Comair pilots overworked/underpaid? [Archive]

SpootNICK

7th May 2007, 21:07

Comair have always had relatively good morale, and most blokes are happy. From the bottom you have low-timers getting a break, senior f/os with the prospect of command (eventually) and the senior capt's who have no intention of leaving for Emirates, or SAA. Guys do leave, but its not normally because they are extremely unhappy, it normally has to do with finances...and the attraction of a new shiny widebody.

Romeo E.T.

7th May 2007, 22:14

Comair pilots overworked/underpaid?

Currently 800-850 hours per year....doesn't leave a lot for family life remaining

Underpaid..???..salary adjustment for 2007 brought 2004 salaries forward to 2007 standard with inflation etc...no true increase for improvement of lifestyle.

Many F/O's came from "command-salaries" at previous employers and find that they just cannot get used to the lowering of life-style standard that Comair F/O salaries bring...thus leaving for beter salaries ... or doing extra-mural work to "make ends meet"...but 800-850 hours per year leads to "burn-out" rapidly.

CPA have done an extremely proffesional salary scale study...awaiting HQ reaction.

Avi8tor Funny, the boys and girls I know at Comair are largely a happy bunch. Only gripe is time to command.

Time to command has been about 5 years for a long time and still is, only problem with the need for command sooner is for the F/O's to "re-attain" there previous quality of life that they enjoyed whilst at Commanders at Link etc..

Whats with the rumour that some "Link" short listed pilots have now turned down Comair employment due to the lovely 20 "odd" % percentage salary increase they recently attained...???

Deskjocky

8th May 2007, 07:40

Having worked for the Novick’s in a previous life I can say only one thing with certainty- the relationship is very one sided financially! That’s why most people who work for them, and who have any ambition in life, hit the street in search of greener (excuse the pun!) pastures. The crew can stand on their head and whistle Dixie out theirs b*ts its not going to make a difference. I enjoyed my time there- great folks who have all since also left and gone to such places as Mango, 1Time, SAA. In fact the whole story of 1Time is linked to this issue!

JCO7

11th May 2007, 09:33

Always thought Comair was one of the better-paying airlines (by SA standards). How do they compare to the likes of 1Time, Mango, Express?

redskyventures

11th May 2007, 11:26

what exactly are the FO's earning?

Q4NVS

11th May 2007, 13:47

Rands (ZAR) and maybe a few cents as well...:}

Romeo E.T.

11th May 2007, 16:54

JCO7...wrote...: Always thought Comair was one of the better-paying airlines (by SA standards). How do they compare to the likes of 1Time, Mango, Express?
1 Time and Mango....???
Problem with Mango is no "perks" ie medical aid and Pension fund
SAX and Airlink get about 20-30% more for the comparable year service Captain vs Captain and F/O vs F/O than the same at Comair.

Mark J B

11th May 2007, 18:31

FO's at Comair take home between 15K and 19K on a good month, including S&T, depending on seniority.

nugpot

11th May 2007, 18:31

SAX and Airlink get about 20-30% more for the comparable year service Captain vs Captain and F/O vs F/O than the same at Comair.

Sorry, I'm sitting with the scales in front of me, and that is not true.

SAX SFO's are slightly better off, but that is because you go to Cap1 when you get command and not to Cap(years service) as in Comair.

line-driver

11th May 2007, 23:22

Some "unofficial" numbers doing the rounds..
+/- 11 resignations in April
possibly another 2 resignations this last week

recent new F/O is 25% down on "take-home-pay"at Comair, coming from F/O on local "Turbo-prop" airline.

rumour as I have heard thrown around is "Link" got +20% and that makes them beter off than Comair....any body confirm this ??

this is afterall a rumour network....any truths out there.

Q4NVS

12th May 2007, 07:29

"Link" got +20% and that makes them beter off than Comair

:=

Maybe if they got 42%+....:oh:

Zenj

12th May 2007, 07:43

Romeo ET says it taken 5 years for F/O to take Command , is this always happening or sometimes takes longer ?

If it is true than COMAIR must be a place to go for, as long as you can bear the consequences as F/O for 5 years.

I have seen most of the places take more.

I have seen ComAir Pilots during our sim training there and most of them seem to be happy and jolly, not many F/O's though that I have come across.

Whats the difference between Capt and F/O take home ?

