Instructor shortage - are things really that bad?

[prop-wash]

Hi all,
I know there have been various threads running on pilot shortages within the industry, but are things truly that tight? I know of one North Qld flying school that advertised recently for an instructor and did not receive one expression of interest. Are pilots just hanging out for those jet jobs? Does anyone still want to gain a varied experience in flying? Are there just too many easy options to take these days? Interested to hear how different GA companies around Oz are finding new staff and are they able to retain them?
P-W

[Aussie]

Well for what its worth... I applied to a certain company about a yr ago for a full time salary position instructing, and they wanted me to pay for standardisation... i said NO.

Since then i get a call every 3 months asking if ive changed my mind, and 2 weeks ago got a call from the Chief Pilot, asking if i was interested and that the standardisation cost could be waived.

Operators chasing up instructors? Not the done thing a few yrs ago, thats for sure!

[Got the horn]

Seems that way. FTA are heading to NZ next week for interviews, they're going everywhere-even Invercargill! Now that's desperate! Good times to be an instructor.

[gaunty]

Trust me there has never been a better climate for pilots, with any luck the work for food stamps brigade will wind up where they belong and the professionals can get on with it.:D

[tinpis]

Seems that way. FTA are heading to NZ next week for interviews, they're going everywhere-even Invercargill! Now that's desperate! Good times to be an instructor.

Clean yer gumboots.

[Lodown]

Fascinating repercussions of a pilot/skills/experience shortage. Everyone with a CPL and ATPL subjects gets pulled up rapidly creating an increased flight training demand. Who's going to pay for an instructor rating and then hang around flying 152's when the demand and compensation is easily attained further up the line? Just when more pilots are needed, there are less instructors to train them. Good instructors might be able to name their price sooner rather than later. That'd be a turn up for the books...well paid instructors.

[gaunty]

well paid instructors. about bloody time.

The piper is now being paid by the airlines. Not only that but the huge cohort of boomers are now retiring over the next few years.

[To infinity & beyond]

So does that mean that the pilot shortage will continue or maybe get worse? That is, no instructors which means not as many new pilots and this might keep pilots in demand. Sounds like a good thing to me.

[das Uber Soldat]

my moneys on instructors being too stupid to figure it out. (im an instructor too however). The bull**** cover story that employers use to mask the abhorrent pay conditions instructors are placed under, 'these are the proving grounds, you have some kind of professional responsibility to undertake this rite of passage' will continue to be 'bought' for some time to come in my view. It is an attitude that makes my blood boil. :*

I remember thinking a while ago that as soon as I got my 1000 hours I was off like a shot up north to have a crack at a 206 job or something of the like, but now that i'm there and in the current climate I must admit I peruse the afap offerings with a little more confidence in what my services are worth, and a little less desire to sweep hangers :ok:

[puff]

In relation to the NQ position perhaps people aren't too interested to move all the way to Cairns for what was listed as a casual job. Instructors especially G2 and above seem to be VERY much in demand, doubt many would be interested in casual these days.

[highflyer23]

The shortages are definately real and those instructors in nz woul be silly nt to seriously consider it. In Australia they actually pay in structor if if they have next to nil instructing time unlike most places in NZ. They will pick up sum good quality pilots in the south of NZ due to the fact tatthey fly in just about all weather conditions and know what a x wind landing is.

[Tee Emm]

up the line? Just when more pilots are needed, there are less instructors to train them. Good instructors might be able to name their price sooner rather than later.

And pigs might fly...

[Rich-Fine-Green]

From what I can see in SY and ML; There still seems to be a steady availability of Gr 3 Instructors available looking for work - albiet lots less than years past!.

But, there seems to be the usual reluctance to leave town to instruct in Cairns and other regional centres.

Low pay and rip-off rents in places like Cairns may be an issue (as it was 25 years+ ago when I plodded the same routes).

Could be a case of better off to stay with Mum and wait for something to pop up in the big smoke.

[prop-wash]

Rich-Fine-Green, don't know about rent as I own my own place, but it is award pay and the busy season is just beginning to kick off, gotta love the far north this time of year.
P-W

[poteroo]

There's a change in the air.... that's for sure. I believe it's about more disposable income, and more time in hand for boomers to enjoy.
People no longer haggle prices here for scenics.
There have been several new ab initio students at the local flying school, and several 'old' RPPL,GFPT turning up to finish their navs. We now have 2 grade 1's working.
If this is the case in other regional centres, then there will be an ongoing shortage.
I hear that RAAus are similarly short of senior instructors to meet the new training demand.
happy days,

[TLAW]

If wages for instructors increase, wouldn't the knock on effect be that the cost of flying training increases also?

[Rich-Fine-Green]

TLAW: Regretably for those still to finish their training - You are 100% correct.

Schools that pay their instructors the right money will have to charge out at least $75 hour for grade 3 instructors and well over $100 hour for grade 1 instructors. Expect $50+ for briefings etc.

The true costs of a properly paid grade 2 Instructor with M/E IFR - including Super, Worker's comp, Check flights etc etc etc. works out to be $60-$65 per hour in the air. Even with a very modest $25 margin - that works out to $90 that should be charged out.

Costs of a modern day flight school at a GAAP airport with high rents, CASA fees and insurance etc run out to about $35-$40 per flying hour.

Last time I was at BK, I noticed one of the bigger schools charging out Instructors for only $50 hour!. Assuming they are paying the right wages - they must have a special dispensation from CASA that allow their staff to fly 1,300 hours year.

The cost of Flying Training and Charter will have to increase soon big time.

Schools that don't increase their prices soon will either go broke or lose staff to companies that are willing to pay the right wages and increase prices.
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I pay $100 hour to get my car 'dealer serviced' yet my local G.A. workshop only charges me $65 hour to work on my aeroplane and the school I get occasional Instruction from only charges me $70 hour for a Grade 1 Instructor!.

Something is not right here.....

[tnuc]

what about the shortage of engineers !
When the pilot shortage is finaly ove there might not be any servicable aircraft left to fly...

[P2T2]

G'day guys,
Given the current / supposed lack of instructors in G.A, what would be the likelyhood of someone working 4 a major, with the appropriate quals doing part time instructing work ie would any school offer any work?
During my time in GA, jet drivers stealing wannabe's flying time was a criminal act, however given what has been said above I'm wondering if attitudes may have changed???
Cheers

[das Uber Soldat]

P2T2 there is so much work going around at the moment that nobody would worry in the slightest. We have a few guys doing casual where I work and its no issue for any of us.

[P2T2]

thanks - now just gotta remember how 2 "fly" an a/c again...


Cheers

[cloudsabove]

Getting paid more does not guarantee a wide and varied GA career, but moving to "Cairns" or other non-capital city airports certainly will. I took the chance to leave a job offer at bankstown as a fresh G3, headed north to instruct, and ended up flying multi charter in my first week of work (after a free initial twin endorsement). Whilst the pay was not fantastic, the opportunities to progress quickly were, and some pilots need to take that into consideration when evaluating the worthiness of a job. Having said that, we certainly are worth much more than we get!!!