Rookie in india looking for guidance [Archive]

quarryking

12th Mar 2007, 15:42

HI Folks, my maiden post here on this site. Like many other posts, this too is centered around finding the right place to do my flight training subject to numerous factors.

I write in from India, am 26 and am not from a science academic background, but am greatly interested in flying. Am open to training locations outside of India and have a budget in the region of say US$ 40,000 for my course fees.

Would also be looking at getting employment in the Indian region on completion of the course, so the necessary conversion courses too need to be kept in mind.

Have some queries:

Would I be able to get my PPL, Instrument Rating and Commercial Multi Engine rating in say 12 - 15 months time? Is this too short a time frame.
Is my budget of US$ 40,000 enough or would I still be short of funds?
Would my lack of science back ground prove to be a hassle or would I still be able to give this a shot?
Would my age prove to be a hassle
Based on the above which place would be a good bet for me

jai6638

13th Mar 2007, 06:27

I'd recommend New Zealand or Ausralia from what I hear.. This wil make it easier for you to convert back to Indian licenses since the FAA license is not recognized!

Check out www.indianpilots.com for more info..

divinesoul

13th Mar 2007, 07:16

This wil make it easier for you to convert back to Indian licenses since the FAA license is not recognized!

What a load of crap.:eek::ugh: :ugh: U must be joking.

there are so many guys i know who have done their training in US and converted successfully to the Indian DGCA licence.

Please dont mislead people with wrong info:= := :=

Cheers.

soulfly

13th Mar 2007, 07:22

hey quarryking

Exactly what most of us go through when deciding on the "right" place to train.Good you posted the question up .
I was looking for a good school to get my ATPL as well , here are a few schools that are pretty reputed among indian students. Have a look
Basair Aviation , www.indianpilot.com (http://www.indianpilot.com)
Its in australia and has an extensive program as per Indian requirements.
Go through their site; like you said you have sufficient funds , that wont be a problem. The overall cost at Basair would be around the 18k-20k mark including your accomodation .

Harv's air and PacificFlying Club in Vancouver , BC , Canada.
Canada has a high percentage of Indian Students , and it feels almost home there as well.
check out www.pacificflying.com (http://www.pacificflying.com)
Lemme know if you need more information about flying schools lemme know , ill also add info about the conversion process you need to take up back in India.
Have a good day :)

soulfly

13th Mar 2007, 07:35

This wil make it easier for you to convert back to Indian licenses since the FAA license is not recognized!

dude thats not true at all. The FAA license is widely reputed around the world and theres no way its not recognized by the DGCA. Yes , there had been a few schools in US that were 'supposedly' blacklisted by DGCA.
Yet if you look and do your homework right , you can get into a good Flight School at US , and convert your license when you get back to India.

check out these sites for flying schools in US :
www.raaflightschools.com (http://www.raaflightschools.com)

www.deltaconnectionacademy.com/ (http://www.deltaconnectionacademy.com/)

soulfly

13th Mar 2007, 07:42

Quarry King , relax

Usually major airlines prefer graduates or candidates with a 4 yr university degree. You don't have a science background, thats fine . The DGCA doesnt mention anywhere that you need to have a science degree or a science background. But having basic knowledge about math and physics does help cause you'll have to go through math-physics calculations during your training. So long as you can manage and survive that, its bally fine.
I know many pilot trainees who didnt have a science background yet completed their CPL , though they did work hard to cover lost ground.
So be chilled , just make sure you look for a good school . lemme know aight.

Visit www.dgca.nic.in (http://www.dgca.nic.in) for the requirements still .
Cheers .

soulfly

13th Mar 2007, 08:16

@ divine soul

1)indian medical
2)FAA permanent license(not the tempo white slip)
3)composite paper(met n nav)
4)regulations paper
5)day + night +ir check rides
6)u need a 300nm cross country with some specifications (given on dgca website) done within last 6 months
7)a 120nm night cross ctry check within last 6 months..(again chk for specifications on dgca.nic.in)
8)40 hrs IR
9)a letter frm school for each of these crosscountries
10) a letter frm school summing up ur entire IR experience on one page
11)a letter frm school summin up ur entire cross country experience
12)listen the sad part is even if u have a license u still need to meet indian cross country requirements for some strange reason ... that is some 50 hrs of (100 nm each) cross countries....make sure for each of these specific requirements u have a letter frm school on their letterhead...will have life much easier during the conversion.
Hope it helps :)

quarryking

13th Mar 2007, 09:02

Hi all. and thanks for taking the time to reply,

Been also looking simultaneously at schools here in India and some which came up are the following. Please do comment on them,if u’ve know of any one that studied there or if your from there:

Orient flying school – Pondicherry
Flytech Aviaiton academy – Hyderabad
Madrad Flying club – Chennai
All the above have a close proximity to Chennai (madras) where I live thereby making lt easy for me to commute or study there.

Another thing I forget to bring up was that have heard most major airlines ask for a huge deposit once you get the job, more as a guarantee so that you don’t quite as soon as u get a better deal. They collect up in the form of post dated cheques. More like a bond to keep a hold on you. They periodically keep giving you back your cheques as you clock more time with the company. That still prevalent in the industry and if yes, how much would I need to ear mark for this as I need to budget it into my overall financial outlay

Soulfly:

- where did u do your training, since you mentioned you too were scouting around for places to get ur training done
- you know of anyone else that’s done a stint @ basair

jai6638

13th Mar 2007, 09:07

I apologize for not being clear... The FAA license is recognized but converting from FAA license is more tedious since it requires taking all the exams and the flight test again. As far as I know, the flight test is not required for conversion from New Zealand license to Indian license ( or from any other commonwealth country, for that matter)..

Cheers

soulfly

13th Mar 2007, 09:15

Hey Quarry King !

I'm planning to take a plunge into the aviation industry. My dad happens to be a pilot and also planning to start an aviation co. here in india itself.

Well you could look at Madras Flying Club or even Flytech aviation , ive heard they are pretty good.
First of all , best of luck for getting a CPL , and dont worry 26 isnt too old to start an airline career.

I happen to know a lot of people who're training at Basair and Pacific flying club at Vancouver. If youre planning to do your training from India itself you could also consider IGRUA at rae bareli : www.igrua.gov.in (http://www.igrua.gov.in)
Usually they have issues with the instructors , the fleet and it's time-consuming.
However , the infrastructure , the student to Instructor ratio , the training and the whole composition of the course including your own knowledge would be much better if you train abroad. Some flying schools abroad also have integrated 'fast track' programs that take lesser time.
As you would know Indian flying schools do have a lot of issues , a lot of red tape and maintenance problems.

Major airlines when recruiting , make you sign up a bond . Thats right , you give them post dated cheques , the whole amount is reimbursed to you after youre done with the bond-period. Usually it's in the range of 10-20k.. like i've heard.
It's just because of the high attrition rate prevalent in the industry.
I'll have a word about it with my colleagues and get back to you when i have specific info.
Cheers .

quarryking

13th Mar 2007, 10:26

i have people in the vancounver region and so staying with them will help me save accomodation costs... all depends now on how much the Pacific flying club would charge for their programs

divinesoul

13th Mar 2007, 21:37

apologize for not being clear... The FAA license is recognized but converting from FAA license is more tedious since it requires taking all the exams and the flight test again. As far as I know, the flight test is not required for conversion from New Zealand license to Indian license ( or from any other commonwealth country, for that matter)..

Cheers

again Jai you are talking nonsense.

Any licence from an ICAO contracting state to convert to Indian DGCA equivalent requires flight tests and exams.They are all equally tedious as you are up against bureaucracy and red tape courtesy of the officials at DGCA hence more paperwork required.

Now When it comes to a common wealth country's RT(radio telephony licence) one need not to give any tests or anything of that sort for converting into to Indian RT.It only involves only paperwork.

Jai take my advice stop embarassing urself by posting info based on half baked knowledge.

Make sure u are posting something credible not any bed time stories or half baked knowledge(no offence intended).

cheers.

karam

13th Mar 2007, 22:31

I'm afraid it's true. FAA licenses aren't really looked at with much degree of importance unless it's an ATP. The fact of the matter is, the training in the US at the low hours level is inadequate as considered by most operators outside the US. I obtained my PPL in the states and when I came to the UK to start my ATPL course, they didn't even consider my US license and said it's better we start from the beginning. When I went for a SIA interview, one of the captains interviewing me actually mentioned the US pilots being a bunch of cowboys. NOt my opinion neccesarily, even though I think the JAA standard is far higher than the FAA, but it's generally what most airlines think outside the United States. My advice is to go for a non-FAA license if you are a low hour pilot. It opens up more options.
Oh and in the case of the DGCA requiring mandatory test for licence conversion, well i'm afraid that's a bunch of BULL. It depends of which contracting ICAO state your licence was issued. If it is from the CAA then it's likely you will not have to do a flight test.

quarryking

14th Mar 2007, 02:21

Have heard of chaps that have done their flying training in the states, but have had to do a whole host of conversions in order to be recognized by DGCA...and yes, being a govt. setup there's apparently an insane amount of red tapism to deal with...

quarryking

14th Mar 2007, 02:24

By the way, Soulfly...where u headed for your training..??

soulfly

14th Mar 2007, 08:20

hey quarryking ..

Bro , am still looking at a few options , went and met agents for Basair Aviation college , sounds promising till now.
Going to visit another couple of places , RAA flight academy or Delta connection , gonna have a good look the course lines and the schools and then decide..
What's your scene like , considered any school already?

jai6638

14th Mar 2007, 10:14

again Jai you are talking nonsense.
Any licence from an ICAO contracting state to convert to Indian DGCA equivalent requires flight tests and exams.They are all equally tedious as you are up against bureaucracy and red tape courtesy of the officials at DGCA hence more paperwork required.
Now When it comes to a common wealth country's RT(radio telephony licence) one need not to give any tests or anything of that sort for converting into to Indian RT.It only involves only paperwork.
Jai take my advice stop embarassing urself by posting info based on half baked knowledge.
Make sure u are posting something credible not any bed time stories or half baked knowledge(no offence intended).
cheers.
I suggest you do some more research on the matter instead of passing blanket statements.... The same conversion rules do not apply to all ICAO states...
The FAA license is widely reputed around the world
I am a FAA license holder and have found that the FAA license does not seem to be very "reputable" in all parts of the world since training is not standardized in the US under part 61. Quality varies from institution to institution... . Hence, please stop generalizing your opinions...

karam

14th Mar 2007, 10:26

There are a lot of people here who seem to make sweeping statements without really having any knowledge of the point they are trying to make. Seeing as sweeping statements are a mainstream practice in this forum, here's one:

"FAA licences are fine if you are working in the United States. JAA licences are accepted in many more parts of the world as the industry standard."

On the other hand, flight training is significantly cheaper in the US because of the low cost of fuel. By the way, Singapore Airlines has opened up it's cadet program to Indian nationals. If accepted you will be trained at their expense. Not a bad deal if you are an aspiring pilot.

divinesoul

14th Mar 2007, 13:19

@jai

I suggest you do some more research on the matter instead of passing blanket statements.... The same conversion rules do not apply to all ICAO states...

I am pretty sure of what i am talking here . As far as the Indian DGCA is concerned they have set rules for conversion of foreign licence to the Indian equivalent.they dont have seperate conversion rules for CPL holders from different licencing authorities like the FAA,JAA,CASA.NZ CAA etcetc.Its the same for everybody.

Only conditions are ones CPL must from an ICAO contracting country and one must satisfy the Indian DGCA requirements for CPL. All foreign CPL holders looking to convert have to give check rides and conversion exams in India.

You said and i quote

The FAA license is recognized but converting from FAA license is more tedious since it requires taking all the exams and the flight test again. As far as I know, the flight test is not required for conversion from New Zealand license to Indian license

The above point i dont agree with it at all.

anyways i rest my case.

cheers.

Jorge46

14th Mar 2007, 15:37

This might be worth checking out!

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2007/03/08/212498/canadian-flying-school-winnipeg-aviation-to-offer-pilot-training-in.html

quarryking

15th Mar 2007, 04:47

SIA's cadet program has a whole lot of pre requsities that one should fall under...i jus missed their age bar as i turn 27 in a few weeks and there cut off is 26...

quarryking

15th Mar 2007, 04:49

that sounds interesting...must check in and see what's the status on that college

DesiPilot

15th Mar 2007, 19:22

Quarry King, Karam and Jai,

Please listen to what Divine Soul is writing here. He is absolutely right, the DGCA doesnt care whether you hold a JAA licence, FAA licence or a CASA licence. All they care about is that you have met all the requirements for the conversion as previously listed by DS.

Now, why should you believe me anymore than DS. For starters I hold DGCA and FAA ATPL and I also hold JAA CPL. I also hold FAA and JAA FI ratings and also JAA FE ratings. So when I say I had no problem converting my FAA CPL to Indian and JAA CPL first and later my FAA ATPL to DGCA ATPL I speak from my own experience.

So do you research and go to any ICAO country. Now to find a list of ICAO country you can go to http://www.icao.int/cgi/goto_m.pl?cgi/statesDB4.pl?en
So my suggestion do not go to Taiwan or you will not be able to convert your licence in India. As long as the name of the country is in this list, the DGCA will not have any problem converting the licence.

Good luck with your training.

DesiPilot

PS: I'd not do my training in India; only because it will take you more than one year to complete your flight training whilst if you go to NZ, OZ, SA or USA you can finish your training in 6-7 months.

divinesoul

15th Mar 2007, 21:50

thanks desipilot atlelast someone agrees with me.

cheers.

quarryking

16th Mar 2007, 02:53

Desipilot...thanks for the post and all the info. How long did ur entire training take?? who u flying with now??

quarryking

8th May 2007, 03:50

divinesoul

8th May 2007, 05:31

Evev if i were to do my CPL training outside of India and then wish to join an Indian carrier, would me not having the 10 + 2 with maths and physics prove to be a panic...???

Cause i do not have the +2 with Maths and physics

It doesnt matter if u are doing ur CPL in India or outside.u have to meet DGCA requirements for the issue of CPL.All requirements are to be met when u submit ur application for the conversin of ur foreign licence.

So u have to have +2 with maths and physics as subjects.

cheers.