QR Payrise or just rice...

[Spirit1]

What to do. What to do:rolleyes:

[knotaloud]

Stop it you guys! Haven't you heard? You are knot aloud to say anything bad about QR or they'll 'spit the dummy' and sue prune.

PATHETIC!:*

[salamalikum2]

After Emirates, it is confirmed(from a reliable source in Etihad) that there, as well salary increase is coming(figure not yet published), just wondering what will be the reaction of Q.A. Are they going to remain blind to the problem they are facing(let the good and experienced guys leaving the company) .

Just would like to advice or fellow management that Etihad has plenty of Qatar airways pilots application...!(from a very reliable source as well inside Etihad..):hmm:

[Qatari515]

You want to hear something funny?

Our management knows all this, they are fully aware of everybody wanting to go there ( even the names involved) and they know the othe packages inside out!

Even the CEO knows it, I overheard him raving about it last week!

But hey, probably they are all too busy covering up for each other....Some very dirty games will be disclosed soon....

Ans a susual...QR just continues to puff along...

[Goat Liner]

I got a feeling its gonna be a long summer guys...new airplanes coming every month, rosters getting worse and from what I hear less guys showing up for courses. Who can blame them? Take a look at http://www.willflyforfood.cc/Qatar_Airways_interview.php to see how our wonderful recruitment team interview new joiners. Plus the rents here have officially gone beyond a joke. Paying 3000 USD for a shoddy excuse for a villa and my landlord said its gonna increase by ten percent in the next few months. Great!
CVs are in the mail.

[Chowdhury]

Don't believe anything until it actually happens! Also be prepared it could disappear as sudden as it comes!

As for backstabbing, no news, or should I say old news?

Chowdhury

[loc22550]

Take a look as well at www.etihad.com

just ckeck the new package from them...basic salary for F/O has been increased by more than 7000 riyals(24500) +500 riyals annual increase!...interesting.(plus the house or appartment!!!).Flight allowances are less,but still much more attractive...Not good...for Q.A...:ouch:

[popay]

Mama mia, this is good indeed!! just to place a correct link
I'm telling ya those guys EK EY QR are gonna ruin each other financially and we will enjoy the benefit. I have no doubt QR will come up with something similar. Doesn't look like they can agree upon keeping the wages down. Good for us.
There isn't even a antitrust bureau in the ME. What for??? They are too proud to agree:D :D :D :D :D
http://careers.etihadairways.com/ehire/english/careers/jobDetails.aspx

[ETIHAD]

ETIHAD NEW AND ENHANCED (different way to skin a cat) PACKAGE is re-formulated so it looks better on paper to attract new pilots. The only new addition is the meal allowance, otherwise it is i pretty much the same as before. Annual increments is fixed at 700 AED Capt. /500 AED F/O, this equates to merely 2% or 1 1/2 % with flight pay included.
This is hardly enough to attract new pilots or retain old pilots, I am afraid we will loose even more pilots now that it is all clear that there is no goodwill and one-way street only in this company. :D :D :D :ugh:

[popay]

ETIHAD, no offense man but you've been given a bag of gold and you're complaining about carrying it. Now lets compare it how much is the pay for an F/O at EY flying 85 BH or 130 FDP it's somewhere around 29740 an average, if I'm correct. That amount excludes housing right?
QR F?o flying the same will have around 32200 that including 6500 housing. In other words he/her is effectively making 25700 a month or 4000 QR more. Besides you wage is better structured higher basic. Try not to fly and you will see. Anyway guys good for you.

[ETIHAD]

Popay, I am not sure I agree with your goldteory. Now down to pay: F/O flying 85 hour will take home 27900 AED. No extra for FDP. Before this new package he would have flown around 20-22 duty days to achieve the same 85 hour and the pay would have been between 25900-26800 AED that is about 4 % increase. My point is not the pay, it is how the company went on and on about the NEW AND ENHANCED PACKAGE and in the end it is just another way of paying the same. One good thing as you mentioned, is that the fixed pay is somewhat higher and that allow me to take a month leave without having to overlap months so I can maintain my commitments to the banks.

Now where did i put my Jet/Vietnam/Kingfisher/China Eastern and Korean application again.:D

[popay]

EY hockay my flenda lets do the math again:
EY package
basic 24500
flying 85 BH 3400
meal all. average 1000
housing 9583
____________________
lump sum of 38483

QR package
basic 15500
flying 85 BH 7650
meal all. av. 1000
housing 8100 (including utilities transportation furnishing etc)
______________________
lump sum of 32250


La difference 6233 doing the same job. Questions?????

No problems with me I can swap today...

[EasyGo-Lucky?]

Also conveniently forgotten.

Someone has just highlighted the fact that if you were to remain a First Officer for 10 years at Etihad, highly unlikely with the present upgrading, then your end of service benefit has just increased by approximately AED 88,650 not exactly a small amount.

[THRCLB]

wow
in ek
basic 22135
telephone 22
utilities 9430
ttl 31587
and that for an FO 4 years in the company :rolleyes:

[popay]

THRCLB, hi man. We gotta compare apples with apples and not bananas.
Your calculation doesn't contain housing whereas QR and EY does.
EasyGo-Lucky? well that's of course a big issue? However I find it hard to believe cause I know for sure that guys who left for EY got their upgrade after about a year. However that all might have changed.
To wrap it up:
It's either the money or the career. The airlines will have to make their choice either to keep rising the wages or to offer the career like many of the European low cost do. I'm afraid there's nothing in between.
Despite all that logic I'll just keep on pressing the buttons in my bus and be a happy bus driver.

[EasyGo-Lucky?]

Popay

If you are upgraded whilst at Etihad then your end of service benefit has just increased beyond the additional AED88,650 mentioned. It was just worked out based on an F/O with 10 years service for ease of calculating.

[THRCLB]

popay hi man
utilities 9430( is the housing allowance)in ek they do it differently:cool:
and that exclude the 6% pay rise....

[loc22550]

After 10 years as F/o in Etihad your basic will be almost 30.000 riyals(500 annual increase)...
in Qatar airways......16300!!!!!(15500+800)....:ugh: :ugh: \
Good job Etihad!
Happy i have booked my assessment there..

[loc22550]

..yes i think it´s in the interest of Q.A. to react immediatly...not in 6 months...it will be too late...

[Cpt. off the hook]

loc22550 my dear don't be so sure you will get an assessment day cause I tell you a big secret. The chief commander went personally to AAH and tried to arrange the QR pilots not to be taken. He apparently succeeded but that is not going to prevent people from leaving.
Silly boys.

[gnadirs]

when is somebody going to stop these people....

Modern day slavery....IT DOES EXIST!

But as you said...this is not going to stop people from leaving...


Its a free world outthere....

[Qatari515]

Euhhh...maybe its time you get your facts straight...

Easyjet: Capt 10000 euro/month
FO 6500 Euro/month

Ryanair: Capt 11000 euro/month
FO 6500 euro/month

Thats just to name some LoCo operators

Main carrier salaries are the same as in the Gulf when you calculate all the perks like retirement, profit sharing etc...


There are many contracts around as well

When you can get a place with the big boys in Asia you will earn more on the long run but than again, flying there is not everyones cup of tea either.

But europe is changing. And if you have good experience on the types they are looking for you can have the same money with a much better lifestyle. Dont let the cash in hand trap of the Sandpit carriers fool you...

[Qatari515]

Hi there.....


If I am corect a captain at EZ goes home ( after tax) with about 10000 euros....That is off course when he is working.

Safety.....I would not be too sure about that. Just pay a visit to our gatekeepers and listen to the stories they have to tell! The standard at QR is appaling at the moment due to the fast expansion!
Pilot levels dropping, training dept flooded with work, no experienced instructors around, no standardisation and QC, maintenance not done properly due to low downtime of planes, no management structure etc....
Most of the gulf airlines ( QR and EY being the first ones) are accidents waiting to happen!
When you are at the flight safety office, ask about the loadsheet incident we just survived!

Jobsecurity: I agree with you....if you do as asked ( including flying around illegally, against regulations etc) you will not loose your job! QR will not go bankrupt!

A hull loss will close it down though!

[thebeast]

Ryanair:
FO 6500 euro/month

wow what am i spending my money on!!!

i must be out of touch or is there 3 euros to the pound these days?

[popay]

Qatari515 hi there.
Cancel all after good morning! It's still valid 10K. It was in the plans but hasn't been changed yet but could be the case anytime. Sorry for not correct information.
I recon THE job for the time being is CX.

[loc22550]

Cpt off the hook...right somebody from Q.A. went to Etihad..in order to ask the name of Q.A.pilots who applied to Etihad(i think more than 30...):ugh: Why?? still i don´t known! Since when a Q.A. pilot is not allowed to apply elsewhere....?????
Off course Etihad refused to give those names...

[ramiyns]

loc22550,You better make your move sooner rather than later,cos there is no payrise,It's just Rice.
There suppose to be a meeting with the CEO this month,So far there is no sign of that happining.:ugh:

[loc22550]

OOh.. thanks for the advice Ramiyns..!:)

[salamalikum2]

Not a good news if there is no salary increase...oh i´m not talking about money(although a big issue here), BUT S A F E T Y...yes a lot a good and experience pilots will continue to leave..:bored: as a consequence Q.A. will have to quickly hire new (cheap) pilots, put them quickly in the sim..in order to make sure no aircraft in grounded...and them you end up with CPT who doesn´t have any clue of what´s going around....
This remind me one of last Sim check, where the CPT was barely able to handle the aircraft with (just) one egine failure,and almost put a wheel in the grass during the landing,being well outside the safety enveloppe during final approach....Result: Passed..of Course..Not comment from the TRE,NO debriefing,NO remarks!!!!
VERY VERY WORRIED!!
(oh i forgot..this captain was flying for more than 30 years, with big experience on Airbus)
MIster AAB, HOPE you will stop to ignore the problem pilots are facing quickly, before your 5 stars airline end up in the first page of all newspaper!!
Being optimist is good but some time it´s better to be realistic!

[tuan74]

:sad: ...What happened to the rice...?

Looks like people in QR has stop talking about the pay rise...
Sick & tired with too many rumours probably..:ooh: :ooh: :ooh:
Hahaha..exactly what AAB wants...

[tuan74]

Think it's not really 'BAD' pilots, they're just probably having a 'BAD' day.:\ :\

I mean come on, don't tell me none of us ever had that particular day when everything you do doesn't work at all. It so happened (maybe) during the sim cx.

Had once before (in my previous company) did a trng for this one F/O.. 1st day everything was excellent, 2nd day... I felt like failing him straight away. If I didn't take him on the 1st day, I would probably think he's really BAD...but after further consultation found out he got some unsettled problem back home.

Don't think I can judge pilots with only one or two flight with 'em. Bad or good.. it's actually a subjective matter. Hey..even a seasoned ace pilots can't make a super duper greased landing all the time...:rolleyes:

Cheers..

[loc22550]

Just Wondering why they told people who came for interview that they gone have a new package,even to people who resigned more than 6 months ago......just the carrot.....
By the way i think few guys just make a quick turnaround in Q.A, after being told during interview about the increase, they discovered when they joined the company that they will be no increase...they just resigned after a couple of weeks:D :D Congratualtion to them!

I just hope soon the Sh.. will hit the face of those people who play like that with the crew,that's really the only think they deserve,nothing else!

[tuan74]

Aaaahhh...now I can't decide...take the insult first or have the expired foods..:ugh: :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[piper 606]

Pls think of your future.

Dont spoil your life.

Take my piece of advice beware of QR.

But still decision is yours.

Good Luck

[piper 606]

It will be a RICE.

Maybe if you have WASTA u can get a MEAL not just a RICE.

Sukhhhrann...

Piper 606

[Qatari515]

I just hope they would get this bloody meeting over with!

7 month they have been playing with our feet by now!

New joiners where PROMISED a 25% increase during their interviews. I hope they will get it! One thing I know, lots of them will leave ASAP in case this promise is broken!

The same goes for the loyal workforce allready in place....The rumours could fester for such a long time that expectations are so high right now that anything less than a 25% increase will be experienced as a dissapointment!

And when you look at it, the last payrise was 2 years ago. In a country with 12% inflation a year a 25% payris barely covers this loss!
So this is NOT a payrise, in the real world they would call it a salary correction....

Knowing our management a bit, I would be very surprised if we got a 25% increase anyway! They would rather die than to give something like this to the almighty group of mercenary pilots!

Lets see when the 4th approaches....Ill believe it on the day itself! Just a shame that there is no nice bar in the sheraton....4 seasons is much better for that purpose!

No applause/no diner for me though.....Been there/done that...NEVER AGAIN!:yuk:

[piper 606]

Heya QTR515,

It seems u have a very very very long patience.

However GoodLuck it seems you like CAI so much????

Or CAI is very memorable to u?

Yr using QR Flight number...anyway I just notice that no big deal.

However extend my regards to A7-ADS and A7-ADT aircrafts ...

I miss that 02 aircrafts...aslo memorable to me.


Cheers

[tuan74]

We got new one now...A7-ADU

[loc22550]

The best wise advice: Don´t attend this meeting, unless you like to be insult off course....
If ABB faces an empty room,than the insult will be for him this time not for us!

[Goat Liner]

Have I missed it or has this meeting on the 4th been officially announced somewhere. Not that I'm planning to attend but just wanted to know wether this is part of the hundreds of rumours I've been hearing since last september.

[piper 606]

4th of April will creat history to QR.

Im hoping that it will be a GOOD HISTORY for the benifit of STAFF not for MANAGEMENT.

So prepare for SUPRISES...

Cheers

[piper 606]

new fleet thats gud.

That will be good gift for QAS...

Another headache for PARKING BAY Allocation.

Cheers

[tuan74]

Confirm date is on the April 5th...in Sheraton.

Wonder what "SURPRISE" are waiting for us......:sad: :sad: :{ :{

[tuan74]

Hey piper606..were you flying with QR before..? Just curios..your thread sounds like you're a pilot but why is this then..?
Heya,
Can anyone can give an idea how/where i can get CPL in the Philippines?
Also is there is flying school in Philippines?
Also approx how much is the cost?
Thanks-Piper 606
A bit confused now....:confused:

[superman_32]

It is on the web site they are now in south america recruiting.

[A300Man]

Hi Piper and Tuan,

Off topic but FTR, A7-ADU is an A320, whereas Delta Sierra and Tango are 321's.


A300Man

[loc22550]

Sh...nothing mentioned about free dinner this time...:uhoh:

[tuan74]

Yeah..somebody please post it on the youtube...:} :} that should be fun to watch (since I'm not gonna waste my time going there..)

So how much you guys think he's going to give us..? 40%..:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Qatari515]

Rumours....again.


Capt:

Basic: 30000Qr
Housing: 12000Qr


FO:

Basic: 20500QR
Housing: 10000QR


So all in all....for everybody about 10000QR increase ( housing included!)


To be confirmed but rather sure about it!

[piper 606]

Tuan,

I am not a pilot.:=

In general PILOT needs me to fly.;)

Dont be curious.

Yes Am part of the team who helps QR when they started with 05Aircrafts.

But dont worry I am not AA fanatic, instead one of his critics.:ok:

Piper 606

[piper 606]

Heya,

Always be hopeful....

update us if its true.

Goodluck

Piper 606

[tuan74]

Hi Piper,

Thanx for the clarification...:cool:

Aaaahhhh...countdown has begun...pretty sure every pilots in QR is crossing their fingers right now. Don't really care about the insult so much (kin'da get used to it by now..):ugh: :ugh: :ugh: What important is the out come..

If it's not up to expectation...there will be much frustation piling up & eventually might led to....:oh: :oh:

[Black Stain]

I feel swamped by stupidity right now. It seems we pilots really are simpletons....

Are we puppets on string? Do all real puppets feel the urge to dance no matter what music is played??

Question Time:

Do you all feel the need to clap on Thursday night? Do you need to give thanks for your now swollen wallet? How many of you go home and think: "I am so glad I have the opportunity to work in this fantastic place"?

You will be expected to clap and cheer. You will be expected to give thanks to HIS most generous GIFT. And you will be expected to repent your sinful thoughts and change your woeful arrogant mercinary attitudes.

Wake up!! The only reason you are getting more cash is because the market price for a pilot to live and work in Hades has increased. And without the minimum correction HIS business plan for 2007 faces possible failure. He doesn't like you and he has only just realized that he only just needs you. So why clap? Why bother going at all? The salary correction will happen wether you attend or not. Your attendance only serves to fan an already deranged ego.

I am beginning to think I am really not meant to be a puppet or dumb exchangable commodity.....



I agree with HIM on one point, anyone who attends that meeting really has no right to whine on this website anymore.

[loc22550]

Tuan 74...You don´t really care about the insult now....?????
Probably you are one of those guy ready to sell your dignity and respect to AAB.Shame on you...:uhoh:

[oryxbollocks]

Perfectly put, Black Stain.

Since I'm not silly enough to go, only to be insulted, would one of you gentlemen who see the need for personal abuse and a free dinner, please post the results here?

Remember everybody, that any increase in housing without a HUGE increase in SALARY is just smoke and mirrors.

Oh. And PLEASE don't clap.............

GB

[piper 606]

Heya QR guys

Be realistic we all knew no matter if there is INCREASE or NO INCREASE or what so ever.

There is no change.....

MOST employees of QR and in the umbrella will stay.:confused:

Why? we all knew the answer.........that.....:ugh:

However I do believe very soon they will prepare to keep thier DIGNITY:ok:

Rgrds

Piper 606

[tuan74]

By Loc22550...


Tuan 74...You don´t really care about the insult now....?????
Probably you are one of those guy ready to sell your dignity and respect to AAB.Shame on you...

Buddy... does it make any difference if I care about his insult or not..? Will that change anything in QR..? Will that change his attitude..? Will that makes me feel better..? So why care so much...why do I need to live in misery thinking about all the bad things that's happening in QR right now... If I can change things..well I'll be glad to do so...but truth is..who are we to make that change..??:sad: :sad:

I'm not gonna be a hypocrite saying I don't care about money..the more they give me the better... but do I sell my soul for for it...? Heck NO..:= := the fact that I don't care about his insult doesn't makes me his minion.. I just simply don't care about it.. totally shutting it down as much as possible..and when the time come I'll just be gone...

Why do you care...?:rolleyes:

[Qatari515]

Hi guys,


in stead of debating whether to get insulted or not...

Why dont we all meet up at the bar in the Four seasons ( Sheraton has no nice bar) just like before, and in stead of enjoying crap dinner with people we dont like we discuss the whole thing over some nice Mojittos?

Ok, well be paying them ourselves but at least you wont have to feel like a an abused wh### afterwards!

Oh, and maybe we should all buy the drinks for the one who dares to video tape the whole ordeal to put it on YouTube....

Maybe it will be a fun night after all...and a good opportunity to see friends in a bar once again. With the ****ty rosters we have to endure it has become very difficult to meet up with each other anyway!

[Goat Liner]

Ok...I'll be at the four Seasons bar. First rounds of drinks on me. Now we just need to find someone who will SMS us the results.

[Hajj Man]

OryxBollocks,

"Smoke in Mirrors"

I have not heard that one used in a while. How right you are to say that.

Many will be fooled with the increase of housing allowance and add that to their income. How wrong is this of them. Some captains and f/o that live three together, which we have and some other pilots who may pay only 8,000 a month and get a raise to 12,000 a month will count the 4,000 as extra in their pocket. It is extra, but what happens next year when the rents sky rocket again.

The word is that Captains will get 12,000 for housing and F/O and S/O will get 10,000. This is still not close to getting a decent place to live alone with your family.

HM:ok:

[NA]

Please dont be a joke my friend. I stay in a 4 bedrooms villa, in a campound mid of doha, with a pool and tennis court, and I pay 12000 QR, so please dont say that the proposed housing allowance is not anough.

Be a man, and when the company does a good thing (I hope they do it !), have at least the courage to admit it.

[salamalikum2]

Right, even if they increase the house allowance(FINALLY....)and th basic...
Generally speaking housing is still a big issue here in Doha.....
It´s not normal that some people in order to save some money Have to share accomodation with others...
12000 qr for a villa...very nice but...what about next year...?:uhoh:
I think this rate is already part of history in Doha...
I personnaly think Q.A. should be one step Ahead, and not always one step behind regarding this problem...
Their reaction time is very slow,too slow even and is probably ONLY dictated by the rate of resignation during the last months, and certainly not to make us more happy.

[Hajj Man]

NA,

I am not sure what you are on about with your coments of the 12,000 and you live in a villa with pool and tennis court? I was just saying that if a guy thinks that he is still paying 8,000 for his accomadation and he is getting 12,000 as an allowance and counting the QR4000 towards his income it is not good mathematics to count your housing allowance in your salary. Because the day we all get housing then that person will think he is getting a QR4000 decrease in salary. ........... hence "Smoke in Mirrors"

Some people are lucky ( like yourself) and still have this, one in a million low rent but for anyone who is a new joiner they will NOT find this sort of villa. I am sorry to tell you this but long gone are those days my friend and the going rate out there now is not going to get you a 4 (four) bedroom villa with a pool and tennis court for QR12,000.................... :=

[B787D]

Hey GOAT LINER , get your facts on the DOT before you :yuk: your ignorant :mad: , people like you are a bane to QATAR

[Goat Liner]

Take a deep breath 787 before you pop a vein. First of all no need for the insults. Second, just what are the facts that I supposedly got wrong? I didn't mention any...

I have been in QR for many years and given the airline much more than it has given me. I definately ain't no 'bane' to Qatar.

Back on subject...I actually will be at the meeting tomorrow. Since I have decided to continue working here at least I want to hear what the future holds directly from the horse's mouth. I won't be staying for the dinner and will applaud only if there's reason to.

Regards

[loc22550]

No need to go to the meeting to known what´s the future of the airline....!!
It will be the usual standard Q.A. propaganda.......!!If you go ones in your life, that´s it,that´s more than enough!:uhoh:

[piper 606]

mr.Goat Liner,

Do you mine to share to us what is the result of so called meeting?

No matter good or bad >>>>:ugh:

Appreciate your soonest reply.

Brgds

Piper 606:ok:

[A300Man]

Too much conjecture and supposition and irrelevance creeping into this thread now, chaps..........it (the thread) probably needs a rest until the "meeting" has actually happened.

Some of the newbie postings on this thread are "baffling" to say the least, and surprisingly inquisitive, for supposedly distant enquirers to be displaying so much interest.

===

On an entirely seperate note and to bring in a much needed commercial break, I see the A346 chaps will be having a bumper month from today onwards, with the big long plane making at least one daily foray (according to www) into DXB from Doha.

The F pax won't (and don't) like it, given there's only 8 seats in that cabin, whereas some other QR planes on the same route operate with up to 32 seats in "F" class. A lot of downgrades in the offing.

Some of our respected "local" friends don't at all like the public humiliation of being downgraded (depsite the fact that the only real difference in QR F and J class ops on the route is the offering of Arabic Coffee and dates), due to the very limited F class cabin on the 346. I have witnessed a few bizarre potential riots and potential slappings at DXB check-in of late, depsite the fact that the 39 minutes hop to Doha in one of the most technically advanced aircraft in the world is not such a bad thing, no matter which cabin one sits. Does anyone actually need a flatbed for 39 minutes?????????

===

Anyway, briefly back on topic, I wish all you professional drivers over in Doha the very best of luck when it comes to your big meeting. You all deserve not only a hearty pat on the back, but an injection of humanity from the employers who currently take you for granted. Y'all are doing a fine job, and those of us on the other side of the curtain at 41,000ft thank you. We appreciate it. Let's hope the Commercial Bank of Qatar has to commence a new print run to produce all the banknotes that you all deserve.

A300Man

[A330_300]

Update on the QR pilots meeting.Meeting started at 7:15. AAB was supposed to arrive at 7 and he came at 7:15 which was not very late. Initially the GMFO did a slight briefing on safety related issues and then handed it over to the CEO. AAB did the complete briefing and started with appreciating the pilots and he was happy to see lot of pilots present there. The house was full and AAB was in a very good mood. He was very friendly and answered all questions politely and infact used words like its **** in other airlines.He did few jokes too. The salary increase is apparently not very much i would say but its not bad.

F/O Basic 18500 with every year approx 3% raise and Captain is 21000
F/O Housing Allowance is 10000, captain is 12000
transport Allowance is 1500 for both
Furniture Allowance is now a lump sum figure of 50000 upto 5 years service and if above then 25000
school fee is now 50,000 per annum upto 21 years of age.
No change in flying allowance even though they tried to fool us with showing a high figure but it was basically the same flying allowance i.e 90 riyals but now hours shown was 70 as they claim the average hours are 70.
AAB did accepted that there is a problem regarding housing and now they are providing villas to captain and F/O with apartment and depending on the size of the family F/O will be provided with big size apartments. AAB said they are building a 62 stories apartment and with all the facilities for qatar airways pilots.

Parking issue was discussed and he said very soon when dispatch will be shifted to the new airport the transport allowance will be finish and there will be company transport for pick and drop.

Few question were asked regarding allowances, housing and parking. the meeting was then followed by a group photo with AAB, he was joking there too and then a dinner. There was a live music band playing soft jazz music.

Overall the meeting was very nice. Apparently all the pilots were in an agressive mood before the meeting but they all came out happy and that because the CEO was in a good, this is my observation.

[NoJoke]

Well if you live with five other pilots, or have an old housing contract you may make something out of this. I hear the Capt basic was up about 3500 ? If you are in a Villa costing 12000, or in Comp accom then there is nothing gained there. If you discount housing and schooling - what was the raise? No wonder the Boss was happy.

[NightSkies]

R I C E - is the answer!!

[tuan74]

Yup... I'll be able to stock a lot of RICE in my house right now...:ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

What a shame...thought it's gonna be a huge raise..but then...:{ :{

[A330_300]

I am bit confused just want to know that why did you came here to work. You are not happy with the airline,country, people etc.. but you still wanted to come here. why???

if you dont like it then why dont you leave it and if you cant then stop complaing. Nobody is forcing you to work here.If you can find a better job you all should go and work there

There are people outside looking for jobs and with this salary they would love to come here.

[Hajj Man]

A330 300 has said it all correctly.

The meeting was well presented and the boss was in a good mood with pleasant conversation and answers.

Overall conduct was good......... money was ???????....... Not sure how to answer the money issue. Lots of hidden things I think with the lumm Summ pay for furniture and you will loose the 900 for capt and 700 for F/o per month for furniture.

HM:ok:

[fiddlair]

Could someone clarify please the numbers, 'cause the cpt basic was 23000 and now 21000, or the increment 21000? Can't believe it...

[Hajj Man]

The captain Basic for a new joiner now is 26,500........... not 21,000

HM:ok:

[Autobrake1]

good mornig guys!

request details concerning school fee: 50,000 per annum ??

which total amount may i expect to pay per annum for primary school in doha

thx

[A330_300]

Yes its 50000 per annum and its around 20000 - 22000 per child per annum for primary school. This is the fee of british schools or other international schools in Doha, except American School which has a very high fee, approx 1000 US per month. You can go and check various school website in Doha, they have school fee details

[NightSkies]

People are unhappy as they were made promises on joining that haven't been kept. And also how can people just walk away to another job when they have financial commitments in Qatar now ??

[A330_300]

As i said earlier nbody is forcing anyone to work here, financial committment are only done if you know that you are going to live here for life.

for the last post, yes you can talk to them by asking if they can consider you for the different fleet, but i doubt it once they have selected you for A320 and then change you to A330. The layovers on A320 are not much except Vienna, Kathmandu, Nairobi, Colombo depending on the traffic load otherwise its either A300 or A330 etc.. I am surprised why people are interested in Layovers. If you have a family in Doha then its better to have turn around flight and spent time with them. The layover meal allowances are not very exciting that one should depend on. In my opnion i would prefer to do a turn around instead of layover flights.But unfortunately there are hardly any turn around flights on A330

Moving on to a long haul aircraft will take atleast 18 - 24 months depending on your performance.

[340-200]

hi all.

mr A 330-300. could you tell us how much the f/o on the A330 makes total a month, compared to A 320, thanx a lot.

[shaheen]

i have been in qatar airwyas for 4 y ,salary has raised about 3 times in another way am getting now twice what i have started with .
upgrade is going good since 3y fo are now flying as capt .
a new rise is in the way confrmd by ceo in a meeting with crew.
i love qatar airways and no body is forced to join so if you dont like it leave it

[Black Stain]

From your above reports the only interesting note from the meeting seems to be that an angry little man has learnt some manners and improved his interpersonal skills.

That I am confident was a for 'One Night Only' show.

[Qatari515]

Chivas Regal,


NO....you should not ask tyo be employed on another fleet! It shows the wrong attitude. They emplyed you on the 320 because you have NO previous widebody experience and you know it.

Do your time, be a good boy and you will be on another fleet within 18 months time.

The engine question....You asked us that when in Doha and we explained it to you then as well!


Just a little advise if you want to come here....dont give out too much info about yourself. Not too many guys are joining these days with your qualifications from your part of the world....Just by posting them I know exactly who you are and if I know, management will know as well as they are searching these forums with GREAT intrest!

[doha]

need to know how much we getting from now on plz ,,any body been there and knows how much is the incr....

[A330_300]

Well to be honest on A330 flying is alot and we end up doing average of 85 hours per month. At times i have crossed 90+ hours.
so you can imagine due to this the salary difference is about 4000 - 5000 riyals, on A320 in fact in past few months flying is 50 - 60 hours. As the CEO said that flights will be increasing on A320 soon.so hope for the best.

F/O Basic from 15500 to 18500........... 3% increase after 1 yr
Housing Allowance from 6500 to 10000
Utilities Allowance 300 is the same
Furnishing Allowance 700 is finished and now lumpsum amount of 50000 riyals is given to new joiner and less than 5 years of service will get the amount on pro rata basis.
e.g if 3 years then they will not get 50000 but it will be less than that, HR will give the details. My assumption is that its 5000 less for every year.
With more than 5 years of service will get 25000.
Transport Allowance from 600 to 1500
Flying Allowance 90 riyals per hour.(90 * 50 is 4500 average)

So with 50 hours of flying its 34800 riyals equivalent to 9600 USD.
and 50000 riyals one time now. (13700 USD)

My Caculation, the increase is 6700 Riyals (1850 USD)

Captain

Basic is now 26500 (dont know the % increase every year
Housing Allowance 12000
Flying Allowance 120 riyals per hour
Rest Remain the same as above i.e Utility, Furnishing and Transport Allowance

So with 50 hours of flying 46300 equivalent to 12700 USD




For Captain i think the increase is 11200 Riyals (3080 USD)

Please correct me if i have given any wrong figures. This is the maximum i can remember.

For people with Company Accommodation, They will not get the Housing, Furnishing, Utility Allowances.

Cheers

[340-200]

thanx a million A 330 300. for taking the time to give all of these details,

[togaluck]

Just check Etihad's basic

F/O 24500!!!
Capt 33000!!!

flying 65 hours @ 40 AED/hr F/O
50 AED/hr Capt

2600 AED
3250 AED

plus housing 9500 AED or RENT TO BUY A VILLA!!!

TTL F/O 36600 AED
Capt 47750 AED

Q/A

18500 (6000 QR difference)!!!!!
26500 (6500 QR difference)!!!!!

flying 65 hours @ 90 QR/hr

5850 QR
7800 QR

plus 12000/10000

TTL F/O 34350
Capt 46300

BUT YOU HAVE TO FLY 65 HOURS AT LEAST PER MONTH!!!

and lets face it .... QUALITY OF LIVING!!!!!

doha is not the friendliest place for expats!!

and JOB STABILITY....!!!!

NO AAB!!!!!!!!!

if you get a company provided accomodation you don't get the 50000 for furniture, (or 25000 for the senior guys who have been taking all the crap from management for who knows how many years)
Ok maybe WE have loss of licence insurance... but have you ACTUALLY read what it covers?????

EVERYTHING IS A PRE_EXISTING condition!!!
Screw that

and still NO retirement...

and good luck trying to decent accomodation for 12000/10000 !!

etihad... EVERYBODY gets a villa ... Q/A.. only captn. F/O's with families are second class citizens??

RENT TO BUY!!! says everything... not giving away your money to some greedy bastard. have you added up how much money you have paid in rent for the last couple of years??? DO IT ...


not really a good package...

[Fly4Fun]

Hi

Just a question regarding the flying allowance, do you get what you fly or do you get a fixed amount per month, for example, do you get every month a fixed Qr120 x 70:00?

If taking company provided accommodation, is it furnished and does it have good standards (I mean all the amenities like AC, monthly paid utilities, etc)?

Thanks a lot for your time.

Happy landings :ok:

[A330_300]

You only get what you fly so the month you dont fly you do not get anything...... Let me explain you how it works............

Company calculate the flying allowance from 15th to 14th of next month, e.g you flew in April the whole month and went on leave in May and flew again in June.

Now your salary for the month of May will have the flying allowance of 15th March to 14th April and salary of June will have the flying allowance of 15th April to 14th May and so on. So basically it does not affect the salary much even when you are on leave.

Yes the company accommodations are fully furnished with all the amenities i.e AC, Fridge, Electric Oven, Furniture and all utilities paid. But remember the utility allowance is only 300 so if the electricity and water bill is more they will deduct it from the salary.Electricity and water comes under one deptt and its not expensive and so is the telephone.Local calls are fixed so they deduct 65 riyals monthly regardless of the calls and if you have an ADSL then extra of 200 riyals and international calls are reasonable now and charge as per the usage. People generally use SKYPE or Other VOiP programs for international calls.

[A330_300]

Dear togaluck, you have not mention the transport allowance and remind you there is no pick and drop for the deck crew in Etihad and Airport drive from the city is about 30 - 40 minutes with no traffic.

The Rent to Buy house purchase program is not that company will give you the villa in exchange of your Housing Allowance. Its a simple calculation the housing Allowance in Etihad is 115000 dirhams per year so if they bind you for 10 years then it will be 1150000 (1.15 million dirhams) Now please do a search in Abu Dhabi and find me a 2 bed room apartment for 1.15 million, the current market price in AUH is not less than 2.5 million dirhams, i dont think EY is stupid enough to lose 1 million dirhams

You also forgot to mention that EY is offering 3 options for Housing and that is either

1 - Take an allowance of 115000 dirham per year (9583 dirhams per month), please i would be grateful if you could find me a villa or an apartment 2 bedroom for 9600 and make sure they have car parking facility too.The whole AUH is having a problem in finding a parking spot. People park there car along the road and sometime they have to park it 2 -3 blocks away from their residence

2 - Company Provided housing depending on the availability, so it means the company is having problems with accommodation and in Etihad majority of pilots including captains are living in an apartment so this is not correct that everybody is getting a Villa and what does this mean that Housing depending on the availability???? and at the same time they are offering a 3 option that is

3 - Rent to Buy housing purchase Program. I dont have any information how it will work but definitely with the bank. So far Etihad Airways does not have his own accommodation and they are planning to build it at the Khalifa City so that is a very long process.

Nobody is saying to give your money to greedy bastard, invest money in the Pearl Qatar and get a 2 bed room apartment, Its a very good investment and Qatar is a booming market and Investment Gurus from all around the world are investig here and they claim that Middle East Hub will be no longer Dubai and Doha will take it over, so be patient and watch.

Qatar AIrways is just 10 years old and is growing rapidly and everyone agrees on that.

I do not agree that its not a friendly place for Expats, my family is very happy here, I think local people are nice and they dont bother the expats, it all depends how you behave with them. I know lot of expats from UK living here for last 20 years and they have never complained that its not a friendly place.They have seen lot of changes, and i am here for past 2 years i have so far did not have any probelms, I am not saying its a perfect place but at the same time you have not experienced Dubai or AUH. You must have gone for few days and thats it if you have to live there then you will come to know. Dubai and Abu Dhabi are very expensive arab states, yes i agree there is lot of things to do in Dubai but you have to wait when you will have everything in Doha.

Job Stability is nowhere in the Gulf so stop living in a dream world thinking that the Jobs are confirmed there.

AND AT THE END PLEASE WHY ARE YOU STAYING HERE IF YOU ARE NOT HAPPY, JUST GO AND START WORKING FOR OTHER AIRLINES. BELIEVE ME PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE NOT WELCOME IN QATAR AIRWAYS.

CHEERS:D

[cavelino rampante]

togaluck

you expect a fully furnished company provided accomodation AND a 50000 riyal company furniture allowance

why dont you p**s off home and whinge there instead

[Black Stain]

The last two posts are proof that there really are some wierd people out there. I have also heard of people who eat cochroaches and dogs and believe that AhmedGingerKebab of Iran is Jesus.

Each of us must choose his own path.....

A330-300, do you really believe that Doha will one day be a world class city? I find this most comical. The rubble, potholes and rubbish totally obscure this vision from me. I honestly dont believe that the 'artists impressions' you have viewed will ever be accurately realized. There is little planning here and most action is uncordinated. After two years Airport Road is still not finished.... all they did was lay a sewer pipe.

Cavelino Ramparte, I pray you remain here until the day you retire. No-one deserves it more than you.

Cheers

[cavelino rampante]

Yes I plan to. Now go put yourself out of your own misery.

[A300Man]

Off topic, I know. But since some of you guys are A346 drivers, I thought you may be interested.

I guess QR will only allow slim passengers to be accomodated in F and J from now on???????????

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/engineering/article1624119.ece

[piper 606]

Togaluck,

All yr details are VERY very Imformative.

However I am confused if u knew this things why u r still with QA?:confused:

You must choose wat do u thing is right for u..:ok:

That would be better rather than keep comparing and complaining.

Just to clarify Am not against you but this a friendly advice.;)

Thank and Best Regards.

Piper 606

[Qatari515]

A340-300,



I agree with you on most of your points.

However, I have to strongly disagree with you regarding your views about the real estate situation.

No serious investment guru is saying that Doha will be taking over from Dubai! What they are saying is that the whole middle east real estate market is a bubble witing to burst! Its an artificialy inflated over estimated real estate market, designed to give even more wealth to the few rich sjeikhs around!

One golden rule in the middle east! The local rich men will only give you something ( or allow you to invest) at the moment where they are 100% sure no more money can be made by them!

This happend in the DSM, it is happening in real estate as well!

Proof! Just read the newspapers....they are almost begging people now to buy real estate while 2 years ago the buyers had to beg! Nowadays...no more down payments etc...

On top of that, you dont have to be a wizzard to see that there is a total over-offer here in Doha! Compounds are empty, buildings remain unfinished/unsold!

Prices are still high because the greedy bastards made arrangements amongst themselves NOT to lower the prices and, as we all know, they dont really need the money anyway!

And dont forget the fact that the whole market is constructed as a money laundring scheme...

Even the less lucky Qatari people are extremely unhappy with this situation but unfortunatele this situation is dictated by the happy few! Yes, they are present even here!

Ill tell you something, I have been here many years and as long as I dont see people, who have been here 4 times longer than I have and who defenitely have the means to buy, are not buying I do not think its time to buy for normal people like ourselves!

Dont fool yourself. If you bought your 2 bedroom appt for 1.6 million QR today, nobody is going to offer you 3,2 million in 5 years as was predicted by the sales boys!

For that money you buy an appartment in New York or Hong Kong....and I know where I would buy than...


Wake up and smell the roses!:rolleyes:

[knotaloud]

Whether you like it here or you don't; whether you're leaving or staying; would you please stop conning yourselves into believing this is a GOOD PACKAGE!

Put simply, the payrise is approximately QR 3,000 + 900 for the car for both FO's and captains. B.. F...... D...!

[NA]

Dear Mr. Knotaloud,

I met QR Human Resourced Manager:

As a captain with more than 5 years in the airline, my basic is up from 24,000 to 30,000 QR

My housing allowance went from 6500, to 12,000 QR

transportation is up from 400 to 1500

After all this (almost 12,500 QR increase), you want to tell me that the salary increase, is only 3900 QR ?

Please think before you write.

[Goat Liner]

NA,

Please don't confuse the increase in the housing allowance with an increase in Salary. 12000Qr is the minimum required for a decent accomodation in Doha and it doesn't make up for the last two years where I have been subsidising the rent out of my own pocket. Plus most of the pilots joining nowadays are taking the company provided accomodation so they wont even see this allowance.

The real increase, as Knotaloud said, is 3000Qr + 900Qr. In the case of those of us who have been here more than five years its 6000Qr + 900. Thats it. I'm glad you are happy about it but honestly as a five year+ captain I'm not too exited that I am making only 3000Qr more than a new joiner. Especially since said new joiner gets a 50000Qr furniture gift and I only get 25000Qr.

It is also worth mentioning that at the meeting the CEO was happy to announce that we have the highest hourly flight pay compared to Emirates and Etihad. Frankly I would rather have a higher Basic and less flight pay. With the current system when we are on leave/training/sick we make less than our collegues across the water. The much advertised 6 point something per cent we are getting more than emirates only works if you fly at least 70 hours a month. So what about the 320 guys?

As a matter of fact this new package seems to be designed to penalise the high seniority pilots: A ten year captain makes the same as a five year one. Or even worse, a F/O who has been with the company more than five years and has just been promoted to captain gets the same basic salary as a direct entry captain. Actually the new captain will make more because he gets 25000Qr more as a furniture gift. Nice!

[Qatari515]

as said before....smoke and mirrors!

Dont fool yourselves....

The increase is something and the seniority system is a first step into the right direction but....

By far we are still lagging behind all the competitors here in the gulf!

The mentality is still that of a cheap third world airline, I am sorry to say so...

Once more, an opportunity was missed....QR will always stay the little brother of EK and EY...

[A330_300]

MESSAGE FOR THE CRYING BABIES:{ .........................

STOP COMPLAINING := ....................TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.............

ITS A VERY SIMPLE RULE ITS HIS WAY OR THE HIGHWAY SO YOU ALL DECIDE . YOU ALL ARE BUNCH OF HYPOCRITES, WANT TO WORK IN QATAR AND AT THE SAME TIME KEEP COMPLAING.

I can bet all those who are complaing dont even have Balls to even leave this airline.

I notice the major issue is not the raise its the furniture allowance 50000, which is bothering all of you.

I am enjoying that people like you are not happy and crying like babies.

:ok:

[togaluck]

in order of apearance

A330 300:

I did not mention the transport allowance because it is, as you said "temporary".
PLEASE if YOU find a villa or apartment decent by western standards fit for a family for 12000/10000 IN doha, tell me. Trust me i have been looking very hard and its impossible, unless you want to share it with someone of course, which honestly is not a very good option for a family with kids. I really hate the idea of having to pay 4000 USD for RENT !!! do you know what you can BUY with that ANYWHERE else in the world ???
About buying real state in qatar, brother, please tell me WHO are these "gurus" that are telling you that investing in the pearl is a good idea, First of all just take a look at the stability in the region... Iran right next door? the US with a A/C carrier in the gulf? the british sailors incident? c'mon, any other conflict here and all your money is gone. Second, it IS an artificially inflated bubble (like qatari515 notes) about to burst, if you invest, you wont get your money's worth you dont really need a degree in economics to figure this one out, but maybe your financial advisor DOES! Third, this is a lawless land!! everything is by decree, do you really think for a second that you as an expat have any real rights here??? just think about what would happen if you were involved in an accident, with a local and they get really hurt WHO do you think they are going to blame?? (god forbid one of your family members?) what will happen to your "investment" if you go to jail? or lose your residency? if a local really wants to screw you over they will, no matter what you do or dont. thats why it is a COUNTRY IN DEVELOPMENT in every aspect, everybody is NEW MONEY and the mentality in this area doesn't help.
Fourth, the pearl is going to sink man! its the cheapest, least skilled labor force in the world who is planning it and building it, just look around at all the new structures around they are collapsing!! It will look nice, but who can garantee you wont get the worst quality?? better get a good civil engineer for inspection.
my advise if you really want to invest, look somewhere else not the pearl or qatar for that matter.
Job stability? ok, i know that it is the middle east and its non-existent, as a matter of fact unless you are in a company with a strong union (that's not half bankrupt) nowhere in the world will you have such thing.
but lets be honest, WHY are people SO afraid of the ceo and other management positions?? this place is run by FEAR of losing your job.
i know management will always be critisized by employees, its a natural thing, its even healthy for any organization, but here, its ridiculus, with the amount of money that is put into the airline, do you really think qatar airways is the best it can be?? there's a lot to be desired.
In a REAL 5 STAR airline, people in the end actually ADMIRE their top management.
Look at emirates not the best salary, but the way employees are treated, says a lot for the management (so far). I know they have their bad things, but ALL the airlines in the world have it and I know it.
To be honest with you when I joined i was very positive and enthusiastic, i thought i had made the right decision, but now in retrospective i sadly see I didn't. I am not happy and will most likely leave.

only sharing what i think, not really whining or complaining.

so cheers mate and wake up,
the package is NOT good,
maybe only IF YOU CAN'T GET A JOB ANYWHERE ELSE!
I know i WILL.



CAVELINO RAMPANTE:

Mate, I am NOT asking for a fully furnished aptmnt AND the 50000 QR.
only decent accomodation ( don't really know what kind of cave you are used to ) .
If you brush up on you READING AND COMPREHENSION skills maybe you'll understand what i meant.


PIPER 606:

Answering your question: I am still with QA because, the new package was only "revealed" 2 days ago. and we have to give 90 days notice to resign.
I also thought the increase would meet or exceed the ones of other airlines in the gulf, you know since QA its supposed to be THE 5 star airline and all that crap!!! we are about 20 years behind in mentality. to say the least. That's why.
thanks for the advice, and by the way i am not complaining, I AM comparing. You have to otherwise you don't see the options (remember CRM :rolleyes: ), only sharing my point of view.




CHEERS ladies and gentlemen.
best of luck

[NA]

dear Goat Liner

although it is very hard for me to say it, however Its seems the CEO was right in the meeting when he said 'no matter what we give, they will be always ho want more'.

Stop naging please, and try to avoid to behave like a teenager ho is never satisfied of what his parents bring him at Chrismass

[A330_300]

Dear togaluck,

I can just wish you best of luck for your dream job and i hope you stay happy.

I was reading your post and i thought i cannot waste my energy to give you the facts and figures. If you stick around in this region for long then you will come to know by yourself.

Cheers

[knotaloud]

I truly hope the childishness of the postings of 330300 and NA indicates that they are management clerks posing as pilots?

As toga said, he's "comparing". And that is what all of us will do. Some will stay, some will leave. However, what's more important is that the pay is not good enough to attract pilots here, rather than to the competition. Particularly when you add in the AAB factor.

A new DEC joiner on the 330 will see 28,000 as a salary plus around 8,000 a month IF he flies.

Add in the failure to address sick leave, LoL, pensions, human rights and all you have here is a training ground for other airlines. Wouldn't you management wankers prefer to see pilots want to stay rather than being always on the lookout for something better?

We COULD have a good airline here.

[Mr Ho]

Mr Not Allowed, what is this "wranker" thing you talk about?

Is local thing? are many wranker there? or are wranker everywhere?

Prease Exprain :8

[NoJoke]

Mr Ho, please the read posts by A330-300, Cavalino Rampante and NA. You will find excellent examples. What a bunch of T*a*s. Sorry Mr Ho you will have to learn that word on your own, work here long enough and you will find out .........

[gnadirs]

WHOOOP WHOOOP ....


Wind up Alert!

A330-300.....what are you smoking my friend...maybe we should all get some of that stuff! It surely worked well with you!

[M06]

Folks, cheer up!

Be thankful for what you've got. Why bite the hand that feeds you?

No one owes you a living. You chose to work for QR out of your own free will - and you can choose to quit if you want to.

Whining and complaining shows a lack of maturity and ruins prospects for everyone else (Westerners will no longer be the first choice for jobs/promotions).

Just a thought.

:= :)

[NA]

To Mr. Joke (sorry NoJoke), and Mr. Knotaloud:

The pilot market is strongly in favour of professional pilots these days, if you don't like QR, then have the dignity of leaving this airline ASAP (but please pay your bond before you go).

If you don't leave,with the demand so strong for pilots, then sorry, you are not professional enough dood, thus stop nagging, untill a better airline is available for you.

In Europe, I can only work if I hold a local passport, same in the USA, when one day, only arabic passport holders will be allowed to work as pilots in this arabic region, is the day when nagging will stop in QR.

[popay]

Fellow aviators,
happy Easter to start with. Anyone out there having a reference to the rental law, please? I kinda have an upcoming event called RENT RISE therefore would like to have a reference. The land lord want 34% rise for a fully furnished accommodation. Does anyone have any idea about the legal situation? Some people say that a fully furnished accommodation is an exception from the law but I doubt it. If anyone went through that appreciate an advise.
Cheers.

[340-200]

so guys what's the new scale now, whatever it is i'm sure you deserve more, best luck all.

[pilot306]

QATAR AIRWAYS NEW F/O PACKAGE
BASIC = 18,000 QR
HA = 10,000 QR
UTILITI = 300 QR
TA = 600 QR
+ 90 QR per hour avrage 70 = 6300 QR
+MEAL/A = dependes on destnations and how long
total = 35,200 with out meal/A

**will keep u updated soon :E

[Safari Goat]

Popay,

Joyce in housing has a pilot that has information on the law and has extended help to many pilots with landlord,rent,accomadation problem.
Call her.

[Hajj Man]

Pilot306,

You need to know TA (Transpot Allowance) is not 600............. it is 1500 for captains and first officers now. Mafi Muskala
HM:ok:

[Mr Ho]

Crearly the problem you have I see.

What need is, different pay scrale, different pirot.

In China is airrine with A an B money, what need you is W X and Y money:

Y money for all good pirot that say YES to all good order. This best money.

X money for rordinary X PAT

W money for all wrankers. Wranker not leaving so just give tent, camel, fish rod and bag of rice.

Is good idea :8

[Qatari515]

Hi Popay,


what you are saying does not seem right to me. The law clearly stipulates the 10% and nothing else.

Joyce should be able to help you. Otherwise the company lawyer is always there to give you advise on these things as wll. You will have to go to the 9the floor for that however as his office is there.

Another option: give him back his crappy furniture, re-negotiate and buy your own with whatever is left over in your case of that 50000QR housing lump sum.

Thats what I did ( without the lump sum....wasnt there when I did it)

[popay]

Qatari515, hi there. Well I totally agree with you about 10%. Neither does it make any sense to me. However I've heard now from several people about a loop hole in the law regarding the fully furnished case. I most certainly will seek for a legal advice and make use of the legal insurance. To convert it into the unfurnished one is an option too. Strange though I couldn't find any reference online regarding the law. I don't believe in speculations ergo I need a reference.
Cheers.

[loc22550]

The only problem Qatari 515 is that this 10% increase for the rent is ONLY applicable ..for UNFURNISHED accomodation...
This law doesn´t apply to furnished accomodation.:{

[Qatari515]

Loc22550,

just as Popay mentioned before, I havent been able to find anything regarding this anywhere in the law!

Therefore, it could just be a smart intrepratation of the landlord but that does not make it legal.

Which is why he asking for a legal reference.....

In case you are right...what about semi-furnished accomodation?


Just traying to get things right, thats all!

[Safari Goat]

Popay call that pilot who has helped peope with rent problems before. I think he has helped many pilots already with landlord greed and fighting the system.

[popay]

S.G. hey. I did phone up the guy unfortunately he just confirmed that a fully furnished accommodation isn't subject to that particular law. By the way he really did well and won the Court case. Bravo, really cool chap. However I can imagine due to dynamic changes taking place in the legal system (within common law) things do change and who knows maybe there's been a different interpretation already. I can imagine the judge to decide in landlord's favour provided it's new accommodation or if just been refurnished.
However if nothing has been done and NO additional costs were borne I personally don't see a reason to exclude it from the law. Of course it's up to the judge to interpret the particular case. All I'm saying is let's not assume but stick to the law and try to win the case. :ok:
Cheers.

[a330flyer]

... I personally don't see a reason to exclude it from the law. Of course it's up to the judge to interpret the particular case. All I'm saying is let's not assume but stick to the law and try to win the case.

oh...I pesonally didn't see a reason for the CEO to violate my contract...of course it's up to the judge to interpret the particular case...let's try to win the case...and all the best to all of you who still believe that there is justice for non arabic expats in the Middle East! Salamaleykum!

[filoxym]

Contact Dr. Jaffar 4496901 for helpful strategies. He has been recommended by Flight Operations to assist us for matters relating to tenant-landlord relations. Good luck.

[popay]

filoxym, thanks a lot man. Appreciate your input. I'll try so.
a330flyer, I suggest you don't get too sentimental but just proceed according with your plan. The guy is an expat and he won the case. Again it's not enough to accuse someone without presenting facts. By doing so it's just allegation nothing more. You might be wrong or right without knowing the details I perceive your statement as hot air shaking, sorry mate. Come up with hard facts and I'm sure the audience will be fair.
Cheers.

[instruc231]

:ok: So how much will the s f/o get 18000/or 20000 !!

thanks.........:confused:

[Hajj Man]

The Second Officer deal has not been worked out yet.

HM:ok:

[loc22550]

nothing new actually...but at least it´s a change compared to the usual local propaganda we can read in our "favorite" daily qatari newspapers...!
For people who might ignore it: there is a human right committee in Doha....:ugh: no,no it´s not a joke....

[loc22550]

And why do you think Q.A. is opening sometime new"strange" destination.... just to make the "import" of new slave easier...

[instruc231]

:ok: SORRY i want to know how much is the busic for the sinor f/o mor than 5 yers with qr

[Qatari515]

Well,

for someone with your writing skills anything they offer you would be too much! I hope you talk English better than the way you write it!

For info...

new FO: 18000
Senior FO with 5 years inside: 22500

[Hajj Man]

Your first year as a F/O in QR you will receive 18000 basic + 1500 transport allowance ( for about 2 more years until they bring you to work and back to home after work) and the flight pay of 90 per hour + the pay for food at your nightstops.

second year will be 18540
third year will be 19100
and then when you start your fourth year you should be a senior F/O with a basic of 20000.

You will be promoted to senior F/O based on your performance in the company.

If your performance is not good and you remain a F/O ( not a senior F/O)
forth year will be 19670
and fifth year will be 20260.

And for the DEC pilots it will be the same transport allowance and night stop allowances with 120 hour rate of flight pay.

you will join and get 26500 basic
second year will be 27295
third year will be 28115
and fourth year 28960
with fifth year and above capped out at 29830.

HM:ok:

[old747man]

Any changes on overtime payments in the new deal ?

[Plutos]

Qatari515
can u explain me how it works for the housing allowance scheme pls?
I mean, is it that u take the allowance and look for the house u want(furnished/unfurnished) or no allowance and u get a standard house from the company ?
tks for your time.

[Black Stain]

Very interesting, this website changes the whole game: http://www.qatarsucks.com/

A person must be truly :mad: off to bother creating a hate mail website; thought did cross my mind once, but I am way too lazy. And quite a good one it is. Broad in scope, very factual, something there for everyone on the planet to read. And be sure, eventually nearly everyone will read it.

But when are the Qataris going to see the Big Picture. Not much point being the richest man in the city if you dont have any friends outside your own street.

[Qatari515]

Plutos, its rather straight forward.

Option 1


You take the allowance ( 10000QR FO/ 12000QR Capt) and you go and look for your own house. In that case the cie will pay you as well an expense allowance ( dont know how much...must be somewhere around 600QR) for utilities and a furniture allowance ( Now replaced by a one time lumpsum)


Option 2

You take company accomodation ( house for capt/ appartement for FO/ only avail for new joiners now) and you dont get any of the above mentioned allowances as they are all fully furnished.



Hope it helps...


Hajj man.... a senior FO with 5 years company has a basic of 22500QR...

[popay]

Qatari515, hi there. house for capt/ apartment for FO/ only avail for new joiners now That's not what the latest crew notice says. Supposedly it's according to the seniority now. Lets see though how it works. Rumors are in the air about some kind of skyscraper in the west bay for pilots being in the tube.:8

[Goat Liner]

Does anyone know what the situation is for those who accepted the one off payment of 40,000Qr a few months ago in lieu of the furniture allowance; Do they have to pay that back now under the new sytem or do they get to keep it? Does someone with 5+ in the company (therefore entitled to 25,000Qr under the new contract) have to pay back the 15,000Qr balance or does he get to keep the 40,000 and get another 25,000?

Just to know if I made a stupid mistake in not accepting the 40,000 a few months ago!

[Qatari515]

Hi Popay,


you could be right, I have no idea. The info changes here every 5 minutes anyway!

Ill tell you one thing though...No way Ill be accepting an appartment in that 62 stories block of appartements...

Imagine....Living in a pilot Ghetto all together! Just go to Musheirib tomorrow and have a look on how it would be like....

NO WAY!

[salamalikum2]

so...does it mean that the Basic salary is Blocked after 5 years..no annual increase....???:confused:

[popay]

QR 515, well that's an individual choice. Its ARMY style man but clearly providing the required protection from the arbitrary rent hikes. 10000 is maybe enough for now to rent a flat or if very lucky a villa (unfurnished AL WAKRA) but tomorrow the same thing will be 15000. Don't forget the law 10% is only valid till the end of 2007. To be fair I believe the prices might stabilize but they wont drop significantly cause tomorrow there´ll be another new ambitious project causing shortage again. Someone served in the army will be glad to be back to the old core. I don't mind actually as long as it´s nice and clean place. Welcome to 5 star MARINE CORE.:ok:

[Plutos]

Do u know if it is possible to step from one option to the other one on the way, or when you have decided for one option there is no way back ?
How are the house/appartament prvided by QR ? Which Qatar area ?
tks

[oryxbollocks]

I've been watching this thread for a while now and finally MaxT here has hit on it! There's nothing in writing so, for the moment, there's NOTHING! I think it was knotloud who spotted the management w*nkers posting here in a vain attempt to get us all to like what is still just a PROPOSAL from AAB.

IF, it comes about, it is a miserable increase which will do nothing to help this company expand into the future. The cries from our management posters here to 'like or leave' will become a reality. It's a pilot's market at the moment for those with mobile passports.

You may all be interested to know that the ground staff, "granted" a pay increase and housing increase, were emailed not long after the announcement and told that the rent increase was not to be 'assumed'. All staff would be notified individually, in due course, as to what their respective rental assistance would be.

Both the rental assistance and travel allowance for pilots will disappear in due course as we are all forced into company accommodation. So the company gives and the company takes away.

