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View Full Version : Australia - 'Steady as she (successfully) goes' or a Republic?


Wiley
19th Dec 2007, 00:15
Since would appear that weeks after the event, the original election debate isn’t over yet(!), I thought maybe it would serve this ‘cyberspeaker’s corner’ (and bandwidth constraints) better if I opened a separate thread on the Oz republic debate. So here’s my original post on the subject, from page 46(!) of the Australian Election thread:

Ok, time to start a whole new debate.

There's a fair to middlin' chance the Krud will go for another referendum on the republic question - and, I'd be guessing, a fair to middlin' chance it will result in a 'yes' vote this time if the question isn't purposely skewed to guarantee a 'no' vote as it was last time.

Which leads me to the question that (I'm told) caused most people to vote 'no' last time (in '93) - how will we elect our Head of State? The majority of people wanted (gasp!) something along the lines of the American system, with a popularly-elected President.

This blows me away - the fact that the majority of Australians who are in favour of Ozmate becoming a republic (not the majority of Australians, but the majority of Australians who are in favour of a republic) want to inflict something on the country similar to what we see all over our television screens today - (all **** day, day after day after day) - from the US, with an popularly-elected president - which will mean the selection process will eventually turn into something akin to the American 'experience').

A president voted in by a 2/3rds majority of parliamentarians would almost certainly guarantee a non-political appointee, which is surely what you'd want for a ceremonial head of state, which is what an Ozmate Head of State would be as long as we stick with the Westminster system.

As for a title: why not stick with Governor General? Everyone has a 'president'. Let's be different.

Tin hat's chin strap pulled tight, head well below the parapet.

marty1468
19th Dec 2007, 04:23
I'm all for a republic in as much as i see the British Royal Family is redundant for Australia.

On that note, i voted against the republic last time as i didn't like the way our head of state was going to be decided. I don't particularly like the idea of a President elected by the people either as you have already mentioned, some do-gooder with loads of money and friends but no political experience in running anything but probably his own pen which ultimately would be disasterous for this fine country.

I think we should just keep the system we have now but for all intents and purposes, be a republic.

EASY....

Howard Hughes
19th Dec 2007, 06:55
Republic all the way for me, but don't listen to Bino's, the flag should stay the way it is!:ok:

ScottyDoo
19th Dec 2007, 08:18
Republic.

Unless Harry Pothead finds himself on the throne. The royal one, that is, not the Thomas J. Crapper.

If Young Pothead were to be king it could be worth hanging around for.

Otherwise let's turf the old bag and get on with things.

Oh and get that crap cross off our flag... (doodah, doodah!!) :rolleyes:

B A Lert
19th Dec 2007, 08:31
It is all very simple. As things stand, an Australian citizen CANNOT (or even aspire to) be his or her country's Head of State. This must change, and the only way to achieve this is for the country to become a republic. I say "Bring it on!!" :ok:

jindabyne
19th Dec 2007, 09:03
Speaking as a Pom who lived, happily, in Oz for several years, I would say the sooner the better for all concerned: (1) the British monarchy is largely irrelevant to today's Oz multi-cultural society and has no bearing on its internal affairs, and (2) I'm a UK royalist and don't like my Queen being slagged off by antipodean numpties such as Doo. But you'd be crazy to change the flag - prettiest of all, and reflects origins (good or bad).

tony draper
19th Dec 2007, 11:06
Yup, just get rid of Mrs Queen and all your troubles will be over,remember we already tried it once,and got Cromwell.
:E

Windy Militant
19th Dec 2007, 12:34
If the Ozmates show their usual response to authority and protocol they'll vote to become a republic, then vote to have the Queen as head of state because they'd rather have a class act than some bludger of a slime ball politician. :ok:

Edited to add that Mrs Queen is surprisingly popular with the ethnic minorities here in blighty so it's possibly the same dununda.

priapism
19th Dec 2007, 20:29
I'm for Sir Les Patterson to be the first Australian President.

reynoldsno1
19th Dec 2007, 21:01
I believe the process to change to a republic is quite complex in OZ - 'tis far simpler in NZ (Act of Parliament only) - so I'm betting NZ will change before Oz....

tony draper
19th Dec 2007, 21:09
Makes no difference, fifty years from now both places will probably be Kaliphates anyway,as will we.
Hmmm, Dunundistan has a ring to it.
:rolleyes:

Fliegenmong
19th Dec 2007, 21:54
My thoughts exactly Priapism! :ok:

TD, a caliphate in OZ, bah, too many pork snags, grog and scantily clad wimmin!! :)

I'll try to find a link to the protests in Western Sydney last night re the proposal to build an Islamic school out there.

CoodaShooda
19th Dec 2007, 22:07
too many pork snags, grog and scantily clad wimmin!!



Too many reasons for the caliphates to the north to want to take us infidels off the map? :E

Arm out the window
20th Dec 2007, 00:58
David Boon for president, a kangaroo holding a can of VB for the flag, to be drawn by Reg Mombasa.
Official male attire in parliament to be stubbies, thongs and Jackie Howe singlet (duffel coat and ugg boots in inclement weather) with the amount of bum crack exposed proportional to the MP's rank. Tank top and jeans for females, cold weather gear as per the blokes.
National capital moves to Hamilton Island.
Oath of allegiance:
"Do you swear to be a fair dinkum Aussie?"
"S**t yeah!"

tinpis
20th Dec 2007, 01:10
Reg Mombassa is a kiwi.
Cant have that now can we?:hmm:

Fliegenmong
20th Dec 2007, 01:53
I have always been a fan of the Bundy Ad that has 'The Bear' as the cooat of arms between the Kangaroo & the Emu :ok:

CoodaShooda
20th Dec 2007, 02:05
Why not tinny? :confused:

Anything good coming from enzud is automatically granted Orstrarlyun citizenship. :rolleyes::E

Bally Heck
20th Dec 2007, 02:19
The only qualification a head of state should have, is not to want to be a head of state. I think Liz is the only HOS who qualifies on the entire Earth. The rest of the bar stewards want power. No idea why? Not one who is competent. And a huge number who are to say the least....well.....Mugabe. and worse!!! Why would anyone want a president? Bush? Ebagum? Putin? Any number of despots?
Can you imagine the United Kingdom. President Blair. (For life.....presidential decree) And Prime Minister Brown Nose?
Give me a Queen Lizzie! No power and lots of influence. Luxury!

parabellum
20th Dec 2007, 07:26
Bally Heck Your formula is exactly what is required, no power but lots of influence, trouble is, where in the whole of Australia would you find someone who qualifies? You are right, keep Liz.:ok:

Dr Jekyll
20th Dec 2007, 09:49
It would be quite amusing for the UK to become a republic (UR?) before Australia or New Zealand. Then they would probably try to show their contempt for all things Pom by keeping the monarchy.

ORAC
20th Dec 2007, 10:06
To quote Montesquieu, the UK is already a "republic disguised as a monarchy".

While France is a monarchy disguised as a Republic.....

Wiley
20th Dec 2007, 10:46
I'm quite amazed at the difference in tone and content of this thread to the Oz Election thread, where this discussion started (on page 46(!) of the thread).

I suspect it might be explained that no one from 'back home' even bothered to look at the Oz election thread, (which is totally understandable - many fom Ozmate feel the same way).

The comment made by Bally Heck is the diamond among the coal - The only qualification a head of state should have, is not to want to be a head of stateAgree 101%, BH, which is why I'm so against the popularly-elected model that seems to be favoured by the majority.

Binoculars
20th Dec 2007, 13:42
Wiley, I'm not sure why you would be amazed at the difference in tone. The in-your-face antagonism of the Dunnunda forum is so intense there is little relief from it, and in your years of inhabiting the place you must have noticed it. Indeed, as one personally involved in the 1989 business, you probably contributed to it at some stage.

My absence from D&G is not entirely due to my retirement. It's more a search for a more agreeable debating room. As the last couple of days have shown, that doesn't always happen, but once you sort the wheat from the chaff there's a lot of intelligent input to be found in JB.

Start by avoiding all threads with more than 1000 replies and work from there!

1DC
20th Dec 2007, 15:45
Binos, when you become a republic,which i am pretty sure will be soon, if you were to design the new flag what would it look like?
Hopefully not a yellow flag with green stars or a green flag with yellow stars..

Binoculars
20th Dec 2007, 15:56
I don't go much for flags. As long as they are easily identifiable it doesn't matter much to me; as I said earlier it's just a symbolic piece of material.

I was in Thailand recently, in a bar (strange, I hear you say) where the flags of many countries were portrayed. I was asked which was my country's flag, and I pointed to New Zealand's flag. Now that possibly says more about my ignorance than the flag selection and I'm happy to admit it. Would I be happy with a Green background with the usual stylised kangaroo in gold? Yes, at least it would be unmistakably ours, and how many countries can say that?

tony draper
20th Dec 2007, 16:29
Well go your own way by all means, but remember Mrs Queen may no longer feel duty bound to offer you the umbrella of her Trident Boats stuffed full of buckets of sunshine when the hordes to the north of you decide they need some Lebensraum.
:E

Wiley
20th Dec 2007, 17:51
Our Granddads thought they could rely on her Dad to do something similar back in '42, drapes, but some bloke named Winnie thought the AIF (Oz Army to you) should stay and keep the hedges trimmed in his backyard and bugger Orstraylia. When the Ozmates demurred, he even tried diverting the ***ing convoy taking them back to Ozmate to Burma.

I think the chances of Mrs Queen's Tridents coming all the way to Sinney to bail us ungrateful colonials out at some time on the future are about as slim as the chances were that the RN would have sent a battleship or two out to the Antipodes in Jan 42 - especially after they'd seen the way the natives treated the Prince of Wales and the Repulse the month before.

Andu
22nd Dec 2007, 12:23
Shame to see this thread sinking into oblivion on page 2. I thought Wiley's comment about Winston (PBUH) and 1942 would have got a few bites.

BenThere
22nd Dec 2007, 12:43
We were there in '42. Battle of Coral Sea. Things didn't look too good for any of us then.

tinpis
23rd Dec 2007, 20:59
We will probably end up as part of the Republic of China

tony draper
23rd Dec 2007, 21:09
Err, that is what one was hinting at Captain Tin.:uhoh:

MReyn24050
23rd Dec 2007, 21:32
Republic.
Unless Harry Pothead finds himself on the throne. The royal one, that is, not the Thomas J. Crapper.
If Young Pothead were to be king it could be worth hanging around for.
Otherwise let's turf the old bag and get on with things.
Oh and get that crap cross off our flag... (doodah, doodah!!)
Why don't you just go if that is your attitude I am sure you will not be missed and why you are about it recall all the Aussies here in the UK? Incidently why are you bothering to post on a UK website?

CoodaShooda
23rd Dec 2007, 21:58
Mel

ScottyDoo appears to be more stereotypical than archtypical of Australians on this forum.

I'd suggest that when Binos referred to wheat and chaff, he wasn't including Scotty in the former.

However, your 'rant in response' is also disappointing and gives comfort only to the Republicans and the trolls (possibly one and the same :hmm:).

PS While PPRuNE had its genesis in the UK, I think you'll find it went global some time back.

Getting back on track, it used to be said that the optimists were learning Russian while the pessimists were learning Chinese. I think Mandarin is now the second most common language in Australia - so where does that take us?

MReyn24050
23rd Dec 2007, 22:34
CoodaShooda
Forgive my rant. It just annoys me that certain people take great delight in rubbishing HM The Queen who has spent her life unselfishly dedicated to the 'mantle' she inherited. That added to the couple of tots of Grouse got me going. As you say he is "more stereotypical than archtypical of Australians on this forum2
Forgive me, have a great Christmas.
Mel

CoodaShooda
23rd Dec 2007, 23:16
Nothing to forgive.

Most Aussies have a great deal of respect for Elizabeth II and her mother. Its the kids we're not so sure about. :E

have a great Christmas

You too mate. :ok:

Binoculars
24th Dec 2007, 09:18
Not sure what the tots you were drinking were, but they certainly didn't do much for your post, MReyn. ;) (been there, done that!)

I made my views about the republic known in the other thread and I don't like to bash people over the head with them; well not more than twice anyway!

I'm also on record several times in this forum over the years as saying that I have nothing against Lizzie or any of the misfits in the inbred "royal" family. I suspect the monarchy is probably revenue neutral for England, but either way I don't really care. If England want to hang on to the whole bizarre concept of somebody being born to rule, that is their business.

My belief is simply that they are an irrelevance, and an increasingly embarrassing one, to the country of which I am a citizen. In no way do I suggest we forget our colonial past and the role the UK played in it; it's a part of us whether we like it or not. Let's remember that, let's by all means place it in our history texts, let's be grateful for the good things we got from it, including the Westminster system of government.

Then let's look at ourselves and our position in the world, take a collective deep breath and ask ourselves why on earth we are allowing a foreigner to be our head of state. I see no reason why anything significant has to change: our (insert name of choice here) can still be a figurehead who attends tea parties and once in a hundred years is called upon to make a binding decision about our government.

It's 99.9% symbolism, and the flag is the ultimate example. I repeat that I don't give a stuff what the flag is as long as it's unmistakeably ours and it doesn't crawl to a former colonial power now being forced to re-examine its own place in a new world where Rule Britannia is significant to an ever-decreasing proportion of its population.

TheDesertFerret
24th Dec 2007, 10:26
Binos.

In reverse I feel the same - Aussies do as they see fit and it's none of our business in Blighty.

Though I must correct one observation. That is the notion that the Royal family are "born to rule". Not true. They are born to be members of the oddity that is the Monarchy but they rule nothing.

They have no power (as the head of your state how much power has the Queen ever brought to bear? None whatsover. Zilch. Kaputen. Same here.).

I don't have much affection for the royal family but I do like a head of state with no power.

tdf

Wiley
24th Dec 2007, 10:42
Binos, reading your 10:18 post, I find myself hard pressed not to take the name of tomorrow's birthday boy in vain. Have you managed to place a bug in my living room? You must have - but then again, maybe not, for I think you stated my position on this topic better and more accurately than I could myself.

To the Brits, let me repeat one point Binos made - you'll look long and hard among Australians to find someone without a relatively high regard for Mrs Queen. (Well, maybe not too hard if you look for Ozmates with a strong Irish connection, but that connection is usually three of four generations removed these days, and even most of them don't get too steamed up about Easter 1916 any more, except perhaps late in the afternoon on Paddy's Day.)

Most of us think of her with some affection. She's a really nice lady who has done - and continues to do - a more than creditable job as British HoS these last 50+ years. It's just that she's your HoS, and (I think) most Australians under the age of 65 can't see why in the world she should be ours anymore.

HotDog
24th Dec 2007, 10:49
Oh well Binos, you cant have it all your way you know. Not satisfied with the demise of "Little Johny" and his ilk, you now want to take it a step further and get rid of the Queen as well. I am 73 years of age and belong to a number of prestigious clubs that are named Royal. Flame me as much as you like, I'm old enough to take it without hurt but I do like the feeling that our head of state is Queen Elizabeth and not Robert Mugabe, however symbolic or ineffectual the results may be to our everyday lives. Why bother at a great expense, to change the satus quo that is not hurting anyone?

Tempsford
24th Dec 2007, 11:24
Good luck to the Aussies.
Their politicians have manipulated their immigration policy so that it is easier for some to get in than others so that in the years to come the status quo will neither have the ties with the 'mother country' or the historical connections that are rapidly becoming a distant memory. The Republic is only a matter of time.
Australia is a fantastic country, great people and an amazing potential and I just hope that you have learnt from our mistakes and don't 'cock it up'.
When working nights at BNE, being one of the few POMS on shift, the subject of a republic and severing the ties with the YUK (as tinny calls it)came up in conversation more than a few times as did the subject of the Australian Flag. The argument was somewhat one sided as to be expected. I said 'perhaps you should ask us'. Stunned silence. 'Well', I said 'how do you know if we are happy for you to keep using our flag as part of yours'.
TILT.
This did not compute.
Remember, be very careful, because what you dream of will come true, but will you like what you are going to get more than what you have now. QED.
Anyway, all the best folks, you have been and I hope will remain good and loyal friends. I hope that irrespective of the way the situation develops, that will not change and that Earls Court will ever remain an outpost of OZ.
Temps

Binoculars
24th Dec 2007, 13:51
HotDog, I'm sorry, but how I am 73 years of age and belong to a number of prestigious clubs that are named Royal has any relevance to the argument I'm at a loss to see.

For the rest of it, despite a half-hearted attempt at scare tactics by mentioning Mugabe, your post comes down to the same old cliche around which the whole anti-republic referendum campaign was successfully based: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

I just happen to think it IS broke, not fatally, perhaps in the order of things not even seriously. We are talking a symbolic change, and given the number of things that desperately need fixing it is quite right to place it at a low level of importance to our daily lives. But that argument is normally used as a stalling tactic and implies rather absurdly that we can't do more than a couple of things at the same time.

Certainly not the time of the year for flaming however, and I don't think I have ever flamed, as opposed to disagreed with, anybody on this topic.

Seems like yesterday we walked around Royal Mackay ;) Golf Club, and it came as a shock to hear you are of such advanced years. I wish you a Merry Christmas, and political differences aside, should you ever be passing through this way on a pensioners' free rail pass, I'd be delighted to reacquaint you with the NQ approach to golf. Carts are available, I could rustle up a zimmer frame and there is a ramp into the bar where you can hold court and harrumph over a gin and tonic!
Cheers!

MTOW
24th Dec 2007, 17:44
... so you're planning to give a right Royal good time, are you, Binos?

I wonder if there's someone out there with the time and inclination to give us some idea of what it would cost?

I think Kev could bypass a lot of the emotion associated with the switch if he left the flag issue alone until some time later. Hawaii still has a Union Flag on is State Flag, and I have to admit, Union Flag and all, I quite like our present flag.

Howard Hughes
24th Dec 2007, 19:01
The flag should stay as is, if we are to be thankful for what the motherland has given us, then what better way?:ok:

Now for a name, the republic of Southern Indonesia perhaps...;)

HotDog
24th Dec 2007, 23:57
Thanks for the invite Binos and a Merry Christmas to you and yours. Happy to say that in spite of my years, I do not need a Zimmer frame. I pull my buggy around 18 holes three times a week, keep my young wife happy and don't need a pensioner's rail pass as I still have the benefit of ID90 travel by air. God save the Queen.:ok:

Barkly1992
25th Dec 2007, 08:59
Republic or not has nothing to do with loyalty to the British monarchy - it is simply about a system of government.

Canada and India (and other members of the Commonwealth) are republics but are members of the Commonwealth which has Betty Windsor as head.

It is not about abandoning the title Royal for the Royal Canberra Golf Club, or the RSPCA - or any other club which managed during the 1950s to obtain the title by making a 20 page submission to the Foreign Office.

It is more about a state of mind.

My mind (born in England) but having lived here for many years wants a republic. We don't need to elect a Head of State - we would only end up with Dick Smith - just make the lected Prime Minister, the Head of Governemt the HoS.

John Howrd showed everyone many times (including the opening of the Olympics or the Commonwealth Games) what he thought about the fact that the GG was supposed to be the HoS.

He only got a look in nhwen John Howrd didn't want the photo-op.

Go Republic - and lets do it NOW.

:p

PS: The Canadians chnaged their flag - and isn't it a beautiful flag.

Track Coastal
25th Dec 2007, 10:29
Canada and India (and other members of the Commonwealth) are republics

Canada is a constitutional monarchy utilising the Westminster system with HM QEII as the head of state, locally represented by the Governor General (same system as us).

But it does have a beautiful, unique and easily recognisable flag (unlike ours). The flag was adopted in 1965. Interestingly, Canada utilised the Union Jack as its flag until 1965.

There is no discernable republican movement in Canada. There is however a separatist movement in Quebec.

IMHO we should change the flag then the HOS. Something unique, something instantly recognisable (like the Canadian flag). I'm a big fan of simplicity (again like the Canucks): a Roo, Crux Australis, the Federation Star, Green and Gold...

It's 99.9% symbolism, and the flag is the ultimate example. I repeat that I don't give a stuff what the flag is as long as it's unmistakeably ours and it doesn't crawl to a former colonial power now being forced to re-examine its own place in a new world where Rule Britannia is significant to an ever-decreasing proportion of its population.
Succinctly put Binos. :D

tinpis
25th Dec 2007, 23:27
Anyone know the words to Advance Orstraya Fair?

Howard Hughes
26th Dec 2007, 00:57
Australians all let us 'ring Joyce'....;)
Courtesy of Kenny.

tinpis
26th Dec 2007, 19:57
Yes...well these wont do will they?

While other nations of the globe
Behold us from afar,
We'll rise to high renown and shine
Like our glorious southern star;
From England, Scotia, Erin's Isle,
Who come our lot to share,
Let all combine with heart and hand
To advance Australia fair!
In joyful strains then let us sing
"Advance Australia fair!"

Shou'd foreign foe e'er sight our coast,
Or dare a foot to land,
We'll rouse to arms like sires of yore
To guard our native strand;
Brittannia then shall surely know,
Beyond wide ocean's roll,
Her sons in fair Australia's land
Still keep a British soul.
In joyful strains the let us sing
"Advance Australia fair!"

BOFH
26th Dec 2007, 21:47
Thank you for the long-forgotten verses, Tinpis.

Did anyone else start humming 'Auld Lang Syne' by accident? It fits rather well.

BOFH

Binoculars
26th Dec 2007, 23:18
Or more to the point of the current thread, did anyone else cringe in embarrassment at the words in bold?

allan908
27th Dec 2007, 00:13
I repeat that I don't give a stuff what the flag is as long as it's unmistakeably ours

So which other country is flying OUR flag?? The only similar one is NZ and it's basically a State of Oz anyway.:E


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c92/allan907/AussieFlagr-01.jpg

BOFH
27th Dec 2007, 07:32
Er - Fiji?

Becoming a republic may not be such a bad thing if coupled with other constitutional reform, notably that of the arbitrary distribution of senators amongst the States. Once dispensed with, the constitutional monarchy will no longer be an albatross around the neck of the Liberal party (not that they want for those).

However, complaining that the current HoS system is undemocratic whilst the Senate remains 'unrepresentative swill' (as Keating called it) is rather like condemning homosexuality with a **** in one's mouth.

BOFH

Clockwork Mouse
27th Dec 2007, 09:16
I’m a Brit and a strong supporter of our British system of constitutional monarchy and, a separate issue, of our Royal family. I cannot bear the thought of having a presidential system with some popular celeb or, worse, an ex politico b*st*rd like Blair, Heath or Brown as our HoS.

I am also a lifelong fan of Australia. My dad was a PoW in Changi and Burma and had an enormous respect for the Aussie soldiers of all ranks who were there too. We also had dozens of great Aussie friends in Malaya after the war. My family felt our government betrayed our friends when we ditched the old Commonwealth and surrendered our sovereignity to that unspeakable gang based in Brussels, with whom we have nothing in common except that we’ve fought and beaten most of them repeatedly over the last 5 centuries. Now what they say is law in what used to be my country.

I fully understand and sympathise with the desire of Australians to ditch what is now to them a foreign HoS and to reinforce their own sovereignity. It is right, it is probably time and I am sure it will happen. I only hope that it will happen in a gentlemanly (you can tell my age) and amicable fashion with no recriminations and bitterness on either side. And I hope our countries can remain friends for ever. We both have much to be grateful to each other for.

Track Coastal
27th Dec 2007, 09:57
I fully understand and sympathise with the desire of Australians to ditch what is now to them a foreign HoS and to reinforce their own sovereignity. It is right, it is probably time and I am sure it will happen. I only hope that it will happen in a gentlemanly (you can tell my age) and amicable fashion with no recriminations and bitterness on either side. And I hope our countries can remain friends for ever. We both have much to be grateful to each other for.

I'm hopeful too as an Aussie that it will be so as you described. Same with our flag, the Jack in the canton is no longer representative IMHO and hopefully something like Canada has got is just around the corner.

I remember fondly queuing as a serving commisioned officer in the ROYAL Australian Air Force at the Heathrow immigration line ('others' ie not EU) as the Lufthansa flight lands.

They go through, I finally get to the front after the African and Indian contingent...

The Ghanian lady with braided hair who is your immigration officer asks: "what is your business in the UK?".
Me: "Hmmm drink some of your fine ale, sail off the Isle of Wight, enjoy the ambience of your history whilst taking in a museum, the National Gallery once again, maybe more Ale and catch a test match",
Immigration Officer: "Who's playing?",
Me: "England and Australia at Twickers",
Immigration Officer: "I don't know anything about that game, are you telling the truth?".
Me: "Hmmm, maybe you should learn more about British culture and whats going on in your own country"..

My parting shot..."you have been to war twice in the last 90 years with the country of those in that fast queue, whilst my countrymen have bled and died for you in those conflicts. Do you see anything wrong with the fact that they sail thru and I get the 3rd degree whilst I serve in one of those said forces and have a Commission from Her Majesty, your boss?". She had no idea what I was alluding to.:ugh:

Clockwork Mouse
27th Dec 2007, 10:30
It is a widely held but incorrect belief that the Queen has influence but no power. The beauty of the system is that, while she plays no executive part in the daily government of the country, she is the ultimate protection of our constitution (and yours too) against take-over by a dictator. If it ever comes to the big crunch, she can disolve parliament and compel a general election. That should hopefully prevent illegal usurping of power by a would be Adolf.

ORAC
27th Dec 2007, 10:36
So which other country is flying OUR flag?? The only similar one is NZ and it's basically a State of Oz anyway.
A little (Royal) bit of the USA....... State flag of Hawaii:

Hawaii was once an independent kingdom. (1810 - 1893) The flag was designed at the request of King Kamehameha I. It has eight stripes of white, red and blue that represent the eight main islands. The flag of Great Britain is emblazoned in the upper left corner to honor Hawaii's friendship with the British.

http://www.50states.com/flag/image/nunst016.gif

ORAC
27th Dec 2007, 10:42
Flag of Tuvalu: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Tuvalu) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/38/Flag_of_Tuvalu.svg/250px-Flag_of_Tuvalu.svg.png

Flag of Fiji: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Fiji) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/ba/Flag_of_Fiji.svg/250px-Flag_of_Fiji.svg.png

BOFH
27th Dec 2007, 11:12
ORAC

Is that Tuvalu flag just something for Christmas?

Bad news, TC. Nothing has changed.

I bet a beer with an Australian I'd never met before in the UK resident queue at LHR that he'd get through the visitor's queue more quickly than I. He was behind me, accepted, and I lost. I still feel like a Gastarbeiter sometimes when dealing with the authorities, in contrast to the genuine friendliness of many British.

BOFH

Track Coastal
27th Dec 2007, 11:43
in contrast to the genuine friendliness of many British.

The growing social garbage notwithstanding (Chavs)...the more' socially' old fashioned English, Scottish and Welsh on the mainland are fantastic. Always friendly, always in for an ale and a chat. The problem is...getting caught by the Chavs at closing time.

Confuse this constitutional monarchy's flag with someone else:

http://www.appliedlanguage.com/flags_of_the_world/large_flag_of_canada.gif

Binoculars
27th Dec 2007, 11:59
I would be horrified to think that any Brit would take my views as anti-British. My mother was English, my paternal grandfather from County Sligo. This has nothing to do with personalities. I love the good-natured thrust and parry between those soap-fearing poms and the loud-mouthed beer-swilling uncultured aussies, and long may it continue.

I feel the same way about the Kiwis, and I suspect most aussies do too in the final washup. (I'm not at all sure the same percentage of Kiwis think the same way, but that's just Queensland vs NSW taken one step further. Above all, I think all the countries mentioned have a fine history of accepting people for what they are; a good bloke in Australia can hail from anywhere, and a good bloke is a bloody good thing to be. Other countries may use a slightly different vernacular, but the underlying sentiment remains the same.

No, this discussion is purely politics, it's image, it's symbolism, it's an index of how we see ourselves as a country: and to be perfectly honest, not a thing would change in the daily lives of 99.9% of Australians if the mooted changes were whisked in overnight under cover of darkness.

Discuss, enjoy the discussion, then decide bugger it; let's have another beer and get back to the cricket.

Wiley
27th Dec 2007, 18:41
Track Coastal, I had a very similar experience some years ago at Heathrow, but my 'English' Customs Officer was a very heavily-accented Sikh, who asked all the same questions of me.

After about the sixth question, I said something along the lines of "Y'know, I don't think you mob required my father to get a visa when he came over here in 1941." It was wasted on the man - he didn't have a clue what I was talking about.

On the question of an anthem: I vote :)for "Tie Me Kangaroo Down Sport" sung to that truly stirring British tune "Land of Hope and Glory". Every stanza fits the tune perfectly, right down to the lump in the throat final "so we tanned is hide when he died, Clyde, (voices rising) and that's it ha-ng-ing on the shed," (da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da), "So we tanned is hide when he died, Clyde, (voices dropping) and that's it ha-ng-ingggggg on the shed."

tinpis
27th Dec 2007, 18:59
Agree with your choice of anthem Wiley :ok:
However the verse "Let me Abos go loose Lou.." may need a bit of work. :hmm:

Wiley
27th Dec 2007, 19:28
Yeah... that particular stanza might require a bit of serious work to make it PC, tins.

frostbite
27th Dec 2007, 20:02
Let the Asbos go loose?

Wiley
27th Dec 2007, 20:25
"Give an ASBO to Bruce, Bruce"?

(Anyone who watched the Monty Python 'Bruce' skit will know we're all called "Bruce".)

Charlie Foxtrot India
27th Dec 2007, 23:23
This here's the Wattle
The emblem of our land
You can put it in a bottle
You can hold it in your hand

Amen!

allan908
28th Dec 2007, 00:51
The only similarity is the Union Flag in the corner. Only Oz and NZ have a dark blue background with stars in the shape of the Southern Cross. Our stars are white (with extras) and EnZuds is red (with no extras).

In a few weeks time I shall be wearing my Oz flag shorts, thongs, hat and T shirt while disporting myself on my Oz flag beach towel as I celebrate, along with 21 million others, Australia Day.

PS Just so long as we don't adopt this one-eyed rag

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c92/allan907/bungflag.gif

BOFH
28th Dec 2007, 01:47
It's following me around the room - reminds me of goatse [0].

BOFH
[0] If you do not know what that means, do NOT find out. Just leave it.

DirtyPierre
29th Dec 2007, 06:02
Binos,

I'm with you mate. Lets become a republic and change the flag.

As for our national anthem. I like the words, but we should sing it to the tune of Cold Chisel's "Working Class Man". and in the ilk of Jimmy Barnes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7T8pCi-tKk

7x7
29th Dec 2007, 10:24
Gawd, I keep expecting Big Brother's voice to come out of my computer if I look at that big yellow dot for more than a few seconds.

allan908
29th Dec 2007, 10:26
Don't think of it as a dot - think of it as a blot (on the landscape)

merlinxx
29th Dec 2007, 21:41
Kevin 'B' Wilson for Home Affairs & International Cultural Affairs Minister.

I speak as a Taffia member living as a Pom in Pomistan Sussex.

A question to all my chums in OZ, why is our sense of humor, our slang, our method of telling jokes, our appreciation of taking the piss out of each other, and the comfort of living in each others country so in bloody tune?

Be what the **** you want to be, just stay as you are, don't go all feckin 'Septic' on us!

PS: I had to explain the slang in the movie The Odd Angry Shot to some of my US crew in the big Sandpit back in the early 80s, don't think they were happy!

Just get the ABV of your beer up to scratch.

tinpis
31st Dec 2007, 21:29
The question of Statehood has reared its head in the NT (http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/01/01/2129683.htm?section=justin) again
Suitable names? :hmm:

Wiley
31st Dec 2007, 22:03
Rather than make the NT a State, I'd like to see them do away with the rest of the States.