Is airport security doing the right job?

[aviationmug]

This is what happened in an Australian capital city airport the other day.

We had a slight wait before we were to crew an aircraft on a regular scedule flight, so the other Pilot and myself decided to go up stairs at the airport and grab something to eat. This involved having to go through airport security.

Anyway at the security belt, an old lady in front of us, who must of been around 80 years old, was being pulled aside because she had a set of nail clippers on her!!!!!!. Ok, she's really going to do some damage there!!!.

Anyway, this is where it gets interesting. My friend(the other pilot) had one of those leathermans on his belt. (its one of those large pocket knifes with all the fancy blades on it) He was allowed to walk straight through and was not stopped.:rolleyes:

Now here are my points for discussion.

Was he not stopped because he had 4 bars on his shoulders?. I mean, how does security know he isn't some dodgy terrorist etc etc.

anyone else seen this silly nonsense before???

[lowerlobe]

Did the metal detector pick up the leatherman or did he just walk through and was not checked?

[Exciter Box]

Whilst I have never been dumb enough to walk through security with a knife on my belt, I have had to surrender a corkscew on one occassion and a small pair of nail scissors on another (had changed from paxing with checked bags to carry on as crew). On Both occassions was dressed in the full giggle suit, ASIC and all.

I haven't seen the general public, let alone 80 year old ladies, being treated any different to crew at all.

Perhaps the guy just plain didn't see it and for some reason the detector didn't go off.

[fallen]

I would be very surprised if he was let through because he was the pilot. Sounds like the Walkthrough Metal Detector didn't pick-up the Leatherman or the screener wasn't paying attention. If the old lady had only prepared herself first and stuck the nail clippers in her pocket she wouldn't have had to stop :)

[Dehavillanddriver]

Pilots are allowed to carry "tools of trade" through the screening points - Clarrie i do believe you had a reference some time ago..

[FlexibleResponse]

I feel that some mug is having us on!

[Capt Claret]

G'day dHD,

I did, but the ever fluid dotars goal post were moved and in the end the approval wasn't worth the paper it was printed on.

And what constitutes tools of trade seems to be up to the screener on duty. Amazingly some tools of trade which passed through security 62 times around the country over a 4.5 month period, were the other day deemed not suitable, despite passing through the same check point three days prior. :ugh:

Sadly I don't think that a Labour Govt will repeal the current procedures in the short term.

T'other day I mentioned to a colleague, quietly I thought, the absurdity of allowing armed men to bypass security screening, whilst we who had a vested interest in the safe arrival of our craft went through the ringer. Today at said airport, there was a big sign which indicated something along the lines of "comments about the process may be result in civil or criminal charges".

Stalin must be rolling in his grave......

[socks and thongs]

Are airport security doing the right job? They are doing the job most of them are programmed to do. These guys and girls (at least in Syd) are on not a great deal over ten bucks an hour, and work more hours than the sun each week. The first problem is maintaining a microscopic interest in keeping the strictest security levels up, something that on $10/hr after my 100th working hour for the week, I can tell you I wouldn't have.

There are thousands of them, each with their own personality, each with what they believe is acceptable and of course not acceptable. Should there be absolute uniformity in the way they deal with security? Yes of course, will there be? Never.

Unfortunately when you employ human beings, this is what happens, and despite the large security company that runs security at Sydney (and probably a few others too) doing their best to employ actual robots, beneath that hard shiny exterior is a mind that is going to make a decision based on what they deem acceptable or unacceptable.

[boofhead]

"You can fool some of the people all of the time..."

If you believe that airport security has anything to do with airplane security...
If you believe that airport security has ever caught a terrorist...
If you believe that airport security has any chance of stopping someone from attempting to take over an airplane or use an airplane to attack a ground target...
If you believe that airport security is applied to everyone who has access to airplanes on the ramp...
If you believe that any airport (except for maybe some airports in the former USSR or Asia) has any plan to counter an attack by determined terrorists who might be detected before boarding an airplane...
If you believe that airport security is anything other than one of the greatest con jobs in history...
If you believe that airport security is not mainly being used to incrementally take away our rights and freedoms...

See the above.

[Kanga767]

absurdity of allowing armed men to bypass security screening
Not only that, they are not legally required to have an ASIC.


K

[lowerlobe]

I don't think many people would argue that there is a need for airport security.That need is as much for safety (preventing some goose from walking onto the tarmac when aircraft and other equipment is operating) to something more sinister.

However,most airports are owned and run as a business and as such the main criteria is the dollar.The owner of SYD is a case in point when you need to take a loan out to buy a meal and a cup of coffee.

That also means that they are going to put the blowtorch to security and accept the cheapest tender that accepts their requirements.As socks and thongs said how can you get adequate anything when you pay them $10 per hour.

Darth has said that he does not like paying for air marshalls simply because they cost money.I have always had the impression that he must hate putting his hand onto his wallet for anything.I wonder if he eats Kosher meals!!!

So at the end of the day it comes down to the cost and with anything you get what you pay for.

[FlexibleResponse]

Quote:
absurdity of allowing armed men to bypass security screening
Not only that, they are not legally required to have an ASIC.

This has got to be some sort of sick joke. Right?

[pakeha-boy]

Capt Claret says.......T'other day I mentioned to a colleague, quietly I thought, the absurdity of allowing armed men to bypass security screening, whilst we who had a vested interest in the safe arrival of our craft went through the ringer.

MATE !!! just so happens that I,m one of those blokes,,...the big difference is that I,m the Captain as well;) .....reckon I have a "vested interest" as well...

always two sides to the coin...PB

[Capt Claret]

PB, I don't follow what you're trying to say. :confused:

[J430]

Capt Claret

I think our kiwi cousin is one of the "armed" and trained Captains on someones big Boeings........is what he is referring to.

J:ok:

[pakeha-boy]

J430...eggs-zackery!!!....only,currently its an Airbus.......but there you go....

its a hard -sell for many of us pilots....and weve been down this road before...but,blow me down blue,....if the buggars want my Aircraft it will be a tough take!!!! ...the debate continues:uhoh: .PB

[J430]

PB.....sorry about that....big boeing rolled off the keyboard better...could have said the big bus too:uhoh:
Not a fan of guns on planes, but best if they are, that they are in the right place! I reckon I would shoot first ask questions later if given a REAL threat. One dead hijacker is........a good start!:}
J:ok:

[Kanga767]

sick joke

If the prior reference to armed persons bypassing Security is to APS, then yes, they are not required to have an ASIC; or perhaps that should be 'display' an ASIC airside.

This was pointed out to me only a week or so ago during a random ASIC check. We pointed out to said APS person that his ASIC was not displayed, which resulted a sleeve with a woven badge thrust in our faces and the words 'not required when you have one of these' uttered.

Further reading of the relevant Aviation Transport Security Regulations indicates this is the case if an individual or group is granted an exemption.

I might point out that most APS guys and girls possess and display an ASIC regardless.


K