N reg and SICS legal in Europe?

[Pace]

I am flying as Captain on the CE550 aircraft in Europe on the N reg.

Not long ago it was possible to use a co-pilot who only held an FAA Multi IR

Then the new SIC (second in command) rating was required

Now I have been told that even the SIC is not acceptable and that the Co-pilot has now got to hold a full type rating to fly as crew on the CE550 in European airspace?

Does anyone know about this or is it false information?

Thanks

Pace

[Chilli Monster]

For part 91 ops - rubbish.

The certificate (licence) has a rating on it - that's all that matters. It doesn't differentiate between an SiC course at Flight Safety, or doing it using the ATP signoff method.

The SiC privileges rating was brought in to bring the US in line with the rest of ICAO. As far as the rest of the world is concerned the P2 has a rating, just with limited privileges. It was effectively European insistance that brought this about - they can't move the goalposts if they feel like it.

[G-SPOTs Lost]

Quite right CM, it is being very heavily policed by FAA inspectors who insist that it be issued within the US.

Dont just pitch up having done three landings one of them being OEI, you will be sent home empty handed.

The inspectors/examiners will expect to see a course completion certificate from an authorised 61.55 school or again a letter from a Chief Pilot stating exactly what training has been carried out such as upper airwork prec and non prec apprchs together with a OEI ILS, and dont forget a circling approach or your chap will be limited to VFR/Day circles only.

The SIC type rating issued on the FAA is in accordance with ICAO FCL so its bonafide and people cant object, it was brought about at the behest of the europeans.

Having said all that it was subject to years of abuse by people flying around with PPL/A&P's in the RHS seats of BBJ's etc etc.

I would also check with your insurers, they are now wise to this 2nd tier training and are insisting upon sim training for FO's within the last two years effectively slamming the door on SIC's

[1Bingo]

For Part 91 ops, SIC type rating is required and the certificate limitations state "SIC privelages only."

[NHAWK]

Can someone with a JAA IR and only a FAA SIC rating legally fly as P2 in a G or JAA reg C550?

[Gulfstreamaviator]

As a FAA/JAA ATP, with 61.58 and in current operation on GV and G550, I have been asked to SIC on a CL601.
I have a PIC type rating on the CL601, but not flown in recent years.
What must I do to be able to operate N reg CL601 outside the USA, in regard to recency on the type. Plus of course all other input appreciated.

glf

[1Bingo]

News Flash - yes, per FAR 61.55 there is currency on SIC qualification to perform and document 3 T/O and landing, engine out, etc within the last 12 months.

So, logging T/O and landings should not be such a big deal, but simulated engine out should probably be done with FAA instructor (or chief pilot, chief trng, etc) and no pax onboard - poor technique to bounce one on with PAX aboard!!

1 Bingo

[B200Drvr]

SIC rating that is done at various FAA TR institutions is the full course minus the final check ride. This gives a person a full type rating, but with the restriction (as stated above) "SIC privileges only"
This is the minimum requirement for a person to fly, outside the boarders of the CONUS, in the right seat of an "N" reg turbo jet aircraft that REQUIRES two pilots.

[bfato]

Did the CE-500 SiC TR in the US last month. To expand on the above:

The full course minus the full check ride but with a minimum of three take-offs and three full stop landings as sole manipulator. One approach and landing must be engine out. Additionally, one approach must be circling to avoid a further restriction on the rating.

[heliski22]

What puzzles me is the willingness to consider a second crew member up front who does not have a full type rating on the aircraft, regardless of legislative licinsing requirements.

If it's certified as a two crew ship (two pilots) then two crew are required to evenly distribute the workload and, of course, to enable a response to an emergency by way of incapacitation of one of the crew by the remaining pilot. What chance an inexperienced, non type-rated pilot trying to operate a two-crew ship on his own with a medical emergency in the other seat behind him?

Frankly, I don't even see that the subject merits any kind of serious discussion!