Will QF Longhaul CC fly the 380???

[Southside747]

What guarantees have we got that we get to access new types and flying? Have heard from a reasonable source that we will be losing a fair amount of this flying to Short Haul. Surely we cannot let them get their hands on what is really Long Haul flying? This person is adamant that QF shorthaul CC will operate the 380. Whether they mean all of it or only parts of it is still totally wrong. They should not be touching it at all.

What else is there to ensure the Kiwi base does not grow and they get significantly more of the lucrative LA flying leaving us Longhaulers subject to more of the crap? If we miss out on 380 flying, which is suggested to do the bulk of US trips within 5 years, where are we left? Will the kiwi crew be on the 380 as well?

The more I am hearing on this subject, the more I am worried about what future we have for significant growth in the Longhaul ranks. There has to be a much clearer distinction between what is longhaul and what is shorthaul number one, so we fly what we joined longhaul to fly, and the domestics and casuals fly what their name suggest they fly (ie. shorthaul).

I am worried that in 5 to 10 years from now, a big proportion of Long Haul flying is going to go to the LHR base, AKL base, Shorthaul and MAM casuals. This worrying sentiment was expressed by somebody to me this morning, and as to who it was, the source was somebody who has me worried now.

Tell me it isn't possible?

[DEFCON4]

Ms.Grant is on record as saying the current wages and conditions of LH CC make them too expensive to operate the A380.
The other question that needs to be asked..Do you want to fly on this thing?
650 customers...4 classes...22 crew..all in the length of a football field.
How far are we prepared to compromise to keep this beast out of the hands of the domestics?
No Long Range..no overtime...probably no transport..a reduced hourly rate.
This aircaft is also slower than a 400...Direct LAX... add an hour 30(at Least)
Someone will correct me if I am wrong.
Sounds attractive?
In 10 years there will be no long haul/domestics/regional.
It will be just one big unhappy family.
The bid system will be in name only.
Attrition rates will be around 30%..if you have 8 years flying you will be considered really senior.
Stafftravel may not even exist as airfares will have plumetted
Service levels will make todays standards look like 5 star.
One thing is certain...what customers expect and what they receive will be much further apart than they are now.The complaints and whinging will reach stellar heights.
With low wages and conditions available to them CC will be in the enviable position of telling some annoying punter to get stuffed.
There will be no loyalty...fly for a few years and then leave.
Just like the LHR base now,CC will not be intimidated because they will just not care.
The worst job at QF will be the CC manager.Threaten the crew with dismissal and you will be laughed at.
Come to think of it its getting that way now.
If nothing else this job is always entertaining.
No wonder they are called" management clowns"..paid to entertain.
By God they are good at it!
Twiggs...the ultimate entertainer will no doubt soon have something to say.

[THE IRON MAIDEN]

Lets hope its the pilots at the controls

[DEFCON4]

Airbus are trying to design the pilot out of the Cockpit.
The FMC overides their decisions now any way.
Remember the treelopper?

[Keg]

I'm no fan of the Dugong but it helps to have the right facts....or were you aiming for hyperbole Defcon4?

650 customers...4 classes...22 crew..all in the length of a football field.

450 in QF config. I have no idea as to the cabin crew complement.


This aircaft is also slower than a 400...Direct LAX... add an hour 30(at Least)

All the figures I've seen indicate a cruise speed of .85 mach. That's the same as a 744. If it's .84 then you can add on 10-15 minutes. If it's .83 then 20-30, etc, etc. To add an hour and a half you're talking about it flying about .78 which is slower than the 767. It will be interesting to see how it copes 'off optimum' and what sort of speed trade offs exist to maintain fuel.

Of course, the extra time you allude to could well be the time spent getting from the remote bay at LAX until you get your bag! :eek:

[RedTBar]

Your right keg with the bit about parking at a remote bay.How long will it take until the last bus has gone and the cabin crew finally dismebark.We are paid for 30 minutes after blocks.

How long will this all take and should be a point in the EBA which should include the 380.We all know we have been white anted by S/H as has mainline tech crew.

The only question is how much will Dixon want and how much are we prepared to give.

[twiggs]

Twiggs...the ultimate entertainer will no doubt soon have something to say.

No need, Keg did it for me.

[RedTBar]

OK Twiggs then how about the remote parking and disembarkation by bus?

[twiggs]

If LAX is not set up for the A380, then it sounds reasonable to me.
Isn't it on the QF wish list to pay us only blocks-blocks?

[prunezeuss]

It may start off at 450.
With time it is sure to rise
Twiggs is now the definitive technical commentator

[DEFCON4]

Finally...a person of substance and education understands.
Hyperbole...exaggeration to highlight or amplify a point.
Obvious(to a few) and intentional.
Oh welI..... it was fun for awhile.
Fishing will never be the same.
Glad I didnt use "onomatopoeia"

[RedTBar]

From Twiggs If LAX is not set up for the A380, then it sounds reasonable to me.
Isn't it on the QF wish list to pay us only blocks-blocks?

Reasonable?????..

Exactly what I expect the company to say so I'm not surprised at your answer.

Do you understand how long it will take 2 buses at a time to disembark a full 380.We are not talking after a SYD/SIN sector but after an LAX direct.

To those here who remember Athens and using 2 buses at a time from L1 and L5 will know what I'm thinking.

There is is also the problem you get at LAX with lack of groundstaff and wheel chairs for pax.The more I think about it perhaps we should give them to s/h

[prunezeuss]

Twiggs:....aka the Flathead...always rises to the bait

[Keg]

Thanks Keg
Finally...a person of substance and education understands

Strewth! Can I give you my phone number so you can talk to my wife and tell her that. I'm sure she wouldn't believe it otherwise! :} :ok:

[stubby jumbo]

American Airlines To Recall Flight Attendants

FORT WORTH, Texas -- American Airlines said Wednesday it plans to rehire
460 flight attendants who were laid off when the airline lost money after
the 2001 terror attacks.
American said the recalls would address staffing needs and offset expected
attrition for the rest of the year.
The flight attendants worked for TWA, which American parent AMR Corp.
bought out of bankruptcy in early 2001. The union representing American's
flight attendants put their TWA counterparts at the bottom of the seniority
ladder, meaning the TWA workers were first to lose their jobs as AMR
slashed thousands of jobs.
In July, Fort Worth-based American rehired 200 flight attendants, more than
half of them former TWA employees. Since 2003, the airline has contacted
more than 1,900 attendants about returning to work.
American, the largest U.S. carrier, has about 17,500 attendants and 1,600
will remain on a furlough list after the 460 are recalled, airline
spokesman Tim Smith said.
Since January, American has rehired slightly more than 200 pilots, Smith
said. Those were the first pilots called back since 2001. The airline has
about 12,000 pilots.


Come back 'Lobe the A-380 awaits your service!!!;)

[twiggs]

I'll admit I'm no brain surgeon like roamingwolf or a rocket scientist like lowerlobe, but neither are the majority of the population, so it is for the mere mortals who have to look those words up on google that I highlight the inaccuracies.

[Le 3rd Homme]

Who looks them up for you?
You doing that is like the blind leading the near sighted.
As a champion of the mere mortal you fail miserably

[cokecropduster]

It is now EX-Domestics to you DEFCON....:eek:

[Going Boeing]

This is a bullsh1t thread and I am reluctant to keep it going but in the interests of getting the facts straight:

The A380 will fly at Mach .86 which is nominally .01 faster than the B744 but as it will cruise approx 4000 feet higher than the B744 at the same stage of the flight then the speed over the ground will be the same. The range of the A380 is approx the same as the B744ER's.

The first four QF aircraft are planned to operate only on the LAX route (from SYD & MEL) and I suspect that the configuration of 450 seats is a "Pacific" version with a "Kangaroo" configuration of about 500 seats to be fitted to later aircraft that will operate to LHR.

The A380 is significantly quieter both inside and outside than the B744. It is also uglier hence the nickname "Dugong".

I won't comment on the industrial issues except to say that QF management and consultant (Oldmeadow) will continue to use their most popular tactic - divide and conquer.

[RedTBar]

Easy there Going Boeing and take a deep breath.The thread is titled "Will QF LH CC fly the 380"

One of us used exaggerated figures to make a point regarding the performance specs for the 380.

This is about L/H CC and their future not about the specs.We are concerned just as you are about the intentions and honesty of Darth and his apprentices.

[Mr.Buzzy]

We are concerned just as you are about the intentions and honesty of Darth and his apprentices.

If you think Darth has been quiet of late, it's because he is working on one helluva poop to drop into the already murky punchbowl.

bbbbbbbbbbbzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz z

[surfside6]

If its a BS thread why bother posting?
What are you?....some kind of self absorbed martyr?

[ScottyDoo]

American Airlines said Wednesday it plans to rehire 460 flight attendants who were laid off when the airline lost money after the 2001 terror attacks.


Wow, that'll free up a few beds in their over-crowded old-folks' home industry... good news all round... :ok:

:rolleyes:

[labia vortex]

You are a second officer and as relevant as a glovebox on a bicycle.

[regitaekilthgiwt]

I heard from a reputable source that the crewing for the A380 was going to be Short Haul Cabin Crew upstairs and Long Haul Cabin Crew downstairs....:ok:
Same bus for transport though.......:)

[sydney s/h]

There is is also the problem you get at LAX with lack of groundstaff and wheel chairs for pax.The more I think about it perhaps we should give them to s/h

.......careful what you wish for....:rolleyes:

[roamingwolf]

scotty you work emm sorry fly out of the sandbox dont you mate.or maybe up in orchard rd.couldn't you find a job in oz pal? no outfit would look at you in oz or did you have to leave oz.
mate your not the nrt capt are you.whatever it is you must be dropping bricks when you think of the good life back in oz.or maybe your not a driver at all and you couldnt get a job in oz as a cleaner and you are over there working as checkin with your boyfriend abdul.:O
why don't you stick to the drivers thread and go on pretending to be a pilot.we all believe you pal we really do;)
keep sending posts mate because they make me laugh so much as i'm having a cold beer with a surfnturf on the barbie.tomorro i'm taking the boat out with the boys for some fishing.have a good one mate

[roamingwolf]

sydney s/h tbar is right on the money mate.think about a la trip and 2 hours before you get to the crew bus?no allowances,no long range pay or the stuff we get.can you imagine how many pax will be blueing because its taking longer to get off the frog aircraft than it did to get there.then when you finally get the last of the punters on the bus and get your duffle bag you find out the drivers have got sick of waiting and have taken the transport.now it takes another 45 minutes to get a bus for you guys.:yuk:
pal i'd be worrying if i were you that your union/mam are trying to get the froggy bus.if you do get it i reckon you could always transfer to l/h but

[surfside6]

I wish to spend the rest of my flying career working on the 747.400.
I dont care where it goes.Its just a great aircraft.
The A380 is yours Mr.Sydney s/h....enjoy...the jetlag ,the fatigue and the problems.

[lowerlobe]

If there was ever a case for seperate crew transport then this is it.

Then again with the size of the crew bus in LA you would probably need 2 buses with the crew required for the 380.

Darth is not going to like that...

[ScottyDoo]

why don't you stick to the drivers thread and go on pretending to be a pilot.we all believe you pal we really do

That's not very nice.

But I'm glad you hold pilots in high regard, that you find it so hard to believe.

So why didn't you get your ATPL???


with the size of the crew bus in LA you would probably need 2 buses with the crew

Are you sure it's nothing to do with the size of the arses on those old boilers, LowerEndLubed???

Jokes, everybody...... just jokes...! :ok:

[RedTBar]

captaindejavu,Thanks for the info and if the Dugong can cruise as fast (fully loaded that is) as the 400 it will make life a lot easier.
As far as the problem with remote bays goes I thought the major obstacle was that the yanks did not want to make it easier for the French by accomodating the Dugong at any US terminal.If they are trying to help Boeing by doing that then I doubt my grandchildren will see any change in terminal infrastructure.
That is unless Boeing builds an aircraft of similar size or dimensions.

[Going Boeing]

The northern end of the Tom Bradley Terminal is currently being modified to accept A380 aircraft and I understand that once that is complete, and the bays are back in operation, then the bays at the southern end will be closed to allow construction of an A380 bay. I suspect that SQ will use the northern bay and QF the southern bay. If more A380's are in LAX at the same time then remote bays look like the only option unless AA allow modifications to bay 48. The A380 won't fit into the alleys so that rules out any of those bays.

[lowerlobe]

Little Scotty...

I always thought that the ability to count would be a prerequisite to be a pilot.

Now try and follow me and see if you can stay on the same page.

If a bus is going to be suitable for passengers then there has to be the same number of seats or greater than the number of pax requiring a seat.

Little Scottydoo you really will have to get with the program....

[ScottyDoo]

Yes you're right again, Lube.

And I do apologise if I've offended you by lumping you in with my comments on old boilers and their fat arses; I should've twigged with the "lower lubed" thing being your handle.... :p

[PitPin]

And Joe's garage will be handling the line maintanence !

[RedTBar]

Apparently Airbus have taken into account our company's maintenance regime and costs concerns and as such have installed emergency lighting installed with a zipper.

This way our preferred maintenance operator "SUM TING WONG" does not have to worry about using sophisticated materials such as double sided tape and staples.

[travel thickness]

If mainline ever get them I would love to work on these babies.
To hell with working on the A380.
The Dugong is way too long from stem to stern and holds way too many pax irrespective of the config.
Ultimately there will be too many a/c types and variations and Cabin crew will end up being type rated.
The so called "elite fleet" will be flown by the cheapest not the best

[sydney s/h]

Trust me... the thought of working on the A380 does NOTHING for me. Let alone doing longhaul flying. It aint for me. I've flown on the A330's and hate them. Goodluck to those who want it...you won't see me on one unless i'm a pax!

Do you really think SH are going to get them? I doubt it.

I did hear that the new A330-200 (we have ordered) that will fly AKL-LAX will be crewed by SH.....Idiots.

[travel thickness]

Ahhhh yes....the chickens are now coming home to roost.
Boy did you guys ever get done over!!?

[sydney s/h]

Yeah...thanks travel.

Did you ever think that not all of us voted and agree with our current conditions?

Jerk.