Kit build P51 mustang

[maxgrad]

Been searching for some time for info on a kit P51. Not the SAL or other 1:1 scale but the smaller version ( for the not so rich buggers).
Saw one a lifetime ago at an airshow at ballarat but unable to find info.
Looked exactly like the real thing except the canopy seemed too big for the rest.
Any help on sites etc would be welcomed.

[OpsNormal]

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u109/OpsNormal/port11.jpg

A bit like this one Maxxie?

If I remember where I took this one correctly, (I think that) I took it at Warbirds Over Scone 2001. Bendo and a few others may remember clearer than I can.....

Don't remember if they had a website or exactly what the name of the kit is/was, but I do remember that it had either a Chev V8 in it and boy it was seriously close to the sound of a merlin both in the air and on the ground.

Big thumbs-up!:ok: :ok: :ok:

[Bendo]

Jim Wickham owns that one - he lives in Victoria, in Gippsland I think.

Top bloke and I am sure if you catch him he wil be only too happy to pass on the details :ok:

[Aerodynamisist]

Try this one
http://warreplica.homestead.com/

also try
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/kits/index.html

There was a composite 3/4 p51 replica kit getting around from fighter escort wing and a few kits were being built here in oz, Conrad ? from crop jet in Wee Waa was building one but that was 10 or so years ago now.


What I want is a spitfire and if I can't have a real one this will do
http://www.supermarineaircraft.com/

[Squawk7700]

That one is a 350 Chev, built flown and owned by Jim Wickham of Tyabb, Vic. It's a 3/5th scale.

He also has a single seat Spitfire with Jabiru 6 cylinder.

The other one that you might be thinking of is the Titan Mustang. www.titanaircraft.com, it's a 3/4 scale Mustang, gross weight 56 kilo's. Finished cost around US$70 apparently with Rotax 912s. 130 knot cruise. I suspect Jim's aircraft is quite a bit quicker than that.

[Richo]

Ozzie Ozgood, was building one in Darwin. It was in the hanger with Roys Victa and some other homebuilts at the back of the Aviation Museum.

Used to see him down there reguarly until his wife died a few years ago, Ozzie was not all that well himself.

Not sure what happened to that machine or if it was completed, maybe one of two of the Darwin brigade will know.

richo

[Andy_RR]

This site should make you go oooh aahh!

http://www.seas.ucla.edu/~osmith/s51/

[nomorecatering]

Forget kits, Fluwerk in Germany are planning to new build P-51's. Now if a company in NZ can scratch build a Liberty V12 using new metalurgy and CNC machining processes etc. It runs and apparently is the real thing, puting out rated hp. Why can they do the same with a Merlin.

[Keg]

Is that the same mob in Germany who are doing the new build FW190? I think they were working with original jigs and everything. Even the serial numbers continued on from the WWII serials......now all I need to do is to find the link to it again! Long time since I've read it! :}

[Ultralights]

There is a nice P51 80% scale aircraft in my hangar at cessnock, powered by a Suzuki 4 cyl injected engine, looks fantastic, but talking to the owner, the kit is a nightmare to build....

[Andy_RR]

I think the reason for scaling these fighters is that the fuel bills also scale disporportionately.

I wouldn't want to have to fuel a Merlin, myself! :eek:

[OZFURYFAN]

Hi Richo,after Ossie passed away the Mustang was bequeathed to Roy,Nobby,& Trev.After a period of inactivity it was sold very recently to an engineer/pilot who lives near Gatton.It is already in Qld and he intends to finish it.Cheers,Pete

[aldee]

Ivan and Sandy Campbell in NZ are the Australasian agents for the titan t51 mustang,supermarine mk 26 b spitfire and fisher r 80 tiger moth.

Have seen both the tiger and the mustang flying,I think the mustang is around us70k + engine.

www.campbellaeroclassics.com (http://www.campbellaeroclassics.com)

[M14_P]

Yes there is also a private individual in Germany, who has had alot of assistance from Flugwerk who has built two full scale Fw190s, with 1200hp R1800 P&Ws. fantastic creation, it looks, sounds and I'd bet it flies just like the original, it is around half the weight of the original 190s too.

Get one of those.

The work those guys at Flugwerk in germany is nothing short of amazing. Not only do they have several new-build 190As with BMW radials, they have a Dora being built too. And further afield in the US White1 is being restored, with almost 100% original Fw190 components, also in the works is a Dora in similar condition regards originality. The folks that own that D-13 'yellow 13' (formally a part of the Champlin collection) could fly it, but have chosen not to as it is just too rare, being 99% original, but rebuilt to airworthy condition.
Great stuff, what I'd pay to see one fly.

[Kingswood]

Max, check out http://www.thundermustang.com/

Should the gods of lotto smile on me one evening, I'll be over to search out one of these beauties in a flash!

[maxgrad]

Thanks all.
All I can say is...DAMN!!....
Some very nice machinery there, Looked into the Supermarine Spit, would love to see one up close as I need more convincing re the look of the thing. Whereas the Mustangs seem to be more original shape. I read that the Spit handles pretty much like the real thing.
Now
How do I raise the $$?

[Pseudonymn]

Now
How do I raise the $$?

You could start by selling the kids... :E :} :E

[J430]

I keep trying.....no bidders......may end up being cheaper to pay someone to take them off you!:cool:

J:ok:

[Alistair]

This is probably the one you are looking for. http://www.thundermustang.com/

Have the volume up when you open the web page, they have a recording of the Falconer V12 at full song!

Performance wise it smokes the original below 15,000' or so (composite = lighter (no guns etc) and improved naca airfoil & smaller wing required due less weight), no blower so up higher it suffers. Although they were looking at putting a blower on it and some have been re-engined with turbine power.

Generally one of the faster normally aspirated aircraft at Reno (see www.bluethunderairracing.com )

Now if I could only find a buyer for the kids :p

PERFORMANCE Thunder Mustang {P51}

Rate of Climb @ gross 5200 ft/min {P51 2800 ft/min}

Maximum Level Speed @ Sea Level 326 kts (375 mph) {P51 326 kts (375 mph) 380 kts (437mph @ 25000ft.)}

Cruise Speed @ 75% Power 300kts (340 mph) 22-25 gph {P51 250 kts (300 mph) 50-75gph}

Range 1300 naut. mi. {P51 700 naut. mi. }

Service Ceiling 25,000 ft. {P 5146,000 ft. }

[Alistair]

Oh and this link confirms how quick it can be. Although the record was set in 2005.

http://www.aafo.com/racing/2005/thunder_mustang_records/

And for some aeros (Design Limit Load Factor +9g/-6g @ 2600 lbs, +7.3 g/-4.9g @ 3200 lbs )

http://www.thundermustang.com/images/movies/aerobatic.MPG

[Richo]

Thanks pete

Sad, I had not heard about Ozzies passing. Surprised that it did'nt get a mention on PPrune.

pass my best on to nobby, Roy and the unmarried one.

PS the FU4 must be getting close?

richo

[OZFURYFAN]

Nah,the F4U-5 is at least a couple of years away,the yanks are dragging their heels on the engine and the Corsair is so unique compared to other american types that commonality of basic parts is non existant.With regards to Ossie,I believe there was a post on Prune when he lifted off,regards,Pete

[Daqqy152]

http://www.flugwerk.de
http://www.flugwerk.de/fotos/061228/fw190/fw5.htm
http://www.flugwerk.de/fotos/061228/fw190/fw5.htm

[Hempy]

Yeah, the Thunder Mustang is a beast, 3/4 with a V12 racing boat donk;

here's some vids

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=me5cJyUma4Y Ardmore NZ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBslOEg44e8 Flypast

http://www.thundermustang.com/images/movies/fastclimb.mpg Climbout

[bodex666]

Been to the Spit factory in Brissie, its out past Kennmore (moggil hill area) The current spit is 80% but he has started on a 90% with wait for it...Dual controls !! The 80% has two seats but is a bit cramped in the back seat

[1mlt]

If you want the V-8 chevy powered version go to LegendaryAircraft.com. they have a composit 3/4 scale aircraft. Top speed is 300+. If you want an all aluminum aircraft go to TitanAircraft.com. lt is also 3/4 scale. It has a top speed of 197, cruise at 150mpm and uses a v6 Susuki or two versions of the Rotak motor. Both are tandem seat. My prefrence is the aluminum version. Much more forgiving. Stall is 39mph. There is a group in New Zeland who is a rep for them, but I don't have the web address. Hope this helps your search.

Both can be purchased with or w/o retracts.

[maxgrad]

1mlt
Thanks for that, I have emailed both the Thunder Mustang mob and Ivan Cambell last week to get some more info.
Like the idea of the racing boat engine in the thunder Mustang but the price and possible availability is a struggle. Don't know if you can put the Falconer 12 in the T51 or if room or W & B end s the idea there?

Ivan in NZ was super prompt with the reply and info. So far I have had nothing but great customer service from his company and good feedback from others.

Got the wife on side, now just got to get the $

It will happen, when is still to be arranged:ok:

[tinpis]

Yer always gonna be the one in the dinky toy P-51.

Why doncha build something useful like an RV4?

There a chap up here in Darwhine is an absolute ACE at building them.


Save some money and go hire a real P-51 in the States for an hour or two,youll get over it.

[the wizard of auz]

there you go again, ya old cynic. :}
why muck about with an RV4?. may as well get the far better RV8........... or then again, get a real airplane that doesn't come in a kit form.
I build and fly large model aircraft as a hobby, and I would rather buy an airplane that has manufacturer doing all the work, personally.

[maxgrad]

Had a look at the RV's and although I think they are great they just don't perk that much interest.
I will probably get some one (LAME) to build the thing for me as I keep getting flashbacks of Frank Spencer attemps at maintenance stuff.
Any T51 owners about want to tell us about them? Or let me have a go (even as a pax)?
Tinni
Love the "dinky toy P51" bit...classic:}


edited for dumb ass gramma:E

[tinpis]

Im a live old cynic. :ok:

Max contact the RV man in Darwhine hes not hard to track down.

[maxgrad]

old "live" cynic, will hunt this animal down and discuss r's and t's
Ta

You have to give me points for getting the missus on side though!

[tinpis]

Max not really sure but he was building a V8 RV earlier

He is the consumate RV and dinky toy hairyplane builder .:ok:

[Dixons Cider]

If you're going to weigh up an RV4 or 8, then have a look at this...
http://www.teamrocketaircraft.com/gall/gallery.html

F1 Rocket.

Evolved from the RV4. Absolute piece of work. 540 up front. Goes like a cut cat...doesnt need miles of blacktop...good for a yank and bank session.
What more could you ask for?

[Dixons Cider]

Ok so I'm a goose and cant post a picture :}

have a look here ... www.teamrocketaircraft.com

[slackie]

As has been mentioned before in this thread....the affordable option is the Titan Mustang but the kit leaves much to be desired...very lightweight, poor component design (nothing fits properly) and although advertised as a "first time builders kit" it really doesn't seem to be...and I wouldn't even toy with the thought of putting the Falconer V12 up front, it'd rip the aircraft apart!!
If you want a REAL toy then the Papa51 (Thunder Mustang) must be the ultimate...beats the original aircraft in every respect except weight...and a REAL V12 up front...trouble is you'll pay more than an authentic one to get one in your hangar.
Take a look at "Tiger's Blood" on http://www.kiwithunder.com

[Edited to get the link right]

[Floppy Link]

...the really affordable one is the Loehle 5151 www.loehle.com (http://www.loehle.com) - it'll give you the looks of a P51 but performance of a Cub. Wooden built, Rotax engine...
http://www.loehle.com/images/Customer_Gallery/Paul_1.jpg

Me, I want one of their P40s but in desert Air Force markings

[illusion]

This is the one- Queensland based:

http://www.supermarineaircraft.com/

[Brian Abraham]

Another option
http://www.teamrocketaircraft.com with a builders page http://www.docthrock.com

[maxgrad]

Had a rather strong feeling that the Titan was nowhere near that of a TM but am somewhat concerned at statements like,

"very lightweight, poor component design (nothing fits properly) and although advertised as a "first time builders kit" it really doesn't seem to be"

Makes me wonder at the viability of the machine.
Must admit the F1 Rocket is a nice bit of gear.

I initially looked at the Thunder Mustang,(for about 10 secs) before I started looking for a cheaper version but the old saying "you get what you pay for" is a strong indicator

[1mlt]

The Titan T51 is SUPPOSED to be a docile airplane and weight was a consideration. It was designed to have a wing load of 12, and a cruise of 150 on small engines. Everything I have been able to find on it says it is a super airplane, and does exactely what Williams designed it to do. The back seat looks a bit cramped though. OK, for the boss to ride in as she is pretty small. I don't know if a guy would fit very well. Granted, I have never seen one, but I find it hard to believe that it is a poorly designed fit and finish kit. Over 100 have been sold. The Legendary P51 is designed to be the Corvette version, whereas the Titan is the Camaro version. They don't compete with each other as the are not the same plane. Even if they do look alike. The Titan flies 150mph the Legendary flies 275mph. The L5151 appears to be a single seat only. Is that correct? The Thunder P51 is no longer in production from what I can tell. There are a few unfinished kits for sale, but this plane is a 300k kit and no support. That Supermarine is a beautiful plane and I bet the GM Isuzu V6 for it would wake up the Titan. Airframe would need a bit of boosting to handle it. I'd make bet it could get to the 225mph cruise range with a little wing and frame help from the factory. Now, if someone would make a 80% scale P51, you could capture the market.

[maxgrad]

1mlt
Thanks for that, most of it I knew, some I didn't. But alaways good to hear from others to build or disband ones own thoughts.

Methinks I must venture to sheep land to see it for myself, this was mentioned by the factory boss who as I have said has been extremely prompt with replies and open with info.

[HappyJack260]

I've seen and sat in the Titan built by Ivan Cambell; I've flown the Tiger replica he built and I use one of his helmets. His build quality is superb.

When I was there in November, he had four or five T-51's under construction for customers. I can't remember the pricing but if I was seriously thinking of getting a warbird scale replica I would get him to build one for me. I'm quite tempted by the 90% scale Spitfire he's building - put a GM V8 in it and it should go quite well.

Funnily enough, before flying his Tiger Moth replica I thought, "why would you bother with a replica?". After flying it, and going on to fly the real thing, I'm inclined to think, "why would you want the hassle of the real thing?"

[1mlt]

Pricing currently in the USA is 49,900.00 US dollars, no instruments, no motor, no PSRU. What is that in Pound Sterling about 90,000? I have no idea what the conversion rates are today, just a wild stab ...

Go to the USA web site and take a look titanaircraft.com
:O

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

"Pricing currently in the USA is 49,900.00 US dollars, no instruments, no motor, no PSRU. What is that in Pound Sterling about 90,000?"

More like 25,000 Pounds Sterling!

Dr:cool:

[tinpis]

P-40 looks like the park brake is on
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g173/gavsgt/GC_030036copy.jpg


and um...

http://www.myaviation.net/search/display_photo.file?filename=9/1/3/00982319.jpg&ZyXtCe=MDEwMTQ1&id=00982319&ViD=middle

[MCKES]

Have you checked out the 1/2 scale WAR replics search for it on google you could have your own WW2 battles in miniature!:}

[cf1950]

The Titan T51 Mustang 75% all metal kit build aircraft is in the UK and in the imported by Titan dealers Euro Aviation Ltd.It is in the process of being built at Rochester Airport,Kent,England.
It is an all metal,2 seat fully aerobatic aircraft with Rotax 912S engine, constant speed 4 blade prop,retractable undercarriage.

[MasterGreen]

A small syndicate of 'older' pilots have a T51 in progress at Ardmore, NZ. It is not an easy build and the basic kit leaves a lot of work if you want a finish and build quality anything more than basic. Originally the factory quoted 600 hours to complete; this was revised to 1600 hours a couple of years back. We are 1900 hours and counting, but we are trying to build a more maintainable, shiny version without the pop rivets.

There are some quite decent photos of the last year of build progress here :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - NZ Warbirds T... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/NZWarbirdsT51TitanSerial70)

We are using the Rotax 912 ULS and the standard 4 bladed CS prop and have a projected basic weight of 880 lbs which will allow this to comfortably fly as a microlight under NZ rules. At 12 lbs per HP and 11 lbs per Sq Ft she should perform quite nicely once the gear is up - we shall see. Certainly the 20L / Hour fuel flow is the consolation.

The biggest concern is CofG which naturally falls too far aft - no problem if you are using the manufacturer's MAUW of 1450 Lbs but as a ML at 1200 lbs this is a waste at best. 30-40 lbs of nose ballast is not really on, so we have taken the radiators out of the dog box and put them under the engine; where there is room for a single bed anyway. This mod scored another weight bonus as it dispensed with 4 x 13ft runs of tubing and associated fluids.

Size wise she is a squeeze in the back cockpit for a 6 footer, but we have dumped the center tank and used the space for a rear seat footwell and put the rear pedals there rather than alongside the front seat. It is now quite an acceptable perch for a 6+ footer without getting terminal cramp after 15 minutes. This also allowed slightly wider and more comfy seat pans.

The scale is 75% overall with 24.5ft wingspan. This is functionally identical to the Thunder's scale. So much so that we have used the 'dog box' mold from a Thunder for our underbelly scoop as it a better scale shape than that supplied - plus ours is now a lighter shell; not having to house anything other than an air ram for cockpit ventilation.

Currently we are looking at a Christmas roll out, but we are not betting on which Christmas :)

[OpsNormal]

MasterGreen. That sounds fantastic! Have you got any pics of your mods detailed in your post?:ok:

[maxgrad]

Mastergreen
Great photoes! Very interesting to see the build progress and the standard of the kit as is and your mods. Well done.
Were you happy with the kit condition? PM if you like

[Howard Hughes]

Great pictures MasterGreen and the workmanship looks second to none!:ok:

Just one question, does all the aluminium come pre-cut, or do you have to cut it yourself?

Cheers, HH.

[MasterGreen]

HH,
if you take the standard kit sheets then all the main body panels are cut to size / shape. However we wanted overlapping flush panel joints and ordered the sheets uncut. Even with the standard kit there is a fair bit of trimming and cutting to do. A lot of this is possible with shears /snips and a decent saw, but access to a 6ft+ guillotine would be a huge advantage. For a kit like this you will need a rash of decent tools whichever route you take and either budget for them or get access to them before considering it.

With no labour or tool costs our final butcher's bill is now pretty solid at around $165K NZ. That includes the Dynon EFIS/EMS; 286 GPS; Becker radio and level 3 transponder; twin head heated pitot (for AofA on the Dynon); compulsory sat beacon; LED strobes and position lights. The spreadsheet tells me we spent 15K on avionics alone - not bad for a microlight :)

If you were starting now you would need to add another 20K NZ to that as the kit has inflated from US$37500 to US54K+ and the Rotax gets no cheaper either. This is not a cheap homebuilt or an easybuild. However it is a charismatic microlight / LSA that will go upside down and +6/-4 and fly GH for 20 liters / hour.

There is a lot on conjecture about cruise speed, but I am hoping for 150 kts @ 75% / 16-18 lph with the solid rivets and very clean build. We shall see.

Keep your eye on the link above. Things will happen quite quickly now. All the infrastructure / wiring & plumbing is done and just the fuselage skinning and final assembly stands between this pile of assorted bits and a flying machine ....

MG

[slackie]

150kts might be a pipe dream...don't think the standard wing will do that....while it may LOOK like the Thunder (and 75% of the real thing) the wings are very different...would need MUCH grunt to pull a T51 to 150kts S&L me thinks!!:confused:

[MasterGreen]

Slackie,
well we shall see. The standard machine is quoted at 150MPH cruise on a Rotax 912 at 1450 lbs. I was hoping our flush solid rivets, super smooth surface, sealed control surfaces and 1200 lbs might do the conversion. I will let you know after Christmas :)

MG

[slackie]

Master...yeh I'd be interested to hear...JS's one in HN might come close with that rotary up front.

[tinpis]

Is there enough headroom in the cockpit for a parrot perched on the shoulder?:E

[Howard Hughes]

Any news on your project Master green?:ok:

[MasterGreen]

The tail feathers have caused a lot of work - there was a lot to do getting the elevators properly setup and balanced, but that is now done. The fuselage skinning is now proceeding reasonably well. This one and the B787 is going to be a race to flight test I guess. But remember building one of these is a journey - not a destination. When it is actually finished we may have to fly it and I am not sure if I can watch so much work get airborne without having a little lay down....

As an aside I brought myself an Avid Speedwing to use as the syndicate tailwheel trainer. This is a very useful machine. It is more than demanding enough to be an excellent TW revision aircraft, and is cheap to run (and buy). Actually it is a little bitch to fly nicely - hence the name - the Wattle Witch.

There are some ongoing cooling problems with the new 582 setup that I have identified as a mistake in the original cooling circuit that allow the RH radiator to vapour lock on climb out. I have just ripped all the hoses off her and tomorrow she gets a new cooling setup that will have the wet stuff going around in the correct direction. It is a wonder that she ever got 204 hours in her previous life with this setup, maybe the new engine is more demanding on the cooling capacity. Anyway there is nothing too hard here and it is a nice change to work on a live one :)

There are some photos here with explanatory captions :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - The Wattle Wi... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/TheWattleWitchAvidSpeedwingIV#)

MG

[Howard Hughes]

Thanks MG, that was quick! Please keep us updated.

Cheers,
HH.:ok:

[maxgrad]

Great work and explanations. Thankyou MG

[MasterGreen]

ZK-AKL is very close to completion now - we are doing final assembly of the fuselage and cockpit at the moment. Power will go on ship by next weekend. I had hoped to beat the B787 into the air, but I fear we will miss by a couple of months. Latest piccies tell the story here :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - NZ Warbirds T... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/NZWarbirdsT51TitanSerial70#)

I have also got my little Avid Speedwing flying to serve as the base trainer for the T51. She can be a total bitch to fly so the name of "Wattle Witch" seemed appropriate. Actually she is a pussycat if you know how to fly properly and know what your feet are for, but sadly I find that some who try - can't and don't ...

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - The Wattle Wi... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/TheWattleWitchAvidSpeedwingIV#)

Certainly getting our T51 syndicate members up to speed on the "Witch' is a good refresher of tailwheel microlight techniques and once they can fly her properly the Titan will be a simple conversion.

Enjoy the piccies and try not to drool on the keyboard thinking of those 1000's of solid rivets :)

Ken

[maxgrad]

Great photoes. now I am bloody green......

[Hempy]

Onya Ken :ok:

Makes me realise just how much work actually goes into one of these projects. Well done to all involved, I hope to see her in her natural element soon. Please keep us updated.

[MasterGreen]

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0014.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0003.jpg

Cowlings nearly complete. Power on ship in a couple of weeks... We will not beat the 787 into the air - but it will be close.

The whole photo album is here :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - NZ Warbirds T... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/NZWarbirdsT51TitanSerial70#)

MG

[jamie_duff]

What's the latest MG?

I like your cowlings. Did you wheel those yourselves? They are a great improvement on the kit items.

[MasterGreen]

Jamie,
we are firmly locked into the 90/90 rule - 90% completed and 90% to go. Having said that we are now going to beat the 787 to flight. The engine runs were satisfactory and the 912 fired up 2nd go - not bad for 4 years in a box. The cooling system mods (all the rads in the nose on a custom plenum) appears fine and I have now managed to get ALL the instruments working.

The engine mount extensions turned out easier than imagined - in fact I managed to upset our 'metal wizard' by asking when these would be fully incorporated. In fact they had been done for a while and they were so neat that I couldn't see them added to the stock mounting). A reverse compliment if there ever was one.

The cockpit is just about complete apart from labels - what a nightmare that is.. We have the canopy surrounds to finish and one aileron to rivet up. There was one aileron with a small 'factory damage' nick in the lower trailing edge that needed fettling - so that one was left behind the assembly process.

I managed to find some blade server fans - dual counter rotating 2" units - that solved the demister power beautifully. The undercarriage controller worked perfectly and took just 2 hours to wire up. Considering that it took me six months to R&D and develop it - that was (hopefully) expected.

Here are some more photos. We roll her out for final engine runs and taxi tests this weekend (18/09) and will hopefully send her to flight line mid November. Flight tests will take a couple of weeks - depending upon the weather. I have booked leave to do the performance testing, but I have implemented the Dynon data gathering software - so that will not take very long compared with a pencil and kneepad job.

The Wattle Witch is proving invaluable in doing the training and she is sorting out everyone's Tail Dragger skills nicely. No more flying in big boots around here - it's gym shoes or bare feet to keep this lady from wobbling :) The stock phrase seems to be - "If you can fly that bitch - you can fly anything", which is just what is needed really.

Oh and yes, all the cowls and panels were English Wheeled from flat stock. We had to use a slightly thicker, softer alloy on the cowls to achieve the curvature, but the results are stunning (if I say so myself) - even close up. The biggest problem we have with visitors is to keep their sticky hands off the rivet lines :)

All the piccies are here :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - NZ Warbirds T... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/NZWarbirdsT51TitanSerial70#)

Some teasers here ....


http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0010.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/controllerV3.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0025.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0016.jpg

MG

[DUXNUTZ]

Here ya go MAX,


MUSTANG P-51 • $40,000 • FOR SALE AGAIN • Stewart p-51 project, near complete, V12, reduced for quick sale, all serious offers considered, full details avail. must sell by months end.. • Owner - located Granchester QLD, Australia • Telephone: 61-0-407-448-414 . • Posted September 25, 2009 • Show all Ads posted by this Advertiser • Recommend This Ad to a Friend • Email Advertiser • Save to Watchlist • Report This Ad

[maxgrad]

Dux,
Definitely worth a look. very low price??

MG,
Looks like a great job being done by all. Thanks for the update.

[jamie_duff]

Looking great MG! Can you please tell me how the outer wings are attached? I assume this aircraft is not intended to be derigged often?

I am seriously considering the Titan T51 for my next project and the ability to fit the wings at or near the end would make it much more attractive. I would rather have the ability to do most of the work at home and move a near-complete aircraft by road to the airfield, as opposed to driving to the airfield to do all of the work...

Those cowlings really are beautiful!

[MasterGreen]

Jamie,
The outer wing panels are plugged in at the spar and secured by 4 bolts a side + rivets (as per plan, or screws / captive nuts in our case) around the skin join. It is a bit of mission, needing 3 people, but not a major problem. Wiggle / push / wiggle / bugger / back a bit .... etc. I have done worse on gliders.

As long as you make the required quick join provisions for the light / strobe cables and whatever in the wing it is possible to de- rig it in 30 minutes. The aileron push rods are one piece and can be disconnected at either end. The flaps are just a set of bolts along the trailing edge.

Wings off she is 8ft or so span. Each panel being another 8 ft = 24ft span.

One word of caution. We are close to 4000 logged hours on this sucker and God alone knows how many peripheral hours. To do a decent job you will need some seriously competent metal skills and a lot of patience. It CAN be assembled with basic tools and some help. As part of your research I would take a long look at the Yahoo group for the T51 - found here :

titanmustang : Titan T-51 Mustang Builders Group (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/titanmustang/)

There are lots of links, photos and observations there that will be invaluable. I would never do another one, in fact if I knew 4 years ago what I know now, I would never have started this one. Right now I am pleased I did, but building one of these is a once in a lifetime job. Satisfying when done, character building - definitely.

Costs - well I have just done the accounts up to yesterday. With the caveat that we brought the main components 4 years ago at way old prices and didn't spend too much on specialised equipment (since we have most of it in house). There are no hangerage costs in here either. The butcher's bill to date is NZ$143,412.04 exactly..... :D

MG

[MasterGreen]

Here she is fully assembled ready for engine runs this weekend. Horrid sodium lighting - but the effect is there...

MG

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0013.jpg

[MasterGreen]

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0067.jpg


The Tail Flies - T51#70 doing final engine runs and tailplane load / on ground pitch stability tests 31 Dec. She is running late - again - but we are ready for flight bar a lick of paint on the cowlings.

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0065.jpg

Full Piccies here :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - NZ Warbirds T... (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Ken.B.Smith/NZWarbirdsT51TitanSerial70#)

Movie of Growling Rotax here (it's on straight pipes :) :

T51 #70 Final Engine Runs on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/8288247)

First flight in a week ... It says here, but after all this time I am not in a hurry any more...

MG

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/CIMG0066.jpg

[maxgrad]

Damn nice!
The mods you have done upgrade the generally nice looking minny mus to a much better state.
nice job those men and women.

[Howard Hughes]

Looking good Master Green, if it were up to me all aircraft would be polished aluminium!:ok:

[Arnold E]

Stop farting about and build an RV:ok:

[Jabawocky]

Not everyone has good taste Arnold :}

That baby stang is a lovely looking kit machine! Well done! :D

[djpil]

Nice MasterGreen but I can't help thinking that the fin & rudder looks a bit small.

[Arnold E]

Hate to admit it Jabba, but it does look rather cool.:cool:

[27/09]

I hear that a very nice example of the Titan has just had it's first flight in NZHN. Mazda rotary powered I think. It looks very nice.

[Howard Hughes]

Mazda rotary powered I think.
You can't put a Jap engine in a Mustang!:eek:

[Jabawocky]

Last Mazda Rotary thing I saw ended up in a crumpled mess in the trees at YCAB :eek:.

Now I truly wish them lots of success, but I am not that brave!

Good point HH.....:=

[MasterGreen]

There is an outfit called Rotaryae who have / had some very promising rotary aircraft engines for the experimental / LSA market, but there are not open for business just now. I had been talking to them for some time, but the latest I got back was they had lost a lot of backing after the $meltdown. They are using licenced Mazda tip seals and and a total loss oil system.

That oil system was a major sticking point with the 'greenies' apparently but over a 50 hour cycle the oil use was less than half if you consider having to dump the old oil on change etc. Also no filter or cooler required. I thought that rather neat. Add to that a 3000 TBO and a 4 man hour strip down / rebuild and you have a promising engine...

A pity since they could deliver 125HP normally aspirated twin rotor units for the same weight as a Rotax 912 (inc PSRU) for half the price. Or a Turbo version for a little more weight and a good deal more poke. Very nice specs - I can only hope they get going again. The web site no longer has the blurb, but I do have a copy and here it is as of 6-9 months ago :

MG

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/rotaryae.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv153/terciops/rotaryae2.jpg

[27/09]

You can't put a Jap engine in a Mustang Yep but it's quite OK to put in an Austrian one with a German heritage though. :hmm:

I hear the NZHN one has 190 HP up front using the Mazda Renesis engine.

[MasterGreen]

Well the T51 serial 70 flew on the 9th March 2010. After 4 years building she flew very nicely. The CSU didn't - so speed was restricted by RPM, but that is a simple fix. The first flight was a gear down, couple of circuits anyway. No handling issues, no cooling issues - nothing fell off :) What more can you ask for ?

25 hours of flight testing / proving ahead for certification and she is done. I am looking forward to the flight testing as I am very keen to get some solid performance numbers on this (basic) T51 powerplant setup and see if our 'clean' airframe will give us a performance improvement relative to the amount of extra work involved. I doubt it - but she sure looks nice.

If the next few flights prove the cooling system is sound - it is a novel approach with both radiators up front in a 'managed flow' scoop - then we will not need to make any mods to the cowl openings and that final bit can have some paint.

So that is the end of the build phase, 4 years / 4500 man hours aghhhhh. Hopefully we can now get down to some flying...

Now about that 1/2 scale Mosquito :)

Movie at VIMEO.COM - search for T51 Mustang Ardmore. I have only just uploaded it, so I don't know what the quality is like. I will replace it on the same tags if it is a dud.

Unfortunately I was not there to see the first flight as I am up to my armpits doing the test acceptance on a new 777-300 CAE 7000 Sim. Never mind I will get my hands on it this weekend....



MG

[M14_P]

Hey folks,

No one has mentioned Gilles Kupfer's Focke Wulf Fw190D-9 replica. Utilising the legendary M14P 9cyl Radial. This thing is unbelievable. Was over at Wanaka doing a bit of flying over the last few days and had a good looksey and a yarn with him. It will be on static display this Easter at the airshow and he will be selling kits from next year. This is by far the best replica I have ever seen. It looks right, and it flies right, and it sounds right!

www.gilles-kupfer.com (http://www.gilles-kupfer.com)

[gardcycl]

:{I Have the ideal project for you, spent a ****load, nearing completion, still instrumention and fuel lines to go, and selling far too cheap can call me 0417646838 if still interested

[Arnold E]

http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/boohoo.gifI Have the ideal project for you, spent a ****load, nearing completion, still instrumention and fuel lines to go, and selling far too cheap

Why??:confused:

[MasterGreen]

The old adage that a build is always 95% complete and only 95% to go is almost certainly true. After her first flight last year I had to ground her for months while we sorted out issues with fuel leaks and many minor niggles. After 7 hours of flight testing the prop proved troublesome and had to have new blade bearings. But that is all behind us now. (I hope).

The final basic weight was 951lbs and she is effectively a single seat microlight unless you are thin and your passenger is anorexic. However a single seat at 1200lbs MAUW is a good place for this one as the performance is rather nice there. At 1450 she would be a bit of a slug and 1850lbs doesn't bear thinking about.

I have done all the testing myself and she flies remarkably well for 100HP. Very responsive and light on the controls. Not the fastest thing I have ever flown, but she certainly is slick for 100HP. Sitting in the big bubble is the nearest thing to being on the 'Magic Carpet' I have come across yet in 45 years of aviation.

Latest piccies here :

Picasa Web Albums - Ken - T51 #70 - Pos... (http://picasaweb.google.com/Ken.B.Smith/T5170PostBuild#5566699278556566242)

I have the drag polars worked out for this airframe at 1200lbs and the HP/IAS figures are interesting. - the basic table is below although I am not sure if the formatting will come out well off of excel....

Speed kts Speed MPH HP lph US Gal MPH/HP HP/MPH
Baseline
120.0 138.0 75.0 18.8 7.1 1.84 0.54
111.4 128.1 60.0 15.0 5.7 2.14 0.47
114.4 131.6 65.0 16.3 6.2 2.02 0.49
117.3 134.9 70.0 17.5 6.6 1.93 0.52
120.0 138.0 75.0 18.8 7.1 1.84 0.54
122.6 141.0 80.0 20.0 7.6 1.76 0.57
125.1 143.9 85.0 21.3 8.0 1.69 0.59
127.5 146.6 90.0 22.5 8.5 1.63 0.61
129.8 149.3 95.0 23.8 9.0 1.57 0.64
132.1 151.9 100.0 25.0 9.5 1.52 0.66
134.2 154.4 105.0 26.3 9.9 1.47 0.68
136.3 156.8 110.0 27.5 10.4 1.43 0.70
138.4 159.1 115.0 28.8 10.9 1.38 0.72
140.4 161.4 120.0 30.0 11.4 1.35 0.74
142.3 163.6 125.0 31.3 11.8 1.31 0.76
144.1 165.8 130.0 32.5 12.3 1.28 0.78
146.0 167.9 135.0 33.8 12.8 1.24 0.80
147.8 169.9 140.0 35.0 13.3 1.21 0.82
149.5 171.9 145.0 36.3 13.7 1.19 0.84
151.2 173.9 150.0 37.5 14.2 1.16 0.86
152.9 175.8 155.0 38.8 14.7 1.13 0.88
154.5 177.7 160.0 40.0 15.1 1.11 0.90
156.1 179.5 165.0 41.3 15.6 1.09 0.92
157.6 181.3 170.0 42.5 16.1 1.07 0.94
159.2 183.0 175.0 43.8 16.6 1.05 0.96
160.7 184.8 180.0 45.0 17.0 1.03 0.97
162.1 186.5 185.0 46.3 17.5 1.01 0.99
163.6 188.1 190.0 47.5 18.0 0.99 1.01
165.0 189.8 195.0 48.8 18.5 0.97 1.03
166.4 191.4 200.0 50.0 18.9 0.96 1.05
167.8 192.9 205.0 51.3 19.4 0.94 1.06
169.1 194.5 210.0 52.5 19.9 0.93 1.08
170.5 196.0 215.0 53.8 20.4 0.91 1.10
171.8 197.5 220.0 55.0 20.8 0.90 1.11
173.1 199.0 225.0 56.3 21.3 0.88 1.13
174.3 200.5 230.0 57.5 21.8 0.87 1.15
175.6 201.9 235.0 58.8 22.2 0.86 1.16
176.8 203.4 240.0 60.0 22.7 0.85 1.18
178.1 204.8 245.0 61.3 23.2 0.84 1.20


MG

[Andy_RR]

...

Now about that 1/2 scale Mosquito :)

...


EAA News - 3/4-Scale de Havilland Mosquito Project to Fly Soon (http://www.eaa.org/news/2010/2010-12-02_mosquito.asp)

http://www.eaa.org/news/2010/images/ScaleMosquito1.jpg

[harvey6]

I have it on good authority that Terry Kronk's Mustang replica is nearly ready for its first flight, and the scale Mosquito is well underway at his hidden Emu Works facility.....

http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x429/spacewalker2/P1040056Large.jpg

http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x429/spacewalker2/P1050666Large.jpg

[MasterGreen]

The airtesting on our T51 is now completed and she flies just fine.

Piccies here :


https://picasaweb.google.com/Ken.B.Smith/T5170PostBuild#5577914525073368674

MG

[Howard Hughes]

Truly magnificent piece of work MG!:ok:

[flyinkiwi]

JS and co have put a lot of time into their Renesis powered T-51. There were a lot of engineering challenges to overcome and I believe they are still working on a few niggles.

I was fortunate enough to be out at the airport last weekend and saw JS flying it around the circuit. It doesn't sound like a mustang, but it sure goes like one! They did an excellent job of the finish too, it looks stunning. Wish I had my camera with me at the time but I had left it at home. :ugh:

[maxgrad]

Fantastic finish, well done.
Where is that damn money tree!