Regional F/O's: how do you make ends meet?

[Bendo]

G'day guys

just been crunching the numbers with The Boss, looking at the economics of working as a FO for Eastern, Rex, McAir etc. With a wife, child, dog, mortgage and aspirations towards a second child, it looks pretty tight to me.

How the hell do you make ends meet on $650 pw?

Even if the boss works 3 days/week, there is about $20 pw 'spare' in our draft budget after child care and everything else.

We are teetering on the brink - there are no money fairies at the bottom of our financial garden - How can you work as a regional FO and still live a life? :confused:

[aircabbie]

250 bucks better off than flying around the Kimberlies. If you have a very brief search around this site you , will read of guys flippin burgers just to get that extra dollar towards his CPL/MECIR/ATPL/ENDO ect ect . im sure they give a :mad: about your issues . Life is about choices my friend , keep your daks up or get another job .

Cheers
:ok:

[DeafStar]

Your going to earn more than that with Eastern. Its just the 10k you have to give them at the start you have to factor in! Also dont forget you will be an FO at Eastern for a long time. I hear there aint much progression.

However, regional pilots get paid allowances on top of the wage which will give you an extra $100 a week on average. Also you get fed at work which can save a few $$$.

[Jet_A_Knight]

Aircabbie, I bet you're a real hot-shot!:rolleyes:

[pilotdude09]

Is the pay really that bad?

$650 a week :eek:

Bloody hell, i know regionals pay crap but far out. I earn more at woolies working as a supervisor for 38hrs a week as a 17 year old!!

I know its not about the money but you need to be able to afford to live on the basics even doing something youre passionate about. I would love to know what my instructors are on....but they wont tell me.

You pretty much need to have 2 jobs to be a pilot, well thats the way it seems to be headed which is sad. Hate to know what it will be like in 10-15 years time.........................:ooh:

[DUXNUTZ]

REX ~ 39k p.a , Eastern ~ 45k p.a What that after tax per week?

[Enema Bandit's Dad]

Eastern FO's are okay and there is a bit of movement.

[aircabbie]

Jet a knight ,

Because you would know right !!! it is a fact that most who go through flight training these days to a CPL level are unable due to high costs afford to continue to higher levels of training there for are unable to continue/progress with their career . Life is all about choices thats all am saying , sorry if that comment offends anyone other then the tool this is in response to , however i would have thought its a sad fact .

Bendo hope it works out for you mate .

Cheers
Hotshot:cool:

[Dj Dave]

Eastern about $49,900 Gross p.a.

average 3-5000 p.a. in allowances.


Astro, that really sucks. Which company u work for? You think you're out of GA unntil you find out stuff like that.

[Peter Fanelli]

Maybe if pilots would stop paying for their own endorsements and training they'd be in a better financial position to commence an aviation career.

[Mogas]

I did work at McDonald's for about 2 months. I'm 21, single, and don't give a f***. I got the job on the spot so I did it to earn extra $$$ to pay off rent and buy groceries, and save my pilot cheques. But I tell ya those f****** kids drove me up the wall.

[aircabbie]

My point exactly MOGAS . hope you get to where ever you wanna get to in the industry , if not already there .

cheers
Cabbie

[Mogas]

Thanks. I am now a Jetstream 31 and 32 FO now and I'm lovin it. Might still look for a second job to add to the comfort level. Stuck in northern Canada. No girls, no buddies, heck, might as well make extra cash.

[bushy]

You are right. There never have been enough jobs for the thousands of pilots that come out of the flying schools. It's been that way for 35years. And for 35 years the flying schools have been talking about the wonderful opportunities out there for pilots.
So now we have a flood of pilots who go to GA just to "use them up" and get for free the experience and endorsements needed to move on. Some move on, some move out of the industry, some move overseas. Most move, and more endorsements and cost are needed. So pretty soon the operators decide the only way to stay viable is to charge for endorsements. This is also not very good, as some companies then turn into flying schools, and make profits from endorsements. Some have been known to exploit young pilots.
The RAAF have a scheme that ensures they get sufficient years of service from their pilots to justify the cost of training.
Many of the airlines are now charging for endorsements . Do they get loyalty from these pilots?
I see contracts and bonds being the future for GA, with some money up front and legal agreements to keep everyone honest. I think a fair way would be for the pilot to take out a loan to pay for the endorsement and /or bond, and the employer to pay him/her an allowance to make the payments with. I'm confident that the AFAP would be very interested if one of their members was in this situation, and was sacked.

Someone has to pay for endorsements and training.

Operators need a stable and reliable group of pilots.

Pilots need a stable and reliable job, with reasonable income.

In reality a pilot's an apprentice for the first 1500 hours.

A lot more appreciation fo reality is desperatey needed.

[Mogas]

Ladies N Gents,

Check out this shiznit. http://youtube.com/watch?v=RayMaswju1A

[Mogas]

And let me know what you think of the slideshow...............


Wooooooooooo!!!! We need some MOGAS!!!!!!

[Launchpad McQuack]

Hey Mogas....your unit wouldn't happen to be an operation out of Yellowknife would it??

[Mogas]

No. My unit is not from the "knife". Why you ask?

[vh_ajm]

If it were me I would get rid of the dog and go-around on the second kid, downsize the house (and hence mortgage). Yes, I know, I'm heartless- but with a passion (flying). Then I'd go get Mogas's old job at maccas.

If you want it bad enough you can make it work. I really admire stories like mogas's's's.

Good luck with what ever you choose.

[Metro man]

Get a second job; shelf stacking in Coles, brickies labourer, taxi driving etc have all been done by pilots.

Note you may also need a second job even if you are a Captain with certain companies.:*

[Bendo]

Well yes... and no.

I have worked 2 jobs all my working life... but one would hope that a pilot for a major regional airline wouldn't need to do so. :ugh:

...get rid of the dog and go-around on the second kid, downsize the house

...and what do we go to work for anyway? To support our families, I always thought. :hmm: Just guessing, AJM, but do you have dog or kids, or a wife nearing forty? :} Not having a go but being in that position changes your perspective! :p

No I'm not whinging either... but just amazed, when I do the maths on the job I thought I always wanted, that it is such a backwards step.

Thanks guys :ok:

[vh_ajm]

Yer. I wasn't having a go either. They're just my priorities at the moment. They may change of course...And like I said, I'm fair heartless hehe.

As I said, good luck with what ever you do.

Cheers.

[maxgrad]

I did the GA starter and hour build with strife and lids in tow, think my starter wage was 29g.:eek:
Now at the udder end of GA and getting somewhat more.
Would I consider an FO drive with less pay?
I would need to weigh the facts and possibles VERY carefully before doing the jump. This stage just not worth it. Progression, stability, satisfaction are just a few variables.

[neville_nobody]

You blokes would want to hope that CASA don't legislate Fatigue Management Systems as you won't be able to survive by the sound of it!!
(for those who aren't aware FMS system count hours work in a 2nd job toward your total score):suspect:

[podbreak]

Bendo's got a point. The position presented isn't of someone who has just waltzed out of training and expects the golden check. To be a regional FO requires quite a bit of experience, typically not your first job. Its not too much to expect for it to pay enough to live. There is a growing experience shortage in this particular sector, with conditions geared towards an over-supply of experienced pilots. More money will need to be offered to lure experience away from the airline path.

250 bucks better off than flying around the Kimberlies. If you have a very brief search around this site you , will read of guys flippin burgers just to get that extra dollar towards his CPL/MECIR/ATPL/ENDO ect ect . im sure they give a :mad: about your issues .

Everything is relative, accept the fact that this bloke is facing a real issue and is looking for constructive advice, not sob stories.

[aircabbie]

My post is hardly a personal sob story i KNOW how crap the money is in aviation and yet its what i CHOOSE to do . I belive this gentleman does have a real issue and needs to make a decision on what more important and and where he directs his life.

If he can't afford to be a Regional F/O someone else out there will be able to . I make no apoligise for my original post. And as i have said before Bendo i wish you all the best mate. :ok:

[bodex666]

Ive worked for 2 regional airlines for almost 3 years. I usually clear $550-$600 pw. Usually including allowances, depending on what my roster was. Now out of that 600 take off my rent, food, bills, petrol, loan repayment, I was left with around $100 which was usually saved. Now my girlfriend has a job and will be earning more than me (keep me in my lifestyle !) Mate its hard and I couldnt imagine you supporting your family on your salary alone. I think your only choices would be for your wife to work or get a better paying job until you can work it another way.

Best of luck

[Lasiorhinus]

I think your only choices would be for your wife to work or get a better paying job until you can work it another way.
Best of luck

Re reading the OP, it does seem like the OPs wife does not work. Her getting a job would be my first suggestion on making more money.

[Bendo]

... and she earns $500pw (lets say, being a regional job...) ...

Childcare for #1 is $50/child/day

Mrs B then goes and gets herself preggers (none of my doing, Your Honour :uhoh: ) and 10 months later drops #2.

Childcare now $50 x 2 x 5 days... guess what?

... that's $500 pw. Mrs B need no longer work for frucking living as frucking wages all taken by frucking ABC child "care"!!! :{ :yuk:

Be warned! Be a FO before you get hitched and before you get preggers!

Cheers :yuk:

[OpsNormal]

Bendo, you still haunting the top end of the Valley?

[AerocatS2A]

You blokes would want to hope that CASA don't legislate Fatigue Management Systems as you won't be able to survive by the sound of it!!
(for those who aren't aware FMS system count hours work in a 2nd job toward your total score)
There are companies using Fatigue Risk Management Systems already.

And Bendo, keep the dog (they cost SFA to run,) put the old girl to work 3-4 days per week, see if you can rent out your house at a rate that covers your mortgage, rent a cheaper place for yourselves, delay child # 2 until the finances come together (a command for instance, or you slot in to Virgin/Jetstar/Qantas or something.)

And last, based on a salary of $49,000 you should clear about $700 then you have allowances on top of that.

[aircabbie]

Bendo i'll try not to get preggo mate thanks for the advice :ok: