PPRuNe Servers vs Exceptionaly High Number of Visitors

[Danny]

Whilst this may be a sore point for many of you who actually manage to read this, due to the BA B777 accident at LHR yesterday and the intense interest it has generated worldwide, the number of people attempting to log into PPRuNe has more than doubled. This has led to some problems with the servers being able to handle the loads.

PPRuNe is scheduled to transfer to new, more powerful servers in three weeks. Whilst this should resolve the problems, it does not help in the short term. We are making every effort to control how many people are able to log on to PPRuNe at any one time.

Our normal level of visitors runs at around 2,500 at any one time. This increased to over 7,000 yesterday and caused a partial meltdown of our servers. It has been running at around 3,500 overnight and has once again increased to over 5,000 this morning.

This causes the server to run quite slowly, for obvious reasons. To try and alleviate this problem, a system has been installed that gives priority to visitors who have registered and are logged in. I will be tweaking these facilities throughout the day but we are currently restricted by overwhelming numbers of visitors.

If you are a guest and manage to read this, then congratulations. You are one of only a few to be able to do so. Please bear with us whilst we try to keep everything running, albeit more slowly than usual. If you are a registered member and are logged in and have had the "server busy" message more times than you would like, then I apologise for the substandard experience you are having of PPRuNe at this time.

[MrJoshua]

As a forum administrator myself, I understand the problems.

Good work getting it working for registered members!

Many Thanks,

Josh

[powerstall]

Thanks for all the help, it only means that pprune is getting bigger by the day!

Cheers!:ok:

[P.Pilcher]

Good to hear it, Danny. There is a fair bit of whingeing going on about it on the computers forum. The current Heathrow problem has obviously exacerbated PPRuNe's growing pains which we have been seeing again recently and seem to occurr every two years or so as it just grows and grows. Please keep up the marvellous work.

P.P.

[11Fan]

And now with the AirDisaster.com forum sailing off into the sunset, I would suspect even more traffic.

Thanks for it all though Danny.

[PA38-Pilot]

Don't worry... we can survive a few seconds without PPRUNE:}

Thanks!

[gwillie]

Post #336 in the BA B777 thread offers this:

"It's worth noting that I found my way here because the Wikipedia page for BA38 now includes a link to this discussion forum - this is, no doubt, the reason for the heavy traffic that's causing server overload. Somebody might want to edit the article to remove that link, but I'll leave that up to PPRuNe regulars to decide."

[pasoundman]

Sorry, can't find how to edit the references on Wikipedia or I'd fix it.

[Flap 5]

I've not been able to get on to the 777 thread at all! I've taken several attempts to post on this thread! :hmm:

[Cubs2jets]

While I fully understand the increase in traffic due to the BA incident and the demands this puts on the server, let's not overlook that server problems were clearly evident prior to the BA incident.

Lots of effort goes into keeping a website (especially a popular one) up and running smoothly. A tip of the hat to the folks that have kept PPRUNE running smoothly.

C2j

[jimworcs]

The server problems started way before the incident at heathrow.. but I am sure that made it worse! There was a whole thread devoted to the server problems well before the 777 hit the grass

[NigelOnDraft]

Danny ... ditto the above 2 posts. "Problem" became evident in recent weeks, had been posted about, and errr ignored :ugh:

Meant that, unlike previous incidents, BB was "pretty useless" in a situation it could really have shone :{

I trust your starting this thread is not as an "excuse" but an acknowledgement "it will be learnt from and addressed" :eek:

NoD

[av8boy]

On the upside, every time I see the "Server too busy" screen I also get a fresh reload of the ads. That's got to mean another $.0000001 in somebody's pocket at PPRuNe!

Dave :ok:

[kiwi grey]

The Register is also not helping with an article "Heathrow 777 crash flattens servers" at http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/01/18/servers_flattened/


Next thing you know, we'll be knee-deep in IT geeks :}
(like me)

[Spui18]

that gives priority to visitors who have registered and are logged inGood idea. You should keep that as a standard in the future.

Brgds,
IFTB

[Danny]

Thanks for the comments. However, I'm not sure which bit of "PPRuNe is scheduled to transfer to new, more powerful servers in three weeks." you didn't quite understand. As for the tidal wave of visitors the BA crash generated, I doubt anyone would have predicted the numbers being so high.

As I mentioned in the first post, the server is already scheduled. These things do not happen overnight and have to be planned carefully. No doubt there will be a lot of gnashing of teeth when the swap over takes place as it will involve a certain amount of down time. C'est la guerre!

To give you a slight idea of the numbers involved, we normally have around 35,000 to 40,000 unique visitors a day. That's around 60,000 visits in total a day increasing to an expected 160,000 today. That number has more than doubled the last two days. That's over a 100% increase and that's with the throttling we are having to apply to keep the servers from melting!

Finally, PPRuNe advertising is not charged on a per view basis and all our clients pay a monthly fee. Value for money? You bet! Now that you've unleashed the marketing guy from within, I will direct any potential new advertisers who would like a daily audience of the numbers above to visit our advertising pages at: http://www.pprune.org/forums/advertise.php and for an index of our current advertisers, please visit: http://www.pprune.org/forums/advertiserindex.php?

There! That feels better. ;)

[Spui18]

There! That feels better

I don't know how where you get your patience from.

IFTB :cool:

[AirScrew]

Danny,


thanks for the update. I think most of us understand the interest and the additional hits that the server has taken.
You have founded a great forum, and its its great even when its on its knees...:)

[Xeque]

Danny,
Bet you never thought that you'd have to deal with problems like this when you started the website eh!! :)
Cheers and thanks for providing a very interesting forum

[Loose rivets]

Saving bandwidth.


If all major works could be written off line and pasted in, it would cut the time on site down tremendously.

[Human Factor]

If half the stuff spouted on the 777 thread was written off-line (and then binned before it got posted), that would probably help.

Sorry, here I go again....:rolleyes:

[Gipsy Queen]

At last!!! More thrust should ensure less "Please try again later" but you've coped well, Danny.

There certainly has been a fair amount of tripe following the Triple Seven's early arrival but, sadly, there's little new in that and I suspect, Human Factor, that off-line composition is unlikely to filter much. We can but hope . . :rolleyes:

Does anyone know why this particular incident has generated so much public interest?

GQ.

[airsupport]

Yes had that message several times earlier, seems okay now, probably because most Europeans are in bed. ;)

[IB4138]

Shouldn't you be having your afternoon nap at this time, airsupport? :p

[airsupport]

Not today, too busy watching the Cricket. :ok:

[JEM60]

I retired four years ago, moved next to an Airline Pilot who directed me to this site last year. I am only an ex PPL unfortunately, but have always had a lifetime interest in Aviation. This site has been a complete delight to me, it keeps me away from my underneath my wife's feet for a start, and I don't personally care that the site was overloaded for a time. It simply gives me more to read later!!! Congratulations on this magnificent site, and long may it continue!!

[merlinxx]

Thanks Danny, much appreciated.

[bertrandbuggerie]

Just to say thank you for a great site, Fully understand server issues, so m'dears don't panic! :p

[GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU]

Human Factor (partly!) and Loose rivets, good point. Word/Text plus copy and paste is our best friend.

I'm as guilty of this as anyone but does logging in in the morning and out at tea time (to dip back in during odd slack moments through the day) affect available capacity? Is my understanding correct that bandwidth is only "eaten" during page download and Reply/Post send? In short, If I'm logged in but the computer's not using it (or even sat in screen saver), I am not wasting capacity for others?

[Super VC-10]

I doubt that the link from Wikipedia caused the servers to crash. Wikipedia is not the only place that has a link to Pprune, is it. Lets face it, as soon as Sky, BBC, CNN or whoever mention Pprune people will google the term and find this forum. :ugh:

The reason that there is a link from Wikipedia is because I put it there! :eek: The reason I put it there is because I have posted a copy of the METAR in force at the time on the article about the accident http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_38 when wind shear was being discussed. Pprune is (correctly) questioned as an unreliable source, but the METAR came from a reliable source in the first place, which is why I am able to quote Pprune as the secondary source. If anyone can point me to where I can access a copy of the METAR in force at the time of the accident on the internet, which is likely to be available to view in the future, then I will gladly change the reference source to that one. :) The important thing with Wikipedia is that speculation is kept to an absolute minimum, and facts should be verifiable.

I see from reading the thread that Pprune has gained at least one new member because of the link from Wikipedia, so it can't be all that bad, can it?

[sexbomb A3XXX]

fab website! where would we all be without it.....:ok:

[Right Way Up]

fab website! where would we all be without it.....

..............having a life. :O

[arcniz]

Writing's on the wall, Danny. Find special ways to charge for (or otherwise profit from) access PRIORITY during peak periods.

Given the subject matter, these surges of activity are pretty well inherent - they can be a "feature" or a "bug", as one may choose.

You've done a great job so far, with likely better to come. Best wishes and thanks for the resource!

[S'land]

In this day and age, where we have instant access to news and information, it is only natural that the general public turn to specialised internet sites for more information about an incident. For a while (under a day) registered users had a problem logging on. Now we have a solution that works and we can again PPRUNE.

Well done the site admin for keeping the site running.

[Matt35]

Dan,

Isn't it wonderful that the LHR incident resulted in no fatalities...and that the SLF like me survived the loss of Pprune for a day.?

Power to your elbow...

Matt35

[MamaPut]

Well done for keeping it going at all Danny. When I got the 'server too busy.....' message a couple of hours after the 777 accident I wasn't at all surprised. Sky News has so many 'eyewitnesses' and armchair 'experts' spouting absolute bollox, combined with Sky's own 'instant aviation expert' reporters that more people come here now that your fame is spreading. It's a shame we've had so many people posting entirely uninformed speculation here too, but in these days of instant opinion, it's not at all surprising. Keep up the good work :ok:

[Green Flash]

Victim of your own sucess Danny! Methinks the overload is a rather backhanded compliment as to the authority of your site. True, lots of heat and light generated here (and a damn good thing too!) but if you've got more than a couple of brain cells to rub together you can, no, will, get some absolute gems, good hard facts and a fearfull slagging, depending on what you are after! And that's all down to yer good self. All strength to you Danny, all strength.:ok:

[linesocode]

I've got to be honest, I was amazed that we were at least getting "Server Busy" messages that afternoon. This is exactly the sort of thing that would've melted lesser servers and eaten all available bandwidth. It's events like this that demonstrates which forum owners are putting effort into what they do.

