Torn between services

[abr69]

Dear all,

I am after some advice. As a serving Aeromed I have operated in the IRT role in most theatres, from the greener to the sandy. I have operated with most UK rotary wing assets and I have made the decision to apply for NCO Aircrew. The easiest route would be for me to remain in the RAF and attempt to become RAF NCO aircrew, however after numerous duties with both the RN and RAF I am torn. There is both positive and negative sides to each service. Please could the better informed give me their views, advice etc, as I am very keen to make the transition to full time Aircrew as soon as possible.

[seafuryfan]

abr69,

The best thing to do is to ask the operators on type, face to face. Did you ask them while on the job?

If not, why don't you pay a visit to a RN and RAF sqn and talk to the individuals. it won't take up much of your time and in my experience the sqns are always willing to show you around and have a crewroom chat.

I also suggest you use the search facility to go through past threads. There's a wealth of information on here - use it.

Good luck.

[Ivan Rogov]

Good advice to visit and see for yourself, it also looks good at the interviews if you decide to continue. It will be one of the few times to get honest answers to some deeper questions like are many people leaving and why, how long do you spend away from home, general level of risk involved (I was amazed how many SAR guys had crashed when I visited Flights), etc. Speak to the old sweats but also those fresh out of training, ask how long it took in total, did they find it difficult, was it what they expected, did they get what they wanted, etc.

Consider the length, stress and intensity of training as it can take its toll on relationships. We were told this at the start of training and it was true for, most unmarried relationships failed and unfortunately some marriages. That said, don't discount an entire career based on your current girl/boyfriend.

Are you aware that joining as RAF NCA (Non commissioned Aircrew, and the current official name for what was NCO Aircrew or Airmen Aircrew) you will be a WSOp, this encompasses all the old NCA trades (Loadmaster, Engineer, Air Electronic Operator (AEOp) and Linguist). You do training as a generic WSOp before being streamed later on at Cranwell and may not get what you hoped for, AFAIK most people get what they hoped for but manning requirements might dictate where you are sent.
http://www.raf.mod.uk/careers/jobs/searchjobs.cfm?searchType4=rank&rank=NC+Aircrew&subbut4=Go
A good time to join if you want WSOp crewman I guess, again why are they urgently required are more leaving than the other trades? Probably not as the extra 6 Chinooks and 6 Merlin come into service. Beware though you could end up with a job similar to Airline Cabin Crew or
Ship’s Bursar :} except without the exotic destinations, modern aircraft, attractive hostie mates/passengers, etc. :sad:
http://www.raf.mod.uk/careers/jobs/weaponsystemsoperator.cfm
So find out the chances of getting sent to a trade/role you might not want.

AFAIK you can only join the RN as Commissioned Aircrew (Pilot or Observer) they only recruit Aircrewmen from within the Service
http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/nav.2400

If you are RAF and remuster you will be offered 22yrs service and could possibly serve until 55 if that floats your boat, or should that be flys your kite? Sorry I don't know the RN terms of service.

It's also worth considering what else the respective Sqn's and Services do when not deployed on Ops. For example, if you are a bit of an eco warrior then the RN is for you. protecting fish :E
http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/nav.6028

as I am very keen to make the transition to full time Aircrew as soon as possible.
Apply through the RAF Careers Office now, if you decide and are able to go RN then you can always cancel your RAF application. You have no reason not too, some people wait thinking that their next report or promotion will make them more successful, they won't. If you have the required qualifications you can do any other stuff ie: visits, getting fit. while the application is being processed, as it may take some time! :ok:

[abr69]

Thank you to you all, their is a mass of advice and information so far, a lot of it RAF based. The only reason I have a quandry is that during my IRT time I really enjoyed working with the RN, as I was really made to feel part of the crew and it was much more enjoyable experience. I am sad to say this was not always the case when operating with my own brethren. However on the upside you become a SGT much sooner in the RAF.

[abr69]

I have obviosly spoken to crewman about this matter whilst in theatre and there is obviously a bit of service rivalry, I have heard that there are people who have been an crewman in each service and I was hoping to tap into their experience and what made them make the move.

[seafuryfan]

abr69,

I don't know how long you were working with your RAF/RN crews. On a sqn, the crews change all the time. The programme will dictate how often you fly with individuals, sometimes people have been on the same unit as you have not flown with you for most of a tour. So if you were paired up with certain individuals, or just one particular sqn/type, you might not have the full picture.

The atmosphere on a sqn is often dependent on the boss. He sets the tone, and this permeates down to the rest of the sqn. Op tempo is another a factor, so don't be surprised if you go to a sqn that has a dip morale due to continuous ops, and mates killed/injured.

What I'm trying to say is, your experience might not reflect the big picture of sqn life. Mates always stick together, and the younger crewmen on the sqns I served on have looked after each other. Don't forget as well that many get a commission after some time as a crewman.

[PTC REMF]

I have heard that there are people who have been an crewman in each service and I was hoping to tap into their experience and what made them make the move.

There are a considerable number of ex RN crewmen on the RAF Chinook fleet, the extension of service to age 55 was one of the more obvious reasons to transfer (but I think the RN is now offering extensions ). I'm unaware of any ex RAF crewmen that transferred to the Royal Navy, (but that doesn't mean there isn't).
Just contact the Squadrons and ask for a chat.

[abr69]

Thanks again for the response, I find it interesting that the transfer between services appears to be one way. I would be interested in the reason behind this. As I have said before, I enjoyed operating with the RN as a crew. This was not a one off experience, I have operated with both services in numerous theatres and aircraft types.

[Tiger_mate]

Singularly loadies (or whatever they are called at the moment) are fine, however collectively within their cadre can be irritating always trying to justify an existence, at the end of the day they service the aircraft; man the gun and open the door!!

You will need better bait than that to make me take my mind off this months paystatement!

Have any RAF Crewmen crossed over to the Navy?

[Tiger_mate]

The Navy have the PA Spine as well then. You learn something new everyday.

[guidedweapons]

Correct, every day is a school day!

[abr69]

To be honest guys, the money is not really a factor that would influence me at present, I just want to do a job that is both challenging and enjoyable. I want to be absolutly certain I choose the correct route. I really do not fancy C130's, Tri-stars etc, that just doesnt float my boat. I would like to specialise SH or SAR.