Emirates Coming to Town

[safari005]

Don,t Know whose interested but received this from a mate over there.

Emirates Information Sessions in Australia for Experienced Pilots 4th -9th March 2007



Representatives from Emirates Airline will be coming to conduct information sessions in Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane between 4th and 9th March 2007.

Details are:

Melbourne – Hilton on the Park, 192 Wellington Parade, Melbourne
4th March 9.00am – 12.00pm
2.00pm – 5.00pm
5th March 9.00am – 12.00pm

Sydney – Sofitel Wentworth, 61-101 Phillip Street, Sydney
6th March 6.00pm – 9.00pm
7th March 9.00am - 12.00pm
2.00pm – 5.00pm

Brisbane – Stamford Plaza Hotel, Cnr Edward and Margaret Streets, Brisbane
8th March 9.00am – 12.00pm
2.00pm – 5.00pm
9th March 9.00am – 12.00pm

The information sessions will provide more information on Emirates, our selection program, the benefits of living and working in Dubai (including detailed information on our salary package and other associated terms and conditions) and some personal perspectives from a current Emirates pilot. We will also be available to speak to you following the presentation to answer any additional queries you may have about Emirates careers or living in Dubai.

Emirates' minimum requirements for Direct Entry Captains and First Officers can be found on our careers website (www.emiratesgroupcareers.com (http://www.pprune.org/Data/www.emiratesgroupcareers.com)).

To help us with our planning, please register your interest in attending a particular session by emailing [email protected]. Walk-ins are welcome.

Spouses/partners are also welcome to attend the information sessions.

We look forward to seeing you there.

[the_last_viirgin]

Hi All,

Does anyone have info on what exactly goes on at these road shows.

Thanks,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,:ok: :ok: :ok: :ok:

[ACMS]

All you Virgins may want to read the Middle East Forum about life in Dubai.
I am in the Fragrant harbour and frequently visit Dubai on overnights and I can tell you it's not the place I would want to move to. 50c temps, real bad traffic, smoke/dust haze and it's getting more and more expensive by the day. The locals don't want you there and let you know it. One of our Captains was verbally bashed by a local in the crew hotel, turns out he was some big wig who hates "white trash". He and his security thugs hassled the Captain for quite a while and the hotel security refused to help because of who the local was.
Nice place, makes you feel really welcome doesn't it.
Please take a close look before jumping the VB ship, I know it's not rosey in VB either but boy I know where my family would rather live. Money ain't everything.

[B772]

Living and working in a Muslim country may its challenges in the not too distant future.

[Buster Hyman]

Jetstar Information Sessions in Australia for Cheap Pilots 14th -19th March 2007






Representatives from Jetstar will be coming to conduct gullability sessions in Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane between 14th and 19th March 2007.

Details are:

Melbourne – Airport Car Park, , Melbourne
14th March 9.00am – 12.00pm
2.00pm – 5.00pm
15th March 9.00am – 12.00pm

Sydney – Luna Park, Sydney
16th March 6.00pm – 9.00pm
17th March 9.00am - 12.00pm
2.00pm – 5.00pm

Brisbane – Parliament House (Ask for Beat's office), Brisbane
18th March 9.00am – 12.00pm
2.00pm – 5.00pm
19th March 9.00am – 12.00pm

The gullability sessions will provide more information for Jetstar on the actual bottom level of conditions likely to be accepted, our lowest bidder program, the benefits of living and working in Sunbury (including detailed information on our salary package...(tee-hee)... and other associated terms and conditions) and some personal perspectives from the current Jetstar pilot. We will also be available to speak at you following the presentation about any additional queries you may have about Jetstar careers or living in Sunbury however, answers are unlikely.

(A $5.00 non-refundable cover charge applies!)


;)

[Pete Conrad]

Buster...love your work.

[MMSOBGYTAST]

ACMS,

Bloody classic mate, you don't live in Dubai but you are giving expert testimony about the place, and what gems they are.

Of course, one never raises a sweat in Hong Kong during summer, oh and those locals LOVE you GWAILOs. Confirm Hong kong belongs to communist China?.


What no traffic in Hongkong? HA. And YOU are giving advice about haze and dust, try the LUNG destroying pollution in Hongkong.


