"Bootleg" WinXP from Amazon???

[IO540]

I've just bought WinXP SP2 from Amazon, £90. OEM CD.

As usual with anything from Amazon except books, the sale is passed onto another company, Synergy-something. The CD has an impressive hologram etc all over it.

I installed it. Installed fine, key entered fine, downloaded all latest updates during installation, downloaded masses more updates afterwards, then asks to download the Windows Genuine Advantage Validation Tool, which then tells me I have been a victim of counterfeiting!!

The M$ website which you get taken to offers a free of charge validation package IF the counterfeit CD is of a high standard i.e. with a proper big hologram all over it. So I have sent it all off to them.....

Does this make sense?

Would Amazon sell bootleg XP?

Would it accept the serial#/key while online to M$ and not complain?

Would it download the updates during the installation?

Would it download loads of subsequent updates (about 150 of them)?

On a different tack, does this validation process check for other software on the PC and object to that, while pretending the windows O/S itself is bootleg? There is a load of other software on that PC, even though the partition that XP was being installed on had a trashed FAT and had to be recovered with a Truimage disk recovery tool. I don't use M$ software generally but there is an old copy of Office floating around on that PC.... there is also a legit MSFS (FSX) on there but its registry entries would have been trashed when the original XP was trashed.

The original XP, which got trashed, came out of an old MS developer pack... maybe that was a problem. But all that stuff got deleted after the accident.

Another thing is that I had installed that XP O/S twice, due to a misunderstanding, on the same drive. The first time it ended up on \temp\xp and only the second time it ended up in \windows where it should be. The first copy was deleted, and I don't think I ever got as far as downloading and running the Genuine Advantage tool.

This kind of crap is why I prefer to stick to win2000.... however in this case I had no option because Pinnacle video editor doesn't support HD cameras unless running under XP.

[Hyph]

It is not always immediately clear who you're really buying from on Amazon.

Sounds like you have inadvertently bought from one of the "Amazon Marketplace" sellers. Amazon do sell non-book items directly, but they allow Marketplace sellers (i.e. practically anybody) to list items directly alongside regular Amazon items.

When viewing an item, there is a box on the right which has the price of the item and a statement saying who you're buying from or what your buying options are. You need to look for "Dispatched from and sold by Amazon.co.uk" to be absolutely certain that you're buying directly from Amazon.

In my opinion, buying from Marketplace sellers is no different to buying on eBay. Most sellers are reliable and honest, but there are a few who abuse the system.

Amazon have a feedback system where buyers can rate sellers and view previous feedback - is there any previous feedback for this seller?

Would Amazon sell bootleg XP? Absolutely not.
Would an Amazon Marketplace seller sell bootleg XP? An unscrupulous one might.

Amazon have a "safe buying guarantee protection" scheme for buyers. If you were sold counterfeit software, you may be able to claim for a refund from Amazon. I imagine Microsoft will be interested in your CD and the sellers details if they decide that it is counterfeit.

As an aside... to qualify for purchase of an OEM version of XP, the seller should have sold you some hardware. If they didn't, technically, you don't have the right to use the OEM version. You paid about the right price for a genuine OEM XP Professional CD, make sure that is what you got.

[Saab Dastard]

IO,

It is an OEM license, not an upgrade or retail license (£90, rather than £160 or £250). This is probably the reason for failing the WGA validation process.

This product is intended for system builders and small OEMs (Original Equipment Manufacturers) who manufacture computer systems and preinstall Microsoft OEM system builder software onto those systems.

Its use is subject to the OEM System Builder License Agreement that is affixed to the side of all OEM system builder software packs. The system builder who installs the individual software license and distributes hardware units must provide end-user support on terms at least as favourable as the terms under which the system builder provides end-user support for any fully assembled computer system. The system builder must place its support phone number in a noticeable location in the fully assembled computer system help files or end-user documentation.

The full documentation on Microsoft OEM System Builder licence is at http://oem.microsoft.com/downloads/Public/sblicense/English_SB_License.pdf.

This software is not intended for purchase or installation by consumers. Click here for licence details and system builder obligations by manufacturer.

SD

[hellsbrink]

IO

To start with, there has been assorted cases of WGA saying that genuine MS software is "fake". Another problem could be that your serial key has somehow been compromised and used by someone else, someone using a hooky version of XP where they have used a keygen to get a serial number is one example of that.

Now, would the key be accepted whilst "online" to MS? Yes, although I wonder how you were online while installing windows as the key's only asked for during the initial stages of the install before anything like drivers are installed...

Certain updates are downloaded before the WGA, so you getting some updates is normal. You can remove the WGA, and when you update windows you can "deselect" it so it doesn't get downloaded (I assume you mean the WGA tool, and not the WGA check on Windows Update which cannot be avoided.) so it doesn't bother you again.

Now, to WGA itself. It won't check anything else apart from Windows. Office has a separate validation programme (Office Genuine Advantage) which you have to download/install when you first update office. The WGA only checks your serial key, to make sure it is a "real" one/isn't installed on 20 computers instead of one/etc. That's all. Let's just say that because of that check both the WGA and OGA are easily circumvented.

[IO540]

OK re OEM but I don't see how M$ could tell that I did or did not buy some hardware...

On this installation, I am not bothered about not getting latest updates because it isn't used for general internet access. What I don't want is the constant popup in the bottom right telling me I am a victim of counterfeiting... can one disable that somehow? Or can one roll back the updates until one has removed the point at which the validation update was run?

although I wonder how you were online while installing windows as the key's only asked for during the initial stages of the install before anything like drivers are installed

IIRC, the install process asks for the key very early, and it is after that that it goes off to M$ to download the latest updates. This is all before the normal windoze screen appears. I would have thought that M$ would validate the key immediately - it seems an obvious thing to do because otherwise anybody could install any bootleg XP CD, and get a pretty up to date fully working XP.

[Background Noise]

I have bought a number of OEM Win XP discs and never had a problem with them updating or not being accepted by WGA.

[IO540]

Dammit, it took 5 mins of googling on the words

how to stop "text of the message"

and I found it here (http://www.9down.com/Windows-Genuine-Advantage-Validation-v1-7-59-1-UPDATED-Cracked-20785/). It works too.

But it will be interesting what M$ come up with in this case. I have noticed the receipt contains no contact info for the seller, except an email address. I've packed up the whole lot, receipts and all, and sent it off to M$.

Incidentally, this PC is built from parts (except laptops, I have never bought a ready made PC) so why not call it "OEM"? I could be selling it on to somebody like that.

[Parapunter]

An OEM licence should still drop in just fine. In my experience, oem copies are for one build only - you csan't reinstall off it, without a good reason. I had a good reason & MS told me to foff, so I hacked their software to make it work. No wonder no one likes 'em.

[frostbite]

I've just missed a copy of XP Pro (with COA etc.) for £15.50 on ebid. Dithered because seller would only take Paypal (which I do use) and had only registered three days ago, so no feedback.

[IO540]

An OEM licence should still drop in just fine. In my experience, oem copies are for one build only - you csan't reinstall off it, without a good reason. I had a good reason & MS told me to foff,

That explains it then - I installed twice on the same PC, because 1st time I misunderstood the dialog screen for the directory name, thinking it was a temp location for installation files....

[Parapunter]

So a genuine error then? This is why my IT mates tell me that whenever you get a message to activate an MS product, only use the phone & only tell them that you've stuck in a network card & now it wants activation.

It is fair enough that a corporation investing hundreds of millions in a product should take measures to stop it being pirated, but IMHO, MS really don't get the balance right at all.

[Background Noise]

You must be able to re-install an OEM copy (I've done it - sometimes more than once) in case of upgrading a HDD or motherboard for instance - or just wanting to wipe the whole thing and start afresh. I've re-installed sufficiently in some cases that I've had to go to the automated telephone activation (when auto online hasn't worked) and even had to speak to a real person once and there still wasn't a problem re-activating.

[hellsbrink]

IIRC, IO, WGA will not run under Xp without SP2 so you hae to download/install all updates up to that pooint before the WGA will appear.

Never been keen on cracks, you have no idea "what else" you can get as there are so many holes in XP someone could take advantage of that.

There is a "safer" way to get around the WGA checks, but since that can be used to make MS think that an illegal copy of XP is "legit" I ain't sure if we allowed to talk about it.

[Keef]

A couple of years ago, I bought a CD of XP Pro for £15, to sort out a friend's PC. When it arrived, it was very obviously an illegal copy. It went back with a stiff letter and my money was refunded.

I then bought one on eBay for £60. That was legit, with the COA and the hologram etc. It was still in an unopened wrapper. It came with a "piece of hardware" - a 64MB USB memory stick. Apparently, that made it legal in MS eyes. It installed fine, anyway, and the lady in question is still happily using it.

More recently, there were ads all around the web for XP and Office 2003 etc for something just under £20. They, too, were bogus.

So if it's on eBay for under £50-ish, don't worry if you don't win it.

[IO540]

Well, it turns out that this XP was counterfeit after all. The Amazon-connected retailer claims:

Thank you for your email. I have have looking into this order extremely
thoroughly and have discovered that we had a number returns from the same customer last month, we now believe that he swapped our legitimate copies for counterfeit. I will also be contacting M/S first thing on Monday morning with a view to discussing what can be done, as I'm sure this would fall under fraud.

They claim they have done a refund to my CC.

I sent the package off to M$ 2 weeks ago but have heard nothing.

The crack I applied works OK for the O/S but Medial Player 11 won't install, saying it fails validation. So one day I am going to have to do it all over again.

Can one just install a new copy of XP over an old one, entering a new S/N, and preserving all application settings? Or should I reformat the whole partition?

[PPRuNe Pop]

Sorry to say been there done that. Its a nightmare and well worth forgetting about, especially as MS have done rather well in protecting their work

After a three turnbacks to those setting out to con you I was put on to a £60 'Student' copy of XP Pro. Sealed box, validation certificate and it loaded just fine. This is it!!

I later had a very nasty crash and had to re-load it three times over a period of months but MS, via the telephone number on the install sequence if things go wrong, were very helpful and understanding. They gave me a new ID's each time and off I went. Never looked back.

It was inevitable that MS were going to protect themselves come what may. I believe they have now done it.

[Background Noise]

You can change the licence number of installed XP. However, if you have added 'cracks', and/or you don't trust the 'cleanness' of the setup disc you used, I think it would be safer to re-format and start again. Who knows what else had been added to the disc you received.