QF/ JQ/ VB etc...any older guys getting in??

[Gearupandorrf]

Hi all,

Just curious....are there any older guys/ girls (say 35+) who have the minimums for the majors getting a look in these days?

Would be kind of nice to hear some success stories.

Happy New Year to all!
Gearup.

[Howard Hughes]

34+ you young whippersnapper...;)

I know a guy of 47 who has got a start with Jetstar and a 54 year old who has gotten a start with Virgin, only one had previous jet time!:ok:

I also know several who have gotten a start with both carriers in their 'mid' forties!:E

[Yusef Danet]

Plenty of grey haired/ no haired recruits on VB induction courses of late. Some more than double the age of some current capts.

[marty1468]

:ok:Wow that's encouraging. I turn the BIG 4 OH this year and am only just finishing my CPL. I was kind of hoping that i would still have a chance in the airlines but wasn't all that positive. All of the OS airlines say experience commensurate with age!!!

Also was not sure about giving up the 60K job at Boeing to get a GA job for peanuts or even REX at $40K as a first officer. I just can't afford that with a new baby. At least with my Boeing job i get to play in the 737NG sim at Alteon every few months :)

There is hope. I will point this out to my wife hehe.

[Gearupandorrf]

I was asking because I'm currently 33, and completed most of my flight training up to CPL including ME Endorsement/ Multi CIR and happily now have the House paid off too and no debts.

The whole "experience commensurate with age" thing laid down by the likes of QF had me thinking that it probably wasn't worth trying to pursue things further.

However, the current state of the industry is making me think otherwise.

I'm having a very serious think about doing an Instructors Rating, and Instructing on a casual/part time basis whilst keeping my current work, until I have enough time (between 500- 1000hrs) to be of some use to an operator for a full time gig.

And then- who knows- anything could happen given some predictions for this industry!

[Towering Q]

Also was not sure about giving up the 60K job at Boeing to get a GA job for peanuts

Hey Marty, plenty of jobs in GA will pay 60K and above. It's not all doom and gloom.

[The Bunglerat]

Supply and demand. When the airlines are in desperate need of drivers (as seems to be the case at present), they'll take whoever they can get - within reason of course. When airlines don't need drivers, well it really won't make too much difference what your age and experience levels are.

FYI, obtained my CPL at age 27, and landed my first gig with a major airline after 11 years in G.A. But then I had the misfortune of entering the industry at a time when supply definitely exceeded demand. Timing is everything...

[marty1468]

Thanks guys,

very encouraging indeed. I'm only newly married with an 18 month old daughter as well and i know if i buy a house now that'll be the end of the dream.

On another note, i have a mate in the UK who got a job with EasyJet with only 530 hours total time at 38. He's been with them for just over 2 years now and is cracking up towards 2500 hours already and is loving it.

I also have a UK passport as well as Aussie (mum's Scottish) so i was thinking that it's an option to head over there also.... Who knows, time will tell.

In the mean time i have a 'round' queensland nav to finish planning before i head off on the 12 day adventure next week. Hopefully the weather clears as it's been S**T the last week or so.

Anyway, thanks again for the encouragement guys.

[The Bunglerat]

Marty, for what it's worth, I'm British by birth (thus hold a passport with all the usual EU right-of-abode/work privileges). As such, for years I copped questions from many friends and colleagues in the industry along the lines of: "Why don't you just go back home to the UK and try your luck there?" Needless to say, I think it's a prime example of the "grass-is-always-greener" syndrome. When I looked into it (which admittedly was a few years ago now), it didn't seem worth the trouble. After already having spent a small fortune to obtain local qualifications, I simply wasn't prepared to throw away more money than I already could not afford. Thus I decided it would be better to stay put and take my chances in this corner of the world. As it turns out, my Aussie qualifications eventually paid off, and I'm quite happy with my lot in life these days.

Nevertheless a word of caution (with only the best intentions) that you can either heed or ignore: Like you, I am also a family man and a late starter in aviation. It's true that I have achieved my goal of flying jets for a major airline, but at a cost. I went through a period where dogged pursuit of the "dream" almost cost me my marriage and family. These days Mrs. Bunglerat is pretty happy with life (including me), but in fairness to her and the kids, I made some decisions and put us in some situations that, quite frankly, if the shoe were on the other foot, I don't know that I would have stuck it out. How glad I am that I can now look back on it with a view to those testing times becoming a repressed memory.

So by all means chase the dream - and best of luck. It's certainly worth it in the end when your ship comes in. Just don't let aviation define who you are as a person. It's a part of your life - but not your whole life. I learned that one the hard way.

[marty1468]

Thanks Bunglerat,

Advice well taken.

I too often think "am i wasting all of this money?". My wife fully understands and is encouraging but i think even she is not all that positive about the outcome "even with the looming pilot shortage". I kow she would be very happy if i ever got into the airlines.

At the moment have 191 hours and am hopefully going to be able to take my CPL Flight Test within the next six months. From there, i'm not sure i can afford to do even my instrument rating or twin endorsement. Everything seems at a distance to me and i dont feel as if i'm making much progress. I also dont think my trainng organisation is very encouraging as they seem to be more involved with the 20 somethings and the Overseas full time students (I wont mention who they are) even though i've lashed out loads of money already.

I am holding onto the hope that i will make it at the moment but time will tell.

Marty

[flyingtake2]

Hi Marty

For what its worth mate, I am 37 and in similar spot. Gave away flying 7 odd years ago - did most of the training for CPL but had to give it away due to lack of finances and some personal hassles.

I am back in the zone of contemplating finishing it off and having another crack, but have a wife and two young kids to consider. Its not an easy decision to make, balancing up the pros and cons. Like you I am earning a good income in a non related field Accounting / Commerce- but the bug is still there.

Best of luck with your decision - its seems like if there was ever a time to say _ _ ck it and throw caution to the wind nows the time to do it - given the supposed likelehood of employment at the end of the expense of training.

Cheers

[KRUSTY 34]

Gidday The Bunglerat.

What a true and very familar story. Thanks for sharing it with us. The road to a career in aviation has never been easy. Unless you, (and your family) have been through it, people have no idea of the sacrifices that we have made. Some sail under a lucky star, but I believe them to be in the minority.

The problem of course is that our profession has fallen behind others in terms of pay and conditions. Earlier last year in an outburst of surpreme optimism, (read all fingers and toes crossed and head buried tightly up his a.....), our Chief pilot told me, "Krusty, supply of pilots will never be a problem as people will always be driven to learn to fly no matter what they are ultimately paid"!!!!!

Well, despite such nonsence, the penny will finally drop. We may see a resurgence in the numbers learning to fly, but only after the industry starts to truely compete for labour. Such are the changed attitudes to aviation as a career today.

So marty, jump in and make sure you are a part of it. Because when these characters (airline management) eventually see the light, all your sacrifices will be worthwhile.

[TLAW]

G'day Marty,

35 Same story. I got the same treatment from my original school, got fed up and found a smaller flying club. Things improved immediately :ok:

[flying-spike]

Marty, Sounds like you're not enjoying " the journey", give 6342 a ring from Monday to discuss

[marty1468]

Thanks heaps guys. I am definately going to keep going, bit by bit until i finish and hopefully it all ends up well and i get that coveted job flying.

best regards to you all and good luck with your own flying dreams.

Marty

[marty1468]

I've sent a PM to you Flying-Spike.

Cheers

Marty :)

[agcatman]

You guys are such spring chickens. I've just turned 45 and am giving it another go. I gave up 7 yrs ago but my wife has pushed me back towards aviation as she can see it is still my "love".
I know it will be hard but if we don't follow our heart, we may be in that rocking chair thinking....what if?

I'm not going to try Qantas as I don't have Oz HSC only NZ which they dont accept

good luck:D

[flyingtake2]

Thanks to all the positive feedback outthere. I admire all those that have bitten the bullet and taken all the hard times and sacrifices in their stride like Bunglerat and others and have finally hit their goals.

One of the the things I like about aviation is the characters that you meet - there are some very inspiring and humurous individuals out there.

My flight instructor a few years ago was one inspiring lady , never flown until she was about 40 and then got a flight for b'day present. She then decided this was her career, so went for it and became instructor. Best teacher I have ever had..............

Good luck to those on this post that are giving it a crack............I reckon late 30s is a good age..........bit of life experience compared to the young ones ..................and you can never be accused of not being committed given the cost and struggles of qualificagtions and work in Aviation.

[Tee Emm]

who have gotten a start

I hope their use of the English language is better than yours...:rolleyes:

[Towering Q]

My flight instructor a few years ago was one inspiring lady , never flown until she was about 40 and then got a flight for b'day present. She then decided this was her career, so went for it and became instructor. Best teacher I have ever had...........

I notice you're from WA, wouldn't be Jan would it?

[flyingtake2]

Nah ....I get told of from mentioning names in here dont I? , but wasnt Jan. Worked ( and still works) at RACWA.

