Macau Asia Express

[AirOcean]

Any info on this start up?

[A/T less]

CRJs and B737-800s, I heard from a guy at Bar George last week.

[CR-ASC]

Someone told me the same DFO that had to leave Air Macau
moved to them, not an happy sky for sure:ugh:

[BILLI]

hi guys, I want to know about interview in MAX, someone got any information?

[dodi33]

I m loking for information about the interview with Macau expresse in london the Tuesday thanks for your help

[Left Wing]

A320 Sim check and interviews in Alteon LGW

[Arrowhead]

Still no AOC - but at least they have applied for it...

Changes to visa rules is mainland China a bigger issue, perhaps

[Saturn]

How about Air Macau directly. Says they are looking for A300 drivers.

[whiskeytangofox]

Possibly heard a rumour some of the management may be from the former Hong Kong Express!!
A320 arriving December 07

[hailer]

Some more information that might be useful - appears to be well funded for a start up, with reasonably well known share-holders (CNAC and Shun Tak - the gaming lot). Claim it is going to be low cost but it remains to be seen if this is possible. Appears to be a lot of ex Dragonair influence in the start up team, but I am not sure that will be so in Flt Ops.

Six leased A320 aircraft confirmed - 5 in 2008. All ex ANA aircraft, not in the first flush of youth but well maintained. They are currently recruiting Training Captains, Captains and First Officers- it appears the initial package they offered was pretty thin (certainly NOT Dragonair packages) and rumour has it that a sizeable increase in salary may be about finalised - rumoured to be US$135 K per annum for a Captain, US$100 K for an experienced FO. They are also apparently willing to take low time FO with no jet experience.

They state a preference for A320 experienced crew - but then who doesn't! At least they are offering A320 transition courses - no formal bond but a three year reducing loan against the transition cost.

Initial routes to Japan, Vietnam and Philippines but they state that eventually China will be the main focus. Given the huge growth of casinos and "associated delights" in Macau it does appear there is a genuine business case to feed the voracious appetite of the gambling tables. Usual over optimism about growth and profitability - plans to have a zillion aircraft by year three!

Couple of permanent management guys rumoured to be about to start - Safety Manager ex CX; CP and MT from some European operator. The VP Ops and Manager Operations are ex Air Macau - at the moment there is an old ex Dragonair guy as Head of Operations but he is apparently only there for the next couple of months to get the show going.

The formal AOC application process is underway and most of the manuals supposedly written and submitted for approval.

Interviews are the usual routine - personal interview, a group session on technical subjects and a simulator ride (very straightforward). Pretty friendly atmosphere I am told.

There is a pretty good web site on Macau - COL, tax, cost of accommodation etc - look it up on Google. It ain't Hong Kong, but neither is it Shenzen so on balance probably a reasonable bet.

Hailer

[pyote]

In that case, how does one get hold of them????

[Arrowhead]

Just a few more thoughts...

1. Still no AOC, so still no airline

2. 6 A320's is a nice idea, but shame there is no-where to park that many between 11am-1pm, and 6pm-8pm. And following any red TS warning. And 6 A320s for the 3 countries (ie 6 routes) you mentioned is unlikely. Either 6 acft includes a number of other routes (eg SIN, China), or 2 acft is really the real number for the next 2-3 years.

3. Vietnam, Philippines and Japan? This is a complete turnaround from China, China, China as the previous stated strategy. Admittedly, given the new visa rules for mainlanders, something was likely to change. However it does make MAX mgmt look confused. Moreso when you consider 1 (and from October 2) loco airlines already operate from MFM to Clark and MNL. As does as Air Macau too. Furthermore, Air Macau recently said its future focus is on Japan, which makes the Japan strategy also look unlikely, give MAX's parentage. So that just leaves Vietnam. Meanwhile, where has SIN gone?

Hailer, I dont work for MAX so I cant be sure. But it looks like what you are being told is just PR bluff to wind up Viva. My guess is it taking another 6 months to get an AOC (and therefore to call pilots), and then MAX starting to SIN, maybe KL and BKK, plus taking some Tier 2 Chinese cities from Air Macau (such as Changsha, Guiyang, Haikou, Kunming) to create space for Air Macau to put Japan in its schedule.

Just some thoughts....

[PONCHOVILLA]

Arrowhead ,

Thats right on. Sounds like the same bull**** spin that hongkong express are well known for (just revisit that thread) I am sure this venture will result in the same turnover as HKE. Same players so I would not expect much different. :=

[wayne's tache]

Arrowhead - you got a view on what is going on in Macau? I make it now five runners-and-riders....

Viva Macau - supposedly long-haul into Macau from various concession points but now telling the regulator that they can't make any money on their own routes so they want some new ones. But flying wide-body, dual-class aircraft so wrong type/config for the shorter haul segments that they now say they must get access to?

Air Macau - basket case; split between the late-lunchers and the Politburo. Unlikely to survive too much longer in current form, especially if direct links open up from Taiwan.

Macau Asia Express - not clear quite who or why but nominally at least backed by some money and supposed to have leased aircraft.

Venetian - newest entrant, ready to throw its weight about in insisting on special status and perhaps looking at a widebody operation to fill their weekly convention cycles?

Golden Dragon - a sub-concession owner and Stanley Ho narrow-body operation, but no news on it anywhere.

So, a lot of players, a lot of talk...

[Arrowhead]

In brief...

Viva - largely depends on how Japan and Sydney pan out. Effectively decent mgmt versus the regulator and Air Macau:ugh:. My money is they grow nicely.

Air Macau - good description! Mgmt's "bury head in sand" strategy is bizarre and typical of an ex-monopoly:eek:. Normally followed by "change mgmt and desperately try to compete" once competition is fully established. Sadly most ex-monopolists survive through sheer mass.

MAX - still no AOC and no acft and no clear strategy - but I am guessing will start Q1/Q2 next year. I think the real test will be how they compete with Air Macau esp. once the cross-straits thing gets going. I dont believe Air Macau mgmt has the balls to compete with its own loco baby, which is what it should do. Which means MAX will be supressed and maybe eventually killed by its own parent.:ouch:

G. Dragon - very quiet. Cant see anything happenning.

Venetian - focused on VIP market right now. Now that all major Asian cities (bar India) are about to be covered by direct flights to Macau, I dont think there is such pressure. I think they will continue to lobby politicians to open up the skies to ensure more frequencies. They did try for an AOC though...

Also look out for more inbound flights. East Star is starting to Wuhan, Cebu to Manila, and I would expect more once Cotai really opens up.

[wayne's tache]

Arrowhead,

Good summary.

I have my doubts that Macau as a market at the moment can pull in enough long haul business to make Viva's approach viable. They'd have to price at such a serious discount to fares into HKG that they will bleed cash. Otherwise choose the airmiles, the frequency and the "service" on a full service operator into HKG. Its only an hour on the ferry.

The other option is to switch to shorter haul routes but this runs into NX/regulatory issues and is in itself a limited strategy. For SE Asia, Tiger and Air Asia already fly into Macau at cost levels Viva cannot presumably get close to. If Viva looks north to the PRC, they run into emerging carriers like East Star or state funded traditionals who can also price lower for longer. Plus Air China is de facto big brother to NX and MAX, so at the very least can slow Viva's attempts to set up operations from there to a snail's pace.

Either way, if the prospects are as positive as you think, why did the CEO/founder leave for another opportunity? Maybe it will work but whoever is funding them is going to have to show a lot of nerve for a while.

I reckon the Venetian has more legs - no funding issues and they are integral to future of Macau and can browbeat the Government on the risk to the future of the Cotai Strip if they have to rely on the unimpressive existing airline offering.

And why do they need to stop with VIP transport? Their conferences will house thousands, many coming from similar points of origin so once the convention flow starts, they could package up a "complimentary flights" approach that gets their foot in the door.

Anyway, sounds like you have better knowledge than me here....did they actually try and get an AOC?

[pruner01]

Wayne

I dont know much about Macao but I flew into the airport recently and its too small to have many new flights unless they build more facilities. So I can't see local airlines can grow much, even if they manage to get started (and seems so many of them try)!

Ok maybe Macao is becoming Asia Las Vegas but when they build the bridge from Hong Kong, why do you need to direct fly to Macao.

Just my view.

[Arrowhead]

On Viva - we'll see. But take a look at the website and surprisingly you will see the fares (1 month + out) are not cheaper than CX and QF to SYD. ie they are not heavily discounting. Furthermore, cost of operating out of MFM is lower than HKG (people, airport, tax), so smaller acft are offset by lower costs. Regardless, its a charter and so all paid for... and they are not really trying to steal outbound pax from HKG yet - its still an inbound market. Ubt you are right, I think Europe and US are still some way off (just as NX has talked but done nothing for years).

I would agree on the PRC and Air Asia. Hence they dont (and maybe wont) fly to Malaysia, Thailand or China.

I dont really want to say too much about AP leaving, but perhaps its not a bad thing. And on the money front, with Jakarta, Busan, Sydney for one acft and the other going on wet lease they should be break even from here. Furthermore only Jakarta is non-charter (ie on risk).

I am sure Viva investors would sell to Venetian at the right price. Meanwhile it will take some time for Venetian to realise how hard it is to get AOC and routes. So we'll see. I think Venetian will simply apply more pressure on local govt to open the skies faster. They didnt start an airline for Vegas so why in Macau, esp since its not "their line of business". VIPs will come in on the corp acft already parked here, and 2 VIP L1011s on their way - for which they are trying to get an AOC but are running into the standard Macau problems.

On the airport and bridge - (red TS warnings aside) the airport is empty from 9pm to 10.30am, and from 2pm to 6pm. But add more Viva acft plus MAX, plus another NX, plus East Star, plus Cebu plus the new Air Asia to Johor plus 2 Venetian L1011s and its looking busier. They plan to fill in btwn taxiways C and G/H but it could take years (or until the govt forces them).

Rumour has it the bridge will not be started until 2015 and completed until 2020. Meanwhile Macau will be largely built out by 2010. Indeed, I would turn it around. Why would you fly into HKG if you can fly into MFM for less and there is a bridge to the city?

[wayne's tache]

I'd agree with Arrowhead on the bridge issue. The Macau, Guangdong and Hong Kong authorities have to reach consensus on all of the immigration, construction and funding arrangements. Lots of egos to placate and pork barrel funds to allocate, so this is not going to happen fast.

On Viva, well Arrowhead the jury is out. If Venetian decides to buy them purely for an AOC, they will presumably only want to pay up to what they calculate it costs to push for a standalone AOC themselves (and this already assumes that they can cut through the regulatory mess linked to buying a sub-concession from Viva).

This would mean that the Viva investors (who must be in for a lot more than the AOC set up costs alone as they must have been operating at a significant loss this year) would not get anything close to their original equity investment back.

I suppose they could accept a fire sale if they decided that this was the only way to cover some of their losses. The irony is that they can't argue that the sub-concession is worth much as part of any rescue deal as Viva is insisting that it needs to fly to points outside of it to survive! Its tough to cite the subcon as a legal asset worth paying for when they seem to regard it as a commercial liability....

On the business model, your logic of charter operations being 'all paid for' only extends so far. Sure, the risk passes to the charterer for the duration of the charter contract but if he discovers he is losing money himself he just won't renew the deal. Assuming he is signing short term contracts, this doesn't give Viva much breathing space.

So, what are the economics behind the charterer's business? If - as you point out - the fares being advertised are not much cheaper than CX or QF flights from Sydney, we return to the original question of why people would choose Viva. Will they regard the 90 minutes less land travel time from HKG as more valuable than the loss of the benefits of full service carrier product highlighted previously?

I doubt it. The only reason for large numbers of passengers to shift to SYDMFM are a clear and sustainable cost saving to the customer from choosing to fly Viva to Macau. But the costs that you cite as providing an advantage (airport fees, some lower expenses for ground staff) are too small a percentage of the overall cost base to allow for significant fare differentials to be sustained.

One final comment - I hadn't heard that they were trying to wet lease one of their aircraft. If so, it seems inconsistent that they effectively halve their fleet whilst talking about the exciting opportunities in Macau for low fare airlines. If they had a genuine cost advantage, surely they would be keen to maximise it by spreading their lower cost base over a larger operation to as many passengers as possible?

My guess is - if I understand you right that they are trying to wet lease - that this is more a sign that the business model is heavily under water for the foreseeable future, and the only fallback is to try to conserve cash whilst they hope for a change in the aeropolitics. This may come sooner rather than later as NX doesn't exactly have a reservoir of goodwill to fall back on locally. The question is how long this takes and who they can find to fund the wait.

[hailer]

All intellectually sound and esoteric stuff from Arrowhead and Wayne's Tache.

However for those more interested in whether Macau Asia Express (or any carrier in Macao for that matter) is a good bet for employment, I heard an informed whisper last night that MAX have agreed to create two additional ranks - Senior Captain and Senior First Officer, with a 20 % + enhancement of the original salaries.

The Senior Captain (4000 hours; 1000 multi crew transport; 500 jet transport command from memory) now USD130,000 pa; Senior First Officer (3000 hrs; 500 hrs multi crew) now USD84 000 pa. The package is made up of several items - high productivity element based on 17 duties per month (but with a minimum guarantee) - the figures are approximate. There is also a provident fund/ medical etc but no housing. Minimal travel. Still not Cathay but getting better. Start dates for first aircraft late September.

Obviously they must have recognised the reality - if you want to get some decent pilots you have to pay for them, not rely on meaningless rhetoric about the reputation of the shareholders (Which Wayne ad Arrowhead would doubtless demolish in any case!)

Does this make it an attractive job? The jury is out, but it has advantages. They will give A320 ratings; they are offering a permanent job; they do not have a "localisation" problem; they have got 6 aircraft firmed up so there will be promotion and training opportunities. Living in Macao may be an acquired taste, but the tax is better than HK, accommodation is cheaper.

As to the interesting exchange above, much may be aplication of logic to an illogical situation! Having three airlines in Macao makes no sense; creating an airline to compete with your own other airline makes even less sense that defies rational analysis, so there are obviously other forces at play. My bet would be that MAX has a chance of prospering particularly if Air Macau is the basket case it reportedly is. I certainly would not put my pension on Viva's survival even if they are charming guys with or without AP!

Hailer

[pedro luk]

TO ALL DEAR FRIENDS
I am Macau resident . and holding FAA and Canadian licence with airbus320 rating but no type hour , total 750 hours including 200 multi time . anyone can tell me is possible to get hire in MAE and how can I apply the job in MAE :rolleyes:

[hailer]

Pedro,

Try email to operations@macau-asia-express or [email protected]. They may have more up to date information on their web site, but I know those two email addresses will reach a couple of "suits" - no doubt with ostentatiously open neck shirts to show they've rad the text book!

Hailer

[Arrowhead]

Wayne

On HKG - its not really a focus for most people right now in Macau - the focus is the inbound and transit market. That said, why do people in London fly from Luton and Gatwick and Stanstead when they are much further away? Money, and slots at the right time of day. So I think MFM can become a viable 2nd airport for HK over time. Hence Air Asia and Tiger coming to MFM not HKG.


Hailer

On MAX - you have to believe NX will give them room to breathe. Questionable. Personally, I think they should do what BA and Iberia have done which is to create their own decent loco competitor to compete with other locos, rather than have more locos compete and steal their market. Already NX has "lost" 4 of SE Asias biggest markets to loco competitors - SIN, BKK, KUL and MNL. MAX could then be sold later once it has established itself firmly. But I cannot see the Chinese psyche allowing a subsidiary to compete with the parent. MAX should be going to PVG and PEK and TPE, but I just cant see it. Anyway, until theres an AOC and approvals this is all theoretical.

[Arrowhead]

The politically correct answer is that they believe there is no market for a "full cost" service to second tier Chinese cities and on routes where there is already loco competition.

The reality is they dont have the balls. Furthermore, loco has effectively kicked them off BKK, KUL and SIN. They say their full service cannot compete with loco.

[wayne's tache]

Interesting news on the MAX pilot pay Hailer - even when viewed from my high-brow altitude - as it looks like they need people quickly.

Let's see what happens in the next couple of months; if crew, aircraft and an AOC are all sighted on the horizon, maybe a genuine shake-up is underway.

The status quo is clearly no longer an option...

[Speedbreak]

Found this on the web:


PILOTS – CAPTAINS AND FIRST OFFICERS

Holders of Valid and Current ICAO ATPL (or, in the case of First Officers, CPL with frozen ATPL) acceptable to the Civil Aviation Authority of Macau (AACM).

Minimum Experience:

Captains

A total of 3,000 hours

Minimum 1,000 hours on a multi-crew jet or turbine aircraft, or military fast jet, and Minimum 500 hours in command on multi crew transport aircraft
First Officers

A total of 1,000 hours

Minimum 300 hours on multi-crew public transport operations
Preference will be given to applicants with recent A320 experience.

In addition to a good command of English, the ability to speak Cantonese or Mandarin would be an advantage.

Please forward your application including resume, present and expected salary to [email protected].

[wayne's tache]

Press release on their website - six a/c secured (assuming LOI is a genuine commitment), first one arriving in December.


MACAU, 9th August 2007
Macau Asia Express has confirmed that it has signed a Letter Of Intent to lease six A320-200 aircraft from an affiliate of Aircastle Limited (“Aircastle”). The arriving fleet will be utilized to develop a new, single-class, low-fare route network between Macau and a number of cities in PRC, Japan, Vietnam and other points in Asia in 2008.The aircraft are powered by CFM-56 engines.
The first aircraft will be delivered to Macau in December 2007, with the delivery of the sixth aircraft scheduled for the first quarter of 2009. The airline intends to grow further to a fleet of eleven aircraft by the end of 2010.
Francis Wai – the airline CEO - said “We are delighted to have been able to source an initial ‘sister fleet’ of this size, especially in the current marketplace in which aircraft supply is extremely limited. An operating lease arrangement of this scope delivers the initial momentum to begin our growth and enables us to concentrate on adding new routes and additional frequencies in line with customer needs. We are very focused on bringing more people to visit Macau and its rapidly developing range of gaming, leisure and entertainment facilities. So it’s great news for us, the travelling public and Macau’s economy at large.”
Commenting on the transaction Aircastle’s Chief Executive Officer Ron Wainshal remarked, “The growth potential in Macau’s air travel market is significant and Aircastle is excited to be working with Macau Asia Express to develop this opportunity.”

[Arrowhead]

Well spotted. Very interesting.

Turns out the Air Macau CEO has a meeting with MAX mgmt today.

From what CEO Fei has been saying recently, Air Macau does not appear to know where MAX plans to fly to. Sounds like some feathers will be ruffled. Did you notice how Vietnam and "other SE Asian cities" seem to have crept into the top of the statement, but not the bottom?!

[HotDog]

Viva is wet leasing one of their 767 aircraft to Air Nuigini in November I believe. Cabin crew will be Air Nuigini staff.

Just been informed by my source that the lease commences at the end of this month for a period of four weeks only.

[hailer]

Not sure if they are deliberately misleading people or if this is just poorly phrased. The Macau AACM process is that an application for an AOC has to be kick started by a Formal Application containing a detailed Schedule of Events, and submission of most of the Operations and Engineering Manuals. According to the AACM website details of the business plan and route structure are also required. I guess what MAX are referring to is the the Formal Application has been accepted. Not for one second do I believe the AOC has been granted as for a start they do not have an aircraft yet to do route proving. However, I guess it is a start.

The news that the two managements (NX and MAX) are speaking to each other should not, I suppose, be any surprise - they are the same shareholders by and large. It would be surprising if they were not speaking given that both need to get their costs lower and there must be synergy benefits. Someone else on this thread suggested it is a natural synergy to have the legacy and the loco share what they can and be arms length where they have different philosophies. That common sense does not, however, allow for bigger egos than intellects!

Given last week's figures on the number of additional hotel beds and gambling tables Macau sure as hell needs everything from spaceships to rickshaws to get people in.

I still have not seen confirmation of the new MAX salary scales but I am assured they are effective and have been offered to some applicants. Anyone got any news?

Hailer

[wayne's tache]

anyone know what happened here?

I read in the Australian press that CASA is blaming Viva for applying only a few days before they were due to start flying, leaving insufficient time for clearances.

The Venetian will have fewer problems opening up regular charters ex-MFM in widebody aircraft if all the "local" carriers continue to look so amateurish.

[hailer]

Wayne's Tache,

Viva, AACM and CASA seem to be blaming each other for the debacle with the Sydney route. Rumours of people leaving Air Macau abound. The Govt are desperate for some competent people to actually show they can move people into Macao, and it is not easy to find much competence amongst the three contenders! It seems that Macao Asia Express are at least being galvanized into belated action.

I am told the changes to the Conditions of Service have come through a 20% increase on the original. Given the cost of living in Macao they are probably now a pretty competitive package. They have "re branded" (pretty good considering they never had one to start with!) to Macao Express; aircraft deal done; chief pilot arrived; recruitment effort in full swing.

They may be a good bet yet - if you can put up with the ex Dragonair types patting themselves on the back.

Hailer

[wayne's tache]

Bored-as,

Sounds like they were not delayed too long by the regulators, whoever was responsible. Internet says Viva "sources" claim it to be the Macau regulator's fault. The Macau authorities have said nothing...

I'll be interested to see what people are paying to fly to Macau from Sydney on Viva. I've had this discussion previously on the message board with Arrowhead but I see no obvious reason for passengers to sign up for a charter seat unless they are getting a serious discount to a CX/QF fare.

It's interesting - Macau aviation - 500k people and more home airlines than most European countries! My bets are on Venetian (cash, focus, brand) and Macau Asia Express (shorter haul to Asian consumers, with a tighter operational fit to the traditional lower cost model).

[wayne's tache]

Its all gone quiet again on the Macau aviation scene when it should be hotting up, what with the Venetian opening and all those tables to fill!

I did see some stuff came through on the wires about the MAX aircraft deal and their MRO contracts but that is about it.

Anyone got any local insight?

Hailer, you seemed to have your ear to the ground locally on MAX and "Bored As" seemed to have the Viva inside track?

How about those pilots on the board who have had interviews with MAX?

[nyaminyami]

yes please guys some more insight on MAX. I was recently advised that i was being considered for an FO position with them but since submitting the required documentation have heard nothing.

[tonylollo]

MAX pay on productivity, minus tax, minus soaring accommodation costs in Macau. That means when you go on leave or do so sim or something your wages drop........... Oh how they try to fool us. :\

[Arrowhead]

As I keep saying, until they know where they are allowed to fly, and when they are likely to get an AOC, MAX is unliklely to commit to anything.

Meanwhile, I still dont understand how they can compete with the mainland on cost (nb mainlanders wont pay for expat crews), and Air Macau wont give them any juicy routes. Strategically I think they are screwed. Also, Venetian are casino operators not airline operator, so I doubt that will go very far out of the VIP space.

...and Air Macau still has its head up its own *rse.

Three cheers for Viva's first Tokyo flight by the way....

[BILLI]

Hi Do You Have Any Idea For How Long You Need To Stay In Macau For This Class?

[Caco]

Any news about Dubai interview, and Sim check, on 5/6/7 Sept.Next interview, in Macau,18/19/20.Sept. I saw new advertisement in Flight international today.

[hailer]

Caco - there were interviews in DXB last week - I believe about 15 people interviewed. Apparently pretty straightforward - followed usual pattern with combination of indoctrination bull, personal interview and technical group session plus simulator ride. Not heard any results yet. Apparently the same number to be interviewed in Macau next week.

Nyaminyami - I would contact them again if you meet their profile and have not heard. I have it from the horses mouth that potential Captains are on a winner if they can find the LHS in the simulator.

I have also heard that the guy they had appointed as Training Manager has turned it down, so they are probably looking for a TRE with management experience as well.

Arrowhead - your latest post is not up to your normal insightful norm! I know for a fact that MAX have signed for six aircraft, and I also know for fact that the PRC airlines DO have expatriate pilots, and the pay rates are going up by the day. They may be reluctant to pay, but they are not fools and they realise that pay peanuts etc. However whether MAX and AMU realise this is something else given their anal fixation about Macau being the centre of aviation, especially if spiced up with a few past it ex Dragonair types.

Certainly the rumour mill indicates that the talk in the smoke filled rooms is all about "co-operation" between AMU and MAX, and AMU claims that they will rule. That will ruffle a few feathers no doubt, but could be good news for the security of potential employees.

It begs the question, of course, as to why this sham of an exercise of needing a second airline ever got off the ground, but there is no doubt the added capacity, planes and pilots are needed, so jobs should be secure.

I have seen the MAX briefing sheet on their Conditions of Service, and although you need an abacus to work it out, the salary scale now is not bad at all. It could be a good move.

Hailer

[El Kabong]

Hailer, you appear to be in the know. Have recently arrived in HK and generally been shafted by broken promises etc etc. Whats the go with AMU and MAX, i.e. requirements, recruiting, pay and which organisation would be a better bet? I have heavy time.

Would appreciate some no bullsh1t advise for once in Hong Kong

[cpahka]

I copy from their adv for you guys may interested...thanks!





Job Role: Flight Crew
Job Hours: Full-Time
Location: China
Job Position: Permanent
Company: Macau Asia Express
Salary: Up to USD131 thousands per annum
Posted Date: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:59:36 AM
Macau Asia Express Limited has signed the leasing agreement for the first six A320-200 aircrafts and five of them will be delivered in 2008. The arriving fleet will be utilized to develop a new, single-class, low-fare route network between Macau and a number of cities in Japan, PRC, Vietnam and other points in Asia.

We are now looking to recruit;

Direct Entry Senior Captain
Up to USD131 thousands per annum

Requirements:
§ A320 type rating not required but will be an advantage
§ Valid ICAO, JAA or FAA ATPL (A)
§ Valid class 1 medical certificate
§ Minimum 4,000 total flying hours
§ Minimum 1,000 flying hours on multi-engine jet public transport aircraft
§ Minimum 500 hours in command on multi-crew jet aircraft

v These are permanent positions and type-rated training will be given.
v Non-type-rated candidate will be considered up to aged 61 and type-rated candidates up to aged 63.
v Training positions are available for type-rated line training captains and TRE.
============================================================ =
Job Role: Flight Crew Job Hours: Full-Time
Location: China
Job Position: Permanent
Company: Macau Asia Express
Salary: Up to USD84 thousands per annum
Posted Date: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:57:34 AM
Macau Asia Express Limited has signed the leasing agreement for the first six A320-200 aircrafts and five of them will be delivered in 2008. The arriving fleet will be utilized to develop a new, single-class, low-fare route network between Macau and a number of cities in Japan, PRC, Vietnam and other points in Asia.

We are now looking to recruit;

Direct Entry Senior First Officer
Up to USD84 thousands per annum

Requirements:
§ A320 type rating not required but will be an advantage
§ Valid ICAO, JAA or FAA ATPL (A)
§ Valid class 1 medical certificate
§ Minimum 3,000 total flying hours
§ Minimum 500 flying hours on multi-engine jet public transport aircraft

v These are permanent positions and type-rated training will be given.

If you are interested in this permanent position, please forward your application including resume, present and expected salary to [email protected]

[Arrowhead]

Be careful with the pay spiel lads, I have heard (but not seen) that the pay is highly geared towards hours flown. Hopefully you will have seen the exact details. Anyway, remember that new airlines have a habit of adding to the schedule only very slowly - esp in Macau. Meanwhile, remember that AMU and the regulator (AACM) are both either :confused:or :mad:which could add further delays.
Coming back to Hailer's points...
1) I know the A320s are LOI (ie semi-confirmed, ie should go through)
2) My point is that the PRC has relatively few expat pilots (eg the Brazilians in Shenzhen that havent yet gone to HK-cant figure out how they did their ground exams:D). My point about mainlanders paying for expats was that mainland *passengers* would not pay more for their tickets for a gweilo cockpit crew.
3) AMU does rule 100% (even VIVA Macau which is non-subsidiary), because it has the monopoly concession and is totally in bed with the regulator. ie if AMU does not want it, they can make your life bloody hard for a long time (just ask Cebu - whoops:eek:)
4) Air Macau said it would not compete with low-cost given its structural high cost (read low-brained:}) base. Thats why it left SIN, KUL, only does Manila 4x/wk with no service, and Bangkok at a crazy time to keep its Korean agents happy. To be fair, Air Asia and Tiger are strong competitors. So they decided to set up a loco to compete on a level playing field..... or should I say to appease the politicians to add more routes meanwhile sharing the losses with partners (Stanley wants the pax in his Casinos, and probably cares little about airline profitability). MAX can only work if it has a large and shiny new fleet bought for a big discount (oops), or it is highly integrated into the parent to share many costs. Sadly, I fear it will be a loss leader for Stanley Ho, and the cheapest way to keep the politicians quiet for AMU.
I didnt think I would ever say this, but if you are already rated I would join the parent company first - esp since the pro-Brazilian movement has probably ended and 3 Captains have left within the last month.

ps I know sensible people who were hired by the MAX Chief Pilot, even relocated their families to Macau, only to be told on arrival that they were not expected there :uhoh: (they got in, just, eventually...). He's a nice guy, but he is sly. So be careful you have it absolutely clearly in writing before you do anything. You have been warned.:=

[hailer]

Aha! Arrowhead back on song! That is a good thoughtful post, and certainly sound advice. However there are a couple of points worth making:

1. The aircraft according to Air Castle are a signed and delivered lease agreement -first aircraft delivered to MAX in late December.
2. I have seen the contract - it is based on 17 Duty Periods per month average over the year - i.e. work 204 duty periods and you get the loot. The guarantee is for a minimum of 10.
3. I think all concerned in the smoke filled rooms are having second thoughts about head to head competition - not something that is fashionable in Macao! If Air Macau and MAX do end up in bed together then it will be a marriage made in commercial hell, but you never know, it might be good for the pilots employed by both companies.
4. NX or MAX - don't know. You pay your money and you take your choice.
5. Not sure to whom the Chief Pilot bit relates - MAX appears to have two CP! One is VPO designate when the current Head of Operations disappears into the sunset (and is ex NX), the other is CP designate. They are as far as I know the only pilots currently there so not sure about the story of guys arriving to find no job!
6. I agree that the casinos generally, not just Stanley, could not care less how the people get to Macao, as long as they get there and lose their money. That is good news for survival if not for operational discipline.

Hailer

[Arrowhead]

1) I have only seen this: http://72.14.235.104/search?q=cache:XXM9wY99oVwJ:www.macau-asia-express.com/news/news1.html+Macau+Asia+Express+A320&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=uk which says LOI not full contract

2) Then expect 10 (or less) for some initial period of time (several months), do not expect 17.

5) VS (ex NX DFO) is who I was referring to

6) True. And operating performance has never really had any impact on NX bonuses.

Has anyone even been indicated a start date yet?

[hailer]

Ausflyer,

Yeah - considering they are only a potential start up, they seem to have a pretty convoluted organisation!

CN IS the "CP - designate". The other fellow - VS is the current CP but is the "VPO Designate". There is at the moment another player - FH (ex KA retiree) who is there currently to act as an advisor during the start up, as Head of Operations but leaves at the end of October. Then the final organisation will be VS - VPO; CN - CP.

LCC are supposed to have flat organisations and easy access to the decision makers! Apparently they have also appointed a COO and a CCO reporting to the CEO (all ex KA). At least they will have a big legacy airline organisation if nothing else! I am sure that Kelleher, Fernandez and O'Leary must be trembling with fear to discover they were wrong all these years!

However, from the practical point of view it should still be a reasonably secure job for pilots if the shareholders sort the politics out.

Hailer

[hailer]

Ausflyer
Australian I believe, although been working from somewhere in Europe.
Hailer

[Arrowhead]

With Chinese and Portuguese involved, there can only be too many managers doing nothing but having very long unproductive meetings...

I just hope the Aussies can make something of it...

[Arrowhead]

The issue is not Colin N. The issue is VS. He is not a bad guy, he just never tells you how it really is - he is the master of spin. I have had 30 minute conversations and been left wondering what he actually said. So if it is not written down, dont believe it.

You must be prepared for the training and flying not to start until other issues get resolved. "Next week" may be repeated to you every week until they get resolved (possibly months, if at all), since this is how he has operated before.

Living in Macau is cheaper than HK since your accomodation can be done for as little as HKD7k per month, up to HK$15k for a nice 2000sq ft appartment with a view (versus over 50k in HK). Local stuff is the same price, but foreign food/dink is cheaper. Virtually no tax on booze!

[hongkongfooey]

A view, in China :confused::}:{

get that x-ray vision going, if you thought pollution was bad in HK..................thats where most of it comes from.

[hailer]

Hongkongfooey,

Not sure if perfidious humans are not more of a danger to potential MAX pilots than the air quality! The pollution in Macau is certainly no worse than the majority of places in HKG (certainly the ones that pilots can afford to life in nowadays!).

There are still disturbing rumours about delays in issuing pilot contracts and of ongoing political manoeuvring (mostly involving unenlightened self interest and an unseemly scramble for power!).

At least one of the MAX board has "form" in this respect, and a pusillanimous senior management may not be entirely in control.

I would certainly want to see a contract (whether from NX or MAX makes no difference) before I resigned from my current job and told my current CP where to stick his aircraft!

Hailer

[Arrowhead]

:D

You were warned. And I'll say it again. Dont believe "next week" means that until you actually see a piece of paper.

My guess for pilot start dates is still "next year, maybe Q2". Remember they still have no aircraft to base check you on, so you cannot complete your local licence. Use NX's aircraft? Mmmmm, depends on the politics, and MAX's declaration of destintations without NX approval may have screwed that.

On the routes, I still cant see how the politics are going to play out. You have
a) the Hos who want to fly anywhere asap to get pax into casinos
b) NX - the only company in Macau set to report lower revenues and higher losses this year (despite the fastest economy growing economy in the world at 40% GDP growth) - bad face, so no chance TPE, KHH, PEK, PVG, ICN, Japan
c) Beijing who is becoming anti-casino and whose recently appointed COO must be concluding these aircraft would be better placed for Air China by wet leasing all but 2 aircraft out of PEK

So for routes, my guess is still 2nd tier China (aka no profits, load factors) with LCC competitive routes (aka no profits)

:ouch:

[crewbag]

What happened to MAX webpage?

http://www.macau-asia-express.com/index.html

:8

[Arrowhead]

Very interesting. Anybody spot what has gone missing?

All the destinations. Rumours continue that relations with NX hit a new low. Oops.

Also March launch date. Means aircraft arrive Jan, AOC (requires aircraft) in Feb, proving flight end Feb, launch March. I reckon you'll get asked to start in mid Feb - assuming the AOC and proving flight go swimmingly and things dont slip further.

[Johny Walker]

Can anyone out there please shed some light on details of T&C with that new establishment.. Is medical insurance for family provided? What about schooling allowances? Taxes? How much does one need for living say a family with two kids normal life style.
Regards,
Johny.

[Arrowhead]

I know the parent company only offers medical to the employee and not the family. And even that cover is pathetically low unless you want to be treated by a local witch doctor (you go to HK or BKK if you are really ill).

Similarly no schooling allowances, and school fees can be anything from free (once you get residency) to USD8000/yr (see http://www.skhps.edu.mo and http://www.tis.edu.mo). Aussie school also coming next year.

Tax is ~5% on income, no VAT/GST, 7% on booze, 0% on savings and investments. Further cuts possible.

MOP50k/month is enough for you all to have a good lifestyle. Helper costs USD400-600/month for full time six days a week incl babysitting, and worth doing.

If you are already typed, I suggest you contact Air Macau (who is recruiting) since I am hearing that the whole project may be in jeopardy due political and managerial problems.:uhoh:

[hailer]

Arrowhead,

Not sure if all your pessimism is entirely correct, but undoubtedly Macau Express (if that is this month's name) are doing little to refute such views. The first two aircraft are to be handed over by ANA in December and January. The crew Transition Training is due to commence in November, and I am informed the courses are booked. The first crews were due to arrive next week for indoctrination and exams. Macau Express will not make their long trumpeted start date if the crews do not join in the next two weeks (the pilots are not type rated).

However the big doubt remains resolution of what is clearly emerging as a sizeable punch up between Macau Express and Air Macau with Air China acting as the cheerleader. Clearly none of these organisations are particularly aware or caring about the effect their very public spat is having on current staff and the pilots due to join whose start date has been delayed. Macau is even more awash than usual with rumour, counter rumour and character assassinations!

I have been given a copy of a "personal" message from one of the Macau Express management to the pilots offered positions (see below) - it leaves lots of questions open. However, if the crews do end up as part of Air Macau that may not be a bad option for them and their long term security.

The message reads:

"Gentlemen,

I have met many of you during the Macau Express interview process - and for those that I have not met, I am the Head of Operations and Safety.

Undoubtedly all of you will be concerned, and particularly those due to start in the next week, that you have not had final joining instructions and a final Contract of Employment.

Unfortunately we are having some bureaucratic problems, not unusual in start up situations. I can assure you that we are working very hard to resolve the issues, and I believe we are near a solution. It may, unfortunately translate into a starting date delay for those of you due to commence on 10th October of about two weeks.

I am writing to you in a personal capacity for two reasons - firstly because I am fully aware of the anxiety created by a delay such as this for many of you, who may have given up current jobs (and I accept a degree of personal responsibility for encouraging you to join Macau Express). Secondly, until everything is resolved I am not free to express all my views in any"official" message.

For what it is worth I find the situation unacceptable, but that is little help to you. The one silver lining to the storm clouds is that I have been assured today by the COO that the company recognises that there is a commitment to employ the 18 people addressed in this letter, and I believe resolution of our problems is close.

The delay is being driven by Air China who own big chunks of both Macau Express and Air Macau either directly or indirectly, and they are anxious to see what harmonisation and co-operation they can between the operators. From your standpoint the major concern is, is this going to happen? I still strongly believe it is. Undoubtedly there is still a business case for the additional capacity; the aircraft are definitely coming (and soon); the casinos and hotels are built . In the worst case for you it probably boils down to whether your contract will be with Air Macau or Macau Express, and it probably matters little to you whether the terms are Macau Express Conditions of Service or Air Macau terms (indeed the Air Macau ones are marginally better).

There is still amongst the shareholders a strong desire to start service on 15th March and even they probably recognise they have to act quickly if we are to achieve that. Thus, I advise, whatever your first instincts are on reading this, do not abandon us yet! I am more than happy to give any of you as honest an answer as I can to personal queries - please use this email. You have my very sincere personal apologies for this uncertainty which will be hopefully resolved very quickly. Best regards,"

Only time will tell if his (subdued) optimism is justified, but what does seem to be clear is that this situation is not originating within Macau Express but being deliberately manufactured elsewhere. It beggars belief given that the two airlines have virtually the same shareholders!

Maybe they like intrigue more than money????

Maybe no one can remember what the reason was for starting a second airline in the first place????

Answers on a post card please!!

Watch this space!

Hailer

[ayman]

inerviews are going on ,initialy for type rated f/os on A-320.
then non will be called within next 3 months

[ayman]

imm rated on the AN-74 ,,could anyone refer me to a job??

[Arrowhead]

No wonder people are starting to walk out. I'll say it again, they will keep telling you "next week" until it happens or it flops. So take any guidance with a very large pinch of salt. Clearly the pilots start date has already been moved a long way, and I cannot believe Air China gives a stuff about delaying you further, or the launch date.

If it does cave in, I suspect the aircraft will be offered to Air Macau, who will reject them - if only because NX has a CEO that only cares about developing cargo and maintaining the Taiwan-China route (witness how much he has done over 4 years in the world's fastest growing economy).

Which means if you are typed I would personally call or email or visit NX DFO Capt Du to get ahead of the queue. Upgrades are going on, and rumours abound that upto 20 pilots will go in the new year. If you are not rated however, this could become painful if it does indeed cave in.

Hailer - some answers. As someone who has been here some time, I can guarantee you money is of little object to Air Macau or Air China - take a close look at the operations of both. Its about not losing money, rather than making it.

And the rationale for the airline is simple - its a conflict of interests:
- Air Macau: must be seen by the local politicians to be adding more destinations and frequencies (in line with the economy), or it face losing its monopoly. But it doesnt want the losses (they dont want to hurt their own mgmt bonuses) so it has created a start up JV to fly the routes that cant make money

- Local magnate Stanley Ho: wants more destinations and frequencies to China, to bring Chinese punters in to fill his casinos and hotels

- Beijing: is worried that Stanley would be successful. Gaming advertising is already banned on the mainland due to problem of corrupt local officials money laundering here. So Beijing is in control, but does not want flights to the mainland (oops, shouldnt have announced those MAX). And now it will want some face/respect back too, so the bureaucratic machine will slow to an appropriate speed to remind people who is in control.

- MAX mgmt: has been unbelieveably stupid and took a very blase approach, and has upset everyone by declaring destinations that NX and Beijing clearly dont want them to have, before speaking to them.

Which leaves you with a senior mgmt team that probably has to go (but wasnt it good pay while it lasted boys?), aircraft that are coming too quickly for the politics to be resolved, and if it survives, an airline with aircraft that can only compete on existing LCC non-China routes, where it cant make money.

I really hope for all concerned that this gets resolved in 2 weeks, but I have been around for too long to be anything other than cynical. 2 weeks is the blink of an eye for people who rock up late to work, have a long lunch and nap, and knock off early - and do FA at their desks.

[hailer]

Arrowhead

Difficult to argue with your main premise - particularly that guys need to be very sure that they know exactly what they are signing for. I am not sure that there is even much conviction amongst the MAX operations guys. They certainly feel they have had the mushroom treatment from the information I have heard.

Also difficult to argue with your judgment on the MAX senior management -for the three "amigos" involved it may owe more to sycophantic naivety and a sheltered upbringing than mere stupidity. The real rogues may be the share-holders - not noted for their care and concern. Would you let your daughter marry anyone from Air China, Shun Tak or CNAC??

However, that matters little to the pilots awaiting their joining dates. They are not stupid - and I would be surprised of the CV are not being updated as I write. That could be exactly what NX want - the need to recruit using their own "sources"?

Let us hope they confound the sceptics - my money is not on MAX surviving but the pilots and aircraft may still be needed. Air China and Air Macau are short of both.

Hailer

[Noddys car]

Heard from locals on Friday that Max has been scrapped. Engineers already employed were all given notice late last week

[wayne's tache]

My guess is that there will be another airline but one which loses as much money as NX (if not more, as most of the core costs are being locked in at the top of the cycle by a MAX workforce that will not be too bothered about building a cost-effective airline whilst they are being shafted by their lead shareholders).

The current KA management team will be replaced by a suitably nicotine-stained Air China/NX implant and the AOC will come through a bit late but by middle of next year.

So, who is this good news for?

Certainly for the various apparatchiks running NX who hold on to their positions for a little longer, and probably for a few guys from Air China who get to come down to Macau and play Big Brother.

Its also not bad news for pilots wanting a couple of years OK money with MAX/NX, a type rating and some solid hours out of Macau. Like Arrowhead says, NX knows enough about itself not to aspire to make money but it is focused on blocking anyone else from doing anything. Air China is their lender of last resort and they cannot accept "foreigners" on their patch. So job security should be OK for people ready to put up with all of the bollocks.

Its bad news for Macau; the aviation scene will stumble on for another couple of years with no significant internal change and most outsiders will just laugh. NX can't even make money in a monopoly environment...
Air Asia's own growth ex-Macau has highlighted that all of the rehearsed arguments about unsustainable routes are nonsense. The fault is with NX management (and implicitly with their shareholders for choosing, backing and retaining them).

Its bad news too for Viva in that they will continue to be stymied politically, running up bigger losses and making fresh investment for an undefined business plan extremely difficult to source. Ultimately they are as much of a political project as NX and MAX and have no scope for growth unless the politics changes. If they had options out of Macau they would not have an aircraft in Papua New Guinea and their founder would not have departed to Russia.

NX is symptomatic of Macau companies in general, although a particularly diseased case. Shun Tak is not much better but at least has a land bank it can trade on. Its like a scene from Night of the Living Dead, with the corporate corpses desparately gorging themselves in the last few hours before sunlight. Now, who brings the sunlight is a more interesting question...

[Arrowhead]

WT

I suspect everyone on the mainland will be too busy in the run up to the Olympics to do anything (including allocating new slots). So its sooner or much later. On pilots, knowing Air Macau and the regulator I doubt they will take on more than a handful on non-typed guys, if any at all.

"Its bad news too for Viva in that they will continue to be stymied politically, running up bigger losses and making fresh investment for an undefined business plan extremely difficult to source. Ultimately they are as much of a political project as NX and MAX and have no scope for growth unless the politics changes. If they had options out of Macau they would not have an aircraft in Papua New Guinea and their founder would not have departed to Russia."

VIVA fought hard against NX to win Busan and Sydney, and arguably Phuket. More battles likely to follow over the next six months, including the local regulatory (not political) scene. Without MAX, there will be even more political pressure to get more routes launched out of Macau, by either NX or VIVA - esp since the casinos are now undershooting forecasts. And you are wrong about PNG and AP - both are beneficial to VIVA.

[nyaminyami]

still, could have have been an opportunity for us non rated guys to get a leg up in the airlines, stick it out for the length of the contract and take it from there.:ouch:

[hailer]

Despite the conviction of the previous few posts I would be reluctant to write the epitaph for MAX just yet.

It is certain that the in-fighting between MAX and Air Macau has led to a despicable loss of expectation for pilots awaiting start dates. However maybe something can be rescued from the ashes yet - those hotel beds and casino tables in Macau have to be occupied, and I suspect the casino/ hotel operators could not care which bunch of useless self serving and opinionated managements provides the air services as long as they happen.

What is certain is that all the brave talk about creating something different is just hot air. Maybe pilots looking for type ratings and/ or jet experience can still get what they need and then "consider their options"? It would be a brave man, though, who gave up another offer to wait for this lot.

I happen to know that the people involved in the recruitment feel pretty shamefaced about the whole thing - they have been made to look very foolish by the actions of the share-holders. However, for those pilots that can hang on. or have nothing else on offer all hope has not yet evaporated in my opinion.

One thing I do not agree with - Macau does not suck. It ain't Las Vegas or Geneva but it beats the hell out of lots of current expat venues as a place to live.


Hailer

[Arrowhead]

I agree with Hailer, indeed moreso. Macau is a great place (bar the PRD pollution) once you get to know your way around properly. Dont let bitter and twisted old NX pilots put you off. :mad:True, there is more traffic and rent costs more, than 5 years ago. Also true, pay is a even more, there are loads more decent places to eat and drink, and multiples more recreational activities to do.

Hailer, remind us who has resigned from MAX in the last two weeks? :}(positions not names)

[nyaminyami]

i will adopt the prudent approach of expecting the worst and hoping for the best. keep those insightful posts going guys, either way, will be interesting to hear how it all unfolds

[hailer]

Arrowhead,

Not got any information on departures other than the Head of Operations (FH), but he had got to the end of his contract and I think it is unrelated - although he is reportedly very disgusted by what has happened. However further departures are bound to be just around the corner.

The shrewd ones will wait to see what transpires - particularly a potential pay out? The pilots who may have been shafted by this would be well advised to join forces and get an opinion on Macao labour law which could be in their favour for a few dollars at least.

I would hope that the management that has led everybody up this gum tree will be the first to fall on their swords. It takes skill to snatch defeat of this order from the jaws of victory - capital, aircraft and routes all available but incompetence, megalomania and jealousy win the day!

It will be very interesting to see if the regulator (AACM) is going to dance to Air Macau's tune - some of the things that Air Macau apparently want to do would make the hair curl in any normal regulatory regime.

I hope that the Macau Express guys use the facility of pprune to air their opinion on this shambles - if nothing else it might make them feel better! For the sake of those guys facing an uncertain winter let us hope that they manage to salvage something.

Hailer

[MOETMAN]

This is the second bunch of losers FH has been involved with (the first being HKE) as Head of Oooops! and safety. No doubt assuring all joiners of a rosey future then moving on before the s**t hits the fan. If he is embarrassed about it , he should be.
Time to smell the roses FH.

[wayne's tache]

It's Macau and its government who should be embarrassed - four years of trying and still nothing credible has emerged in terms of air service support for the new Macau economy. Its almost as if they want HKG or Zhuhai to take up the slack. Roll on those new ferries from the Venetian and we'll see if it can be done.

CNAC is the prime culprit in all of this in pushing something forward without any coherent plan. Air China then gets more directly involved and asks more sensible questions about where cost advantages are coming from versus incumbents and CNAC (and their third attempt at a management team) has no answer.

Air China doesn't really care anyway, as long as no one else can move into the space. They're too busy dreaming of intergalactic domination to bother with trivial stuff like Macau. Plus the politics of their Taiwan obsession means that controlling a dull aviation environment is more important than anything else.

Throw in an NX senior management desperate to prevent even the mildest of performance comparisons in their own backyard and we have all the ingredients of the current mess. Forced to put money they don't have into an airline they don't want, no doubt NX will now do its best to make a "dual airline" strategy impossible...

Shun Tak is also getting some lessons in minority shareholding...at least Virgin Blue saw the writing on the wall with the CNAC gang and wisely cut their losses earlier in the process. Pansy better stick to monopolies in future...

[malimali]

Does anyone can tell abt the expected start date of Macau Express. It makes me worrying a lot!

[hailer]

Mali Mali - you worry probably with good cause, unfortunately. The civil war between MAX and NX is apparently all but done - down to the mopping up of the last pockets of resistance. It is unlikely to bring with it good news for the pilots hired by MAX - at best they can probably expect to go through an NX recruitment process (and even if successful be expected to fund their own type ratings). NX are enjoying bragging rights all over town and no spirit of reconciliation is evident

The MAX senior management undoubtedly made a grave error underestimating the opposition and over estimating their own reputation and worth. However we may be about to see that bad as they may have been they were brilliant compared with the muppets who will now take over the show. As to the shareholders and board of MAX - a sad ineffectual lot.

Interesting to see if the regulators have any b**** or whether they are in the pocket of NX as postulated. If they are God help everyone - particularly the passengers.

Even in the current climate this is likely to be a sad and unjustified blow for the pilots promised jobs. As ever in this business the pilots seem to be treated as nothing more than collateral damage. I hope they cause some ripples.

Hailer

[FRA2008]

The new restructuring of flight operations department in NX really shows the kind of people that are at the wheel.

Capt D remains as VPFO, he probably forgot how he got that job, but I still remember!!! You were a snaughty little kid, kissing the CEO's ass for over a year when you were the safety manager assistant. Lucky, lucky, the office of the safety department was next to the CEO's, mmhh!!:confused:

The safety manager left, and you self promote yourself to safety manager!! ok, but when the ex, ex, ex, CP (sorry lost count) left, the CEO went over the old VPFO and promoted you to CP, weird???:= First time ever in NX history that a CEO does this!!! Especially from a CEO who can't tell the difference between a A300, and A320 and judges good piloting skills on the softness of the landing!!!:}

But back to Capt D, so the memo came out and you were suddenty the new CP, wow!!! Congrats you really worked hard for that job!!!

What??? One month later the VPFO goes away??? You had nothing to do with it??? :=

Then you called your old buddy from the safety department to be the new VPFO, and he stays only for 2 months, how hot was that seat anyway??:\

Well congratulations again Capt D, you are now the new VPFO after 3 moths as a CP, and you are doing a hell of a job!!!! :yuk:

In the words of the CP (Capt RP) that resigned "If the chinese boy is there just to make money, that's his problem, I can't do the same so I'm leaving":D

Let's go down a step then, the new CP is Capt. CJ, congratulations to you, I really believe you could do a great job as a CP, but that's not gonna happen, and it's not your fault either.:*

Keep in mind that you were not the current VPFO's first choice, you were the 4th!!!! That means that there are 3 guys ahead that he rather have there than you, mainly his (PANG YAO) but luckily AACM said no to all his proposals!! No wonder it's been 5 months since the old CP announce his resignation and no white smoke for that long!!! You guys must be really busy!!:rolleyes:

In deed you are, I figured out why!!! You were figuring out a scheme to promote your friend without the approval of AACM, so you came up with a new position in the company, Fleet manager!!! Wow, congrats Capt F.!!:D

First I thought he was manager of the A320 only, and someone else would take the 321 and the 319, but it turns out he got the whole thing!!!!!HA ha..funny!!!

Ok, but back to reality, an airline with only 320's requires a fleet manager?? Wait a minute, I forgot there's a Cargo A300!!! but they have a fleet manager, well that makes sense because the CP is not qualified on the A300, but he is on the 320, so why the :mad: we need a fleet manager???

Possible answers :
1 - For him to filter all info that gets to the newly appointed CP?
2 - To kick out the current CP at the first opportunity and slide his PANG YAO to CP when that happens?
3 - For his PANG YAO to make more money?

Don't know, maybe there's something else!!! Must be his good skills as an instructor, and his punctuality!!:ugh:

Let's not forget that Capt. F is a hard working chap!!! Last time I had a training class in the office and he was the instructor, he only arrived 1 hour and 15 minutes late, and only took more 45 minutes to figure out how to work the computer!! Must be a new record for him, I heard he took longer before!! The funny part came when he was looking at the slides on the screen and reading them for the first time!!! Awesome preparation!!!:D

Really feel sorry for MAX and the newly recruited pilots, this is the kind of management that NX runs, not sure what's gonna happen but AirMacau loves to create obstacles, this is the only way they can compete, by not having any competition!!!

Safe landings guys!!!;)

[Arrowhead]

So the facts are now thus:
a) Nov sees 3 more daily flights added to MFM: Malaysian from KUL, AirAsia from Kuching, and China Eastern from Shanghaia)
b) Conversely, NX Nov/Dec schedule shows dropping 2 routes (Guiyang and Changsha), and cutting another in half (Chengdu)
c) NX Q3 pax numbers down 2% yoy, and cargo tonnage down 6% yoy - versus economy up >20%
d) NX getting another A300 pax, to be converted to freight (gosh, the last implementation was so successful!)
e) 2 capts resigned in the last week, more pilots expected to follow in the New Year

So the rumours are now thus (I am NOT vouching for the credibility of any):
1) NX will send back 2 A321s early next year
2) NX will pick up one A320 from the MX contract early next year
3) NX looking into taking on some pilots from MX, since NX has own need which is expected to get worse in the New Year (see above), plus looking into some kind of wet lease deal for MX
4) Air China looking into re-organising whole NX mgmt team, and consolidating the lot to Beijing
5) NX to move to own handling in Macau in Nov
6) MX setting up new simulator training agreement in Europe/Mid East
7) most importantly, the restuarant monopoly in Macau Airport ends at the end of this year, and McDonalds is coming

So MX does not yet appear dead and buried just yet.
Meanwhile Air Macau continues getting smaller as Macau gets bigger. Go figure...

[wsw]

Any good news from them????:rolleyes:

[Arrowhead]

I am hearing 2 top mgmt bods at MX have gone in the last week, and that the aircraft are now definitely going to Air China (together with NX mgmt). MX therefore appears buried.

I cannot vouch for the accuracy of any of this. However, if you are waiting for MX, sounds like you now need to activate plan B.

[hailer]

Arrowhead, It appears you are correct. The whisper is CEO (FW) and Chief Commercial Officer (RC) gone. Chief Pilot (CN) resigned. COO (DL) to follow. With a hierarchy like that it is no wonder they had no commercial case to make that would have justified the existence of a LCC!

No doubt there will be much spreading of the blame for this shambles with the ex management in the bast traditions of failed airline managements refusing to accept any responsibility.

In the interim I do not believe that the poor pilots who were offered jobs have been given any official notification of what is happening.

The rumour mill has it that Air Macau and Air China will put in their own management very soon to persevere with the AOC application - presumably to try to get the services up and running whilst they complete the take-over.

Are they underestimating the time scale and the difficulties? Probably. However it gives a glimmer of hope for the current employees and the pilots in limbo. Let us hope that some phoenix can raise from these ashes.

The bright spot is that the new management probably can not be much worse!

Hailer

[Arrowhead]

"put in own mgmt"?

With top NX mgmt rumoured to be for the chop, and operations staff already overstretched with audits and recruitment, I cant see how anyone at NX will take on MX AOC responsibility. Which perhaps explains the rumour the aircraft may be going to Beijing.

Also heard Air China may be partnering with TransAsia for PEK-MFM-TPE, and not using subsidiary and partner NX. Oops. What does that say about Beijing's relationship with NX mgmt?

[wsw]

:sad:....:eek:....:(

[wsw]

will they do the recruitment all over again?...but some of successful candidates are not sign the agreement yet...:sad:

[wayne's tache]

Here it is. The tale of Macau Express in five acts.

Prologue: In a galaxy far, far away NX/CNAC realise that the aviation environment may be changing. They have heard tales of a planet "Low Cost" and an Australian emissary tries to persuade them to embrace the future. They think about it briefly; refuse and return to their shark's fin soup.

1. Act One, 2005: NX/CNAC is under governmental pressure again to develop Macau's aviation scene. They come up with a cunning plan: keep the best routes for themselves and then issue three sub-concessions (the second-best routes for their own start up Macau Express, then some short-haul ones for a friend of the family (who they don't expect to use them) and then the remaining dross to an annoying newcomer Viva. NX seniors actually chuckle during the signing ceremony of Viva's routes (Moresby, Christchurch, Lisbon, Male etc).

2. Act Two, 2005: For their own sub-concession new airline NX/CNAC needs to look a bit "new" so they ask in Shun Tak as a shareholder. Lots of talk about leveraging the core excellence of the combined owners (?). Shun Tak doesn't really understand what it is getting into but Pansy knows best, and who dares to disagree? NX management in Macau not very keen but they hope it will just go away if they close their eyes (in the same way that AACM insistence on action normally does). CNAC figures too busy snoozing to actually look at a spreadsheet and work out that their plan will haemorrage cash.

3. Act Three, 2006: Viva being a nuisance by actually trying to get into the air, somehow finding ongoing if suicidal financial support through backing of another local Family. CNAC takes an afternoon off from snoozing to employ a leading LCC CEO from Europe for their own Macau Express start-up. Leading CEO does not understand that he must kow tow to shareholders, even if they know next to nothing about operating an airline, and quits after three months. CNAC is annoyed by the whole experience and sources a more "culturally-aware" team from KA.

4. Act Four, mid 2007: Macau Express start-up plans move forward, albeit not particularly impressively. Strangely a binding commitment for six old Japanese aircraft is signed. However, major changes in Beijing (CX takeover of KA) means that CNAC geriatrics in Hong Kong and Macau begin to lose power and patronage. Air China now begins to ask questions of CNAC as to why two loss making airlines in Macau would be better than one. KA team not sure which shareholding group to please. NX management is delighted and stirs things up by offering to support in all areas. A five minute review of their capabilities highlights that this is disingenuous.

5. Act Five, late 2007: Everything on hold. Shun Tak realises it is a minority shareholder in an airline which the majority owners don't actually want. Pansy stomps her expensive shoes. Beijing tells her to bugger off. KA management team realises it is deep in the **** and maybe the Leading CEO had a point so they focus on their own futures. NX still desperate to "help". Their grins weaken when Air China insists that they take on most of the six outdated A320s and hand over their newer equipment to Beijing. KA team departs.

Epilogue: The efforts shift to working out how to pretend that the sub-concession routes will be operated by an "independent" carrier. NX and Air China begin to lobby AACM to allow for (depending on the day of the week) two carriers, one AOC or one AOC, two carriers. NX prepares for "takeover" of Macau Express (in effect inheriting a half-finished AOC and six, difficult-to-maintain aircraft). Everyone else laughs.

[Arrowhead]

Given the local political pressure, I do foresee more flights - esp as we move into next year with more of Cotai being developed and more conventions. Macao certainly needs more flights.

It will be interesting to see if NX keeps turning away growth and new routes (or continuing to cut routes because its focused on China/cross-straits and not SE Asia).

...or whether VIVA will be allowed by the politicians to take up the routes NX refuses to fly

...or whether other flag carriers and LCCs take up the slack. Witness recent MFM schedule addditions by Cebu (Clark), Air China (PEK), China Eastern (PVG), Air Asia (Kuching, Kota K), Malaysian (KUL)...

...or all of the above. For sure, there are going to be some big changes coming in the local status quo.

[Bored_as]

Macau Daily News
Date: 10Nov07
Title: Macau Asia Express suffered a setback. CA hesitated for funding the airline and some management team menber resigned.
[FONT=Arial]Content: Air Macau, Air China and Shun Tak incorporated Macau Asia Express suffered a major setback in the establishment, for allegedly falling short of funding from Air China. According to source from the circle, a few of senior management team members, including the Chief Operation Officer and Commercial Head, were resigned already. Some around thirty staff were on duty as usual but the airline official website was suspended. MAE was granted 11 mainland routes and 11 regional routes by AACM and committed the lease of 6 A320. MAE planed to fly Ho CHih Minh and Clark in the first phase. Nagaya, Kitakyushu, Japan and Hangzhou, Tinjing, China are on their routes plan as well. It was believed if CA's withdrawal suspended the operation of MAE, the leased 6 aircrafts would be handled by Air Macau.

Source from Apple Daily

[wsw]

Thanks for your information....
But it's a bad and sad news..
:sad:So, How about all the flight attendant that they hired already?
I'm so worry about it!!!!!
:{

[missingblade]

Kevlar....

13 :}:confused::eek::mad::hmm::ugh::cool::ooh:;):yuk::=:ok::sad : in one post.

New record.

[wsw]

:eek::bored::eek::{

[malimali]

So all finish??

[ltjng]

Looks like it is, dude!

[Arrowhead]

"Its not dead, its just resting....."

NX mgmt still trying to pursue AOC to prevent VIVA from snatching MAX routes such as Beijing, Shanghai, and Taipei.

:ooh:

[hailer]

Arrowhead,

You may be right, but I doubt it (despite your record to date on this forum where you have been the best forecaster).

NX and management is an oxymoron - whether resting or not! I believe the AACM may be belatedly regulating and realise that what NX are proposing for Macau Express is just plain unacceptable or even potentially unsafe.

I am not certain that Viva would be able to get their hands on NX routes unless the Govt come to the party and get rid of this whole iniquitous concession system. Ironically Viva now looks like the best managed airline (real or imagined) in Macau, which is an interesting indictment of the place!

The real intrigue behind the scenes is undoubtedly the in-fighting between the share holders. The Shun Tak lot look set to lose a bundle on their investment, which they will not take lying down; the Air China attempt to arrogantly steam roller everybody seems to be losing steam; the so called Chairman of Macau Express is a discredited man whose protestations to the staff that nothing has changed would be laughable if not so serious for the remaining employees.

I just can not see this phoenix rising from the ashes - a sad case of self immolation. It is a potentially interesting case for the business school types - if an airline has capital, political influence, guaranteed routes and a sympathetic regulator can it fail? We know the answer now - but it took great political skill and management/ board ineptitude to snatch defeat from the jaws of this one!!!

Air Macau management's victory over Macau Express may yet prove to be Pyrrhic!

Hailer

[wayne's tache]

Congratatulations to Hailer for what must be the first usage of "pyrrhic" on Pprune....

I agree with the rest of his message but remain dubious about Viva's long term viability (although probably slightly less dubious than I was six months ago). They must grow quickly and to do this they need more aircraft - and more funding. Most serious investors are not going to touch them until they see more clarity in the regulatory environment, so they will have to rely on their existing shareholders to keep them going for some time ahead. If they can do that, perhaps they will have a chance - although this depends on when NX melts down.

My guess is that Air China has enough clout in Macau to hold Viva back from getting the decent routes on a scheduled basis, even when NX melts down, through pressurizing the government locally through its Beijing representatives. Plus Edmund Ho will not do anything too radical in his last years in office, especially as his family has a holding in Viva and Ao Man Long has made traditional Macau business practices rather more sensitive. The new Chief Executive is also unlikely to rock the boat during his first year in office.

And even if all this is wrong and the concession collapses and it is every man for himself, the largest "newcomer" beneficiary will be the Venetian - who I understand is still working on the Macau SARG to allow a far more substantial operation than Part 91 alone would permit. In employing a double digit percentage of the Macau working population, as well as contributing a serious percentage of its tax revenue, they are going to have a lot more leverage than most.

Anyway, no more predictions on Macau aviation. I leave it to the experts...if you can find any.

[Arrowhead]

Sorry I have been so slow to reply - took me a while to look up "pyrrhic" in the dictionary....:rolleyes:

Hailer - I can confirm NX mgmt are still pursuing MX AOC. Fact. I believe (but am not sure) that NX is taking the first 2 of the 6 aircraft, with the rest going to Beijing. What NX will do with 2 aircraft is unclear, moreso since it is the incredible shrinking airline with pax numbers down yoy (despite operating a monopoly in the worlds fastest growing economy). Perhaps they need to take 2 acft, to later give them to MX, for the AACM to believe MX still has a future (you need 2 acft for the AOC). However, I can only guess they will wet lease these to Air China. NX is currently doing a large number of upgrades and new FO training, so really does look like they are taking the 2 acft.

If PEK, PVG and TPE really are on the MX concession (its a secret remember), they have to keep MX alive for the reasons already stated. There must be a powerful legal case for VIVA to claim those routes if there are no other airlines in Macau. Thats a legal argument, not a "changing the rules" argument.

That said, I am sure VIVA is also lobbying the govt to change the concession rules, since the concession lies with the government (not NX), and the goverment is under pressure to fill up the casinos and hotels. Transport infrastructure is now a political priority since Ao Man Long went ($$$:=) and now you can no longer get a ferry to Macau (old terminal) without buying your ticket in advance... Edmund Ho could go out with a bang (or puff) by dergulating aviation before he leaves (and thereby increasing his familys personal wealth), or his replacement could start with a productive bang/puff. We'll see.

For the record, I think you are way too harsh on VIVA operating mgmt. They have made enormous strides given a very tight environment, esp now with SYD, NRT, Ho Chi Minh, Busan, Jakarta etc - only 1 of which was on the original concession.

I dont really get the point on Air China holding back VIVA on the decent routes. SYD, JKT doing well, and VIVA has already annouced Narita and Ho Chi Minh. So whatever holding back there has been (and NX has tried hard), it has not been effective. What is there left to hold back now? PVG and TPE maybe? But I am not sure VIVA wants a full on war with NX. more Japan and more Oz flights would make more sense for VIVA.

The real question on VIVA is that now the wet lease (read cashflow, or profit) is coming to an end, will they get the pax numbers from Vietnam and Japan to keep their heads above water? They already have "serious investors", and I doubt they will have any problems finding more funding, since the original plan cannot have been for 2 acft - and the macro picture has developed towards the top end of expectations. The regulatory environment is also a huge opportunity for them, should the govt freely open up the market. It cant get worse, unless SYD is pulled. But I cant see that looking good for the govt.

No, their issue is can they get the pax and then more acft to fly to more destinations in Japan and Oz? Clearly they have been trying for some time. We'll just have to see. Meanwhile I cant see NX "melting down" unless cross-strait flights start. Indeed, Perhaps the greatest threat to VIVA is NX getting a new CEO, who starts flying medium-haul.


p.s. As an ex-"business school type" myself, MX was screwed from the get go, as per previous posts. It was never meant to fly... It was a solution to an NX problem. The problem is still there, ergo MX is still there (just). It was just cheaper to screw it now, than let it launch.....:ouch:

Roll on the planned Twotter operation....:}

[maverickav8tor]

I applied with Macau Asia Express and got a prompt reply from a Chiefpilot with an english Name.

I filled out the application promptly...and that was it...........never heard ANYTHING back.

Is this outfit dead.....never got off the ground?

:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

[Bored_as]

Any news on this?

[Arrowhead]

Crikey - you must be bored as.

Turns out they sent the A320s back " because they wanted the white ones...."!!!!!!! :O

[sirod]

do they now still exist???

I guess it's time to quit waiting.......:ouch::ooh::eek::uhoh:

[BEROK1W]

Hi guys!!
Someone knows what happened with this company(Macau Express) finally???:bored:
I'll be gratefuly if somebody can give me any information about this..
Thank you so much in advanced.