To all you virgins out there, I think ACMS was refering to staying away from the Fragrant harbour, and he was just a little confused when he wrote his post.:D

[L1011]

Didn't EK do this about a year ago?

Was there much of a take-up? Anyone know if many Aussie guys interviewed and accepted jobs in the sandpit?

[Mysalami]

Grit ya teeth,
Mate its not even summer yet and you are hot under the collar!!! You got to leave National joke, and don't have to defend your decision to anybody. Calm down, and enjoy your time off while you have it.

[Maxweight]

Yes they were over in Oz last may,i attended the Perth session they had.
They show you a promotional DVD and answer questions.

The requirements are still 2000 Hours jet >50,000kg.
It would seem that since they were over here less than 12 months ago they are not getting the right numbers applying or may need to lower the requirements for entry.

Maxweight

[MMSOBGYTAST]

Thanks Mysalami,

You are right, you have calmed me right down.
Didnt think i mentioned my decision to come here, just putting some balance back into ACMSs post.

:ugh:

[ACMS]

MMSOBGYTAST: the topic is Dubai, it wasn't about Hong Kong. I was just trying to help. Take it or leave it, the choice is yours my friend.

[MMSOBGYTAST]

ACMS, The topic is EMIRATES COMING TO TOWN, and the question was What goes on at these road shows?

I just thought you were a little biased. Thats all my friend.

[halas]

Mate. With your pearler outburst as #3 contributer to this thread, no wonder others are having a go at you.
I don't defend living in Dubai, however as someone who frequents this place as irregularly as you, l find your contributions as some what meaningless.
I have been verbally abused in Australia more times than l care to remember, and not all of it was provoked. Can the Captain you speak of say the same? And, with refernce to Oz, l am not even of "Middle Eastern Appearance"!
I won't go into HKG / DXB comparison as it's chalk and cheese, but please let others make an informed decision without an emotional outburst like yours.
50 degrees has never been recorded in Dubai, but places l have worked in Australia have had temperatures like that. GA flying is like that.
Smoke and dust haze are true, but nothing like l have seen in HKG!
Is there anywhere in the world that isn't getting more expensive by the day? HKG perhaps is shrugging off developed/third world world trends?
This place is third world and there is no denying it, however there are good opportunities here for the right minded individual, even if they are not virgins.
Make an ill-informed decision and you will regret it.
halas

[vbrules]

Been in the desert almost 10 years; almost 5000 PiC heavies. Seriously considering a Beech 1900 or Saab or Dash 8 job to live in a civilised country and come home. Up to you pal...

[propaganda]

I got an all expences paid jolly last year to DXB in business class, 5* Movenpick hotel ...Thanks Emirates for your hospitality, but no thanks.;)

[Icarus2001]

The requirements are still 2000 Hours jet >50,000kg.
...and that is to be a First Officer????

No wonder they need regular visits to Australia to find crew. I am guessing there would only be a handful of those who want to move. Then again I suppose that is all they want?

[TIMMEEEE]

Do Emirates discriminate on religious grounds or sex?

Was wondering if my girlfriend,an Australian citizen but Israeli national and former medical officer in the Israeli Military would be allowed to live in Dubai?

Also if Jewish by religion or female, would that preclude pilots from applying or being processed?

So far neither has been answered.

T

[Buster Hyman]

As editor of bringbackthecrusades.com I've had similar difficulty TIMMEEEE...

[ACMS]

Since when is it wrong to voice an opinion in here???????
And it's not just my opinion either, go ask the roughly 70 EK Pilot's that quit last year why they left.
A very close mate is on the 777, has been for years and years. The information I get is first hand from him on one of my frequent trips to the pit. All I was trying to was get the VB guys and Girls to look at the "middle east" forum and get a balanced opinion on life in Dubai. So shoot me if I did the wrong thing pal.
Oh and the whole basis of this link is not only Emirates coming to town, it is quite obviously about Emirates recruiting and as such my post is totally relevent.
:ok:

[Going Boeing]

The question that will be asked most frequently at these information sessions is: When is EK going to open bases in Australia?

That would take the "heat" out of the argument about living conditions in Dubai.

For them to get the pilot numbers that they need, they will eventually have to succumb, even though they don't want to. I know that a significant number of QF pilots would move to EK if they are based in Oz and are on similar money. Problems for EK would include all the current EK Oz expat pilots demanding that they be allowed to base themselves back in Oz.