JCO7

12th May 2007, 10:19

Heard via the grapevine the Link increase was 23% immediate, further 15% in September, which would put FO's between 22k and 26k/month plus 13th cheque, pension, medical aid (Linkers please confirm). Would be interesting to know how far this is off Express pay.

line-driver

12th May 2007, 13:22

JCO7...your statement validates the comments made by Romeo E.T. about the salary gap being up to 30% difference for F/O's at Link vs Comair....as Mark J B wrote: FO's at Comair take home between 15K and 19K on a good month, including S&T, depending on seniority. noted 19k to 26k/month plus 13th cheque...thats reason enough to turn down employment offer at Comair.

Comair also don't get a 13th cheque either...only a bonus which is at the discretion of the directors and linked to the performance and profitability.....no guarantees of any amount or percentage....spin doctors say things such as "yields are under pressure" and "difficult trading environment" always hang over the employees like a sword of Damocles.

I "think" that Link salary is now (or will be once all the increments are realized...as mentioned by JCO7) very similar to SAX...thus both well in lead when compared to Comair.

nugpot

12th May 2007, 15:26

I think there are a few apples and pears here.

Take home pay of 15 to 19k equates to 23 to 31k before tax and that happens to be the Comair FO range BEFORE bonus and S&T.

I have not seen the new Link scales so I can't comment on that, but Comair captains are better off than SAX captains by about 18k per year for the same command time. This is also before bonus and S&T, and I know that Comair pays better S&T than SAX.

Like I said before, SFO's at SAX are better off than their contemporaries at Comair, but that is only because of the different captain's pay structures.

So this statement:
very similar to SAX...thus both well in lead when compared to Comair.
is just completely wrong.

Q4NVS

12th May 2007, 19:36

I "think" that Link salary is now (or will be once all the increments are realized...as mentioned by JCO7) very similar to SAX...thus both well in lead when compared to Comair.

I "think" you are Trawling...:}

Also remember that Link is not the only Airline getting increase(s) in 2007.

:O

Mark J B

13th May 2007, 17:52

The difference between the take home pay of a senoir FO at Comair and a brand new Captain is R10k-R12k per month. Quite a jump, and this makes for unhappy FO's especially those trying to make ends meet with a family.:ugh:

beechbum

14th May 2007, 12:46

Nugs,

Take home pay of 15 to 19k equates to 23 to 31k before tax and that happens to be the Comair FO range BEFORE bonus and S&T.
I was at Comair just short of three years. Once training was completed I never saw a salary less than R16500/month and my best month was just on
R21000 (take home). This included and varied with S&T. If you went on holiday....you were screwed. So you never took leave because you couldn't afford to. It also depended upon how your salary etc was structured and Medical Aid vs dependants.

nugpot

14th May 2007, 13:19

Sorry beechbum, having slow day. Can't figure out if you are agreeing with me or differing......?

My opinion is that SAX and Comair (and probably now Link) are on par with a few minor differences. From what I surmised, Mango is also in this region (although their structure is totally different). I have no idea about 1Time. We all know where SAA and Nationwide find themselves.

beechbum

14th May 2007, 13:24

Yep having one of "those" too...
Your figures are just a little out. My figures quoted are take home in pocket stuff and included S&T...whereas you state 15k - 19k excluding S&T.(Am I right here?)
Bonus as mentioned previously is a contentious issue at Comair and kindly left out of the equation.

Mark J B

14th May 2007, 13:38

The crux of the matter is that there is serious discontent at Comair, particularly amongst the FO's. The company has had the best financial years of its 60 year history over the last two years but the crew that helped to achieve this are deemed to be greedy for wanting to earn a livable salary. The Captains are alot better off but morale is very low there too. The result is, they are voting with their feet and the likes of Emirates and Cathay are only too happy to help them along.

line-driver

14th May 2007, 14:36

And now is a "massive" drive to join the union "SOLIDARITY" with the hopes that this might get some more attention from the HQ side.

Q4NVS

14th May 2007, 14:52

What is wrong with your ALPA Branch?

When I previously mentioned the fact that the Comair joint CEO's each grossed in the region of R 3.3 Million for the previous Financial Year, it was said that it is a profitable "Private" Company...Don't touch.

By the sounds of it the distribution of wealth is then also very "Private"...

I know SAA is not profitable therefore the comparison maybe not liquid. But in terms of the SIZE of the Organisation, is Khaya then asking so much with his rumoured R 6.4 Million per year?

For the life of me, this is also the first "Private" Company I have ever heard of with "joint" CEO's - except maybe the relationship between you and your wife/partner...:E

Anyways, Good Luck Guys/Gals.

Mark J B

14th May 2007, 14:58

No teeth!:}

nugpot

14th May 2007, 15:09

What is wrong with your ALPA Branch?
No teeth!

A branch gets its teeth from the members standing together. If half the pilots desert to Solidarity, you'll be completely buggered.

If the members are not happy with CPA, speak to the chairman. He seems to be very approachable and hard-working.

Mark J B

14th May 2007, 17:50

Exactly! CPA is only an association. ALPA is the union and not all Comair pilots are members because it is so expensive for what you get.

nugpot

14th May 2007, 17:55

The Airlink pilots were let down by a previous APA Exco. Some of them then jumped ship. The final result was that APA lost representivity (50% +1) at Airlink and so lost recognition. A few years later, some started joining Solidarity, because of the negativity in the company towards APA (ALPA).

When the wages at Airlink became a big issue, most joined up with Solidarity. I agree that they got good results, but the desertion from ALPA was not because of expense or efficiency. It was related to a bad experience with their own elected officials.

line-driver

14th May 2007, 19:01

Quote:
What is wrong with your ALPA Branch?

They have done their work well, but are just not "pushy" enough or militant enough and give-in to the directors too easily....thats my humble opinion.

Unfortunately the directors and co. have smelt blood and are now going for the jugular and thus the teeth has gone outa CPA....

The 1% or so that the CPA union fees represent is a fair amount of buying power for those that need it,...

Unfortunately all the work into regulating agreements etc will be a waste should the members leave and start the whole process all over again with solidarity.....

BUT R52 per month for solidarity is very very very enticing....and maybe being a much more "werker" orientated institution ..might actually have the guts and drive to achieve some more realistic goals with regard to renumeration packages, when the company is doing so well and sharing the profits out so fairly....NOT

divinehover

15th May 2007, 09:59

Those who chose to leave ALPA-SA will live to regret their decision. Your jobs are not only about money. It's about conditions of service as well. Ask solidarity if they have studied what happened in the US in the last couple of years with regard to labour negotiations. Joining Solidarity could mean eventually loss of all aggreements signed with CPA. It's easy to negotiate money. It's tough negotiating everything else.
Go have a look what ALPA did for it's members in the US. Look at what they were asked to conceed and what they got away with in the end.
Ask SAAPA what expert advise they are getting from ALPA during the SAA restructuring process.
Been a part of ALPA not only means you are part of a RECOGNISED proffesional pilot body but you also have access to most of the greatest minds in aviation.

Joining Solidarity would be a VERY short sighted decision. You might score some cash now but you will most certainly lose in the end

Go have a look at what the ALPA technical commitees have done in the last 30 yrs and then ask yourself. Will Solidarity achieve even 1/10th of that.

What will Solidarity do to improve avaition safety in Africa?

What will Solidarty do if you are involved in an accident across the border that will require expert aviation legal advise. Please don't go knocking on ALPA's door when the extra bit of cash isn't part of the big picture.

Those splitting the pilot group do so not at their own peril but also that of they colleagues

Romeo E.T.

15th May 2007, 10:12

Go have a look at what the ALPA technical commitees have done in the last 30 yrs and then ask yourself. Will Solidarity achieve even 1/10th of that.

What will Solidarity do to improve avaition safety in Africa?

I think at this point its quality of life at "HOME" that comes first for the Comair pilots...seeing that there is not a lot of this at the moment....most are so tired that when they have an "off" day they just "vegitate" after the hard work previous and dread the next hard work period ahead....and the lack of "cash-flow" just aggrevates the home situation as there is no room for "home-improvements"...forcing some of the pilots to seek external work on those desperately needed "off"/"relaxing" days just to make the monthly budget.

So what does ALPA do for aviation safety in Africa is not fore-most on the minds at this stage.

Mark J B

15th May 2007, 10:28

Quote:
Take home pay of 15 to 19k equates to 23 to 31k before tax and that happens to be the Comair FO range BEFORE bonus and S&T.

Just to correct you there Nugpot. If you read my post again, these figures INCLUDE S&T. The bonus cannot be factored in as it is depends on company performance. Last year was a bumper year for Comair. The pilots got 75% bonus only after the company agreed to up it from 50%. The rest of the company, including Cabin Crew got 125%. Go figure!:ugh:

Romeo E.T.

15th May 2007, 10:40

Mark J B Quote: Last year was a bumper year for Comair. The pilots got 75% bonus only after the company agreed to up it from 50%. The rest of the company, including Cabin Crew got 125%. Go figure!

Unfortunately this was the pilots or rather those that voted for the salary structure 2 years previous...own doing...this is what the salary structure agreed upon was honoured to the "letter" by the company....they even offered another 25% extra ontop of the agreed 50%....thus the rest of the companies 100% and the extra 25% they got is what the pilots got......................................................... ..............................................shot in foot by own doing.....thats what the pilots did...but now is the time to make things right.....

But how??

Deskjocky

15th May 2007, 11:24

My 10c worth, it all begins and ends with the head of flight ops, he is the one who has to go and fight the company on behalf of the pilots. Not sure who is the main man there at the moment but if he is a "company man" then the pilots are stuffed. Knowing how the Chairman works, all those in executive positions are nicely taken care of financially- provided you toe the line. So I guess that option will be gone.

Comair management have never had to deal with really harsh union tactics before and my guess is that they would bungle it if put under any kind of real pressure now- Solidarity is the way to go, seems they have cut their teeth on Rodger the dodger…..:E

line-driver

15th May 2007, 11:37

Deskjocky wroteNot sure who is the main man there at the moment but if he is a "company man" then the pilots are stuffed. Knowing how the Chairman works, all those in executive positions are nicely taken care of financially- provided you toe the line. So I guess that option will be gone.

The answer is yes...extremely well looked after by the board..thus not on the pilots side for these salary and other issues no-longer, it would negatively affect his "bottom-line"...used to be though..still supportive wrt to safety, planning etc, but on the $$$ side...NO

divinehover

15th May 2007, 19:20

ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO JOIN SOLIDARITY?

Brazilian police are planning to charge the 2 pilots who were flying the Embraer Legacy which collided with a 737 over Brazil last September. This is before the Technical Investigation is finished. IFALPA is appealing to the Brazilian Justice ministry to comply with ICAO regulations.

ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO JOIN SOLIDARITY?

4HolerPoler

15th May 2007, 21:44

I've got to ask bro - WTF has two lucky guys (with their transponder turned off) who drove into a 737 in Brazil, got to do with whether the oke joins ALPA-SA or Solidarity in South Africa?

Ah, wait, I think I've got it! You mean when the next ou who has a midair, saves the day, gets his aerie on the ground and has the cops after him then Solidarity won't look after him as well as ALPA-SA! Brilliant!

4HP

beechbum

16th May 2007, 06:58

Line - driver wrote:
The answer is yes...extremely well looked after by the board..thus not on the pilots side for these salary and other issues no-longer, it would negatively affect his "bottom-line"...used to be though..still supportive wrt to safety, planning etc, but on the $$$ side...NO
ABSOLUTELY correct....
The sad thing is, is that Comair is losing great guys to greener pastures - what was once a career airline is in fact no longer! Pity because the training is fantastic and a good bunch of guys to work with. If the okie at the top could just realise that salaries are low etc...then maybe the tide could be halted.
But me thinks not...give up the lavish bonuses....umm I don't think so.

Deskjocky

16th May 2007, 07:23

Guys, no employee has EVER taken the top dogs at Comair on- those that are unhappy merely vote with their feet, the brass are happy with this because they have always had a huge pile of CV's in flight ops ready to be called. The only way salaries will go up is if the cycle is stopped. Believe me young Novick doesn’t know the first thing about labour relations (also is that ex cabin attendant still running HR?) a consolidated unified effort fronted by an aggressive, in your face, union will deliver the goods every time. He is going to ask himself can he survive a week of not operating? I think they can but the losses would send the Chairman around the bend! You just have to look at how much SAA lost when they had their strike….Sanity will prevail and a capitulation will be short in coming.

Avi8tor

16th May 2007, 15:49

Never forget that the PILOTS are the union!!!

It doesn't matter what federation the company union is affiliated to, if the pilots don't/won't stand together they will come second.

If the pilots have taken the view they would rather 'vote with there feet' than fight, things WILL NOT improve. Things will get progressively worse for those that stay.

What happens is that certain groups see problems as not affecting them, and are not interested in getting involved. Once management have the pilots in this mode, its all down hill. Seen it at Airlink.

There comes a time, if the company can afford it, that the pilots have to be prepared to stand firm. Sadly this only happens when you hit rock bottom. Again, seen it at Airlink.

