Life in China Airlines CAL

[ArielDC10]

I had passed the selection process in CAL for FO B744.
During the interviews and the sim all people from CAL were very nice.

I want to know how is the life in CAL. Many Lantin Americans in EVA are complaining a lot about the life in EVA and they say that it is the same in CAL.:confused: :confused: :confused:

[b747godfather]

trust your friends in latin america....!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :ugh:

[International Trader]

Read all the old threads about CAL.
10,000 people can't all be wrong.

Then look somewhere else.:=

[ArielDC10]

There is any positive opinion about CAL. :hmm:

[jajyay]

from being inside, i think the biggest problem (among other) in this airline is the fact that the management doesnt feel any single respect to their crews. You are just a piece of meat, that is paid to bring the plane from point A to point B with no delay (and no crash) . The rest, believe me, they dont care, (and yes they will always smile you very friendly as long as you operate the way they want you to operate). In other words : arguing is not allowed.
Now, if you can live with that, then get your type rating, fly some hours and be happy to change -after 3 years- if you dont want to loose the 20 000 $ bond !

I think this is more or less related to the chinese culture, and would then explain that the situation is about the same at Eva.

[ArielDC10]

I am new reading those forums but as far as I can see there are few pilots happy with thier companies. :confused: :confused: :confused:
I had talked with three or four CAL's FO and they were happy with CAL.
And if you compare my actual company, a 129 Freighter Operator with DC10, CAL seems to my like Cargolux.:D :D

[411A]

arguing is not allowed

I see you have discovered the modus operandi of operating in Asia, jajyay, and indeed it has been this way for a long time.
Years ago, the retirees from BA received the cold shoulder when they tried to tell SQ how to run their airline.

It really is...fly the bus and go home.

[skiesfull]

411A,
Right on the money again! No employer will listen to how another operates - it has to be an 'in-house' suggestion,(from a manager that is).
Don't forget that when the grass seems greener on the other man's side, it is usually because he is standing on a weed-and-moss infected lawn!! Consider very carefully the culture changes that you will have to endure to settle-in at a new airline, especially in a different continent.

[kwaiyai]

those last 2 threads tel me FANNY A about working for CAL. at least speak English Na,:confused: :}

[ArielDC10]

What is the living cost in Taipei??? :confused: :confused: :confused:
CAL is paying 32000 NTD, I don't know if it is enogh for renting a nice apartment.

[International Trader]

Just like in Buenos Aires there are good places to live and real sh-t holes.
Is that money enough for a nice apartment in Taipei ?......No.
A very small, not so nice apartment, in a not so good area?........ yes,maybe.

Out near the airport where few speak English and where you will never see a friend? Don't think there are too many good apartments there but, they will be cheap.

[ArielDC10]

Is there any expat pilot from CAL in the Forum???

I would like to know:
a) How much the salary is during the trainning.
b) How long the trainning will be.
c) How long an upgrade takes for an expat.
d)any expectation for a contract renegotiation. As far as I can see
the salary and contract conditions are below the average in the region.

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

[typhoonpilot]

c) How long an upgrade takes for an expat.



The Search function might come in handy with this question. The answer is out there, make sure you find out before you go :uhoh:


TP

[Snoopy747]

Is there any expat pilot from CAL in the Forum???

Yes, there is.

a) How much the salary is during the trainning.

Not really much. I don´t have the contract at my hands now, but it was something with 3000 USD. Not really much.

b) How long the trainning will be.

It depends. If you come with an Boeing Type Rating it is shorter, than without. I came from the 73G and I startet in June with my training followed by my Linecheck in September. Some Swiss guys have been nine month in the training.

c) How long an upgrade takes for an expat.

If you are very, very lucky, apply for an Relief Pilot Position after two years, and you do the Ground Training Instructor (744 Fixbase) Job after one year, you might be lucky beeing upgraded after 5 years. But I would not count on that, think about seven to eight. I am not going to wait for this, I am already on my way out to another Asian 744 operator.

Bonds:

for 744 without previous Boeing Experience 18.000 USD 3 Years
for 744 with previous Boeing Experience 13.000 USD 3 Years
for Upgrading 18.0000 USD 3 Years

d)any expectation for a contract renegotiation. As far as I can see
the salary and contract conditions are below the average in the region.

Forget about negotiation. Take it or leave it is the policy. We Germans call CAL "Die größte 747 Flugschule der Welt" what means world biggest 747 Flightschool. Just get the rating, and look for a job somewhere else.

Life in CAL would not be so bad, if the salary wouldn´t suck that much. I get roundabout 5000 USD net per Month.


Considering the housing. If you want to live directly in Taipeh, you pay like crazy. Most expats live in a community called "Lotus Hills" 20 min by Taxi away from the CAL Campus. It is not expensive, quiet, well maintained and clean. You get 29.000 NTD Housing allowance (32.000 is BEFORE tax) and I share a large nice appartment with another expat guy, what cost us round 30000 with all costs included. so 15.000 each and you have 14.000 Left. That´s enough for living in Taipeh and the taxi, so I don´t have to touch my USD, I wire them all home to my account in Germany.

Hope that helped you a little.

[ArielDC10]

Thanks for the information. But the worst contract for flying a B744 is with JADE Cargo. They are paying U$D4500 per month before tax,
they are not offering consecutive days off, the worst thing of the contract is the can take one or two off your 8 days off when you lay over of more than 2 days, the third day is consider as day off, and if the lay over is more than four days, 2 days are considered as day off.

And the base is in Shanhai, it does not sounds better than Taipei. And the housing allowances are U$D500.

Thanks again.

[jajyay]

sorry Ariel, some (not all) of your infos are wrong
pay depends on experience and wether or not u are typerated. for exemple, I got an offer at around 55000 chinese yuan (5500 Euros) (before tax) + 3200 for housing allowance (320 Euros)
base is Shenzhen, at least the expat suburb is quite nice and 30mn by boat from hongkong
for the rest, you are pretty much right, it's unstable !

[ArielDC10]

Dear friend, JADE's people had sent me a contract for a non type rated first officer. If I compare both contracts I would take the CAL's contract.
JADE offers 8 days off per month, but It says nothing about consecutive days...They take 1 day off per 2 lay over days and 2 days off per 4 lay over days.
I have been flying DC10 Freighters for more than four years, and there are seasons where you have a lot of lay over days out of you base, It is not a problem of the employee and I see unfair to take those days as days off, because you are out of your home in a hotel not for your reasons.:ugh:

[ArielDC10]

Do you know how long would take the ground and training for an B744 initial in CAL???
Some people say it would take 6 months, for me it is too much. Any course in Airbus International or even in Alteon is taken not more than 45 days.

[littlejet]

Alteon, or Boeing will give you pure sim type rating.
CAL training has everything included, INDOC, FOM, MEL, CRM, DGR, SEP etc.
CBT, FTD, FBS, SIM and LT are type specific. If you come with no jet time you will do few touch and goes with an empty a/c. Number of minimum sectors before final check are depending on your previous experience and training position and varies between 8 and 24 sectors.
Lots of days off.
They even have cultural differences and self defense course on initial training. Instructor availability is a big problem so the training will take from 3 to 6 months...
Hope it helps

L.

[ArielDC10]

Friends, there are no news from CAL.:confused::confused::confused:
After the ground/sim training and the line training would be days off for returning home.:confused::confused::confused:

Regards.

[Snoopy747]

Well, nobody gives you an answer on that, because nobody does know for sure... They can do everything... approve your days off after sim check, or put you right away on the line training.

How the training situation is now I don´t know. I heard a rumor - as I said a rumor, nothing confirmed - that the new FO contracts are crap - 3500 USD a month or someting like that. I will try to figure it out when I am again in TPE.

Anyway almost every western Expat is leaving for Korean Air. They are going to loose a lot of expats, and when the ICAO English Test comes up, they gonna get at least 1/4 of their local crews grounded, if the TW CAA won´t cheat on these test in favor of the locals...

Hard times approaching for CAL :E