Top class forum, much appreciated by this user.:ok:

[Super VC-10]

I have been pointed to a website where I can view historic METARs. As promised, I have removed the link to the Pprune thread from that article and replaced it with a link to that website. :)

[Desert Diner]

What amazed me was the English papers linking the thread as well.

Too bad about all the b:mad: thats also included in that thread.

Well done to Danny and PPrune for becoming a defact informational source.

[Superpilot]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/01/18/servers_flattened/

[sexbomb A3XXX]

Thats why your a member because you have a LIFE......!:)

[Ian G]

GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU: "Is my understanding correct that bandwidth is only "eaten" during page download and Reply/Post send? In short, If I'm logged in but the computer's not using it (or even sat in screen saver), I am not wasting capacity for others?"

Bandwidth is data transfer - either the speed at which it leaves Dannys computer and enters yours, or the sum total of all that data usually expressed as a monthly figure in Mb or Gb (Gb for here!) If you've already had the page and just have it open and don't refresh it then, in answer to your question - no you are not wasting capacity for others.

This problem is not to do with bandwidth however, I would imagine because the hosting arrangements allow are charged monthly and a few days worth of spikes either doesn't affect the monthly total so much, or we've not yet got near month-end. This problem can usually be fixed by throwing money at it as it shouldn't require much adjustment to the infrastructure.

The 'server busy' messages are to do with the server actually having problems making the pages that are read. As the spikes place a far greater concurrent load, the server cannot physically get the threads from inside the database, wrap them up in a nice page and dish them out quick enough. In the first instance this usually means that page generation times go up, which users notice as a slow-down. This compounds the problem as most people hammer refresh, which just makes the queue longer, which is when the server starts to automatically tell people that it is too busy.

This is harder to fix as it requires upgrade or replacement of the computer which the site runs on, hence the timescales as suggested, particularly as the 'next step' for a site of this size can often be a number of computers rather that just one to distribute load and generally get things running better. This isn't easy.

Danny - hope this is accurate and you don't mind me posting in a somewhat technical nature. Best of luck with the server upgrades. I'm sure you're sorted already but if you need a hand with anything give me a shout. One thing is for certain - the PPRuNe coverage of this event has been somewhat more useful than the media. Even if I need to wait until daft o'clock to contribute ;)

[Romeo Oscar Golf]

there is still no definitive answer as to where the money goes from any donation or the purchase of such Personal Titles......

I guess you're p*****g into wind there Mike:(

However, as you have contributed financially, and the quality of your contributions to these threads are such that the lack of an honest reply to your question is at best, discourteous. I still find the silence deafening.

I will also add that, for me, this is the overwhelmingly best aviation site on the web and I hope Danny et al can keep the new owners on the same steady track and provide us all with the well managed and moderated site which we have enjoyed for several years. Thanks to you all!

To get back on thread, I too have been miffed at the inability to log on instantly and at will, but look forward to the promised new Servers.

[Taildragger67]

Thanks for the update Danny.

Now one question: will the migration to new servers reset our post counters? :\

[Bern Oulli]

As of right now there are 2962 users and I still got the "server busy" message 3 times out of four attempts to post this.

[El Grifo]

2904 users online and the ruddy server busy notice rears it's ugly head once more.

Last week was understandable under the circs, but what is the story now.

I am located in The Canaries. Anyone else having problems.

This has been going on for 48 hours or more.

[IB4138]

Yes El Grifo

Same problems here on the Costa del Sol.

Getting more than a little pished off with it! :ugh:

[El Grifo]

AhA !!!

Maybe it's an anti-iberian thing. :} :}

Or - - - telefonica doing what telefonica does best.

Saludos

Ronaldo

[srobarts]

Just a thought, whenever the server is busy I seem to get multiple emails telling me of the same new post to any thread I have subscribed to. If all subscriptions are receiving such treatment that can't help with the server load.

[nooluv]

I think Danny mentioned there will be a server upgrade in a couple of weeks!!

Regards nooluv........

[banana9999]

One would hope with the millions that Danny has got from the sale hiring a new server or two would be the first thing he woul do as a thank-you to the members that have contributed to his new Ferrari

:) :) :) :)

[Guest 112233]

Not Really Good enough - When you need the forum Its not accessable - poor Show folks.:oh:

[Paul Wilson]

Perhaps you missed Dannys missive about server capacity last week, which went something like.

New server is scheduled for a couple of weeks time.

Wow this crash at Heathrow has generated some huge bandwidth and server demands.

But if you login you get priority over the proles who aren't members.

also, this isn't exactly Terms and Endearment related.