Net Jets Contract

[suchiman]

Hello everyone. I heard yesterday that there might be some irregularities with the new contract. Suposedly, the 25% tax in Portugal is not tax, but some sort of social contribution for self employed personnel. What I heard is that NTA hires us through Net Jets England as if we were contract pilots. We then pay 25% social contribution in Portugal. It is not very clear yet (like most things in this company) but the rumour is that we will not have a Portuguese fiscal identification number. This might mean that the tax autorities in other countries might not accept this 25% payment as taxes ( unless it is clearly expressed on paper by the portuguese tax authorities and showing a personal fiscal number) and that people could be hit with a full tax bill at home.
Anyone else heard anything about it?

[bizantin]

I understood we would receive a receipt from tax authorities stating what we paid but ... absolutely unclear indeed.
However don't worry, if you are not happy they recruited already enough to cover your departure...

[Smeagel]

Hey bizantin!!

I thought I was supposed to be the NJE prophet of doom? :E

Fine by me though, you take over for a while. Perhaps you could do Mondays to Wednesdays and I shall do Thursdays to Saturdays? If either of us want days off though we have to apply to each other three months in advance and reserve the right to refuse the days off at the last minute.

Priority will be given to those with more points in the seniority system except ..............................there isn't one. Well, not that we're allowed to see. Friends of management and brown nosers get special treatment as do people who secretly report back to management. I shall be management on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays while you can be in charge on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays.

We will need to recruit at least one other so we can gang up on them with some plotting and scheming behind their backs and blame them when we screw up. I suggest we watch this forum for a sucker.......I mean, recruit.

Oh, and there is NO leave during the busy period which runs from 1st January to 31st December and if you join I will not tell you your position and duties until you have resigned from your other internet bulletin board and are committed to this one.

Do we have a deal*?:O










* For the purposes of this arrangement the term 'deal' means whatever we agree now until I decide to change it whenever I want or whenever you want on the days it is your turn to be management.;)

[bizantin]

It sounds like a NJE deal. Did you participate in writing the new contract, smeagel? No worries, I will fill up the gaps. Anytime I feel you weakening, I ll take over and vice versa...

Enjoy.

[EatMyShorts!]

Suchiman: If you are employed with NJE, come and discuss it on Jetblasters, here you'll find some kids only.

[Smeagel]

Pssssst! bizantin.

I found our next recruit ^^^^:rolleyes:





:O

[5green]

Suchiman: If you are employed with NJE, come and discuss it on Jetblasters, here you'll find some kids only.Hmm, could be to late, or ?
Infos about it prior joining are always better :cool:

About the kids, yes sometimes there are a lot at pp,
but kids and drunken people often tell the truth :}

[bizantin]

No smeagel, itmyshort is right, go to JB and you will see how bad the deal is!!! After 6months, nobody knows yet what the salary will be. NJE gives you money to figure out and if you leave, they take it back.

I am not seeing myself as a kid but it is truly childish to think that at the end, everything will be find because someone said it is "the best deal in Europe".

Do a bit of maths : 95000- 6000(UK social contrib) - 25%of 95000euros = 5437euros/mois - taxe on the previous year - pension!

The salary of a captain is less than the salary of an FO on a good turboprop company!

still interested? take my seat...

[EatMyShorts!]

Hi,

my net salary in June was 5,700 EUR, plus 1,000 EUR per diems = 6,700 EUR. It is not the best deal in the universe, no! Who is saying that, apart from management? But I doubt that a turboprop operator will pay you that much, really!

[Flintstone]

but kids and drunken people often tell the truth

Little known fact.....

Only children look up if entering a room looking for someone. Adults know it's impossible for a person to be on the ceiling so no point looking there, is there?

Which is how Spiderman manages to catch so many criminals;)

[H.Finn]

Where I work, and it is in the highly taxed part of the world, per diems are not considered part of the salary. They are something you choose to spend on the road, or maybe not. I think NJE salary is crap, for working your butt off six days, having five days off, and spending two of those recovering. I prefer flying 350 or 400 hours per year for a decent owner, getting paid a lot better and also getting a proper pension in the end. Plus of course, the per diems...

[Smeagel]

I agree entirely Mr Finn.

The trouble is that some people in NJE can't or won't believe that such jobs exist. They'll accuse you of lying.

Best thing is to enjoy your better job and leave them to it.

[bizantin]

You are absolutely right Finn. Hope people will realize that...

[Margarita]

Would love to go but haven't got the green card... almost $20K per month!!!!

[Smeagel]

<sports commentator voice> "Aaaaaand Jenvey plays the old 'Look over there!!' distraction but the other players are not falling for it":D

Let's not divert attention from the topic at hand, eh? There are people on this forum for whom the NJE contract is of far more importance than pay scales in a market they'll never work.

If we're going to do that we might as well start quoting salaries at Garuda for an FO based in Nusa Tenggara, it would be just as relevant.

Nice try though :rolleyes:

The contract(s) mess at NJE is deliberately perpetuated and designed to keep the workforce fractured (no pun intended). Has anyone wondered why the deadline to sign the new contract was set so far off? Could it be to judge the response? They wait and see how many people sign and whether they need to do something else or whether they can get away with the contract as it is.

If resignations increase well that's ok, we are overcrewed (now how's THAT for a co-incidence?) and can cover it for a while. If they increase by a lot, recruit more and work the existing crew harder in the meantime. If they stay the same then management got away with the contract and their bonuses are safe.

They are way too good at this to give anything away in terms of pay and conditions unless they really have to and if they do you can bet they will get it back elsewhere. Once NJE crew realise how they are being played (as I eventually did, duh) it all starts to become clear.

[netjetter]

Smeagel, you said:

......The trouble is that some people in NJE can't or won't believe that such jobs exist. They'll accuse you of lying.

Best thing is to enjoy your better job and leave them to it.

Why don't you do that, then? It is getting old.

[CL300]

Margarita Would love to go but haven't got the green card... almost $20K per month!!!!

figures are yearly figures.... not monthly !!!

[His dudeness]

I´m not in NJE, although I was interested a while ago...still I wonder is it true (from suchiman question) that you just not KNOW what kind of tax you´ll be facing??? I just can´t believe that, I mean come on, a company like NetJets?

Is it so hard to get some taxexperts on a contract to make clear what will happen? OR is smeagel right? Is NJE really an evil place ???

My general observation is that most NJE crews I meet down the road are - or seem to be - quite happy. Good actors?

[Smeagel]

Oh, the irony of MJ accusing people of being others. There's the MJ who is around when all is sweetness and light and there's the MJ who disappears when things become a bit too................specific. :hmm: That's not even taking into account his other usernames on here.

His dudeness. NJE is not an evil place and the crew you see are, in the main, happy. The majority are good people. Down route they are all on the receiving end and stick together although fbo's, refuellers and even owners are beginning to report signs of frustration, even rudeness as the season gets busier, the pressure increases and the NJE infrastructure crumbles. The term 'meltdown' is being heard more frequently in Lisbon.

The truth of the matter is this happiness lasts a variable period dependant upon several factors. Experience (those who have worked in bad companies find it better by comparison, for a while anyway), employability (for some it is a refuge for, they just don't fit elsewhere* :rolleyes:) or perhaps the employment prospects where they want to live are just not too good.

The tax situation is messy. The company has taken an easy way out by paying tax somewhere and clearing itself of corporate responsibility. Sadly this does not helps those in countries where this is not acceptable to the authorities and they will be expected to pay tax again.

As has been said before in the current climate it is a fine place to build hours, attain a command and achieve the next step. A career it ain't. What I posted above about the company's methods is no great secret, it's all there to be seen if you just look objectively.

Is this correct? Well, ask those who are strongly pro-NJE. Why do they not dispute what I've written instead of moaning about me?





*one or two of these don't actually fit in at NJE either but they are so far up their own backsides they just think they do and the company is so shorthanded it keeps them around

[transilvana]

I don´t Know, but i´m first officer on GA and actually I earn more salary than a captain at NJE, and as a captain you earn double, and life is much better, 15 days off/month and when 15 on duty we have at least 5 days off, so it makes at least 20 days off per month, nice destinations with 3 days off all paid and much more. 1 year ago I thought NJE was the best place to move, now I think is the worst place to move, If I want to work that much I would move to airliners, it´s much better to sit 6 hours on the cockpit of a 737 than on B400 or a "slowtation", at least you have more leg room and can open the window to get fresh air on summer....

[angelorange]

From PPJN: " if successful at NJ interview, pilots will need to be able to pass a Transportation Security Agency Clearance to train in the USA before we can make an offer of employment. To pass this security screening, pilots need to meet the following requirements: ? current and valid type rating on an aircraft with a weight of more than 12,500lbs ? date of last flight no more than 90 days from the date on which we would send you for training in the USA, typically 30 days after the start of employment."

Does it help to have done Commercial training in the USA pre 911 and an FAA licence?

[suchiman]

I have to say that I completely agree with many of Smeagles opinions and/or points of view. He is indeed very perceptive and well informed. Much of what he says is true or at least very plausible deductions.

His dudeness: Yes it is hard to get tax experts in many countries to say something definitive about what will happen with this contract because the pieces dont fit together. Why do you think its taking so long to get the pension plan going? Its been 7 months already and nothing!! Could it be that they can´t find something that fits the puzzle?

I completely agree with the opinion that NJE is playing the pilots. Its all a matter of how many people sign. They wont do a plain and clear contract (like for example paying taxes in the UK) unless they absolutely need to. To be honest,their little games seem to be working.

If it is true that the 25% tax in Portugal is not tax and the company does not provide proper documentation with a fiscal number, some tax authorities will not accept that as taxes and people will have to pay again in their own countries with no credit whatsoever. Maybe then people will wake up and do something.