Ops Wannabe

[ops kid]

Hi there. I’m not sure if this should be here or on the Wannabes forum but never mind.

I’m leaving university this summer with good grades and am interested in a career in ground/flight operations. What I’m looking for is a little info on the different jobs available in this field. Buzz’s and BA’s website offer some information on this but, for instance, what is the different between ops and pre-ops (from Buzz)

Thanks.

[Harvey SM]

Just out of interest, what did you study at University? Was it aviation related, and if not what made you interested in working in an ops environment? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="confused.gif" /> Dont get me wrong...... It's a good vocation and I thoroughly enjoyed my last 6 years in operational roles (now working with asylum seekers!!!! - slightly different!). .There is a difference between ops and pre-ops.... however, i cant recal that exact difference (I remember Virgin had both departments).. .Good luck anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

[JoyDivision]

Ops kid,. .. .In answer to your question, there are several fields available, Ops which depending on the setup of each airline can be computerised or manual, encompassing flight watch, flight planning, route creation, slot control and schedule adjustment. Pre ops would perform this function for flights between 3 and 30 days away.. .. .Crew control which can be more difficult, the name says it all, again on a day to day basis or at a stage post roster publication but pre release to day to day crew control.. .. .Roster creation (scheduling) again the clue is in the title.. .. .Most airlines have at least 2 levels in these fields, controller and assistant. Some airlines have other specialisations such as nav services or maintenance control (maintrol) lumped in with operations. As with operations sometimes the function of each position is computerised sometimes manual.. .. .Expect to start at the bottom I'm afraid.. .Hope this helps

[ops kid]

Harvey SM: My degree subject is Physics. I have always been interested in aviation and airlines and have previously worked in ground handling at an airport.

JoyDivision: Thanks for the info. With regard to “starting at the bottom”, what is a ballpark average salary for a “bottom of the latter” job in this field for a graduate?

Is the operations department the usual starting place for those who eventually end up being station managers for airlines, or do they progress up from some other department?

[Harvey SM]

In my experience, starting at the bottom literally means just that..... BA are the only airline that I know (someone correct me if I am wrong) that offer specific graduate entry employment. Experience is the main quality employers are looking for and I am sure that they would consider your time spent working for a ground handling agent....... I doubt very much that they would be bothered about a degree.. .When I started out, I was on a pathetic £9000!, although after gaining vaulable experience I progressed to £13500, until more recently £20500.. .I hope this is of help to you, and good luck if you do decide to work in an ops environment.. .As long as you've got a good sense of humour, you're thick skinned, a good team player, and work well under pressure you will do fine. It may not be the best paid job in the world but its really good fun. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

[ops kid]

Not bothered about a degree?! :eek:

The average graduate with a physical sciences degree starts on £18,500. The average one with 1st class honours (which I expect to get) starts on nearer £23,000. And now you tell me I’ve got £9000 to look forward to. :(

Have I really wasted the last 3 years of my life at university? Actually, for £9,000, it sounds like doing A-levels was a waste of time as well. That’s 5 years (or one quarter) of my life I seem to have wasted on gaining useless bits of paper. :mad:

[waco]

If you are expecting a first class degree in a science do not waste it working in ops.... .. .Get a job with long term prospects and a career path. Yes, playing with aeroplanes can be fun. The travel is also excellent, however, you may find yourself somewhat frustrated in years to come.. .. .If you would like a futher chat, feel free to send me an e-mail.. .. .Cheers

[Harvey SM]

Ops Kid........... don't want to sound like a complete w**ker, but......... welcome to the real world! Degrees in ops count for absolutely nothing. The 'average graduate' does not even know what an operations dept is! (You have the upper hand - congrats <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> . .I doubt very much that you will get a salary as low as £9000 (after all I am only telling you my own experiences). There is only one university that airlines look towards, and that is the University of life! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="rolleyes.gif" /> . .After college, i decided to take a year out before considering Uni options and I am glad I did.......... If you feel that your degree in Physics is wasted then I would disagree....... Surely you didn't expect a physics degree to be applicable to a position in ops.. .I left a major Intl Airline last summer to do my ATPL'S....... 2 bust, bankrupt (ir what ever term u want to use!) schools later, you find me working for the Home Office <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" /> Life's a bi*tch...... what the hell, lets try and enjoy it the best way we can <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="cool.gif" />

[Daifly]

Got a 2:1 in Management Science, started in a Handling Agent (£17k), moved through the ranks and now am on the middle-ish rung of airline management (albeit now out of ops) and earning a lot more than your starting salary for Physics Grads. That in 5 years. . .. .I'm happy with that.. .. .Ops is a great job and a fantastic bedrock for any management career in the airlines - which should get you a little more respect than wondering straight in from a management scheme (a la BA). I'm still paying off my Uni debts now but I wouldn't change any of it. . .. .In Autumn last year we were recruiting for an Ops Assistant (trainee Ops Controller) and we interviewed an English Literature graduate (ELG). We were impressed with the way ELG handled the interview and offered the job, on the basis of about 6 months part time aviation work. We accepted that the training would be a long slog and perhaps not as quick as we would like, but we were feeling "fatherly" in giving someone their first step on the ladder.. .. .After offered £18k ELG turned it down, saying that the average starting salary that year was £23k. I'd love to know what ELG is doing now, cos my brother has the same degree, with buckets of motivation and keen etc. and has only now, 5 years on, topped £20k in publishing.. .. .I really couldn't believe that.. .. .I think that careers teachers/staff need a real injection of honesty. Just because the TV News says graduate salaries are now £Xk, does not mean that every single graduate will earn X. . .. .(To be really inciteful, I would say the same is true of Oxford (OATS) graduates...! If I read one more "Career Aim" statement copied from that one lecturer at Oxford, I'll retire!). .. .I think though, ops kid, you've got to decide whether you want an enjoyable career in aviation, or money in science!

[mabrodb]

Ops Kid-. .. .Have to agree with everyone on this topic. It's the same in the US Airline Ops world. . .I graduate with honors from University with a Aviation Mngmt degree. But it really doesn't mean squat!. .. .When it comes to benefits, etc. . .. .Everything in the US airline industry is based on time with company. . .. .I'm on my 3rd airline in about 4 yrs (moving about 3000 miles in the process), left the first one for a better job, but was downsized after 9-11 based on company seniority. Now at a cargo airline, after taking about a 30% pay cut.. .. .It's an exciting industry, you just have to deal with alot of crap. The degree in aviation is fairly useless (sad to say). . .. .Mostly who you know, and how much job seniority you have.. .. .Rgrds. .MB

[Ludde]

I've worked in the OPS inviroment now for 4 years in a medium airline in contact with our parent airline.. .I think the best way of getting intp the OPS busines is to have a background in the Ramp work/Air Traffic Controller.. .You need to know whats going on on the tarmac to handle the flights and the crew.. .We are 3 persons per day and one per night and we have 2 crew controllers helping us with problems.. .. .If you get a job, welcome to the busines.