[cunninglinguist]

Hit the nail on the head boeing, if there is any sort of seniority in EK, no new or recent hiree will stand a chance of getting an Oz base, in fact, they could get killed in the stampede.

[MMSOBGYTAST]

ACMS - Mate, not wrong to voice an opinion. Since when is it wrong to point out flaws in that opinion?

You are big on quoting the numbers of EK pilots leaving. (Lots of CX leaving too from what my mates tell me in CX- going to greener better paying pastures). Did you talk to them and discover they left because of the points you made in your earlier post or might it have been for some other reason.

If you trying to get the VB guys to look at the Middle east forum as was your stated noble objective, you could have said -"Hey guys check out the discussions on the middle east forum".(which i'm sure they could locate anyway)

As I told you already the Link was on the EMIRATES road show. You are entitled to you insular opinion, I was just pointing out how useless your opinion was.

I have read your other posts on how Cathay is the perfect airline, and like the others that have replied to you, think that your opinions are both wrong and ill considered.

But Hey, feel free to say what you want. :ugh:

Ps, Im off for a swim on this glorious 27 deg day and I'll try not to get abused by any locals. Oh and no sign of any dust haze today.:p
(how is Honkas today?)

[A Yak From Yemen]

According to EK recruitment website : DEC - 8,000 total, 3,000 PIC multi crew multi eng jet a/c > 55 tonnes MTOW , 4,000 m/crew m/eng jet or turbo prop a/c MTOW 10 tonnes or more as P1 or P2.
F/O - 4,000 total, 2,000 m/crew m/eng jet a/c.......:hmm:

[ACMS]

MMSOBGYTAST:-- yes mate enjoy the 2 to 3 months a year you can go to the beach without being fried alive.
You must be crazy not to know why lots of your Pilots are leaving. They hate Dubai, hate the pay, hate the traffic jams and you work their asses off, a lot go to early retirement or join companies like Jetstar Intl on much lower pay and conditions just to get away from the sand. That must tell you something about life in the sandpit hey? maybe you could read the middle east forum?
In the last 3 months Pilot's are leaving Cx mostly to go back to the states, UPS, SWA and FEDEX, a few to Europe as well. These guys never intended to stay here in the first place and maybe Cx shouldn't have taken them. The numbers are quite small overall.
I venture to suggest that most guys leave Cx not because they hate it here but, because an offer back home too good to refuse came up.
A lot of Cx retirees even extend past 55 at B scale wages to stay here, I wish they retired but they don't in the vast majority of cases.
I'm not saying there are no problems in Cx, unfortunately there are many.
I have read your other posts on how Cathay is the perfect airline, and like the others that have replied to you, think that your opinions are both wrong and ill considered.
I never said Cx was the perfect airline, go re-read my post in reply to guys slinging off at Cx. It seems to me that Ek standards are just as good as Cx, maybe better.
Oh a Hong Kong is ok today, overcast and around 23c. But that doesn't matter with my better roster I can go almost anywhere in Asia in 4 Hours, Skiing in Sapporo, beach in Phuket, beach in Bali, mountain hiking in Taiwan. And we can use the jump seat to help us get on. We are only 8 hours from Oz, a lot closer than you guys in the pit. So go on, enjoy the beach in Dubai while you can, don't forget the sunscreen my friend. Maybe you could go land mine clearing in Lebanon perhaps?
As I told you already the Link was on the EMIRATES road show. You are entitled to you insular opinion, I was just pointing out how useless your opinion was.
So at the Emirates roadshow in Australia they are going to discuss Gulfair recruitment to Bah? duh my post was relevent, you may not agree with it, but it was relevent none the less.

[ShockWave]

ACMS,

all of what you say can and does happen in the UAE, however it is not a usual occurrence and is certainly not indicative of life in general in Dubai.
I have spent a lot of time in Hong kong and know it is not the place for me, so I am quite happy with my life in Dubai. Even if I may wish to return to a more conventional life in OZ, nobody there is offering jobs that make that decision worthwhile yet, (for me). Having just arrived home from a trip to HKG I am very much looking forward to loading up my 4WD and heading off to the mountains for a secluded weekend of camping with the family. That is something you definitely can't do in your part of the world, if you can even afford to own a car that is. So it is a major difference in life style that makes the move to Dubai or else where a big decision once you get past the money and conditions of employment. Each to their own!

Unfortunately there are no easy answers anymore because there is good and bad with all the choices. Reading what 50 guys may be complaining about does not make it true for the other ~1600 pilots nor the problems of a close mate.

[MMSOBGYTAST]

ACMS,

You are a sucker for punishment. Mate just get the facts right thats all. Too many generalisations from you and inaccurate information.

2-3months - wrong more like 6 months+, but yes it does get tooo bloody hot in summer.

I am not crazy, but i don't know why ALL the guys left Dubai as you assuredly do.
I venture to suggest that most guys leave Cx not because they hate it here but, because an offer back home too good to refuse came up.

Hey, maybe the same thing goes for the EK guys as well. This is not home, and when the time is right I too will pack up and go back home.

Overcast hey (more like smoggy). With your better roster? How do you know what my roster is like. HA!, I just had 6 days off slumming it in OMAN. Off to Milan next for 3 days then 4 days off. Anywhere in asia in 4 hrs. HA HA ok fine if thats where you want to go. Europe is pretty close to here too you know.
Landmine clearing in Lebanon? What the? I'd suggest there are a tad few more land mines in your neck of the woods (cambodia et al) than mine.
Ah whats the point? I am no longer interested in comparing incomparable things to an incomprehensible person.

Ps The beach was lovely.;)

Don't forget to take your umbrella when you go outside today (acid rain and all).

(Skiing at Sapporo HA HA HA - yeah like Europe is so much worse):p

[galdian]

Shockwave
Just wanted to say how much I enjoyed your post - you have made your choice (or know where you don't want to be), you will look at options in Oz (if/when they become decent trade off), you perceive a lifestyle that suits your family regarding time off, you agree that everyone has to make their choices as fits their own needs/perceptions.
Seems pretty fair and logical.
Seems like someone who deals in the real world.:ok:

That will, unfortunately, piss a substantial number of Ppruner's off.
To quote Mr Kelly -"such is life."

Regards to all.

[ACMS]

MMSOBGYTAST:- all reports say that Sapporo has some of the best powder skiing anywhere in the world.
Anyway..............Truth be told I don't much like Hk either, I'm staying here because I can't get as good a job in Oz. Generally speaking I like Cx and like the operation ( as said on other threads ) even if it does have a few kinks to be ironed out!!
I like the aircraft we operate and more importantly the guys and girls I fly with.
So it would have to be one hell of a good offer to up stumps here and leave for Oz, because that's about the only place I would move to.
Although If I wasn't in Cx I would most likely have been in Ek, and who knows what I might be saying then:ok:

[brown_hornet]

ACMS and MMSOBGYTAST, are you sure you guys aren't married?? You would make the perfect couple:p Thanks for the entertainment though, I now know all the pros and cons about living in Hong Kong vs Dubai.....decisions decisions:D

[MMSOBGYTAST]

Brown_hornet,

I'll save you the time going to the recruiting road show. Choose CX.

EK don't take Prop drivers with Cpls only. (Not yet anyways).

:D

[Ron & Edna Johns]

Is this a PPrune first? A dick-measuring contest between pilots about who's got the BETTER conditions?! :eek:

Maybe things really ARE looking up....

[brown_hornet]

Touche MMSOBGYTAST, it looks like I am stuck where I am until I get the vast amount of experience that EK are looking for in their pilots:ouch:

[TineeTim]

Is this a PPrune first? A dick-measuring contest between pilots about who's got the BETTER conditions?! :eek:

Actually it's even funnier than that. It's a dick-measuring contest about
"The sh*t hole I live in is better than the sh*thole you live in." Classic. Absolutely classic.......

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

Emirates to start Australian bases in the very near future.

impeccable source.....

[atiuta]

I got an all expences paid jolly last year to DXB in business class, 5* Movenpick hotel ...Thanks Emirates for your hospitality, but no thanks.

You never did answer the question on what aircraft you got offered.

As the statement appears to have no relevance to the subject, just what is your point? Sounds like sour grapes to me.

[max AB]

TIMMEEE, Being jewish or female does not exclude you from flying with EK, we have both types here already. Just don't put Jew as your religion on any paper work or Athiest for that matter... As for your girlfriend, jewish or muslim, she cannot live with you unless you get married. Many couples do, but it is against the law. As for her past, I would say just don't state it anywhere, If she has an Australian passport then there should be no problem. If she applies for a job that requires a security check I would suggest that might be a concern, but not sure. Check with the Dept of Foreign Affairs maybe??
Now back to the pissing contest...

[Going Boeing]

TCOB

I hope your sources are truly impeccable. CM said at the Second Officer briefing last year that he wasn't worried about pilots leaving QF in significant numbers unless EK started pilot bases in Oz. I suspect that his worst nightmare is about to happen. :D

[woftam]

Last one out,please turn off the lights.
:E
It would truly serve the QF management right!!!!!!! :ok:

[TineeTim]

EK would have to substantially increase their dollars though if you had to be based in Australia and pay Australian taxes.

Not compared to the total package of rent, school fees etc. paid in Dubai. If they opened a base, and that's a BIG if, they would pay as little as they thought they could get away with. I'd wager a weeks pay that a rate of about 180k for a Capt and about 100k F/O and they'd have 500+ apps inside of a week. Basically , I reckon they could pay significantly less than the 'going rate' and still be swamped with apps.

[TineeTim]

Direct, Yep and there lies the problem, and why I doubt this rumour.

Why would Emirates offer basings? The answer is most likely- to increase the pool of applicants. That means it will be for new joiners, not those already in. If it was in seniority order, the numbers in the que would be enormous and new guys would not be enticed. Emirates needs more pilots, lots of them and a basing system would do it. What would it do to the morale of those left in Dubai?????? A basing system would likely cause as many problems as it would fix. I'm not holding my breath.

[typhoonpilot]

You miss the point that basings would improve retention. Therefore obviating the need for as many new recruits. With 5% annual attrition that is a sizeable number. I would hazard to guess that most of the EK guys that left for JetStar would have stayed at EK had they been offered an Oz base.


Typhoonpilot

[Icarus2001]

and they'd have 500+ apps inside of a week. Really? More than 500 pilots who could work in Oz and have more than 2000 hours jet time?

Let's see, Virgin has about 550 pilots TOTAL.

You are dreaming.

[TineeTim]

TP- You miss my point. I don't think basings would be for those of you already there. Basings would be used to attract new guys, not keep those already there. 5% attrition is manageable if you're able to hire like crazy. Basings would allow that. Emirates needs most of their pilots in Dubai. The cold hard fact is that a lot of guys there don't have anywhere else to go.

Icarus- Virgin has 500+, QF has 2000+, Jetstar, National Jet, Jitconnict, ANZ, expats, etc. On the salary that I mentioned, with reasonable promotional opportunities, a hell of a lot of very disilusioned QF guys would certainly be interested- many out of pure spite. 500 may be a bit off the mark but I reckon it would be close to that. TT

[Vorsicht]

My guess is that you will never see basings for the simple reason EK will never accept their crews being subject to OZ/euro/North American labour laws.

If anything we may see some attempt to introduce commutable rosters. Against this is that it would require more pilots because there will be less guys available in DXB to work days off to cover shortfalls. This is also contrary to current EK policy.

Will the market become tight enough for EK to change their position on these issues?

I think we are still a fair way off that yet, judging by the guys who are still coming. We haven't even started tapping the turbo prop market yet. History shows that EK is not forward looking in these issues. They tend to roll the dice and gamble that somewhere another airline will go broke just in time to provide the required amount of pilots. Remember we are not looking at huge numbers, only 250 a year. Given that EK can source from anywhere in the world (unlike Virgin, Qanas or J*) I would say the odds are in their favour, and so far history would support that.

V

[TineeTim]

V- I agree. I don't think there's any truth to this rumour. I was only speculating on what might happen, as suggested by TCOB on the previous page. Ultimately, they're only after a couple hundred guys a year. I don't see that as being that hard. Time will tell.... TT

[ratpoison]

Hoopla Hoopla, the EK circus is in town. Have you seen the elephants, have you seen the clown. ????? :p

[Keg]

I'm sick and tired of living in interesting times.

