Generic inkjet cartridges

[Saab Dastard]

I have decided to do a little testing, and I'm buying a set of cartridges from each of the following to fit into my Canon Pixma ip5000.

I will try to indicate quality / longevity and price.

http://www.tonezoneuk.com
http://www.disc-shop.co.uk/blank-media/ink-cartridges/
http://www.diskdepot.co.uk
http://www.premier-ink.co.uk/

These have all been recommended by PPRuNers over the last few years, but this doesn't imply that either I or PPRuNe endorse or recommend any of them.

If anyone wants to add any more recommendations please post a reply to this thread.

SD

[Mr Grumps]

These people have always been good.
http://www.printclearly.co.uk/
Pretty good quality and excellant service last time I used them (they have changed their name since. Were eazyinkjet but had a fight with the easy group and lost)

[amanoffewwords]

I tried IJT but found their service to be appalling - so I'm a fan of www.cartridgemonkey.co.uk these days - good prices, good service, good choice and nice/easy website to use/navigate :ok:

[green granite]

Saab as I understand it, the problem with cheap/recycled cartridges is not so much "do they work" or "give good results" as the fade resistance of the ink, especially when used in photographic printing. My other half stuck a pickie of herself and 4 colleagues, printed off on their work (Epson) printer, on the fridge door 5 years ago and it was noticeable after about a year that the colour balance was shifting towards the blue, now the only colour left in the print is blue.

Obviously if you just print documents that are only going to be relevant for a few years this is not a problem.

[Lancelot37]

I also used IJT but 2 out of 6 cartridges failed to work. I've gone back to mfrs originals - H.P

[Avtrician]

GG, Obviously the colour has drained away over time, the blue remained as it got too cold to run away.





Sorry:\


I have a photo on the fridge of daughter feeding a squirrel done with canon ink. It has done the same thing, I guess its a function of light reacting with the inks.

This Pic.(when photobucket loads, bloody kids {Son} using up download)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/Avtrician/Feedingtime.jpg

[P.Pilcher]

I have always been a great fan of using ink from other sources than Epson for my Epson printers. I fully accept that, for photographic purposes, they may fade under bright sunlight faster than the products supplid by the printer manufacturers, but why? Originally, it was only possible for cartridges from the printer manufacturers to be used. As soon as the magnitude of the rip-off was discovered and a marketing opportunity created, ink and cartridges at much more sensible prices became available. Is it only the printer manufacturers who have access to "low fade" ink? Surely not, yet no supplier out there, be it a bulk supplier or cartridge one is promoting a more expensive, "fade free" ink. Might this be a case of the printer manufacturers trying to find any lame excuse to justify their exhorbitant prices?
I await the results of SD's investigations with interest.

P.P.

[green granite]

Some interesting articles on fading

http://www.wilhelm-research.com/

[Saab Dastard]

Well, today I installed a black (BCi3e), cyan & magenta cartridge from Premier Ink Supplies (£9.93in total, in. delivery).

As a "control" I used a genuine Canon yellow cartridge (£6.99).

The yellow is suppoed to run out before the others, so if this proves not to be the case, then a lesson can be learnt!

Unfortunately, there appears to be no way of printing a configuration / status page*, as on my laserjet, that shows the number of pages printed to date, so I won't be able to calculate the number of pages printed between replacing cartridges.

* - if anyone finds otherwise, please let me know!

I'll keep you posted, but don't hold your breath, as I don't do a lot of colour printing!

SD

[Bushfiva]

so I won't be able to calculate the number of pages printed between replacing cartridges

Well SD, maybe you could, you know, count the pages as you put them into the printer?? :}

[Saab Dastard]

Well SD, maybe you could, you know, count the pages as you put them into the printer??

Bushfiva, besides "First Officer", can you think of something else that FO stands for? :E

SD

[Bushfiva]

SD, always ready to spring to the assistance of a fellow in need, I offer you a revised counting system, which I've called Counting Method 2, and which moves the counting workload from a sequential page-by-page process to an event-driven process, i.e. when the ink runs out. As a bonus, on the offchance you get more than 10 pages out of a cartridge, it prevents you from needing to take your shoes and socks off to cope with the large numbers involved. Without more ado, I present Counting Method 2:

Don't count anything, but keep the empty paper wrappers. When the ink runs out, count the empty wrappers, multiply by their nominal contents when full (let's call that partial result "F"), count the number of sheets remaining in the not-yet-empty pack, subtract that number from the nominal contents of the not-yet-empty pack (let's call that partial result "O"), and finally sum the partial results, arriving at the final result, which we'll call "Too".

Voila. :ok:

[Saab Dastard]

Bushfiva,

I appreciate your ingenuity! :D

Not a lot... but a little. :8

:)

SD

[Saab Dastard]

A preliminary report on the "Premier Ink Supplies" black, magenta and cyan cartridges installed recently:

Both magenta and cyan are noticeably paler than their Canon equivalents, determined both by comparison of test sheets and actual prints.

Longevity will take a bit longer to determine!

SD

[FlyingNikonian]

SD,

Third part inks usually require a different colour-profile to be loaded, in order to get right amount of "boost" to said colours.
Have you checked if there's a printer-profile to be downloaded from the manufacturors site?

I tried "pirate-packs" before, but ended returning "home" to Canons own inks.
Both due to longevity and also the fact that I had to flood the paper with a lot more ink to get the expected result (=extra cost). Flooding, that in turn can lead to run-back/bleeding of ink, ruining the picture.

[The Flying Pram]

I had an Epson DX4850, and unhappy with the price of genuine cartridges tried an alternative ("Inkrite" if my memory serves me correctly). I can't honestly say whether there was any difference in colour rendition, but one problem immediately showed up - EVERY time I pressed "Print" I got a warning - "Epson has detected that you are using non-genuine inks".

Some while later it stopped printing red, and despite trying the head cleaning utility several times got nowhere with it. Fortunately it was still under guarantee and I still had some original (used) cartridges to put in.

The local Epson agent also had to admit defeat, and I was given a service exchange unit, which gave me no end of problems trying to get the P.C. to recognise it. (Another story)

I've decided to stick to genuine ones for now.... No doubt just what the manufacturer intended.

[iceni]

I have a Canon MP96o with 7 ink cartridges. Thats a lot of dough when all 7 have to be changed.

I have just installed a CISS.

Works a treat. I no longer have to put in anymore cartridges - ever.

All that I need to do now is top up the external tanks with the correct ink, bought at A$11.00 for a 100ml bottle. Around A$61.00 for all the inks.

No connection other than a satisfied customer....from

www.rihac.com.au

They are in Melbourne, Australia.

[ShyTorque]

I have an HP Photosmart 1000 printer. The "78" (colour) and "45" (b+w) cartridges are hugely expensive, so I tried "Tescos" refilled ones.

Out of 6 refilled cartridges I've had one 45 fail to work at all, another that caused a double image of any text and a 78 with a colour missing.

I've had them replaced by customer services, so no major issues, just annoyance and inconvenience.

[Clutch Cargo]

I do some work for HP and what we found in our "lab tests" is that 70% of the time using "remanufactured" inks or refill kits is that you will cause damage to the the cartridge (it may break, spill or leak), damage to the printer , or damage to your document or photo (color fastness, dryness, water resistance, long-lasting capabilities). Also, you have no clue as to how good or bad the ink is they are putting in there.

But some of you, I had an Epson a few years back and I bought remakes of the blk for US$2 and colors for US$3! Hard to beat until that one day a black cartridge broke while printing. Needless to say it was time to get a new printer.

[P.Pilcher]

What this really boils down to is that printer manufacturers seem to expect to get their cake and eat it. If they sold printers for a price which gave them a sensible return and then sold ink cartridges for similar prices to those at which other manufacturers can provide them then they wouldn't have to make up excuses as to why only their replacement cartridges should be used. Furthrmore there would then be no neeed for them to develop more and yet more sophistaced devices to prevent users from using alternative cartridges. I appreciate tht H.P are a special case because their cartridges also contain the print head mechanism. This is because they were the first to market an ink jet device and their ink jet mechanisms would not last the life of the printer itself. It took a short time for this technology to improve this life to that of the printer itself but HP have steadfastly refused to incorporate this technology and thus all HP cartridges still contain the (expensive) print head. The only reason for this is to maximise their profits from replacement cartridge supply.

P.P.

[Clutch Cargo]

Actually, HP does now make a line of printers (the HP Photosmart series), that now have a separate ink cartridge feeding into a separate "heavy-duty" print head. the advantage of those is the printer self-cleans its own heads and it recycles 100% of that ink used for cleaning (where most is wasted) back into it's ink pools for greater output. I don't believe any other manufacture can do claim that. So we have now some of the best "cost per page" we've ever produced.

But to get back to your good reply, it appears the old business model was expensive printer and very cheap inks. Now HP practically gives some printers away and you actually pay for that printer a little bit each time you by ink. Generally from what I have seen is the cheaper the printer you buy the more expensive it will cost you in the long run with inks. But of course HP wants you to buy their ink for that reason. So does Epson and Canon.

[P.Pilcher]

Well, I suppose that this is a start, but ink run through dirty jets will carry the crud which blocked them in the first place so no doubt sophisticated filter systems will have to be introduced (more cost) to ensure the jets don't repeatedly block.
However what Clutch Cargo has stated really emphasies my point, and the violent competition in which our printer manufacturers are engaged probably prevents any rapid policy change (unless they get together and agree changes, but this would be a cartel - not nice). The introduction of the photosmart system seems to indicate that manufacturers realise the situation that they are in and are starting to do something about it.
I acquired an Epson 925 about five years ago when I started digital photography. It still works well and has never been fitted with Epson cartridges. These started at about £ 30 each and are now just less than £20. I pay less than £3 these days but acknowledge that I am not as fussy about exact colour balance as a professional photographer.
My printer is now getting worn in the paper handling department, it owes me nothing and will soon be due to be replaced. What to me will be of paramount importance will be the cost of the new one's consumables. I object to paying £20 for 30 pence worth of ink contained in an expensive sophisticated, chipped cartridge primarily designed to try to ensure that I cannot refresh my printer's ink supply with another 30p's worth!

Anyway, Clutch Cargo, thanks for responding to my comments, it is much appreciated, especially if my feelings and those of a lot of other people on this board get to the ears of some of the manufacturers.

P.P.

[S'land]

After what seems a lifetime using HP printers (well two of them) I decided about four years ago to change to Epson. The printer was Ok, but the ink cartridges were very expensive and did not last very long. To cut down on expenses I started buying Geha replacement ink cartridges as they are about 10 Euro cheaper. In the last two years I have had no problems with them.

One of the reasons for the Epson originals not lasting so long is, so I am informed, that they have a chip in them that stops you using the last 10 to 15% of the ink "as a safety measure to stop damage to the print head".

I will be going back to HP when I get the next printer.

[P.Pilcher]

For my ancient Epson photo printer, from my favourite cartridge supplier, an original Epson black cartridge costs a whopping £19.95 and a colour one £16.95.
However, I buy their compatible cartridges, black £1.69, colour £1.95. Can you beat that with H.P?

P.P.

[profexpat]

Best and cheapest (original) manufacturer's cartridges can be found at http://www.euroffice.co.uk

Been using these prods. for 3 years, and they are genuine.

[P.Pilcher]

It's working again now, but my supplier is still more competitive for compatibles for my "trusty" Epson photo 925 printer. I won't try SD's patience by mentioning them again, but a search engine will help on this forum, and they are referred to in the initial post on this thread.

P.P.

[seacue]

I bought an HP printer because the print head is part of the cartridge. I don't do much color printing and have a laser for B&W. The ink would dry in the print heads before the first cartridge ran out with the Canon and Epson printers I used to have.

I'm willing to pay for HP cartridges to get a new print head with each one. I feel that's cheaper and less bother than throwing away the whole Epson / Canon printer or the trouble and expense of replacing their print head.

Perhaps my case is unusual.

[spekesoftly]

As a long term HP user, I agree with seascue. It is just a shame that the capacity of the later HP cartridges is much less than their earlier ones.
My old HP 820Cxi uses a No 45 (Black) cartridge with 42ml of ink, and a No 41 (Tri-Colour) cartridge with 40.5ml. Our HP psc950 uses a No 15* (Black) with only 25ml, and a No 78 (Tri-Colour) with 19ml. The No 17 (Tri-Colour) cartridge is smaller again, with only 15ml.

(*Beware also that there are two No 15s available. The C6615NE may look a bargain on price, but it only holds 14ml)

[Woofrey]

Last year I bought a HP Laserjet 1600 and am very pleased with it. Now the toner needs replacing the prices I have seen for genuine HP replacements vary from £49.99 to £62.99, and I need 4.

So total cost of replacement toner is around £200 - £240.

PC World are advertising a new HP Colour Laserjet 1600 for £121 !

Bit of a no brainer on the financials really, but a shocking waste of a perfectly good printer, and environmentally disasterous.

[Saab Dastard]

Woofrey,

You may actually find that the original cartridges supplied are not filled to the same level as the replacements - perhaps as little as 1/4 or 1/3 the normal amount. This has been a common ploy by manfrs in their efforts to keep the cost of the printer down, particularly with inkjet printers .

Not all manfrs do this, and not necessarily this printer model, but worth bearing in mind.

SD

[Woofrey]

Thanks SD, I'll play devils advocate in the shop and see what they say !

[znord737]

Gentlemen,
I would urge caution when using compatible inkjet cartridges.

On the latest Epson,Cannon and I believe HP Printers . Manufacturers have designed their inkjet printers with electronic wizardry that detects whether you are using a non Epson/Cannon/HP replacement ink cartridge.

I had a brand new Epson Inkjet Printer purchased only 3 months ago. I used replacement compatible cartridges which worked fine . When i inserted the third set of replacement cartridges I got a message up on the screen to say "Use of a Non Epson Cartridge Detected" .

The Printer switched itself off and no amount of trying would enable the unit to switch on again. I took the printer to an authorised Epson Repair Centre , they wanted £70 just to look at it to reset the firmware and another £60 for one hours labour to repair it . The Printer only cost me £50 originally from PC World.

The Authorised Repair Center said that Epson make their profits out of selling Ink Cartridges and not from the Printers. Just bear that in mind when you next purchase non manufacturer replacement ink cartridges.

I had to purchase a complete new Printer . Something tell me as a Consumer we are being taken to the cleaners over these Ink Cartridge Issues.

Best Regards
znord737

[Keef]

I bought a Canon Pixma some years ago - probably the last model Canon Pixma that doesn't have chips in the ink cartridges. Apart from occasional cleaning of the heads when it hasn't been used for a while, it's done fine. It costs me about £5 for a set of cartridges from PrinterInks.com, and they last a couple of months or more. The colour quality is fine, and I haven't noticed any fading, apart from stuff that's left in direct sunlight.

A friend was impressed with mine, and ordered a Canon Pixma. She got a later one with chips in the inkpots, and was very unhappy when it came to buying new ink - at £70 to replace a set, where the printer cost about £65. The £70 set doesn't last any longer than my £5 set.

There's no way she's going to pay £70 for <£1 worth of ink, and she's too arthritic to refill the pots herself, so her poor brother has the job. What he says about Canon is not printable!

We're now both looking for a colour Laser printer that doesn't have ripoff prices for toner cartridges.

[P.Pilcher]

Oh dear - it looks as though one has to be even more careful if choosing a new printer these days! I expect that the alternate cartridge industry will come up with a fix before too long and maybe some printer manufacturer will start charging an economic price for its printers and loudly proclaim that it has no objection to the use of alternative ink catridges. I mean - there isn't a cartel, is there?

Some time ago, my wife decided to replace an ink cartridge in her Epson printer/copier/scanner. Normally she gets me to do this. Anyway, she didn't push the new (compatible) cartridge down properly so the "protection chip" did not make proper contact. Result - the printer locked up and after a Google search, I found the reset instructions. Since following these, the printer started working normally and thus saved me the cost of having to do what znord737 is possibly being faced with. Hopefully his reset instructions will appear on Google before long!

P.P.

[HuntandFish]

Keef
I to have a Canon Pixma without chips . A very nice printer , Im using £5.00 a set cartridges with exellent results .
I did get a bit of black smudging on the very edge of the paper whent printing a lot of A4 borderless photos but running the cleaning cycles fixed .
A thought can the chip from a genuine cartridge be removed and stuck on the clone ?

[Bushfiva]

I have decided to do a little testing,

So SD, an update on your ink evaporation tests yet?? :}

[Saab Dastard]

Well, the first pass was completed -

Premier Ink supplying Print-Rite cartridges.

I had 4 cartridges - Black (small, for colour printing), Cyan, Magenta and Yellow, of which all but Yellow were Print-Rite, while the Yellow was Canon, as a "control".

Interestingly, the 3 Print-Rite cartridges have all expired, while the Canon is still going strong. Obviously this is far from conclusive, but it does suggest that the 3rd-party cartridges don't have the same longevity as the original Canons.

The original Canon Black (large, for B&W printing) is still going, also.

In terms of colour quality on test prints, my view is that the replacements were slightly - but perceptibly - paler or washed out compared to the originals, although the black was indistinguishable. In real-world printing there's very little to choose between them.

I've now got a set of Tesco cartridges to compare. Results in a... while!

SD

[Background Noise]

Best and cheapest (original) manufacturer's cartridges can be found at http://www.euroffice.co.uk (http://www.euroffice.co.uk/)Considerably more expensive there than at Amazon for my Epson printer. I think that very often, original cartridges appear to empty sooner is that a lot of the ink goes to purge the heads. Once purged, the refills appear to last longer.

[P.Pilcher]

Saab - I look forward to reading your results.

The other day, a friend asked me if I would book him in online and print out his boarding passes as he lives in Jersey and has no computer access over here. Job done then I just had to print out his passes (print-rite ink). My trusty Epson Photo 925 locked up and refused to do anything as it insisted on being returned to an Epson service centre. No warning - it just locked up. Fortunately my wife's printer did the job, but then I checked the Epson. It transpired that this happens when it thinks the waste ink reservoir is full and it is a service centre job to empty it. Probable cost about £70-80 (and compare this with the cost of a new printer). Fortunately, there is a useful utility on the web. Download same and run it so that the printer is re-set. It is working beautifully again now - I've just got to dismantle it to empty that resevoir!

P.P.

[BigEndBob]

We have a Canon Pixma at work.
What a useless piece of junk.
Have to keep pressing buttons 3 or 4 times for it to do anything.
Uses ink like its going out of fashion

Only upside i had the printer it replaced, a 5 year old HP d145.
Brillant work horse, still prints perfect on refilled cartridges.

All you have to do is remove the button memory battery from printer and the thing can't remember what cartridge is in so it just prints away without problem.

Downside, now i'm tasked with printing all our brochures!
Still small price to pay for a great printer.

[green granite]

I notice "Cartridge world" are doing at lot of "get your cartridge refilled here" adverts on the lesser freeview channels lately, anyone used them?