Virgin Blue EBA

[Clipster]

It has gone a little quiet on the VB flight crew EBA negotiations.
Has the matter been voted on. ?
Good luck guys and girls regardless.!!

[Parc-Ratstej]

Mate, nothing has happened and I would be surprised if anything eventuates in the short term,Except another no vote!The way the management are handling this eba makes me believe that they actually want us to vote it down...why I don't know.The latest offer is 3k short of the first!this industry has gone to the dogs!For all the smart 20 year old guys out there that want to fly,heres my advice...go to uni,do a degree make your money and then buy a be58,if your half good at your chosen career you will end up in a kingair or better!Enjoy

[Blue Ruin]

Still negotiating............

[Clipster]

Appreciate the input. Hopefully the 2 parties can come to an agreement that works for everyone.

The rumour outside of Virgin is that the pilots are sticking up for the guys who are about to join the company as well as the pilots already in there. It's a great sign.

Hats off to yiz !!

[Metro man]

Pilots sticking together to improve their conditions ??? What ever next ? Keep an eye on this as it's a first.

[DutyofCare]

I talked to many a tech crew recently and indeed it seems there sticking up for the newbees and in a overall better deal. Score is looking like 1-0 with VB soon ( come Jul 1st ) to start bonding crews to aircraft and J* about 3 months behind VB :ok:

[Intenleftblank]

Rumour this week that J* offered no endorsement cost to a group of Hong kong residents for the 330 that had applied some months ago.This may be the start of something great for all new recruits

[Bug Smasher Smasher]

Woo hoo! It's about time this started happening! :D

Airlines and other operators are finally about to realise the true worth of professional pilots in our region. Great to hear the VB crew are holding out in support of future recruits too, good on yas.

Stick to your guns boys and girls, there's a change in the wind and it's all good.

:ok:

[404 Titan]

Intenleftblank
Rumour this week that J* offered no endorsement cost to a group of Hong kong residents for the 330 that had applied some months ago.
I would suggest they did this only because the said pilots from Hong Kong are already A330 endorsed with a squillion hours on type.

[cunninglinguist]

.....and to add to what 404 said, they would'nt be offered a position on the 330 unless they had a squillion hours on type....................or on the space shuttle ( although that may come in under the MTOW requirement to fly a wide body )
Thats not how we did it in Ansett:{

[Warped Wings]

VB are only going down the bonding road because they realise the pool is quickly drying up and there is plenty of options for potential candidates. Those that take up jobs at VB on a bond can expect to be on a "training" wage whatever that means. Still - it's a better situation than the self endorsement rubbish the rest of us had to endure.

[Intenleftblank]

Incorrect in this case as these guys had bus time and required a ccq course

[Jetsbest]

I know one ex-Cathay A-scaler who, in accord with the Cathay contract, at 55 years old was to be put on B-Scale if he stayed . With 'Wife 1' still around, a very ripe provident fund for the taking, A330/340 command for many years, and a desire to retire in Oz anyway, Jetstar didn't need him to pay or CCQ; they just needed to get him! He's had it all; A-scale pay for a happy near 20 year career in HKG, and now gets to time out in Oz until he's had his fill.

I put it to you that such pilots can, and will, leave at the drop of a hat if/when they've had enough. It will also be interesting to see;
a. how many home-sick expats will rush for the AWAs on better pay/conditions than the J* EBA (potentially lots), and
b. how disappointed the J* loyalists are when they realise they really aren't AJ's golden haired children after all; he'll circumvent their 'water-tight' agreement if he has to to get the CASA-required experience for his fleet expansion.

To me, an irony is that it seems international airline careers for Australians are shaping into a couple of streams;
1. pilots who went overseas early for fast promotion and less tax then come home later for lifestyle, and
2. those who start in Oz for lifestyle thinking QF/Ansett/J*/VB will look after you and then realise they might do better overseas than the slow advancement, management spin and high tax in Oz .

Time will tell and I watch keenly. :suspect:

[Big Hairy Potatoes]

Heard a rumour that the re jigged EBA got up with a 54% majority. :eek:
Any confirmations?

[Keg]

Sources (including Steve Creedy in the Autralian) are reporting that it did get up. 54% for and 46% against- or numbers very close to that.

[Wellhung Unit]

:uhoh:Confirmed....very sad day...look elsewhere.....there is another post

[TurbTool]

Jetbest, perhaps if you were to try not being quite so "holier than thou" judgemental, and look simply at the looming reality.
From my sources at J* you are very wide of the mark regarding comparison of the EBA v's the proposed AWA's.
Nonetheless it is interesting to watch the various machinations occurring both from within J* and without (VB and Tiger, for example, not to mention various overseas contenders). Each wondering how to most cost effectively entice a shrinking pool of prospective employees into their respective camps.
The mindless "having a go" at J* pilots will not help to unite pilots in what should become a common cause, that is to utilise the loudly lauded "supply and demand" situation to enhance T&C's for all pilots worldwide, without killing the goose.
I think you probably mean well, however in my opinion, your attack on the J* pilots would most likely be counterproductive.

[Charliethewonderdog]

I know one ex-Cathay A-scaler who, in accord with the Cathay contract, at 55 years old was to be put on B-Scale if he stayed . With 'Wife 1' still around, a very ripe provident fund for the taking, A330/340 command for many years, and a desire to retire in Oz anyway, Jetstar didn't need him to pay or CCQ; they just needed to get him! He's had it all; A-scale pay for a happy near 20 year career in HKG, and now gets to time out in Oz until he's had his fill.

I put it to you that such pilots can, and will, leave at the drop of a hat if/when they've had enough. It will also be interesting to see;
a. how many home-sick expats will rush for the AWAs on better pay/conditions than the J* EBA (potentially lots), and
b. how disappointed the J* loyalists are when they realise they really aren't AJ's golden haired children after all; he'll circumvent their 'water-tight' agreement if he has to to get the CASA-required experience for his fleet expansion.

To me, an irony is that it seems international airline careers for Australians are shaping into a couple of streams;
1. pilots who went overseas early for fast promotion and less tax then come home later for lifestyle, and
2. those who start in Oz for lifestyle thinking QF/Ansett/J*/VB will look after you and then realise they might do better overseas than the slow advancement, management spin and high tax in Oz .

Time will tell and I watch keenly.
28th May 2007 03:31



I'm sure after one roster period he'll realise that he doesn't really want to fly no more, especially on Jet* rosters.

[Jetsbest]

"holier than thou" :confused: I apologise if I gave that impression. And note that my post is from a month ago... Why reply now? :confused:
I was merely commenting on the perceptions of my sources; we all have sources. The ex-Cathay guy and others are real. I don't doubt that there will be more, just as real, who will end up on higher pay than the J* EBA if that's what it takes AJ to get them there. I know J* pilots who are now very frustrated that they won't have access to as many promotions because outside experience will be brought in; they thought their "flexibility" would be honoured but, alas, it's just business. It's a trusting soul who thinks it's anything else.
Some on pprune actually saw what you describe as the "loudly lauded supply and demand situation" a few years ago; before the 'new-low-setting' J* EBA and variation. I find it ironic that you choose to be offended and I'm struggling to find where I made derogatory reference to J* pilots. I say 'all power to them' and believe that, provided their representatives act rationally and with resolve, the pilots stand to rightly benefit from market forces which will bring them up to a remuneration package they should have had long ago. It was not my intention to have a go at them.
At least we agree on one thing; "it is interesting to watch the various machinations occurring both from within J* and without (VB and Tiger, for example, not to mention various overseas contenders)". :ok: