Grand Canyon, Arizona - Piper/Cessna hire suggestions

[clearfinalsno1]

Hi all

I expect to be making a once in a lifetime trekking trip to the Grand Canyon in October/November.

It seems one of the usual "must do" things in the Canyon is to take a helicopter or light-aircraft ride. These are usually very expensive. As a PPL I can probably do this much cheaper for myself and fellow trekkers.

Thus, can anyone recommend a good place to hire in the area? Ideally a Piper Warrier, although I have flown Cessna 152/172s and others before.

Thanks

[Cusco]

This has been discussed on here zillions of times:

A good place to start would be the 'search' button.

Cusco:ugh:

[Fright Level]

Apart from the search, as a high houred pilot, there is a big difference between flying yourself and not being able to take in the view and being flown by others. One of the best $200 I spent was in a Papillon helicopter over the canyon. Well worth the money.

[alph2z]

I rented from Provo, UT.

- know your density altitudes
- know your runway lengths (you'll need it)
- assume 4500 ft airport altitudes.
- Know your mountain flying and emergency procedures (also low clouds).
- recommend GPS (I didn't have one)
- Everything is rocky, few good roads; good luck on emergency landings.
- Go for the 172 over the piper at TO. You'll need all the climb you can get. i.e. kissin' rocks with your eyes :-O

- In the afternoon, turbulence is moderate to severe. Try at sunrise.

- Grand canyon has extreme min altitudes such as 10000 ft minimum altitudes in certain areas. That's 5000 ft above the rim.

see http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=aardvark2zz

.

[slim_slag]

If you are taking a trekking trip then I assume you are going to drive to the South Rim. Great trip up and down, a lot harder than you think it's going to be, take lots of water and anti inflamatories..

So, if you are already at the South Rim, Grand Canyon airport is only a few miles away. There are tour operators based there who will take not much more than US$100 each and take you for a flight. It's a lot cheaper than the prices you see from Vegas. You also really need to stand on the rim and look down, and for that you need to be on the ground. Just flying over from the air only gives half the story.

Given that you are assumed to be at the rim anyway, I doubt you could do it cheaper yourself once you have factored in the checkout, bit of mountain training, and flying to and from the canyon itself. Also, you talk about fellow trekkers, so if you are going to load the plane close to gross you will need far more than 160hp, or even 180 to get to the minimum altitudes in the SFRA. If you are four up, I'd take a 182. Now you are into high performance which requires an endorsement, and probably a few hours dual to keep the insurance company happy.

Of course you could take them elsewhere in a 180hp, and be lower, but when most people say they have done the canyon it's through the SFRA corridors. Those are 10500 one way, 11500 the other. Remember in the mountains excess power is especially nice to have (as elsewhere of course)

Anyway, plenty of choices, and the other nitty gritty has been discussed before.

[clearfinalsno1]

Many thanks guys for all this advice (Cusco, you're absolutely right - it was late and I didn't think - I am often frustrated that people don't search first).

It seems I had underestimated the flying involved. I had expected a checkout - but with a party of about 12, I expected to do 2 or 3 hours of cost-sharing flying, thus making up for the cost of the check out. I must admit I didn't know about regulation of airspace such as the minimum heights on the aerial corridors. It looks like the smart thing to do is go for the tour operators that slimslag refers to.

I've had a quick look on google and found one for $125 - I think I've found the local airport below - can someone confirm?

Once again, thanks to all for your comments.

Grand Canyon airport on Google maps? (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Arizona+86023&ie=UTF8&ll=35.952789,-112.144489&spn=0.027723,0.055189&t=h&z=14&om=1)

[Cusco]

Last time I crossed the GC, 2 up in a rented , old, pretty clapped Arrow (200HP) we had the greatest difficulty reaching 11500ft in the SFRA corridor; in fact I don't think we ever quite got there.
Even then the rim looked mighty close............
Oil temp hovered just outside the red for a long time.
Views were stunning, and managed one or two photos down sun: Up sun pretty hazy.
I echo others' advice: you might as well go commercial and let pilot know you are a pilot yourself and agree beforehand on what the flight will entail..........
And do it in the morning: it gets hellish bumpy by midday.
Safe flying
Cusco;)http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h118/PeteS_2006/IMG_5093.jpg

[Cusco]

Clearfinals:
Yep that's Grand Canyon Airport:
It gets pretty busy by day with commercial sightseeing twins in from Henderson and North Las Vegas as well as Boulder.I've also been in in one of these and we had to hold over the desert for 10 minutes on the way in as it was so busy.
There are one or two outfits at GCA itself mostly IIRC helicopters who will, for gold, take you to the bottom of the Canyon.
I agree with you, that with all the airspace restrictions self fly is not really a sensible option.
Either way have fun
Cusco;)

[slim_slag]

That's the airfield clearfinals. 9000ft long, and for good reason. Don't know where you are staying, but call them up and they will come get you. Remember to add sales tax to the price of the flight. You need a special permit to descend below the rim nowadays, started doing that a few years back when a helicopter ran into the canyon wall.

Only place I've experienced proper severe turbulence for extended periods, even the tour companies will whine on the common frequency when it's that bumpy. Very unpleasant indeed, once seriously considered putting it down on a road as the passengers were petrified (private flight, 182), impossible to get above without O2. Surface winds made that silly idea completely out of the question anyway, and we just headed on...