It would have been a REAL pay increase if the rental money had gone towards salary increase and flight pay had been done away with so that all of us were on level pegging.

And let's not forget; there's still no sick leave, real LoL, retirement benefits and what about pilots with over 5 year's service?

Another opportunity to make this a good airline has gone begging. Pity.

GB

[Plutos]

Sorry,the question was only because I dont work for QR...
...but still thinking it may be an interesting opportunity.

[popay]

Fellas bad bad bad news. Fully furnished apartments are excluded from the lease law and subject to the civil law therefore there's no limit in rent increase. Land lord can increase unlimited. :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: All studied and confirmed by the lawyers. I think company accommodation or unfurnished in this situation is the best solution.:sad: :sad: :sad: New joiners should only go for unfurnished although even that isn't gonna help if the rental prices aren't to drop.

[A330_300]

listen oryxbollock and few other losers,

You all dont even have balls to stand up in a meeting and say this is not a good offer. What a bunch of hypocrites and please i am happy to be management w*nker atleast i am not a hypocrite like all of you.

And please with no delay just leave the airline since we all are tired of hearing that people will leave and the future of this airline is doomed.

[gnadirs]

Wohow....


A330 300......How is the honeymoon period treating you my friend?

Hope you are enjoying it because before you will know it wil be over and it seems to me you might be in for a rude awakening!

Oryxbollocks has been here much longer than you have and maybe his view on things is a bit too pessimistic, certain points he is touching are very very true!

I can see that you are happy with wath they gave you ( ever heard of the dangling carrott theory?) but still you should realise that some very serious points are not being adressed at this stage!

I just hope you will never brake a leg while flying here because, and I hope you realise this, you will barely see any money during your revalidation!

But hey, maybe you are one of the lucky ones who has a bank account full of money and who censequently does not care about the money QR gives you. That would explain certainly your blunt denial and apathy towards the fact that there is no providend fund either!

Listen mate....the new package was an improvement but all some people are saying here is that the company, once more, missed an opprtunity to be the best in the region!

By the way, did you know that with the new package the overtime pay was raised from 780 to 840 hours per year! Nobody mentioned this during the meeting but for most of us, this means at least 15000QR less this year!

As told.....You win some-you loose some.....5* policies my friend!:D

[Hajj Man]

First off I would like to say to Qatari515 that I am sorry I did not address the 22500 of the senior F/O. I just did a cut off, short cut, and stepped from a three year F/O directly to a first year SENIOR F/O pay assuming you would do the upgrade then. But you are right with the figure. Sorry.

A330_300,
I have to agree with Oryxbollocks and gnadirs when they write here with their words. You needed to have been here a year or two ago when a couple of pilots lost their medical for a broken leg/ankle and were hobbling around ops, pushing papers in a office to keep a salary coming in because their sick leave finished. Also it has been changed now but you would also loose your housing allowance allocation when you were out on longterm sick leave long time ago ( 3,4,5 years back)

Speaking of BALLS, did you stand up in the meeting and ask questions? Also were you at the last years meeting when a guy with balls got up and asked a question? This years meeting was much better I must say but I think if you have any questions here it is best to write or speak to the GMFO or Chief pilot. It has to be a good mood day to get certain things done here and propose some positive changes. If you place your cards on the table on a bad mood day, KHALLAS, you lose!


HM:ok:

[Flyer34]

Also were you at the last years meeting when a guy with balls got up and asked a question?

So what happened to the 'guy with balls' Hajj Man???

[TAT-40]

lost a ball .:}

[A300Man]

A330-300 (New boy, like AEJ)

A rather surprising post, may I say. Your use of the word "losers" is bizarre, to say the least. Many of the correspondents participating in this thread are long term employees of the Company, whilst others have been in the region for more years than I care to remember.

Perhaps best to wait a few months and take a look at the situation from a fresh perspective.

Best regards,
A300-600 (Old git, like ABO)

[kaepa]

for QR pilots :
can you please provide the circular which include the new full pay package with all of its detailes for me ,as a document my e-mail or pm for Capts. and F/Os
much appreciated
thanks

[Hajj Man]

Kaepa, When you get that "DOCUMENT" let us all get a copy of it also please. Because as of yesterday when I checked my pigeon hole box there was no document but I will check tonight again when I go to work and see if it is there.:rolleyes:
Also, A330_300 and anyone else interested, take a look at your paycheck at the end of this month and let me know what is the housing allowance and if there has been any changes to it. You will see that there is still the 900 capt and 700 f/O section there as they still have not figured out how the 50000, 25000, 40000 money will be distributed and how it will all work. I would not be surprised if the end of May paycheck it is still not sorted out.
HM:ok:

[SIUYA]

Well said A300Man!

But I doubt anything can or will change A330_300's perspective if, as he claims:

i am happy to be management w*nker

The w*nker part of that statement is totally confirmed, that's for sure, particularly with A330_300’s little ‘gem’ about:

....i am waiting when the company will throw all the thankliess white trash out from the country. And that day is not far. You people dont even have right to sat anyhting to an arab or their country.................

on the ‘Emirates-new Paydeal For Locals Only’ thread.

Both of A330_300's statements merely demonstrate to others that he really isthe self-proclaimed w*nker he claims to be.

Perhaps 4HP, A330_300 could be invited to 'leave the building' for a little while to allow him to:

take a look at the situation from a fresh perspective

as A300Man seems to be suggesting, and as vbrules certainly DID suggest? :ok:

[Black Stain]

Damn and heckfire.... what's going on here?

After the A330_300 rant I sat down and had a beer, scratched my weary head a few times and thought hard. I actually decided he is probably right and it is time to move on.

No he's not right about the loser tag, I can go pretty much anywhere, whereas he is probably a lifer. But why wallow in the sty when I can live in the house with real people? The market is hot, three resumes now dispatched.....

Thanks for motivating my lazy ass A330 loser.....:cool:

[A330_300]

hehehehe:) ................... i love the replies...they are very entertaining....................

My honeymoon is nice and i am enjoying it.

LET ME ASK ALL THE LONG TERM EMPLOYEES OF THE COMPANY, I HAVE YET TO SEE A SINGLE GOOD POST FOR THE COMPANY............ I HAVE NOTICE THAT ALL OF YOU ARE ALWAYS COMPLAINING.....EITHER ITS MONEY, ROSTERING, HOUSING, CABIN CREW, MEALS ETC...There is not a single post which says the company has done a good job, atleast have a courtesy to do that. That is why you all are thankless people. I am not saying this airline is the perfect airline but atleast have a courage to admit the good things about the airline.

WHAT MAKE YOU STAY HERE.................IF NOT HAPPY LEAVE OTHERWISE STOP COMPLAING AND STAY.

Yes i agree i have alot and i am thankful to GOD for all this and i hope he gives me more but i will not go out and cry for it.If the revised salary is not in the May salary so what it will come later. Atleast you are getting it.What if there was no pay raise then what???????

I know the answer.... you would have been complaing and crying and still working for the same company and posting that all the pilots will leave this airline. Its not easy to leave the company when you have responsibilities and its also not easy to get the job. If it was very easy you would have left this place long time back. Ask people who did not have a job for a very long time, how does it feel?????

Its good to be Optimistic but its better to be Realistic

[maxtorque]

Its good to be Optimistic but its better to be Realistic

An oxymoron from the oryx moron??

Max

[SIUYA]

max...............classic! :ok:

A330_300................

Like a lot of Gulf folks you most likely do have a lot and are probably (and should be I suppose) thankful to GOD for that, as you say. But your posts seem to demonstrate that you don't have a lot of intelligence, tolerance or maturity. Certainly not in the quantities needed to be involved in management.

You're a fool! Grow up, get a life, and stop pissing-off others with your ridiculous and racist points of view. :mad:

[Spirit1]

Hi to all

Pay rise or just rice. I do not know.
From my point of view, it is some where in between.
I cannot live with out the pay rise.
However, a yearly increment of around 3% is ridiculous and will only bring more rice on the table.:sad:
Fly safe and eat all the crew meal you can get


Spirit1
“If I could turn back time… :{

[loc22550]

A330-300,

First You can not "leave" a company like that,it´s not always that easy... unfortunatly; you may have some constraint: bond...kids at school....

Second: why you didn´t mentioned the good thinks about Qatar airways you are talking about...?:confused:

[loc22550]

By the way Gnadirs are you talking about the overtime for this year from april 2006 till april 2007.....?(840h..?)
If they do that,that´s very chocking and scandalous!!
But probably THEY don´t have the balls to announce it.......