EVA looses 10% of pilot workforce

[Agent Mulder]

its the end of 2007 and 70 pilots have left this year. Surely must be time for a pay rise. Emirates need 500 Pilots next year and they accept the taiwan ATPL.

[armchairpilot94116]

I understand EVA is becoming known as a good Pilot training center with its SIMS and achievement of flight hours for previously non type rated pilots who are now worth a lot more to other airlines. Relatively low pay , SIM facilities and eager non type rated recruits add up to this.

[El Lobo Solo]

No bond there to keep folks from leaving?

[armchairpilot94116]

I heard there is a bond but not many people pay it. Tends to be an individual thing. The amount and payment depends on how good a negotiator you are. HOwever, most previously non type rated pilots will stay on a few years to build up the hours anyway so everyones happy. EVA gets the needed copilots for a few years and always has many eager to join to replace those that leave.

Heard the training is first class and the jets shiny and new .

[MonsterC01]

There is a bond with eva, 4 years and $30 000 USD for jet applicants, and as per the turbo prop contract on offer the bond is 6 years, or $60 000 USD. The bond doesn't begin to reduce until 3 years after your checked to the line ( turbine app. ). It's not to clear as to what will happen if you break this bond. In the passed the company has been resonably willing to negotiate with individuals as to how much they should pay. Will be interesting to see how willing they are to do the same in the future when the pilot shortage begins to bit.
Also in the past all of the pilots who have left came to eva with jet ratings and 1000's of jet hours. So it's pretty hard to tell someone like that that you expect to receive the bond in full. Especially when many of the countries these guys are returning to don't recognise bonding as legal.
One thing's for sure, Eva is going to have to ramp up recruitment if they want to avoid parking up planes next year. They're not getting the jet applicants they use to in the past ( hence the recruitment of turbine pilots), and it takes about 8 months to get a turbine pilot checked to the line, and 2 years for a local cadet.
It's kind of hard to understand why the company is so unwilling to improve the T & C for the current crew to try and keep them. It wouldn't take much, besides the low basic pay, non-exsistant super sch, and no 100% universal healthcare for family or educational assistance, this IS a fantastic job. We receive training that is the envy of every major airline in the world, we get decent layovers in great destinations, we get to fly some of the best equipment around, and the local pilots are some of the best operators i've ever flown with ( and nice guys as well ).
It's no mystery to me why Eva use to be one of the best gig's around. Unfortunatly the short sighted focus of the company is in danger of changing that for the worst. If something isn't done soon they are in danger of becoming the best airline training centre around. And that would be a shame.

[El Lobo Solo]

6 years is a long time....:eek:

[boocs]

Is G(or J) K still flying there? Ex-AN from the late 90's.

[varigflier]

How much does a first year F/O make? Does the pay go up with time?

[MonsterC01]

FO's get paid $3500 USD a month base,
overtime above 50 hrs a month ( avg over a 3 mth period ),
$ 3 USD per duty hour away from base per diem,
and avg 13th mth salary at the comp. of very 12 mth's of service.

There is no scheduled annual increments for FO's or Capt's.

[varigflier]

Wow, that is really low pay.

[armchairpilot94116]

Well its a trade off. YOu get the training and the hours. And the 13th month of pay takes care of most of your annual taxes (if you are Taiwan based longer then six months) . Low taxes and a high standard of living at about 70pct of what similar costs in the USA. That makes things a bit better. Plus very cheap and excellent health care. And a room at the company owned dorm at the airport. You are probably going to net 4000 to 5000/month.

Certain things like an American school education for your kids though? Thats something else. Its something like 10,000 dollars/year per child in high school !

Thats what I hear.

[El Lobo Solo]

Medical and dental :}for the family as well?

[armchairpilot94116]

I think someone replied not for the family, but health care insurance is very inexpensive in Taiwan. In fact the government of Taiwan requires all citizens and legal residents to have full medical coverage.

Far as I know.

[RedLiner]

I heard a very large percentage of the pilot workforce commute into Tiwan -- How true is this? How open is mngt. to the idea of pilots commuting?

[armchairpilot94116]

You can go to the unofficial EVA site www.nankantraz.org (http://www.nankantraz.org) to read the forums on life in EVA.

However, be forewarned most of the posters there are unhappy. The happy ones hardly post there it seems.

Thats what I gathered anyway.

Apparently quite a few pilots operate from North America. JUst dont miss your flight as some F/O did recently :)

http://nankantraz.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=208




YOu could ask alll your questions there too and someone probably will answer? And dont forget to tell us here.

[El Lobo Solo]

Thanks for the link. Some interesting stuff there.

Aloha.

[Stike82]

There are currently strong opportunities within EVA at the moment. I am currently on the 77W (Capt) at the moment having moved from an airline I had been with for 33 years. I certainly enjoy it and if you are non type rated many is the example now where training is provided free within the terms of the contract. Pilots are needed guys, what can I say. Having said that I did have 500 hours on the 777 prior to joining. I transferred over from the 742 having spent almost 12 years on it. At 54 my older carrier moved me over to the 777 just prior to retirement at 55. Now seeing out the career until 60 anyway or perhaps more. Love the airline and Taipei.

[TWN PPL]

Stike82, Strong opportunities within EVA?

My question to you is what made you choose EVA over others Airline? And when did EVA start to hire direct entry Captin again?

What kind of pay scale EVA start you off with... C10 pay? What kind of exchange rate guarantee do you have. Because the last time I checked they were paying Taiwan dollars. Why did you choose to work for $3,000 USD less per month when there are other contract out there on the 777.

Why are you so new to this forums; when you been flying for the last 33yrs.

(Love the airline and Taipei) :confused: She must be very gorgeous

[Stike82]

Im just calling it as it as I see it. I have a pension that delivers 2/3 of my leaving salary so I can afford not to be on major money - I speak mandarin fluently so the culture is easy for me to adapt to. Like I say, just calling it as I see it

[Agent Mulder]

Just heard another Turbo prop pilot has left......thats 2 out of 18.Whos next

[armchairpilot94116]

http://www.reuters.com/article/blogBurst/investing?type=hotStocksNews&w1=B7ovpm21IaDoL40ZFnNfGe&w2=B7pJeHult9GszE37UXlSpmUm&src=blogBurst_investingNews&bbPostId=Cz7Y1BqvjAQapCz8Mv4CGBCVIICz4uL72N1jWrEBBnegTJ1LSL8&bbParentWidgetId=B7gSUbux1hpbz8uOa7TWsLnV

[diablo_caliente]

Stike82. Please check your PM's. Thanks.

[blackbird71]

Lets play a game called Close your eyes and dont pay pilots more until parking planes costs more than a payrise.

I hear its quite popular at the moment.

[El Lobo Solo]

Thanks for the article link. I don't know how short-sighted companies can be, but apparently, they'll never figure out that people leaving is a direct result of the working conditions that they impose on their employees. I hope someone works it out soon and starts to fix the problem. :(

[EL CAPITAN]

:bored:Guys there are no Direct entry Captains in EVA anymore, and on the 777??? give me a break, this guy is trying ti stir things up a little bit. Stike82 get out of here....

[El Lobo Solo]

Wait.....are you saying that there AREN'T "strong opportunities" there?:confused:

[EL CAPITAN]

Yes, there are opportunities but as FO, not as DEC.......:ok:

[Stike82]

El Captain please, I am really not interested in mud slinging here. Its not my thing. My god, when I read that article the data protection act springs to mind. Have rishworth any sense at all ?? They deserve any backlash coming there way as a result of that :confused:

[kwaiyai]

As friend of mine said you pays yer money and takes yer choice. There is a lot worse out there aka W:mad: air for example. As for my friend over there or so he is at least earning heavy EFIS Hrs.
30000 usd ? doesnt sound correct. But please correct me if I am Wrong and Apologies If I am. For example how about E???e Jet Deal at Air Asia, I thought they Paid for 500 hrs? or something.
I dont work for this Outfit so spare the Joke replies Lagi Lah:p
suggestion log it and go like all of us. How you do it is your Choice in the first place:ok:.

[EL CAPITAN]

Stike82 I'm just saying that there are no DECs on the 777 or any other airplane in EVA, the rest I don't know what you are talking about...:p

[Stike82]

There are quite a few DEC on the B77W and MD90 at the moment as it happens. Im not sure where you are getting your info from but you must be miss informed :confused:

[zip29]

strike82

I have been in EVA for 12 years, and have seen some ill-informed nonsense posted about the company............but yours really takes the biscuit.

El Capitan is correct; there have been no DECs for 8 or 9 years now. What are your motives for such bare-assed lies?

Please go away.

[Stike82]

Zip maybe you should indeed zip it ! I have said it before I am only calling it as it is. If you want to spread mis information that is your business but to have the blatent cheek to turn around and tell other to walk away as the facts dont fit with your story :confused: Anyway, enough said. I can only imagine that the people want to hear the reality of what is going on, so perhaps instead of wasting their time we can keep focus on the topic at hand and inform them in an appropriate and honest means which is exactly as I have done

[flycold]

Hi, armchairpilot94116, EL CAPITAN ...
Please check your PM.
Good flight!:ok:

[Flying Mechanic]

25 percent pay rise acrosss the board.........otherwise aircraft will be parked!

[blackbird71]

:D Word on the street is the exodus is set to continue throughout 2008.
I think 30% after tax should stem the flow for you guys somewhat.

[MonsterC01]

Don't worry about stike 82, something tells me he does reside in 1 of the 2 green EVA buildings in Nan-can. Just not the pilot dorm building!!!

[Stike82]

Aww gents what can I say, Im really not interested in a mud slinging match here. I dont feel interested to comment on this matter anymore. Believe as you wish but clearly there are some mud slingers here. I can only assume that these guys are trying to fender off any potential competition when they themselves submit application. Happy flying

[TWN PPL]

Any pinhead who had been or is flying around the region knows you are being deluding. What is your purpose and why are you doing this 82? I been in the Airline for 16 years and I really don't know where you are coming from.

[coltrane]

Hi,
Apparently a lot of people are leaving eva, but nevertheless I am interested in working there.. I’m in my early twenties, want to go to Asia and I’m about to get my ATPL. Are there some (ex) eva pilots around willing to help me with some questions …?

-Is it possible to commute to Taipei from europe? (schedule wise?)
- Since I only have turboprop experience I will apply for the cargo fleet. Includes this the 744 as well? Or only the md11?
-What are the living costs on Taipei?
-What does the recruitment process look like?

Thanks,
Cheerio!

[El Lobo Solo]

Why not PM some people who appear to work there instead of posting your resume here? That might be a better plan. :ok:

[Flying Mechanic]

with turbo prop time you can only go on the MD11.
living cost in taiwan are low, u get free accomdation, and its cheap to live, unless you go on the beer alot.
recruitment process pretty standard for any airline, sim ride, english test, interview and medical. The medical is a bit thorough than JAR.
If your interested, fill out the application and see u get the call up!

[reaz]

Checked the EVA Website.
Is there any way of applying online?
Or, I have to Download and Fillout the forms and send through Mails!

[MonsterC01]

There's no way of applying on line. You have to download the application and fill it out. You will also have to attach all of the supporting documents with your application. It takes a while to complete, but once you submit it they're very quick to respond. If you don't have ALL of the min experiance requirements or sup. doc's, wait until you do. If you don't they will just throw your application in the bin. They don't maintain a hold file at EVA.

[coltrane]

ok, thanks for the info.. I don't have a cat 2/3 endorsement mentioned in the application form, since my company is only cat 1 certified... does this mean they won't take my application into consideration??

[dingo222]

I'm in the same situation. It seems even with the shortage globally, nobody wants t-prop drivers. I can't fly for emerites, qatar, or anything in Japan, lol. I may have to send eva and CX a resume

[MonsterC01]

Obviously for the turbo prop applicants the CAT II / III endo is not required. That's more for the jet applicants that go straight to the transition training.

[HelloKitty330]

Strike82
Sorry, there are no new direct entry B777 Captains 55+ years old with EVA

[Stike82]

Not meaning to drag this through further however some of you are really just asking for it coming back and back and having a pop at me. There ARE currently direct entry positions within EVA contrary to some opinions on this site. El Captain, I am personally aware of captains who are over 60 here (main focus would be on domestic & intra asian routes however). I dont know what your angle is here to advise otherwise, no doubt you have a self serving one though. My interest is to provide honest information to would be interested joiners.

[Brianigham]

Looks like same #### different smell.
Look.......If pilots who have been around for awhile are leaving in droves.....something is wrong. Most of the time its got something to do with the paycheck and a few goons who wanted to be top gun but flunked out and are now sit behind the desk.
So if the truth must be told.
You need a payrise!
Why not!
All the best guys.

[EL CAPITAN]

Stike Dude , that stuff you are smoking is gonna kill you, nobady here can follow what you are talking in your posts, as of me I'm checking out....see ya:D

[coastiewantstofly]

got a quick question for anyone with some insider info about a eva air ab initio flight training program. my mom has a friend in taiwan whose son was apparantly picked up for it. does this training program exist? if so how might i get more inforation on it? thanks for any help.....

[Stike82]

Just speaking the truth El Captain, try it sometime - guess what, it costs nothing and that has to be worth a read therefore ;)

[armchairpilot94116]

A friend of mine was selected for the EVA ab initio program some years back. He was working for Evergreen Marine at the time. He didnt make it. Basically EVA would expect you to fly for them for a decade or two after the 18 month training , which takes you from zero time to the right seat of an airliner. I would say its a fantastic opportunity for a pilot wannabee.

The program is only open to ROC citizens though, far as I know. They are looking for young , healthy persons who want to fly as an airline pilot and who clearly show an aptitude for it. CAL had or still has such a program as well.

I am not sure if EVA currently is still seeking such candidates.

[MonsterC01]

Coasstiewantstofly

Yes EVA still runs an ab initio cadet scheme, but as armchair pilot says it's just for ROC Nationals. If your a ROC national it's a pretty sweet deal. The training takes about two years to complete, but the company pays for everything during that time. The only catch is that you have to sign a 15 year bond.

A note of caution thou, if you've been living out of town you'd better brush up on your mandarin, as the classes are only given in the native language.

[El Lobo Solo]

15 :mad: years? YGTBSM! :eek:

[armchairpilot94116]

Think of it as Job Security? They wont fire you for fifteen whole years !! And you get to fly all sorts of hours for years for the cargo fleet and at 2/3 the salary of pilots who came in as F/O (and they are underpaid versus the competition too). But beats sitting in an office in Taipei making 1K/month flying a desk though ?

If you started at say 21, you come out 15 years later as a very experienced F/O at 36 ready to take on the world ! Sort of :)

[coastiewantstofly]

thanks everyone for the information! i grew up in taiwan, went to TAS and i'm an american citizen, so i guess i'm out of the running.

[F.O. 737-800]

I have 1500hrs total with 1300 of those on the 737, would I be eligable for PAX or only Cargo if I applied? Does anyone no on average what you would take home per month as an F.O. PAX and Cargo?
Thanks for your replies

[missingblade]

The reason EVA and CAL pay their expat FO's so little is cause they pay their Taiwanese employees even less. This causes problems - an expat FO cannot be seen to earn more than a local Captain - very bad for morale. The only people who are more unhappy than the expats at these companies are the locals - they really get treated like dirt and are tied to the job through bonds and the fact that the Taiwan Licence is not ICAO.

It is only worthwhile joining as a Captain - you can get a fair deal that way. Some Expat Captains get us much as US $ 15 000 or more. Depending on their negotiating skills. Many different salaries and contracts - changes constantly. If you really really need jet time then it might be worthwhile to sacrifice two years or so over there and get some hours that will enable you to move on.

[Flying Mechanic]

If you have 1500 and ICAO ATPL, then u will have a chnace for 747/777/MD11 at Eva. MD11 is the best fleet by far. If u do 80-90 hours a month, u will average 5 K US after tax. Why dont u apply, come for a 5 day holiday to Tai Pei and have look see.

[MonsterC01]

Heard today that as of next month there parking up one of the 744 freighters due to crew shortage. They better get busy reviewing the pay soon or 1 will quickly become 2,3,4..............