Poor security, a danger to us all!

[Jennifer Crilly]

What does everyone else make of the new tight
security procedures?
My experience of it so far is that I'm not impressed. I got stuck in Florida after Sept 11 and operated a rescue flight back to London five days later (one of the first international flights to leave) and our flight engineer managed to get on the aircraft with a six inch knife in his flight case! I submitted an ASR, what is the use the x-ray staff need a good kick up the a**. On the other side of the coin they're going mad for incidentals, ie our whole crew were stopped and made hand in their ice tongs! I mean what are you going to do tong someone into letting you into the flight deck! in the mean time we have a cart onboard full of metal cutlery when are they going to get it right?
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Red Minx]

We actually ditched the metal cutlery - but somehow managed to keep the glass glasses! surely broken glass could be a serious weapon or have they not thought of that??? :rolleyes:

[Jennifer Crilly]

Yeah Minx,
We were have supposed to have ditched the metal cutlery as well but my point is that things are still getting through. I totally agree with the glass, glasses comment it is ludicrous to think that, that has'nt occured to them...what about bottles apart from being able to use them as weapons they contain highly flammible liquid! it goes on and on. :confused:

[Jennifer Crilly]

Yeah Minx,
We were supposed to ditch the metal cutlery too, but my point is that things are still getting through. I totally agree with your point about glass, glasses it seems ludicrous to me to give a pax plastic cutlery and in the other hand give them another potential weapon or do you think this has'nt occured to the security dept?
Also what about bottles?, not only that they can be used as a weapon but they contain highly flammible liquid which could also be a threat...the list goes on and on.

[LondonRMA]

From the martial arts instructor perspective:

Plastic and metal knoves are equally dangerous. A credit card, a piece of plastic "glass" with sharp edges, can of Coke which had been torn in two, your keys, the clasp on the metal bracelet on your Rolex, eyeglasses, your hands if you position them in the right places (i.e. eyes, throat)- all these things can be lethal with the right training and a certain frame of mind.

I am not sure how practical it is to ban everything that can be considered dangerous.

It seems to me the responses of the airline industry to the Sep 11 events are not necessarily designed to make things better/safer, but to change the perception and make public and air crews feel like something is being done.

However, the most importange change has already happened: awareness and alertness have increased, among the crew and among the passengers.

With a bit of training and knowing that the consequence of doing nothing is likely to be death, most people are sufficiently motivated to participate in the mid-air problem solving, IMHO.

David

[Red Minx]

David - I agree totelly with what you say. You can remove as much sharp equipment as you like ut at the end of the day, a pair of hands may be all that is needed. And yes you are correct in your observation that yes - at least we're doing something.
The main thing I have noticed is our improved security checks. Every single person thoroughly checks every nook and crany when cleaners etc have disembarked where as I know for a fact some crew were previously a little slap dash in this area. We relied too much on the security people who came on to check the LHR/LGW outbound A/C and were only expected to check our planes inbound from outstations. We are now even checking lifejacket stowages and the pouches that contain them and anything remotely 'not right' is removed and replaced. I'm sure you can imagine how long this takes on a 747 but I for one am only to glad to comply. It's our lives up there - not the security people and everyone has a duty to not only look out for colleagues but look after number one. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[mutt]

This is getting totally out of hand, take a walk around the LHR duty free shopping area and look at the number of items that you could turn into weapons!

Or even take a look around your own aircrafts cabin, you could start with the mirror in the toilet!

Trying to stop people from bringing stuff on board isnt the answer, while this may stop the "old traditional hijacker", it most certainly will not stop a determined attacker.

Mutt.

[wam bam]

Where as I agree with all those who say anything can be a dangerous weapon, (I even had my spoon taken off me from security!?) if someone came at me with an icetong, glass bottle, credit card etc, I would have a good go at fighting back, and I am sure people would come to my aid, however a knife is different. A hijacker can kill quickely and easily with a knife, but if his weapon was say an icetong, it would take longer, and he could then be overpowered by other people. If the hijackers on that dreadful day had icetongs, glass bottles etc as weapons, I think the outcome would have been different.
I am quite concerned about the crash axes on board though!

[flyblue]

Wam Bam,
my company removed the axes from the aircrafts, except the one in the Flight Deck. I am wondering how they got the permission, as it is a legal requirement.

[dumiel]

I AM SADDENED THAT MY COMPANY STILL ALLOWS REGULAR AMOUNTS OF HANDLUGGAGE WHILST NEARLY ALL OTHER AIRLINES ARE RESTRICTING HANDLUGGAGE TO ONLY NECESSARY ITEMS SUCH AS MEDICINE ETC.BUSINESS CLASS AND FIRST ARE STILL ALLOWING FULL 18KG LUGGAGE ON BOARD AND SECONDARY SECURITY CHECKS ON THE GROUND ARE ONLY FOR USA FLIGHTS NOW. THESE CHECKS ARE STILL ONLY RANDOM. IT IS WELL KNOWN THAT KNIVES WITH A BLADE SHORTER THAN 6INCES ARE RARELY PICKED UP BY NORMAL PASSENGER X RAY MACHINES. I FEEL THIS WAS THE IDEAL OPPORTUNITY TO ADDRESS MANY MORE PROBLEMS THAT SUCH EXCESSIVE CABIN LUGGAGE POSES NOT ONLY FOR SECURITY BUT ALSO TO HEALTH AND SAFETY? :confused: