Beware! The Kiwis are coming.

[harry the cod]

Morning all

Not a regular poster by any means but this is hot off the press. On good authority from a friend in EK recruiting. Shortly, if not already, off to the land of the long white cloud along with management to invite F/O's AND DEC's from Air New Zealand to come up here for a year or two and enjoy the sunshine. A few quick phone calls reveals some truth in this so perhaps this 'rumour' network is not the place to post. :rolleyes:

What may be just a rumour, however, is that many of these volunteers will only have flown 73's locally and are now being offered the chance to see the big friendly World out there from the 'comfort' of the left seat on a B777. I emphasise the word comfort because these guys will still be ANZ employees and thus have union protection in the unlikely event of a mishap in the shiny new toy. Interesting to see how the roster bidding will work as will be the accom provided/allowance given. Or perhaps the number of firm return tickets they can use per year to pop home for a week or two!

I don't wish to stoke a fire when one's not yet lit but there is smoke coming from somewhere. I still find this hard to believe when we have over 15,000 applicants banging on the door to get in............or is it 1500 banging on the door to get out?

Regards

Harry

[six7driver]

but isn't it a condition of getting on with EK either DEC or FO that you have to resign your current job, no leaves accepted?

[BYMONEK]

From the original post it sounds as though we may be getting contract pilots but not sure how that would work. Too much of a minefield if you ask me. Licences, Air law, training, DEC's, etc etc.........and don't even mention the U word!

Can't see it happening to be honest but there again....................

[Thylakoid]

I believe the latter being more appropriate (1500 banging ...):}

If that is true, bad news! I am sick and tired of finishing the DECs line training for nothing:=

[fo4ever]

I will be absolutely disgusted with any ANZ pilot that come over on a contract. That would be pissing on everyone including their own principles.

Enjoy a few years here while covered by their own union, pension and LOL scheme.

Question to the ANZ pilots:

How would you feel if I came over to you and jumped the seno list to enjoy a few years of flying and skiing. That would never happen!!!!

I could say no to **** flights because I would be leaving shortly anyway.

Absolutely disgusting.

Shame on EK for doing this

fo4ever (now for ever and ever)

[GoreTex]

I understand the kiwis are getting bored of shagging their sheep but the locals here are very jealous and would never let them touch their beloved camels

[CAYNINE]

Marvellous!!!!

Why not give them a bonus as well, new sheepskin seat covers and an set roster to all the good destinations....

How many resignations do you think will happen with this wise decision...?

Gone past even thinking about the future of the company with this sort of news

[Check 'Six']

Well? if they are coming out on contract, then their salary will be different. Plus they will probably be on a ticket confirmed home, every month. Just like Korean, Vietnam etc... First official commuters in EK or even our first basing. Even though they actually dont work for EK.

Interesting developments folks. Very interesting.

Check your Six!!

[Gillegan]

Well the precedent has been set. We now have contract simulator instructors that are making much more than the company's training captains. It seems that the company is more than willing to adequately compensate mercenaries on a short term contract - but when it comes to rewarding long time employees............(the silence is deafening).

[Marooned]

And why would EK even consider this, bearing in mind it is by no means certain?

Instead of making EK the 'wannabe' airline of choice, the short term economics of 'cut backs' and 'go cheap' has drawn blood. Long term it has been divisive and destructive with fleet transition restrictions, DECs and now contract pilots? It has failed to attract the pilots it needs and pulled in pilots it would never have even interviewed a few years ago... even worse it has offered some of them commands.

Training costs have gone up with extended training and outsourcing. Experienced pilots have left costing the company even more whilst those replacing them do not even turn up for courses.

We had every opportunity to make EK a very attractive, long term career. Instead 'the company' has let it slide into an average expat, short term stepping stone which will essentially make EK a training airline for the foreseeable future for other airlines to poach.

The oxymoron of 'EK management' has led us to the more expensive of any of the options they could have chosen. The egocentric nature of the company will ultimately be the stranglehold that prevents it from expanding to the size it aspires to.

600+ aircraft TC? Retire asap, you've lost it.

[yachtno1]

Don't blame pilots for accepting work, blame your company for offering it !:=

[Marooned]

yachtno1

I don't & I do. It is the company, who ever it is, who is 100% to blame.

FUEK.

[Jackson Bombay]

I hope that the ANZ union will not allow this to happen, as you can be sure they would not let it happen the other way round i.e. Us going there.

Any ANZ pilot is welcome here if they resign from ANZ first like most but not all (some have jobs waiting at home SAS, Uk charter etc) of us had to and join as an F/O on what ever fleet needs them.

P.s can you imagine what would happen if they offered a current B737 capt at ANZ a 2 year contract at Ek as a B777 Capt and he/she didn't even have the DEC hours!

[Kamelchaser]

Guys, (and girls)..time to calm down a little about this. Yes, AirNZ has been to Dubai to talk to EK about employing ANZ pilots. EK's response was, and still is, "on the same terms and conditions as everyone else who is applying"
(at least that's today's response). EK is even considering one of their famous "roadshows" down to Aoteoroa to flush out the willing.
However, talk of different contract conditions, tickets home every month etc is a bit sensationalist.
Don't get me wrong; while I have a lot of mates who I'd like to see up here for a few beers, I don't agree with bringing people here whose positions are union protected back at AirNZ (and of course we can't go there and jump the queue) But realistically this is no different to the SAS, US, Canadian guys (and perhaps others) who are here on the short term plan, waiting for the call-back from their legacy carriers.
I see today AirNZ announced plans for increased services to Shanghai, Hong Kong and the Pacific, so maybe it won't even happen.
So, don't get your blood pressure up over some of the sensationist rumours..just more of the same EK b**s**t for the FOs to put up with.
Instead...visit www.adultsheepfinder.com for a bit of light hearted entertainment if, like me, you miss those lovely little balls of fluff we call baaaabaaaaraa.:O

[Gillegan]

Guys, (and girls)..time to calm down a little about this. Yes, AirNZ has been to Dubai to talk to EK about employing ANZ pilots. EK's response was, and still is, "on the same terms and conditions as everyone else who is applying"
(at least that's today's response). EK is even considering one of their famous "roadshows" down to Aoteoroa to flush out the willing.
However, talk of different contract conditions, tickets home every month etc is a bit sensationalist....
But realistically this is no different to the SAS, US, Canadian guys (and perhaps others) who are here on the short term plan, waiting for the call-back from their legacy carriers.
While I agree that we are perhaps getting a bit worked up over a rumour that may not happen, such is the company that we work for that people tend to expect the worst. To summarize (not a complete list by any means):
-DEC's - "No commands will be delayed"
-DEC's - "No one will be brought in on a higher scale than a first year captain"
-Pay Adjustment (2 years ago) - "Cost Neutral"
-Pay Raise - "To be effective from January 1st with another raise in May"
-Training - Contract training captains making more than EK Training Captains.
-Rosters - "We will retain the credit for the balancing of time and to produce reasonable rosters"

The fact is that we have been lied to so often and so frequently that most fully expect them to do something like bring in ANZ guys on better T&C's than what we have. I hope they don't and you are certainly correct in pointing out that we're getting our knickers in a twist a bit prematurely.

As far as the guys with recall rights at the above carriers, at least they are coming here on the standard T&C's and seniority (sic). Should the ANZ guys come under those conditions, I really wouldn't have a problem with that. Commuting rosters, extra trips home or quick commands would be another story.

It is even more bizarre that now that the consequences of their actions are beginning to manifest themselves in increasing resignations and difficulty in recruitment, they don't seem to doing anything to change. Perhaps someone should start a thread where we can just list (dispassionately if that is possible) the lies, half-truths and other changes that we have had these last 5 years.

[six7driver]

Aren't the terms of employment at EK that you have to give up "RESIGN" your current job to get a job with them??? Do I understand that EK has accepted people on LOA's or furloughs from other employers, and if this correct where's the proof..??? just curious because TC document I saw for FO's this is not the case, anyone care to prove me wrong???

[ironbutt57]

Didnt it already happen to the Kiwi's themselves decade or so back the company brought in Tower (shonky) Air on a wet lease and a **** fight ensued..got on t.v. and all sorts of nasty things

[BusyB]

I think you'll find that with furloughed pilots their companies ignore any resignation letter and wait until 2 refusals.:)

[Gravox]

Yes Emirates will be doing a Road Show to New Zealand to talk to ANZ pilots about options for employment.

Leave Without Pay (LWOP) is not being offered to B737 drivers (yet). It mainly affects the B767 guys and girls, and perhaps a couple of bus drivers.

I know Etihad are also interested and may be coming down this way for a chat.

I don't know any of the terms and conditions.

Don't shoot the messenger, this is all that I know, and I feel for you guys, it seems unfair that they can leave ANZ for a period, and return to their old jobs when they have had enough of the sandpit.

[yachtno1]

I took a year off without pay from BA and worked for Air New Zealand. Never had a problem!:)

[Convict]

The deal is LWOP. Go up and do the selection process and start as a day one FO. Not sure of the interest level though. Life is good in Sheepshagger land.

[yachtno1]

tp 2004-2005