Wheels up at TSVL

[crack-up]

Word is a Mooney scraped its belly on 07 at TSVL today. Any more info out there?:confused:

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

Better a Mooni than a Bonana!

Dr :8

[ABX]

Doc,

I'm sure there is a 'z' key on your keyboard mate!:ok:

Or did you mean that the Mooney is now a banana?:}

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

One Mooney wheels-up today is unfortunate ......

...... but two Mooney wheels-ups in one day - on opposite sides of the country - is just plain spooky!

Dr :8

[Chadzat]

Dr- other mooney wheels up at PJT was a few weeks ago.

Still- it hasn't been a good run!

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

"Dr- other mooney wheels up at PJT was a few weeks ago."

Oh yes, silly me! I didn't notice. However I won't pull my previous post cause that would leave yours hanging in mid-air and you will look stupid rather than me!

That said, the only Mooney I have seen hanging around TL lately is a very, very nice one with the sweetest sounding IO550 up front. Will check it out in the morning and report back.

Dr :8

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

Well! There is good news and bad news.

First the bad news: My worst fears have been realised. The sweet sounding Mooney referred to above is looking a little battered and bruised this morning.

Now the good news: It was "landed" with nil gear, and nil flap - thus minimising damage to the latter.

Damage is largely confined to a trimmed prop, damaged underbelly skin, gear doors and step.

..... and I suspect a somewhat bruised owner's ego!

Dr

[Wanderin_dave]

So it was just a cock up?

With the flap left up there's no chance he was aware that the gear was up and was deliberately minimising damage?

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

No, apparently there was no problem with the gear - apart from the fact that it was up when it should have been down!

Dr

[Wanderin_dave]

Yeah, that'd be a problem. Cheers Doc :ok:

[Jabawocky]

Interesting.........Do they not use flap for landing?

So did he forget flap and gear?:ooh:

And you are right, better a mooney than a FTDK!

J:ok:

PS.....Jaba...dont forget the gear, dont forget...........

[Lasiorhinus]

However I won't pull my previous post cause that would leave yours hanging in mid-air and you will look stupid rather than me!

Never stops you when its MY post that ends up looking stupid :ok::}

[crack-up]

Well come, on some one must know by now, did he forget the flaps as well as the gear? :confused::confused::confused::confused:

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

Crack-up

Do I gotta draw you a diagram?

YES, the pilot did not place either the flap switch or the gear switch in the "down" position!

Dr :8

[Desert Flower]

YES, the pilot did not place either the flap switch or the gear switch in the "down" position!
I think that comes under the heading of "If you're going to have a "senior" moment, make it a good one!" :{

DF.

[crack-up]

maverick18
"come on crack up, i thought you knew everything that was happening around the airport!"

No not every thing, only what I am told, and my source didn't qualify the whole scenario.


ForkTailedDrKiller
"Do I gotta draw you a diagram? YES, the pilot did not place either the flap switch or the gear switch in the "down" position!"

And probably ignored the alarm and big red flashing light!

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

"And probably ignored the alarm and big red flashing light!"

CU - I have been wondering about that myself. Been a while since I have flown a Mooney, but I assume that, like the Bonanza, if you bring the MP back below a certain limit with the gear still up, the gear warning horn sounds. Don't know about the "big red flashing light".

The Mooney that is the subject of this post had speed brakes, which leaves one to speculate that it may have been driven on to the runway at higher than normal power setting, because the speed brakes were deployed thru the approach.

Dr :8

[PinkusDickus]

FTDK

Do we have a rego or color of the said Mooney?

If it has the IO-550 it would be the M20R Ovation I'd guess.

[Tmbstory]

There is an old saying in Aviation.


There are two types of pilots in aviation: Those who have landed with the whees up and those who are going to land with the wheels up.

Tmb

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

"There are two types of pilots in aviation: Those who have landed with the wheels up and those who are going to land with the wheels up"

I wondered how long it would take before "the old saying in aviation" turned up.

There are actually three type of pilots: those who have landed with the wheels up; those who are going to land with the wheels up; and (thankfully!) the vast majority of pilots who see out their flying careers having NEVER landed with the wheels up - accidently or otherwise!

The "old saying" is championed by those pilots who have f*cked up big-time, in a vain attempt to make themselves feel better.

Accidental wheels-up landings are entirely preventable by good SOPs and training - something that appears to be sadly lacking in many parts of Ozzie aviation.

Dr :8

[kiwiblue]

There are actually three type of pilots: those who have landed with the wheels up; those who are going to land with the wheels up; and (thankfully!) the vast majority of pilots who see out their flying careers having NEVER landed with the wheels up - accidently or otherwise!

The "old saying" is championed by those pilots who have f*cked up big-time, in a vain attempt to make themselves feel better.

Accidental wheels-up landings are entirely preventable by good SOPs and training - something that appears to be sadly lacking in many parts of aviation. with a minor modification

Hear hear FTDK, well spoken :ok: Far too many of these self-perpetuating 'myths' are accepted as gospel truth.

[bushy]

But if you think it can never happen to you, then it probably will.
It's strange that they have not yet made a good auto gear system, although they have had many tries.
The best auto gear system is to develop a HABIT of checking wheels whenever you see a runway ahead. WITHOUT EXCEPTION, regardless of what type of aeroplane you are flying that day. Make sure it becomes and remains a habit. Then it will happen automatically on that day when you are tired,and under many stresses. The day you forget the checklist, or checklist items.
Checklists can be great or can be a hindrance if they are too long and silly. Our govt agencies nearly always tell us that checklists are the magic fixit for anything. Many gearups have been made by pilots with good SOP's and checklists. A Psychologist from Farnborough aircraft establishment once told us that on nearly all the gearup incidents he looked at the crew had gone through the checklist and said "geardown three greens." One Captain, after landing said "there is something wrong with the brakes"
A good checklist is great, and we should use them properly. But they are not infallible. If you use the runway sighting to trigger a gear check, you have a reliable backup. IF YOU DEVELOP THE HABIT.

[frog-less]

Does ATC always check that the gear are down, you often hear 'check gear' call from ATC for some aircraft. Is there any responsibility for ATC? at towered aerodromes? Hope the chap doesn't get too disheartened.

Anyway time for a jog up Castle Hill I think!:)

[fixa24]

Pretty sure ATC have no responsibility in checking gear down, except when an aircraft has been in not normal ops, we will give a check gear call with the landing clearance, same as military aircraft. Having said that, I do it (check that the gear is down)as habit, for i would rather not have my runway blocked for god knows how long whilst you sit on it with wheels up. Too much paperwork involved. Only twice have i seen an aircraft on final with no gear. 1st one they were trying to slow down enough to put it down :eek: and the other was a dual student under training. Needless to say they went around.

[Desert Flower]

There are actually three type of pilots: those who have landed with the wheels up; those who are going to land with the wheels up; and (thankfully!) the vast majority of pilots who see out their flying careers having NEVER landed with the wheels up - accidently or otherwise!

I'd go so far as to say there are four types of pilots, the three mentioned above then the ones that have landed with the wheels up more than once as an acquaintance of mine has! Said acquaintance has done it at least three times that I know of, with a possible fourth unconfirmed. :{

DF.

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

You hear the "Check wheels" call, for military traffic only, at places like YBTL that are joint military/civilian.

Dr :8

PS: Reported conversation between a CEO and the company Chief Pilot after the latter did a wheels-up in the company aircraft.

CEO: What would you do with someone who landed an aircraft wheels-up?
CP: I would sack them on the spot!
CEO: I'll keep that in mind ...... I suggest you don't do it again.

[BrokenConrod]

Story alledgedly goes that the pilot of this aircraft (who was also the owner), had been flying a C182 for the last 20 or so years and had only acquired the Mooney (his "dream" aircraft) in the last six months or so.

The flaps were up because his technique for landing was to round-out and then retract the flaps!

Apparently the gear warning horn sounded but he thought it was the GPS announcing his arrival at YBTL!

This would appear to be a training accident - ie a lack of appropriate training!

BC

[Brian Abraham]

Underling to CEO after fellow underlings cack up: "I suppose you'll sack him now?"
CEO: "Are you nuts? After all the money I've invested in his education."

[PA39]

Yep its called "the guts up club".