 25% foreign crew numbers will be in place somewhere. Hopefully they don't increase the AKL base and give them even more of the 744 long range flying.

[mrpaxing]

been saying all along the EBA discussions. get your costo shopping in lax as long as you can because unless you are in a zimmerframe you wont see lax in 3 years.:(

[lowerlobe]

mrpaxing.....

I'm not sure how strong the rumour is but I've heard that Costco is looking at opening in Australia....

[mrpaxing]

is true. i will apply for a job:ok:

[lowerlobe]

I could never understand the crew who straight after a direct LA meet downstairs in the foyer and go out to Costco immediately.

Then you have to carry the stuff back to the hotel and then through security and home.....pain in the neck.

If they open up in Aus it will save a load of pain but then what will the crew do in LA?

[blackguard]

Costco has been looking at Australia for awhile.There was a piece in the Financial Review about six months.
There are two Costcos in HNL and one in SFO.The A380 will never go to either of those ports.
So settle down folks all is not lost.There are only 20 on order.These will have three destinations...LHR LAX and eventually JNB.
The 744s will still fly to LAX for at least another five years.
It has been said before :the A380 is designed for high volume routes

[mrpaxing]

i keep trying to go to exotic places like HNL/SFO but my humble senority does not get me there. lax sometimes but not on a regular basis. so, here you see my dilemma. the more A380,s less lax- more regional flying looks like it for me. waiting with my cash for costco to open locally:sad:

[blackguard]

As more of our flying is returned crew will change their destinations and in so doing open up more choice for people of your seniority

[roamingwolf]

I dunno about that blackguard because the crew who are going to lose doing la's because of the airtrucks dedicated crews will be taking all the spots on the 400's that are left doing the states trips.

Is someone who loves doing la's going to do regionals just because we are getting them back?I reckon some will have a novelty trip or 2 but most will keep doing whats left of the 400 trips.So unless you are going to sign your next 2 years away to the flying suburb and then do nothing but la's I reckon the pickings will be slim.

Bring on the next VR to help with seniority.

[blackguard]

Partime is going to be taken up by a large number of very senior crew.
Instead of going every week they will work to LAX every second week.
Thus freeing up a lot of positions.
Also Qantas would like to increase its frequencies and destinations in the states. Namely Chicago and Dallas.
There is plenty of growth in the pipeline and more opportuniies to Work to LAX.
Be patient your turn is coming.
I had to wait 20 years for my shot at reasonable rosters

[Southside747]

Most crew who go to LA do it for the extra money. Lets see, regional trips, less longrange, bugger all allowances due to the short slips, ...., yes I can see an exodus away from LA for these trips.

The simple fact is there will be much less (about 70%) US flying available to current crew in 18 months time. Time for some who just want to believe what suits them to pull their heads out of the sand and look at the real picture.

With the US going into recession, new competitors opening up, and the stated government intention of open skies on the route (therefore allowing SQ and EK to fly the Pacific) by 2010, the chances of QF going to a zillion other US destinations is looking less and less likely.

Looks like most of us will be doing regional flying in 2 years time. No extra flying pay, and few allowances. The future looks bright now.

[roamingwolf]

blackguard I hope your right but my gut tells me different.The ones that will go part time will be the mothers club.and as southside says the ones that go to la do it for the bucks.

remember the joke about a crew asking a local cop how long it takes to walk from the misadventure to the train station.the cop says he doesn't know because no ones ever made it.

crew don't go to la for the great hotel or area we stay in or maybe not since Redondo or pasadena at the most.
the more I think about it southside is right the airbus will take a big slice of the la's and the senior crew who are left on the 400's are not about to do regionals because of the bucks and no decent crew rest.

[surfside6]

Every time there is change at work we have the "doom and Gloom" brigade telling everyone the sky is about to fall.
If you go to LAX for the bucks try going to JNB for the bucks.The difference between a 4 day LAX and a four day JNB is $135.
JNB has always been good for longrange and overtime.The shopping isnt bad either...kids clothes,wine,coffee and mobile phones are all cheap.
Oh and dont forget the Kreepy Krawleys.
But you guys will turn your nose up at JoBurg.

[prunezeuss]

A "zillion"US destinations.
It was two:Chicago anf Dallas.
Like the guy said "you want money and cant get to LAX?
Go to JNB.
I did it for years and made a motza.
It also gave me control over days off that I needed ...including Christmas

[Bad Hat Harry]

You can now salary sacrifice your compulsory employee contributions.Thats a saving of 15%.You now also have choice of fund.
Some of you people wouldnt know a good thing if it fell on you.
After waiting for years I have been promoted...an increase in wages,an increase in super contributions plus the 3%.
Over the life of the EBA I am nearly $80K better off.
There are a lot of people suffering financially out there.
This EBA has made sure I am not one of them
Who care about LAX?
It will be years before I see it again and I dont care

[roamingwolf]

Over the life of the EBA I am nearly $80K better off.

There are a lot of people suffering financially out there.

This EBA has made sure I am not one of them

Who care about LAX?

It will be years before I see it again and I dont care

mate thats an intersting post from someone who says their location is sombrero ca.

boys and girls I highlighted the part which shows our biggest problem.thats we don't stick together and the i'm alright fred mentality is everywhere.

surfer just because crew say something that you don't agree with they are not doom and gloom.
Not everyone wants to go to joberg and not everyone wants to go to lhr and this has started more blues than a bus load of footy supporters but let's not go down that path again because all of us have different ideas on what is good.lets see how this pans out and maybe it won't be too bad.theres always good and bad about everything and this eba will not be different.

[Bad Hat Harry]

Bad Hat Harry..Sombrero...Mexican for hat....get it?
It doesnt matter where I come from ...my observations and statements are still valid...or are you a "hattist"?
You are right there are good and bad in every EBA.
I choose to focus on the positives and what works for me and my family.
I adapt as I have always done.
A self characterized pragmatist.
There are a lot of people who read these forums who would like to be flight attendants or are about to be.
I just try to provide a positive balance to the negativity.
My goal: is to balance my work with my time at home with the kids.
My income continues to grow faster than inflation and I am spending more time at home with my family.
I have never factored in allowances.If I have any left over well then its a little cream.
We have five years of peace and some of the dysfunctional individuals who masquerade as managers have either pulled their heads in or have been moved.eg "the Terminator"is history.
A whole lot of new crew.A whole lot of new enthusiasm.More destinations in the pipeline..Santiago for example.
There are only 20 A380s coming.Spread them over three destinations.
LAX will still be available.
Its the dinosaurs graveyard as far as I am concerned.Sit around the pool,get pissed,smoke,complain and talk about the G.O.Ds.
BTW I hope and pray that all the offshore bases close..not only LHR.
LHR would be a good place to start.I wouldnt have to put up with pax complaing about the LHR crew when I take over an aircraft that has originated there.
Peanut Pusher.... over to you

[roamingwolf]

bad hat harry,
what is a hattist?

Mate i can see what your saying and i want to be better off as well.i just a little hot under the collar when someone says you don't need to go to la so lump it pal.
how many pool cleaners and mobile phones does someone need.i don't want a mobile phone because it is one more way for the company to ring. and I don't have a pool so that fixes that reason to do jobergs.
to be honest I like fra's but the last slip is a killer and the regionals don't do much so i do a few of la's and fra's.
the point I don't get is that if there is not a dedicated crew for the flying renault on the lhr base why do we need one in aus.
if we could have a transfer system and spend say a year on it the company would probably have enough experienced crew to fly it with the B scale newbys.

[blackguard]

The LHR base is a dedicated A380 crew
Thats all they will fly on eventually.
Why do we have Bases and QCCA?
Because they are cheaper than we are..pure and simple.
Its all about cost...supposedly

[blackguard]

There will obviously be a period of overlap but eventually the A380 will be the only aircraft flying to LHR .
Thats why Qantas bought it.
The A380 is a high volume of traffic aircraft.
Three destinations..LAX LHR JNB.
It will take a few years but thats what I presume will happen.
In 7 0r 8 years time LHR and JNB will be off the network for full time Australian based crew.
It will be serviced by QCCA and (if it still exists) the LHR base.
Once Shanghai gets going as hub to Europe that may change

[roamingwolf]

The LHR base is a dedicated A380 crew

hang on blackguard what are those aircraft that the lhr base fly with boeing written on them.
if they fly 400's then they are not dedicated on the renault are they?
you can't have it both ways because thats what the company tries on us.:ugh:
plus i didn't ask about costs.i asked why the company insists that we have a dedicated crew but not the lhr base.
if the lhr base can fly both why can't we.
the company still has the cheaper newby's for other aircraft.

[blackguard]

You didnt ask about costs but costs are pretty much the basis for all decisions made by QF management.
They didnt buy them(A380s) because they liked the shape.
Qantas used to buy the best now it buys the cheapest.
In ten years time there will be very few if any A scale crew left.
That has always been the long term goal.
Thats why we are called "the Last Of The Mohicans"

[Shazz-zaam]

I stand to correct you, "The last of the" :(

[twiggs]

In 7 0r 8 years time LHR and JNB will be off the network for full time Sydney based crew.

So Melbourne and Brisbane will be doing those trips then or have you forgotten that Sydney is not the only Australian base these days?

[blackguard]

My Apologies..off the network for Australian based A scale Crew

[roamingwolf]

blackguard,mate i know what your saying and we all know how tight the company is but i reckon we're being done over once again.
whatever way you look at it the company still has picked the lotto numbers and all new crew are cheaper than a sale at less than best.
if we are going the way of the dinosaurs and they have got their pound of flesh with all new crew cheap why are we the only ones to have to cop a dedicated crew?

the company still has all new crew on the B scale so does it matter if they fly the a-380,747-400,767,a-300,787,cessna 400 or whatever else they buy.

you could still have a mixed crew on the new ugly sister with the higher hours and the new 'hands free-guess what my roster will be' roster ,the company still saves a bucket load but it gives us a chance to fly to la or lhr or even shock horror jnb or wherever the company will send it.that way you could do a mix of flying and the only difference is that we share the flying just like the lhr base.
At the moment the company is telling us if you want to fly the new renault you have to sign on for 2 years and work the same hours and the new magic fingers roster system.If we mix the flying the company still pays the same money for the a-380 cabin crew wages so nothing changes except everyone is happy.

If you don't want to fly the renault and you only want to do regionals or whatever thats what you do but if you want to fly to lhr or la you can fly on the a 380.

like someone else said i don't know about the last of the mohicans because this is more like custers last stand but we're not the indians cause they won.we're the ones standing around about the be creamed.

[blackguard]

Thats why the EBA is for 5 years.It will take 5 years for the croissant to reach critical mass and then its....bye bye time for A scalers.
Five years will see a lot of people out.
Peg or Guardian may have a different take on this

[surfside6]

We are talking about three destinations and 20 aircraft.
The growth vehicle for QF longhaul is the 787....115 of them.
Three Destinations and 20 aircraft.There is still SFO on the west coast and new destinations to follow.(Santiago for example)
The three destinations with the greatest traffic flow will also need to attract a lot of punters at a reasonable price...hence 'B'scale..to lower costs.
In the interim there will be cross crewing..some B scalers will operate on other aircraft.They are allocated a roster AFTER the A scalers have had their rosters generated.
There is still the opportunity to earn good bucks,be professional and have fun.
The LHR base will,in the interim operate two aircraft types..the 744s and the A380.As more A380s arrive and the 744s are redeployed the LHR base will eventually become a one type base..the A380..
There will eventually be more destinations in Europe...some mainline and some Jet*(if it still exists)
Expansion,growth,money and fun will still be in the mix.
It will eventually become a well paid part time job for many.Which is the way it was 25 years ago.
Its a win win situation

[roamingwolf]

surfer,
i dunno about a reality check cause i reckon this is more like a what if check.
what if the 787 is a lemon
what if the company gets a deal with honest pierre the airbus sales guy and buys another 30 or more?
to break even airbus has to sell more than double what they have now just to break even.
what if the renault becomes the new 400 and is doing the fra,sfo and all the rest and we are not on them?
this is all crystal ball stuff but you and the rest of us are guessing
It will eventually become a well paid part time job for many.Which is the way it was 25 years ago.
how do you work that one out?
75% standown rounded up
more destinations than you could poke a stick at
no neil bloody perrywinkle food
the list goes on and if you think they're gonna come back I think your kidding yourself.

[surfside6]

Look,there are a lot of people who get 30 days off a BP now.
Partime means even more time off and you can still clear $40K.
Worry about what you have control over and disregard the rest.
You'll sleep better.
Its been said...the A380 is a high volume of traffic aircraft..you wouldnt send it to MNL 2/3 empty.You send it to destinations where you can fill it.This is why you have aircraft of different size and capacity for thin routes,thick routes and everything in between.
The Qantas network does not have enough high volume routes to buy or fill more than 20 A380s.QF is an end of line carrier with a relatively small domestic population.It will grow but never to the extent of Cathay or China Air or a number of other Asian Carriers.Thats the reason QF bought into Vietnam Air.It has enormous growth potential because of where Vietnam is geographically and economically.
Unless Qantas merges with another carrier it will be a regional carrier that has a couple of european destinations and the states.The Jet* Asia business model is doomed to fail.LCC carriers cannot do longhaul and succeed.The infrastructure cost and the lack of high yield customers mean that only legacy carriers will succeed in longhaul.Virgin Blue started off as a LCC but has repositioned itself to attract high yield travellers.Tiger and JetStar will go head to head while Virgin and Qantas mainline compete.Branson has spent years building the Virgin international network and its all about to dovetail nicely.
The next few years in aviation in Australasia will be interesting.There will be successes and failures...Jet* Asia will probably be one.Qantas mainline cant prop them up forever.
My prediction...once Dixon goes...Jet*Asia goes.The LHR base will eventually become unviable..if its not already with this new EBA

[RedTBar]

The GODs are Now
I know you union boys have to sell your product but the only ones who think the GOD's are now are those who have just started flying or are trying to push a lemon as a solid runabout only driven by an old lady on Sunday's.

By the way surfside I'll let you guys do the MNL's if you think they are the way to go.Personally,I prefer to do Long Haul trips as is our divisions name but if you like regionals you've got them.

Also there won't be too many b scale crew getting 30 days off a roster and you want us to believe that the take home pay for a part time flyer is 40K.Do you take a supply of rohy's and not eat in slip ports:yuk:

[surfside6]

1.Who said anything about MNL except as an example of a thin route
2.My wife is part time ..she earns $40K.
3.I am not in the association except as a financial member .
4.I earn more money now than I ever did when I started Flying.Where I earnt most of my income was a a cruise director on the boats cruising around the harbour
5.At present there are 4 day regional trips worth 35 hours.Do 5 of those and 2 perth day trips and you get 34 days standown...without going more than 2 hours out of homebase time zone.This also includes 8 hours of overtime.
6.I was talking about A scale standown.
Now ignore button..red t bar...click!

[Shazz-zaam]

I thought the topic was about the London Base closing down:hmm:

[surfside6]

The thread has run its course and run out of steam so you get drift.
My apologies for adding to the drift but ther aint much left to say.
Its all conjecture and supposition.
What do you think shazz zaam?

[RedTBar]

Shazz-zaam,
The discussion here is all about the future of flying and very much includes the viability of the base in LHR.
You have to remember that many post here to push a point of view and that means it becomes political.Surfside does not hold much value in the new 380 and thinks the 787 is the way to go.I'm not so sure and although he is taking the ostrich way out and ignoring my point of view he is right and that this is all about conjecture at least at the moment.
I prefer or have a soft spot for Boeing aircraft so I hope in way that surfside is right and the 787 is a huge win for Boeing but there is the possibility that the 380 will work and if thats the case you will have to work on it to get to LHR,LAX or wherever it will fly.I agree with wolfman that it would have been better if there was cross crewing on the 380 like there will be on the LHR base
Surfside might not want to do that sort of flying and thats OK for him but a lot of us do want to fly to LAX and LHR.So if it turns out that the only way to do that is on the 380 then thats what we want.

Here is where the relevance of this debate concerns the LHR base because if the 380 is a winner and the crew are cheaper the company will almost certainly look at closing it and any other base if it is cheaper to use the B scale crew.The company continually looks at any way they can to say anything and if that means closing a base they will drop it faster than you can say 'I'll have another beer thanks'

All you have to do is look at who is on the board of QCCA and how much money they will make recruiting crew for QF just as MAM does with S/H.The added bonus is that it is always easier to manage employees when you have them in the one spot more or less instead of all over the globe.

[AlphaLord]

Everything at Qantas is under continual evaluation.This week the LHR base works.Next week,after evaluation,it doesnt.
Qantas' businesses all cover their cost of capital for the first time.
This allows a little breathing space.Previous decisions may have been erroneous in their execution.They can now be reviewed more effectively.
There may be some surprises in the coming months.
Dixon's departure will bring fresh eyes to the business.Leigh Clifford and the new CEO will seek to stamp their authority on Qantas...ushering in more change.
Its always an interesting ride...just remember to keep your seatbelt firmly fastened

[indamiddle]

anybody know when the short angry one retires?
i need a date for a party.

[RedTBar]

Can you see the behind the scenes posturing until the publican moves back to the bottle shop?

[Tidbinbilla]

This thread has drifted so far off course it's unbelievable :}