Virgin Air Charter

[Lever]

Now this should be fun for Air Partner and the other brokers when this all hits the streets in the USA later on in the year and Europe sometime later.

Virgin USA Enters the Charter Info Industry
Virgin USA is expanding with the launch of Virgin Charter, an online marketplace for charter operators and customers. According to Virgin Charter founder and CEO Scott Duffy, the Web site allows customers to compare price quotes, book flights online and communicate with operators, including small charter operators who make up “the bulk of the industry.” Virgin also intends to create a “Virgin quality standard” to rate operators based on safety information ratings from auditing firms such as Wyvern. Charter providers pay a fee based on a percentage of the sale, while buyers of charter services pay no fee to use the Web site. A private, invitation-only beta version of the Web site will be available online June 12, followed by full-scale product launch at the end of the year.


Lever

[Monkey Boy]

So a bit like Avinode then? Big deal, can't see many brokers shaking in their boots over that. It'll only be as good as the information that the operators put into it, which is Avinode's biggest problem. Buyers cannot make informed decisions about the right aircraft for the right flights by buying online, all they'll see is a price list and pick the second cheapest, just like folks do with the wine list in a restaurant. More often than not, that'll be the wrong choice.

That's why people come to brokers, they know what they're talking about (most of the time)!

:ugh:

[Lever]

Not sure about the logic.
This is Avinode with a B2C portal rather than B2B that Avinode runs.

Kind of like Expedia or Amazon and they seem to have coped rather well against the High Street Travel Agents and Booksellers.

The Virgin brand is very strong - customers will find the site.

I would argue that many educated purchasers will be happy to bypass the Broker unless the Broker adds any value; most of them do not.


Lever

[Monkey Boy]

Well, lets put it this way:

You can buy a car through the Auto Trader directly from the owner, that'll save you a few quid. The seller will tell you exactly what you want to hear, because he wants to shift the car. He may be liberal with the truth because he's got a vested interest in selling. He won't provide you with any guaranty, warranty, proof of mileage, or any come back if it turns out to be a pig. Buyer beware. This is why people go to car dealers or second hand car lots. If anything does go wrong, there's a comeback. They offer more impartial advice on what car to chose as they have a greater choice, the salesman is an expert in his field and knows all the products equally well. Ultimately, the buyer has recourse should anything not meet expectation - something worth paying a little extra for, peace of mind.

So sure, people can - and will logon to this site and I'm sure people will use it. BUT will it be used by PA's who need to find an aircraft for their CEO, employer, celebrity or spouse not knowing any background check on who their using? More often than not they haven't got the time to check all this stuff out, they need answers yesterday and they need to know they're only going to be offered the best suppliers with the best products and also having the knowledge that EVERYTHING is being double checked by people who know what they're talking about and are prepared to put their money where their mouths are. Sure brokers make a commission, but many businesses see it as a small price to pay for protecting their most valued assests and wouldn't have it any other way! You can't beat the personal touch, and you can't beat experience an expertease.

[V12]

The Virgin brand is fantastic, but please don't assume he is Mr Midas. His trick is to associate with others who are trying to get businesses going, and if it works, he wins, and if he doesn't he disconnects having taken the PR victory.
Stick the name Virgin in front of the following words and see if you can spot the successful business:
Virgin Cola, Clothes, Money, Vie, Vision, Vodka, Wine, Jeans, Brides, Books, Cosmetics, Cars, Express, Blue, V2, Trains....
He also launched Virgin Executive Jets a decade ago with a planned Hawker 800 - it never flew.
The man's a genius but don't assume everything goes to plan - instead he's caught your attention on another business idea which makes you think he's Midas, but judge it a year down the line.
Isn't Virgin Air Charter just a dot.com play a decade too late, in a US market dominated by some big boys: NetJets, Flexjets, Sentients, EJM, etc.
Can't see business and leisure users thinking the bearded one can help them better than their existing providers.

[Stratocaster]

Since when do brokers provide any kind of commitment to the safe ending of the business transaction (i.e. chartering an acft) ? I mean, especially in Europe. In the US you have the various "Golden Squib Award" and the "Triple Platinum Radioactive-free Certificate" that may be used as a guideline for the customer to know which company really takes safety seriously.
Don't get me wrong, it would be great if all brokers did that sort of "safety awareness consulting" or "15-seconds safety basics education" to the end-user, but from what I've seen it's rather marginal. Customers want the cheapest (or second cheapest), safety is the authorities' exclusive business... and we know it can be a total joke in some countries, partly because of a lack of resources.

[merlinxx]

I am not a broker, but count many of the best as my suppliers/customers. It is up the the initiator to ascertain if they have a creditable audit programme in place for the operators they use. The ones I know have an annual hands-on audit as well as market research, check with the various association BGAD, EBAA, GBAA, IBAA, NBAA, in UK Baltic Exchange plus the various CivAv authorities. Also folks, they do check out Prune for the back biting griff.

A happy crew makes a happy passenger, makes a happy broker, makes a happy contractor, make a happy bank manager, makes repeat Business.

Unhappy crew spells AAARRRRGGHHHHHH ****E never again.

[Grecian2000]

Internet sales of private jet time was something that popped up years ago and died a death didnt it?

How can Virgin make it work where others failed? (presumably after spending millions on IT)

I think our passengers want to book with a human not a computer web page.

[unablereqnavperf]

OH no not more "Virgin buy or product because it gets you laid" trash again my cable supplier has just been taken over by Virgin the service is now more expensive and even less efficient than before,so god only knows how bad their bizjet buy as you go thing will be!

[SussexBroker]

May I ask what on earth people have against brokers... As a broker (surprise eh?). I'd like to point out a few factors/home truths that will come as no shock to anyone.

1. A good broker acts as a filter for much of the information that airlines don't actually need...

2. A good broker guarantees the payment will come for the flight - even when the client may screw us over - or indeed when the airline mess up or go AOG.

3. Brokers account for a decent percentage of most of the exec-jet airlines work, why do you think this is ? Allow me to explain; whilst brokers get a hard time about sitting in their office playing about with avinode (!) and making a few quid, actually what we (and also people like NetJets and Skyjet) do; is put time, effort and money into marketing to clients people... brokers make reasonable money yes, but re-invest to regenerate the industry and bring new blood to the airlines that often berate the hand that feeds a good portion of their business.

4. Someone mentioned a brokers commitment to the client when things go wrong... what utter rubbish. Perhaps you are dealing with wrong brokers my friend. In all the years of doing this job (about 13), I have never booked a flight where a client hasn't got their aircraft... and even when an airline has totally kippered me, the client will still get an aircraft. I recall last year where an airline hadn't bothered to tell me about a tech (on the day of flight) and it cost me an additional GBP 13k to provide the client with a larger aircraft to keep the client happy. The industry is very busy right now and it is funny to see how the quality of customer service falls with some companies, recall harder times when airlines were champing at the bit to get the flight - these are the things that brokers contend with...

In any case, having worked in airline and brokerage, both work hard and rewards pay dividend for those who keep this in mind !

Clump (that's me getting off my soapbox)

Sussexbroker

[Monkey Boy]

I'd like to be associated with the comments of the last post - well said!

[G-BOY]

What amazes me with Virgin Media, is that he's starting this war against Ruport Murdoch - and good on him, because Sky News are controlling a lot of things, such as Carphone Warehouses withdrawl of advertising for Big Brother (I don't condone the lack of control C4/Endamol had on the programme, but how Sky News reported hours before CW withdrew "We wonder what effect this will have on Carphone Warehouses's sponsorship of the programme")

The problem is, he's started a war, but if he doesn't start to pull a few smooth moves - which he's not done so far - Murdoch will eat him alive.

And let's face it, Good PR is all Virgin has.