Qantaslink & Rex how long have they got left?

[newsensation]

With the stories i am hearing of the numbers of pilots leaving and the ones about to leave......

[Howard Hughes]

I think REX will suffer the most, Qantaslink could at least offer a career path into other Qantas group companies!:ok:

[Casper]

QFLink are losing crew to Jet* and VB, including training captains!

[teggun]

Just watch how many will leave QL next year if no career progression is offered.

There are lots of people who have been offered positions and start dates and there are a lot more with interviews coming up, the company have no idea what is about to hit them.

Most are hoping for some sort of career progression, if it doesn't come before their start dates their off.

I hope they announce progression soon otherwise they will be making other announcements.:eek:

[Aussie]

I think youll find they will still be around a while yet. QL will be anyway.

[newsensation]

What makes you say that Aussie.....

[ALLICEDUP]

Aussie,

I am interested too, not sure if I agree with you and I work for them!!!

[Aussie]

Well,

From what i read and hear from the lads at REX, perhaps it wont be so long for those guys, however, they are well backed, and providing they keep finding suckers to drive the saab, which they seem to be doing ( recently knocked back a mate with 2600hr) they will probably scrape along and get by existing... Once they are really desperate and running out of options, perhaps they may finally do something about retaining the flightcrews. just my opinion.

As for QL, as someone mentioned earlier, i think as long as they open the option for progression to mainline, which they could well do down the track, knowing many guys would take that option, then they will keep existing for the time being too...
Also, things cant be that though there yet either, they are still asking 10K for the endo... that will go before they pack up shop and fold.

Thats my thoughts anyway! Im sure others will disagree.... Hit me with it!

[VH-FTS]

Heard a rumour this week M@cair are close to administration.

Would Virgin step in and buy these guys or Rex if they went under? No way Qantas would be allowed to.

[newsensation]

The 10k for the endorsement at QL is now an option the other choice is a 3 year bond... Progression to mainline??? :ugh:

[Altimeters]

6 people in the last 2 months have gone to mainline.

[KRUSTY 34]

Aussie, the reason that REX are still knocking back reasonably qualified candidates is that they are not meeting the standards either in the interview or the Sim, etc... Now I'm the first one to defend the value of experience but hours in the logbook are not always the be-all and end-all. It is my understanding that the head of check and training has undertaken not to reduce the standards at REX. For this I think we should all be sincerely grateful.

The flip side of course is that the company cannot source enough pilots to repenish the ranks and they will not be able to replace the experienced people that they are now losing.

Qantaslink, in this environment are insane to persist with the $10K endorsement fee. The email I receieved from them several years ago mentioned that it was in line with "worlds best practice" or some other such nonsense. It was obviously seen as an opportunity by some lacky to impress those higher up the food chain. Well that, as well as an apparent pathelogical resistance to allow progression into mainline will probably see them follow REX in quick and spectacular order!

[Aussie]

Gday mate,

Yeah your right, its a good thing that they havent lowered the standards...

However the point im trying to make, is, once they are desperate enough and the threat of folding is at the doorstep, they just may have no choice but to reduce those standards somewhat.. otherwise, yeah, they will fold!

Merry Xmas!

[Howard Hughes]

the reason that REX are still knocking back reasonably qualified candidates is that they are not meeting the standards either in the interview or the Sim, etc... Now I'm the first one to defend the value of experience but hours in the logbook are not always the be-all and end-all. It is my understanding that the head of check and training has undertaken not to reduce the standards at REX. For this I think we should all be sincerely grateful.
Krusty, I had an interview with Rex about 18 months ago and I will be the first to admit that I performed poorly in the sim, extremely poorly. However I answered most of the technical questions correctly and performed reasonably well in the Interview. I didn't get through!

Now this is despite the fact that I had 4500 command hours on an aircraft in the same category as the SAAB, had operated on routes that REX operates and was a Training Captain on my previous type. To say that I was not able to perform the task, or at a lower standard than REX is ridiculous! While there are some very experienced people at REX, I wouldn't go so far as to say that the 'standard' is particularly high, especially given the number of recent departures!:rolleyes:

I am 'sincerely grateful' that the standard was not 'lowered' by employing me, I have moved to another company where my skills have already been recognised!:rolleyes:

Like I said earlier in the thread, Rex will have a bigger struggle than Qantaslink because if they are smart, they can at least offer a career path!

If another thread in D&G is anything to go by, perhaps the career progression at QF will go like this:

500 hours ab initio instructing with new cadets.
Two years right seat in the Dash 8.
500 hours IFR/twin/commercial training with new cadets.
Then Dash 8 command for those who want it, or off to mainline!

Think about it, for regionals to survive in the future they will need to be aligned with a major and provide a career path.