[criticalmass]

Another reason for airlines recruiting older pilots is to ensure an even spread of chaps (and chapesses) reaching retiring age, so pilots leaving due to age-related retirement is spread more evenly over a period of time instead of having a huge spike when their young types become "olde and hoary" all at once.

[boardpig]

This is such a familiar story mate, you are not alone by a long stretch. I too am in the same boat (36, cpl, me/ir, 500hrs, never worked in GA, just been "at it" a few years doing fly away's etc) and only recently resigned myself to the fact that I had missed my shot and stick to the "day" job. There also seems to be a fair few threads which relate to poor pay, conds etc, not so easy if you have a house etc and live in Sydney!! So I breathe a sigh of relief and thank my lucky stars I'm out of it......

Then I read this post and think, who am I kidding. I've been flying for almost 10 years and don't reckon I'll ever give it up!! I used to think my age would work against me, but now I'm not so sure. If Krusty is correct (which he may well be) MGT have a wakeup call coming. If they choose to answer (choice might not come into it) then mabey I should think about another go?
Good to know I'm not the only one in any case!!!

[Nards]

Long time listener, first time poster...

Another "mature" (sic) person here as well. Currently have my PPL. 33 years old and have one more exam to do for my CPL. I have 450 hours accumulated over the last ten years of private flying and a ME rating. As with others here I had assumed (perhaps correctly for the past few years) that I would never get a look in at airline flying, however this seems to have changed with more and more stories of older guys getting starts.

So I just need to complete my Air Law exam and do a practice CPL nav or two and then my flight test. I will then knock over my IREX exam and do my MECIR. However this may take me another 12-18 months as I am a Defence member and I regularly get deployed and I will likely be deployed again for up to 6 months, but it does give a much needed injection of cash.:ok: I also have two young girls and a mortgage so the decision to pursue an aviation career was not being taken lightly. However I have decided that I don't want to be 50 and look back and say I wish I had have tried. So I guess within the next two years I will depart defence and give this aviation gig a go! Will continue to read posts such as these to try and keep a finger on where the industry is up to and hopefully I won't have missed to boat.

Good luck to all the mature age blokes and I would love to hear of more stories of blokes 35+ years old getting airline gigs and what your experience was in order to get these jobs.

Cheers
Nards

[agcatman]

Everytime I read about someone in the "older age bracket" giving it a go, it gives me even more incentive to give it a big go. I have been in aviation before, and for many years and felt it was a poorly paid back stabbing industry......But i still love it and hopefully with more opportunities the backstabbing will decrease and pay increase!!!!:ok:

Here's not holding my breath!:\

Good luck to all.

[Howard Hughes]

The pay may be slowly increasing, but I think the backstabbing will always be there! Part and parcel of being in an industry where people tend to be highly motivated and/or have an ego...;)

[SootyS]

Hmm... I'm another one in the 30 something with CPL, never worked in the industry, currently doing ok but want to get out of the office, looking to make the switch so I don't regret it later, but have a mortgage and child on the way, category.

My gut feeling is that pay and conditions HAVE to improve or the whole industry breaks... or is that just wishful thinking? That being the case I'm looking to try the part time instructing approach as my starting point.

Would love to hear stories from people in similar situation who have made move, how you did it and the end result.

Good luck to all you "older" wannabees.

[Bendo]

Jet Jobbies

34, 3500 TT, 1100 Multi IFR CHTR... no multi crew turbine RPT.

Was offered a posn with Rex

What are the chances of an interview with JQ/DJ/QF?

Have had the apps in online for years and never a nibble :confused:

[KRUSTY 34]

It's an interesting one Bendo.

Talking to a QLD Air Ambo pilot a few weeks ago. He asked me about the pay and conditions at REX and was surprised at how little our pilots are paid.

I told him that with his experience (10,000 + Hours) he should be a shoe in for the major airlines. He told me that if you are over 40 and have no Multi-Crew, then JQ and DJ won't look at you.

Now I honestly don't know if that's true or not, but some in the know may like to comment?

[Howard Hughes]

Was offered a posn with Rex

What are the chances of an interview with JQ/DJ/QF?

Probably pretty good if you take the Rex job I would think!;)

[Roller Merlin]

Just been accepted by Oz LCC. 45 yr old. Persistence does pay off!

[flyingtake2]

Well done on your persistence. Where you a late starter ?

Nice to hear some success stories!!!!

[Doctor Smith]

A well-known pprune personality in his 'mid' forties has a 'bluer' outlook for his future.
Kudos to him coz he's helped stacks of people out over the years.:ok:
Well done shaggs!:8

[Spanwise Flow]

500 hours multi-crew desirable at DJ.

[SamAustralia]

....nice thread

[Capt Wally]

As I mentioned on another thread I tried all the majors even the poorly paid regionals last year (partially out of curiosity) & never heard from a single one of them. I have several thousand hrs on mutli, mostly turbine, several hundred hrs multi crew jet time, albiet small jet but at my age (now the wrong side of 50) experience doesn't seem to count anymore with the airlines, i guess they want young ones to 'mould'.
Never mind I've flown fast, high & with style in cmd so I can at least say i've gone as 'high' as i'm gunna go !:)



CW

[Jet_A_Knight]

WALLY - Don't be so defeatist!

You're not the only guy who was in that position.

Pick up the phone and get yer knee onto the chest of a few of these companies' HR people!

You'd be surprised how surprised some of the HR folk are at having missed your cv.

It happens.:ok:

[Capt Wally]

hey "jet" i don't believe I am a 'defeatist' but thanks for yr words of encouragement. My urge to go further and to start all over again by way of another A/c endo & the new SOPS of another Co. is fading
I figure that it's their loss, not putting tickets on myself but some self praise never goes astray:)
It just annoys me a little to read amongst these many pages that all we seem to talk about here is one of two things, poor T&C's & that there is a pilot shortage, sure lousy T&C's are almost epidemic & is the ultimate demise of our once great aviation industry but a shortage of experienced pilots? Am not so sure, but that's just my opinion.

I'm as happy as I will ever be in my current work it's just that it would have been nice in some ways to join my fellow aviators whom I've seen come & go before me & see out the dying days of my career flying at the other end of the scale, I suppose it's come to this,such is life.............now let 'em swing !:)


CW:)

[Howard Hughes]

I like to look at it this way Wally, there are a lot more 'airline pilots' in this country than 'aeromdical' pilots, so we are part of a select group!;)

[Capt Wally]

Too true HH too true:ok:

Anyway Multi crew in a fully auto plane is mostly boring I'd say & flown by the lazy, that's why I thought I'd fit right on in !!:E:E
Fancy having to work for a living, gawd :ok:



CW

[MONK]

A mate of mine....early 40's came off a chieftain no turbine or multi crew time......got a start with DJ last year....so it does happen....

[fudwinkel]

Capt Wally

J-A-K is right, you have to keep on knocking on the door and of course the more doors you knock on and the more you knock on them the better your chances. Nothing wrong with being the right side of 50, there are many now getting a start with much less experience than you. There were plenty never got started at all in Oz because they were told they needed maths/physics/2020 uncorrected and all the rest of it and there were those of us who persevered and widened our horizons. You must have had persistence to get where you are now but dont let inertia kick in just because of a number. Sometimes you just need to look further afield.

[Capt Wally]

Thanks 'FUD' I am aware of all you say, I've been in this topsy turvy industry long enough to know that ya just gotta be in the right place at the right time to get anywhere!:) I may 'knock' a little more but the word 'knock' also form part of the word 'knockback'!

'Monk' early 40's means about 10 yrs extra employment for a pilot with a Co. than to myself, another reason why they don't appear to want older guys. After 50 it's not a long term prospect considering health etc. for a Co. to hire someone new esspecially if they don't have a zillion hrs on heavy metal already by that older age.
Still I am not complaining as such, just dissapointed to some degree to read/hear that there is a pilot shortage, where I ask sometimes?:bored:
Thanks guys for all yr support anyway:ok:

CW

[HF3000]

Wally

Anyway Multi crew in a fully auto plane is mostly boring I'd say & flown by the lazy, that's why I thought I'd fit right on in !!:E:E
Fancy having to work for a living, gawd :ok:
I know your comment is a sarcastic one, but I do want to say that multi-crew jet operations in OZ are extremenly challenging and rewarding. Go for it.

[Capt Wally]

yeah I know 'HF' that's why I said .......'I'd fit right in'..........:)

I'm not so sure about extremely challenging tho. I flew into Hawaii a couple of times some years ago now & even at that sedate place where the wx is mostly good it was a high work load compared to here in OZ I thought. Hate to imagine what it's like in conditions of snow, severe wind shear & where the traffic is stacked up like pancakes all running on fumes! (so 2 speak)Amazing just to hear the R/T on some busy aerdromes in the states, no place for perfect R/T procedures there!:)
Still I thank you for yr encouragement I intend to seek heavy metal work but most likely on the other side of the 'fence' where I have a chance of getting somewhere:ok:

CW