Its a seller's market at the moment, and while the shoe is on the other foot, time for the pilots to kick some tail.

divinehover

16th May 2007, 19:45

I've got to ask bro - WTF has two lucky guys (with their transponder turned off) who drove into a 737 in Brazil, got to do with whether the oke joins ALPA-SA or Solidarity in South Africa?

What are you suggesting 4holerpoler? Is IFALPA involvement irrelevent. Should these guys be screwed over before the technical report is concluded. My point is IFALPA will give a member the best support the worldwide avaition community has to offer. Solidarity MIGHT give you an extra few bucks in the short term. That will mean F££K All when you are rotting in an Angolan Jail. (If you are a 4 Holer Poler then I suspect you fly there and many other sub-standard destinatons our good employers choise to send us where such an occurence could and will happen in a blink of an eye.)

As a moderator I expected a little more maturity(and wisdom) from your post.

4HolerPoler

17th May 2007, 00:06

I'm entitled to my opinion and will try and keep it away from the fringes - I see no link between the Brazilian mid-air and the respective merits of joining alternative trade unions in Southern Africa. KALPA is a member organization of IFALPA and enjoys the facilities of this august body. What, to date, have KALPA or IFAPLA done in terms of providing any assistance to the recently deceased pilots in Douala? No press releases. I can't find anything.

But I digress; the choice of one's membership of a trade union or organization is a personal one and whilst each may canvass in support of their respective merits, individuals should be able to make their decision unencumbered from hostile rants in favor of one option. Union membership does not in any way commit one to the selected union - if you don't like the support or policies of that union there is nothing stopping one from realizing a bad judgment and reversing the initial decision. Allow individuals to make their own choices.

4HP

line-driver

17th May 2007, 08:14

I think what 4HP is trying to say is that a butterfly flapping its wings in China or Ifalpa's contribution to the Brazilians is not gonna ,make any difference to the Comair workload or Salaries...Only a local union can influence decisions for the local workers.

Have heard that the Solidarity applications are streaming in...but no resignations from Alpa/Cpa as yet

Looks like the members are interested in being members of both unions, 1 for aviation related issues and 1 for the salary issue.

Deskjocky

17th May 2007, 09:29

I have a question, will the company give recognition to 2 unions representing the same body of staff? The only way I can see this working (and Im very open to be corrected on this) is if Solidarity gain recognition by way of representing other labour groups within Comair and then operate on behalf of the pilots on this basis.:confused:

Avi8tor

18th May 2007, 09:03

The guys are missing the point. Solidarity will do no more for anybody that ALPA, in fact prob less. They have little or no knowledge of the industry.
The only advantage Solidarity has, due to there huge membership, is they have a full time legal team. That was a win when getting things thru the CCMA.

Its NOT the unbrella body that will force management to act, its only the pilots themselves. The threat of the strike at Airlink did not come from Solidarity, it came from the Airlink pilots.

Also remember after loosing the recognition agreement that existed between APA and management it took nearly 3 yrs to get another one signed with Solidarity.

If I were the guys at Comair and were unhappy, call an CPA extra ordinary AGM, vote in a committee who have the personality to stick it in management's eye. Also remember the committee can only be as forceful as the members are perpared to be.

Then be prepared to follow it up!!!!

If that had happened at Airlink 5 yrs ago, things would have been TOTALLY different.

And do it sooner rather than later. Management wont think so at the time, but it will be better for the airline, in the long run.

The one thing about being at Airlink, I have learned how to do somethings and how not to do others. Easier to learn the lessons from other people.

Mark J B

18th May 2007, 09:26

I think that is a valid point because the CPA committee are baling ship now too! Chairman on his way out of Comair, and others soon to follow!:uhoh:

line-driver

18th May 2007, 11:43

I personally think that with the resignation of our chairman, the chances are getting a decent salary out of management and a more "live-able" roster is rapidly dwindling.

Last year some members decided to ask for a poll on whether an "independent financial "guru" should be hired in to asses the companies financial status and based on this what would be the reasonable expectations for the Pilots re:salary increases etc..it was shot down in flames by the CPA committee with threats and accusations of mutiny etc.. now see the mess we are in and there is just no light at the end of the tunnel, June rosters published and its as bad if not worse than the May roster,no time available for relaxing and family thing. Surviving fatigue is now an issue for the pilots.

Its time to get the CV prepared and posted.

Deskjocky

18th May 2007, 11:57

Has the roster situation always been like this, or is this situation a function of the fact that Comair is trapped between trying to be a legacy and a low cost carrier. What Im trying to get at is what does management benchmark their pilot utilization against- an LCC or a legacy carrier? It looks like they prefer the LCC methodology, in which case they should then adopt the LCC crew payment methodology. I don’t hear too many Mango and 1Time FO’s having a go about pay.:hmm:

Avi8tor

19th May 2007, 06:07

hmmm...South Africa doesn't have a true low cost model. We operate in a LOW FARE enviroment. Fares in SA are totally artificial. 3 airlines have a HUGE state subsidy paid to them, so they can throw fares into the market that are not realistic.

Puts huge pressure on the other airlines. They end up having to get the most out of everything. And I dont see that changing anytime soon. So I think we have to accept the 900hrs a year is the norm. Unless you are in the state controlled loss makers, that is.

The only legacy we have in SA airline industy is that left by 'ethnic socialism' of the old SA and the good ol' SAR&H.

I am sad to hear that CPA is falling apart. DONT let it go the APA route, management will have a field day with the pilots. If the guys are taking the attitude that this is 'not my problem 'cause i am out of here', sh:mad:t is gonna hit the fan.

The problem is the guys that follow have to 'refight' old fights again later. Airlink guys are not back to where they were 8 yrs ago.

Its a sellers market, management know that they won't find experienced guys without having to steal them from the other airlines. If you guys push, salaries will move up.

nugpot

19th May 2007, 08:40

Has the roster situation always been like this, or is this situation a function of the fact that Comair is trapped between trying to be a legacy and a low cost carrier.

DJ, I don't work at Comair, but I bet that a large part of their roster woes is the fact that they are refleeting and that some guys have left. While replacements are trained, there will always be a transient period where the rosters are really tough. SAX has the same problem in some pools.

I have always thought that Comair is one of the best companies in the country to work for. I think the current low morale has many small reasons and not one big one. Their salaries are not that bad and as the company tries to expand, rosters will always be under pressure. I bet that if Comair opens a Cape Town base and avoids half their crews nightstopping every night, the morale will also improve.

If the guys feel so strongly that ALPA is doing nothing for them, then it is in their hands to change either their committee, or move everybody across to Solidarity. I just think that any halfhearted attempt to belong to both unions will end in tears.

Avi8tor

21st May 2007, 14:32

If the guys feel so strongly that ALPA is doing nothing for them, then it is in their hands to change either their committee, or move everybody across to Solidarity.

I SAY AGAIN.... its not ALPA or Solidarity that will do anything for them. Changing the committee is the only option, and let the new committee know that they have 100% memebers backing!!!

If management gets a sniff of the pilots are divided, the fat lady is on stage.

Deskjocky

22nd May 2007, 08:56

Nugs, I must admit that I agree with you- my perceptions were always one of a happy ship. I also think forums like this have done a lot to demistify what each company offers its crew, so its inevitable that comparisons are made and issue arise.

Its inevitable that the likes of Mango will go out and recruit again, I know they would absolutely love to snap up a few Comair FO's.:suspect::}

Mark J B

23rd May 2007, 08:37

The only problem with Mango is their FO package is less than Comair so I can't see many going that way.

GreenMD

23rd May 2007, 11:15

I see the media reporting that M Louw has sold some shares to the value of R 2.8 million! Not bad. Well done to all of us for working so hard on fuel savings and increasing the share price.

:ugh:

Solid Rust Twotter

23rd May 2007, 13:01

Did a little time on F27s with ML. Seemed a pretty good bloke.

Romeo E.T.

23rd May 2007, 13:03

GreenMD I see the media reporting that M Louw has sold some shares to the value of R 2.8 million! Not bad. Well done to all of us for working so hard on fuel savings and increasing the share price.

OUCH that hurt....

line-driver

23rd May 2007, 13:24

M Louw has sold some shares to the value of R 2.8 million!Thats what its all about.....business's are not in business for their customers, their employees or any-one else except for the "SHAREHOLDERS"...all boardroom conversations are along the lines of how to increase the money that "SHAREHOLDERS" can make from any cost cutting, salary or lack of salary increase, new routes, fuel savings, working the employees to the bone, who cares about their individual insignificant non-company relevant life etc....the employees are just expendable pawns in this game and the more that can be got out of this pawn for as little financial sacrifice, the happier will be the "SHAREHOLDERS"....and the pawn...(Pilot/Cabin attendant/Ground staff)...OH ..who cares about them...:*:*:*:uhoh::uhoh: