Monarch Aircraft Engineering Apprenticeship Scheme

[Keep the dream alive]

Hi all

I have recently applied for Monarch’s Aircraft engineering apprenticeship and have been successful in getting invited to the initial selection tests.:)

I have never been through selection for an engineering apprenticeship scheme before, and was wondering if anyone out there has any advice and/or information on what tests are conducted and the general format of the day?

Any help/info will be greatly received

Best Regards
Keep the dream alive:ok:

[alimax]

hi there
am applying for the same role got teh application pack next to me please tell me what do i need to do to get it i be grateful any help will do i be waitting email me on [email protected]
thanks

[Wodrick]

Excuse me as I have had a wine or two, but learning to spell and punctuate would be two first steps !

[85mastrac]

Much like the author of this thread, I am also applying for the apprenticeship scheme and have been invited to the selection test.

If anyone could shed some light on what these tests are generally comprised of, how the session is broken down, or any particular areas it would be wise for me to brush up on then I'd be very grateful.

Cheers in advance!

[delta22]

Like the above poster, I've been invited to attend an initial selection test. Any information will be greatly received.


CHEERS

[Bus429]

Can't comment on MAEL now but I started my apprenticeship with them in 1978 (when they were members of the Aeronautical Training Group). It was a four year apprenticeship with block-release college courses at the - now defunct? - St. Albans College of Further Education. It was a very good apprenticeship.

[rubik101]

While I can't comment on the structure and the content of the interview and questions you might be asked, I would suggest the following;

When asked why you applied for the position at MAEL, tell them that you
have heard and read that it is one of the best of its kind since it was set
up in the early 1970s. If you mention the names Jock Clacher (say
clacker) and Don Peacock as the founders of the school then you will earn
some brownie points. They were two of the most highly regarded Aircraft
Engineers of their time. Tell them you would like to follow in their hallowed
footsteps!

[smudgethecat]

I wonder how these two would view the way MAEL treats its engineering staff these days rubik?:sad:

[kamshaft]

Hi guys,
just like the guy's above i also have a selection test with monarch next week, it would be very greathful if anyone has information regarding the selection test, as ive never done anything like this before. Also would interviews be held on this day aswell?

Thanks:ok:

[YOUNGBUCK]

If it is similar to any other apprenticeship schemes with similar companies to monarch it will consist of:
General testing, mechanical reasoning or similar, maths, english. If you are bright enough, youll pass it:ok:
Then you may have to do some sort of team work or discussion excercises, this is basically to see your compatability with workmates, if you are able to get along with people. During discussions Dont sit back and not talk, you wont get the job, Get involved but be fair not to leave anyone out, team-player:rolleyes:.
You may then recieve and interview so somebody with a bit of authority can give you the once over.
If all is successful you will get a recall for interview or something similar.

REMEMBER- The company wants people who are going to fit in well. so dont be too boring and dont be too much of a know it all, good personality goes a long way

[rubik101]

Smudge, I fear you are right, they would turn in their respective graves, but then the world has moved on since then, sadly. Bosses who have respect for the dignity of the profession carried out by the working man are as rare as hen's teeth.

Theirs and mine Aircraft Engineering apprenticeships were done at No. 1 School of Technical Training, RAF Halton. The scheme at Monarch was closely based on that in the early days. I have no idea if it still resembles the original!

Good luck to all applicants.

[Capot]

From an interviewer's point of view...

Be clean and smart; there's no need to look like a car salesperson, but don't be scruffy either. If you're male, have a haircut, and shave. If you're female remember you are going for an engineering job, not a receptionist job, and dress accordingly. If anyone tells you these things aren't important, ignore him/her. Impressions count.

Bone up on Monarch; know its outline history and all about its current operation and fleet. Even key names. If you're not interested in the company, they will lose interest in you.

Be very clear about why you want to join the scheme and what your short, medium and long-term goals are. They want motivated people. You must work this one out before you get there; if you're making it up as you go along it will be obvious that you are.

When asked a question, think for a second or two and give a concise answer to the question. Stop when you've finished it! (Sounds obvious but many people feel a need to ramble on.)

In the group situations, only say or do something that's useful and helpful to the team goal. If the others defer to you, take charge. Don't try to seize control by force; you'll come across as a bully. But if there is a real vacuum, fill it. You must attract the assessors' attention positively.

Be yourself.

[Tempsford]

Some good advice here and the usual unfortunate (but predictable) sniping as well. The Monarch Apprenticeship Scheme is excellent. Monarch has continued apart from a gap of a few years, to train engineers (Some airlines and MRO never have!). To date there have been just over 1000 apprentices trained by Monarch. I started my apprenticeship with Monarch or No.1 Aeronautical Apprentice Traing School in 1973. With regard to Don Peacock, I can remember when the workforce rejected a pay deal from management. He called a meeting in the hangar, got up on a box and said that unless we accepted it, he would close the company down the following day. We accepted the offer. As regards how they would react as to how they would view MAEL today, they would be impressed. How do I know that? I knew Don (though not as well, I suspect as Rubik) and Jock. Virtually all other MRO in the UK that were around in 1968 are gone. To survive in todays market does need some difficult decisons to be made. MAEL are making such decisions in order to survive and they are prepared to continue to do so.

[faz1989]

From what I remember when I did it last year, they will be testing you on maths, sciences, electronics and English at a GCSE level. There maybe be a few questions about Monarch such as hubs, aircrafts they fly and destinations they fly to, local and aboard line stations and etc and also about other airlines and aircrafts. Be ready for an essay question and make sure you can name and label most of an aircraft components and parts. You will need a basic understanding of aerodynamics. Brush up on your knowledge about tools and components (e.g. split pins, lock nuts, slotted nut & etc). Make sure you can analysis mechanics by just looking at pictures.
As I did to this last year I don't remember a great deal about it and also as I did go for few other apprenticeships, I might have got confused with there tests and added a few extra things above, but most of it I am sure they will test you on.
You will do the test (I think it will last for approximately 2 hours to complete 2 or 3 tests) and then go home and if you were successful, you will be invited for the next stage.
Good luck and if you are not successful you can always reply for it again next year or go to a Part 147 college and complete your A licence within a year.
I did do this a year ago, so things may be different this year.

Faz

[Bus429]

I am not suggesting MAEL will offer anything like this but in 1978, as an impoverished apprentice living thousands of miles away from my parents, I found it difficult to pay for my B & B. WW mentioned this to Messrs Peacock, Clacher or Hodgson - don't know which but they very kindly granted me an extra weekly stipend that, net, covered most accommodation expenses. This made a big difference and a big thanks to them for their kindness. :ok:

[85mastrac]

A personal thanks to everyone that has responded. Some very useful information is being shared here, as well as re-itteration of good old common sense!

Just out of curiosity, what kind of salary would an apprentice technician realistically expect to receive in their first few years? I don't want to sell myself short, or aim way past the mark should I get asked in an interview.

[Bus429]

85,
I could stand corrected but I'm not sure salary is a negotiating point for an interview for an apprenticeship; I started on £25 week (before stipend referred to above) and managed digs with three meals day (packed lunch), washing etc for the full 7 days and had £9 left for Marathons (Snickers) and other tooth rot (all pre-beer drinking days). Moved soon after to other digs that were not as good and more expensive.

Anyway, good luck to all would-be apprentices; for all the moaning you may read - some of it from me - it is not a bad job. You'll get to work on A300, A330, A320, 757/767 and soon 787s; I had Bristol Britannias, 707/720, 737etc to contend with (and I loved it).:D

[simonchowder]

I would not worry about the salary too much, at the end of the day you will have served a proper hands on apprenticeship with a well respected aircraft engineering company, that will put you way above the droves of chaff being churned out by the numerous aeronautical colleges that deliver so called engineers that are neither use nor ornament, they may have the paper qualifications but they are to be brutally honest unemployable in the real world, yout taking the right route, best of luck.:ok:

[85mastrac]

I could stand corrected but I'm not sure salary is a negotiating point for an interview for an apprenticeshipSorry, I didn't really make myself clear. In past interviews one of the questions I've sometimes been asked is along the lines of:

"And what salary do you expect us to be offering with this position?" ... If they didn't state it in the advert of course!

I certainly don't think I would be in any position to do any negotiating! But if asked, at the moment I would say < £15k, does anyone know if that is accurate?

yout taking the right route, best of luck :ok:

Thanks for the vote of confidence! Same goes to all the others that are applying!

[rubik101]

I note what Tempsford had to say about the somewhat abrupt negotiation techniques employed in the early days of MAEL. I also recall that the company came close to folding on more than one occasion in the very early days, once in particular after taking on some work from a now, thankfully, defunct African airline who didn't pay for the work carried out. The coffers were bone dry and it was with the help of the then current workforce accepting a very meagre pay deal, this in the days when inflation was in double digits, that kept them going at all. Thankfully, new maintenance contracts were signed not too long after this and the company recovered.

[kamshaft]

anyone that has done the exam recently, can you tell us the type of questions that were in the test? and how did you find them.

cheers

[red 5]

I am also an ex MAEL apprentice same year as BUS429, i thoroughly enjoyed my apprenticeship. However we were due to finish in July 1982 and a certain person incharge of the apprentices at the time told all of us that we were being made redundant in a months time. I was not happy with this situation and i asked for a meeting with Jim Rainbow to clarify why we were being made redundant. Basically he was not aware that we were being made redundant and that the person who told us we were would be dealt with. I'm glad Jim listened as there was 9 of us due to finish that year. I stayed till October 1999 and several are still there, i certainly learnt a lot and travelled widely with Monarch a good experience indeed.

[Try_lee]

HI!

Just thought I'd post and say thanks to people for sharing their experiences, particularly faz1989. Really helped me focus on learning things I wouldn't have considered being tested on. :)

[LOGICAL]

Any apprenticeship at luton will not quite be the same at Luton now KP has retired, they have however replaced him with a good guy so the tradition looks as though it will continue, i did mine from 88-92 and have found that the monarch apprenticeship has an excellent name throughout the industry.

[Bus429]

Red 5,
I remember Jim Rainbow telling us, as we graduated and lined up for the photograph outside the ATG, that our jobs were safe. He made the point forcefully - the press was there!
Good apprenticeship all round. During a stint in Brunei in 2001-2, I caught up with several of the RBA guys who trained with us; most now managers at RBA.

[fastener]

What's the current situation at the sign of the spotty M? Spent 5 years working at LTN and loved most of it. Worked with some great characters and had some good laughs. Picked up a lot of good experience (OKADA/Cyprus Airways 707 C checks Arghhhh!!!!). I still miss the Buds/laughs but not going home with blue rakasan fingers.

[smudgethecat]

Not too good from what i can gather, they had a redundancy earlier this year which appeared to have been handled quite badly resulting in the HR director being recently fired and realations betwen the workforce and management are not the best at present to put it mildly, however theres a new bod in charge who appears to be on the ball so hopefully things will improve, hope so as monarch have a lot going for them i certainly received excellent technical training from them during my spell there .

[Bus429]

Fastener,

Did you visit Cyprus to fix 5B-DAL in the 80s?

[topdog1]

Bus 429,Red five and Fastener

Also Ex class of 78-82 and i was in Cyprus on 5B-DAL

Hope your all well and earning a crust.

[red 5]

What a good trip that was, still got many photos of us all in various happy states.

[Bus429]

Red,
You should amend your post; it'll give prospective engineers the wrong idea!:ok:
(I knew of a bloke who was so overcome by the smell of that burnt snake pit that he was sick on the way back to the car park).

Another ex 78-82er, whom I saw recently in AUH, sent me some pictures of the trip. I'm glad I have kept my looks.

[Dani86]

Has anyone heard out from monarch yet who went to the interviews at manchester.

[fastener]

red 5, Bus 429 and topdog 1. Nope not guilty of going to fix the 707. I did not do my time at MAEL but RAE.

[Brian Fantana]

According to the following article I suggest you should learn how to polish teapots, learn how to point out the emergency exits, ask people if they want milk and sugar in their tea, blow into a tube on a life vest.

Monarch apprentices try cabin crew roles : Gatwick Airport News Stories (http://www.uk-airport-news.info/gatwick-airport-news-270709.html)

[officewallah]

I just happen to have a photo of that occasion...
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2585414150104776512BLLHGc?vhost=rides


MON025 pictures from aviation photos on webshots (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2585414150104776512BLLHGc?vhost=rides)

[Bus429]

Early days of corporate communication, then.

[bobgadjet]

I hope this thread is still monitored by those who have gone before. I was looking for something about aircraft apprenticeship schemes for my nephew and stumbled upon this.
I hope the starter carried on and got his (or her) place.

Personally, I did my apprenticeship with British Airways, then British European Airways (1963-1967), and I can honestly say that at that time the earnings were far from my thoughts, and the apprenticeship stood me in good stead as I have had my own engineering company since 1982.
A couple of names mentioned before have brought back great memories as I worked for Monarch from 74-79. They were the best employer I had ever had, and I too remember that hangar meeting shown in the photo.
Another moment in my memory was when the "management" gathered another meeting and advised ALL staff, pilots, cabin crew, etc, that it was not THEY who paid the wages, but the passengers. That has stayed with me since day one.
At that time I was actually working for Aircraft Engineering Ltd (I think that's what they were called) and had a 6 weeks stint in Cyprus looking after 111's for Cyprus Airways.
I would think if any of you were on that stint also you MUST remember drinking at The Old Barrel in Larnaca.

Back to the thread, I will be passing on this info to my nephew in the hope that he obtains as much out of life in aircraft engineering as I did, and by reading previous, what you lot did also.

Being terrible with names I have since forgotten most of those I worked with, and as a former avionics geek, my brain has probably been scrambled by standing too close to the front when the weather radar was on ! ! !

Thanks for the memories guys.

[tarrant]

Hello,
I realize that this is a little off subject but doing some research of ex Eagle people that went to Monarch. Does anyone remember Blondie Brazier an electrical guy. He has I understand passed away some time ago but would like to hear from any who knew him. Also Max Borrial an electrical foreman I think.


Many thanks for any help.

[JackWalsh18]

Hello, I have recently been offered to travel down to london for the first stages of an assessment to become an apprentice aircraft engineer and I was wondering if you would be able to tell me what the assessment process involves since you have been and done it?
Thankyou for any help.

[Yogi Bear]

I am also an ex MAEL apprentice same year as BUS429, i thoroughly enjoyed my apprenticeship. However we were due to finish in July 1982 and a certain person incharge of the apprentices at the time told all of us that we were being made redundant in a months time. I was not happy with this situation and i asked for a meeting with Jim Rainbow to clarify why we were being made redundant. Basically he was not aware that we were being made redundant and that the person who told us we were would be dealt with. I'm glad Jim listened as there was 9 of us due to finish that year. I stayed till October 1999 and several are still there, i certainly learnt a lot and travelled widely with Monarch a good experience indeed.
The 9 Appos. MH, SD, IM, SF, KD, RD, PG, CH, NC. We were told no jobs at end of the apprenticeship. But Steve Poole went in to see the management and fought to save our "jobs" as they could not throw away "36 man years " of training into the bin. Some lads left and went to Hatfield (came back later, SD, MH, IM) which may have saved some positions? The Leading Hand at the time (GH/JH?) was tannoying staff to give them their brown envelopes!!!