[Metro man]

For what REX are paying how do they expect to be as fussy as this ? If they want high standard people then they must pay them appropriately. If they won't pay then they need to lower their expectations.
It's like this for other things in life such as buying houses, cars etc. Why do REX think they are different ?
You could always do their selection process and if successful use your acceptance letter as a qualification for a better paying job. :E

[TLAW]

How long before the complaint "we can't get pilots!" reaches the ears of the Minister for Immigration?

[wesky]

I believe its already there :)

[Capt Wally]

......there is No shortage of pilots!!!!.............there can't be as I know several pilots with way above the req hrs needed by the regionals (as HH has & mentioned) & well above the standards req, ('cause they now perform in the most recognized high workload environment) & their not getting asked to join any of them, how do I know the latter??.......well I know a few that didn't make REX for Eg. & are now in VB for instance & other jet jobs !(their probably better off anyway). If it's then about standards as some have mentioned in here then the big boys must have low stds!!:bored:.......so NO I don't believe for one minute that there is a shortage, most likely a shortage of pilots that REX & QL can mould/use/manipulate but not of the ones that would be willing to pass thru their doors with plenty of experience & at least stay a little while!

Go for it guys, convince me that there is a shoratge !! Am sure some will see red here (xmas colour it is too:))

CW

[chief wiggum]

was it return to normal staffing levelsBYJanuary? or [B]IN/B] January ?

The only reason I ask is that they normally hae a much reduced schedule in Jan, and this could be another way that management there can believe the BS that they are spinning. With less "cancellations"in Jan, then they will think that they have been right all along.
Are they out of touch ??? ... i would hazard a YES to that.

[volare_737]

Just as a matter of interest - How much does a Capt at REX earn per months ?

[KRUSTY 34]

Gidday Howard.

Would've responded earlier but I have been away and working like a dog. Lot of that going on lately.

Sorry that you didn't get through. anyone can have a bad day in the Sim, and I do mean anyone! Hopefully you have gone on to better things. But I think you are right, the standard, although fairly strictly applied is probably no tougher than elsewhere. Problem is we are now seeing people fail not only their Check to Line in a much greater ratio than previously, but more are not coming up to standard in the initial endorsement. This is a huge problem for REX, and highlights the decimation of Australian General Aviation. Driven in part by years of substandard Wages and Conditions. During this period most operators (Including the Regionals and Majors) have embraced the "keep Wages and Conitions Low" philosophy, and we are now seeing the fruits of their labour!

Metro Man,

Just lowering the standards to fit in with the supply problem is not a solution either. I think you'll find that CASA have to approve such changes, and they are unlikely to stick their necks out on that one (and who can blame them).

So will REX survive?

Possibly, but it will be a much smaller operation than it is today.

My prediction:

Best case: In 12 months, approximately half the size it is today! The economies of scale that the business has enjoyed will disappear, and the price of the average regional ticket will be closer to what it was 10 years ago (basically double to what it is today). A reduction of at least 50% in regional frequency with some routes, although profitable, disappearing altogether so that the prime ones may survive.

Worst case: REX will fold because of a chronic lack of skilled flight crew.

In either case, it will be the travelling public that will ultimately pay the price.

[Howard Hughes]

In 12 months, approximately half the size it is today!
With Virgin 'cherry picking' not only the pilots, but the better routes for their Embraers...;)

[KRUSTY 34]

Very good point Howard,

But I did say best case!

[Metro man]

A few short years ago, when there was a huge surplus of pilots REX could be fussy even with their poor terms and conditions. A bit like an ugly girl in a mining town where men out number women six to one, they still get regular pick up attempts.

Now the job market has changed, it's as if the paper bag job has moved to Surfers and is sitting in Shooters bar surrounded by Bay Watch material, yet still expects to go home with Brad Pitt.

Get real REX, you aren't a plum job anymore. If you expect to pay F/Os the same as check out chicks you deserve to close.:yuk:

[PA39]

:ugh:From what I hear, and have no reason to disbelieve, Rex rely primarily on the applicants performance in the sim ride. They are putting people without any turbine time, nor the need for such, into the sim straight up (after an hours practise..at the applicants expense) and expecting them to shoot approaches to minimas in an aircraft much faster and quite foreign to them. The buddy for the exercise can be a guy who has just failed his sim appraisal and having known he has failed, doesn't give a rats. Any misjudgement or error is a fail. THEN they go to the interview with a big cross in the box for bombing the sim ride!! They pass the interview (After having to explain the P Factor to a flight attendant!!) with high distinctions but are not accepted because of the sim bomb out. HOWEVER two weeks later they are asked to come back and have another go at the sim ride...albeit at their expense. These are pilots with a lot of experience in SPIFR in very tough conditions and remote areas and often hold Chief Pilot delegations. Rex should take a long hard look at how they conduct themselves in this area and take a page from a certain operators book from WA (Not Skippers).

[KRUSTY 34]

Great analogies Metro man.

And spot on!

[DeafStar]

I heard Qantaslink will be parking aircraft in Feburary. The Captain exodus has started...