I knew I should have copyrighted that saying when I first put it up on Qrewroom! :}

Still, I've been known to steal the occasional quote off others so no harm done! :ok:

Fascinating reading about the Oz base though. I don't think it's for me (too close to a QF command...maybe...perhaps....who knows) but the lack of schooling and accommodation and so on does address the issue that I had in the back of my mind as to why EK would bother with an Oz base. I always figured that for the money they'd have to offer that it'd be cheaper to slip crew rather than base them.

Interesting times indeed!

[Capn Bloggs]

EK will never accept their crews being subject to OZ/euro/North American labour laws.
Labour Laws? Now there's an interesting concept. What I do know is that there aren't any in Oz at the moment. She's Howard's law of the jungle until Rudd gets in (ably advised by BB of course). :yuk:

[KRUSTY 34]

At a fairwell for a mate on Friday night.

Lots of local drivers now looking overseas. Rumours everywhere, you know what they're like!

One big one doing the rounds was that EK have dropped their pure jet requirement. Not to mention some pretty outrageous claims of big big bucks on offer. (I mean Really big bucks). Checked the website, does not appear to be any changes.

Anyone else heard anything?

[assymetric]

Has anyone got news from todays show in MEL.


:ok: :ok: :ok: :ok: :ok:

[KRUSTY 34]

So Kamelf Hucker,

Do they require Jet time or don't they?

[TIMMEEEE]

Thanks Max AB.

Have made a few further enquiries.

Have been told that because of my religion (which is on my birth certificate incidentally) that I'm screwed and that in all honesty my application probably wouldnt be considered.
I cant change my religion and neither would I lie about it!
If others have lied about their religion in order to get a job then thats their business and good on them.

Having to lie on an application form in order to get a job says alot about that prospective employer.

Also, wife soon to be bride (who possesses an Israeli passport) cant even enter the country (UAE).
And being a former officer in the Israeli armed forces................

Ah, for the equal opportunity employer!!

[VH-Cheer Up]

Quote:
50 degrees has never been recorded in Dubai

Maybe not officially. They'd hate to have to send the labour workers home for the day.

That's the point... The gumment owns the met office and they tell them never to publish a temperature above whatever (46 Celsius?) because of the OHS/Labour laws.

Funny, that, a met office that has a differently calibrated thermometer, and whose pronouncements are censored.

I wonder if private ownership of thermometers is illegal in the pit?

VH-CU

[Vorsicht]

To my knowledge there is no religion that makes you unemployable at EK, even the one that we dare not speak.

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

Any feedback from the EK roadshows?

I talked to a QF CAPTAIN the other day of mid-level seniority who had an application with them. Hadn't heard of that one before.

[KRUSTY 34]

I'll ask the question again;

Do they still require Jet time?

Anyone??

[KRUSTY 34]

???????????????????????????????

[KRUSTY 34]

Sorry for the implied sarcasm,

I'll try and make it clearer what I am asking.

What I meant by Pure-Jet was Jet as opposed to turbo-prop, you know jet engines, but driving propellors!

As the the difference between Pure-Jet and Jet, Kamelf Hucker, I do not have a freak'n clue what you are talking about. But I am prepared to be enlightened.

[Mr.Buzzy]

As the the difference between Pure-Jet and Jet, Kamelf Hucker, I do not have a freak'n clue what you are talking about. But I am prepared to be enlightened.

Sounds like a good interview question to me. Time to break out the books Krusty. Hmmmmm something to do with "bypass" .... Heard of it?

bbbbbbbbbbbzzzzzzzzzzzzzbbbbbbbbbbbbbbzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[KRUSTY 34]

Thanks Buzzy.

Strolled into that one!

Think my question has been answered.

Geeezz! Sometimes it's like drawing teeth

[max AB]

TIMMEEE, who did you ask re religion...some one at EK? I joined with a guy who put Jew on his paperwork, they gave him a job then asked that in future he leave that bit blank just to avoid any hassles. Any way your choice, good luck.

[Macrohard]

For those that don't know how to us the internet search function ...

http://www.emiratesgroupcareers.com/

Have a look and see for yourselves.

[donpizmeov]

Did anyone actually go any of these open days? Many turn up? etc etc

Don

[Bart Simson]

I went and had a look. About 15 was the turn out at that one. I thought they put a good case forward and answered all questions.

:ok: :8

[propaganda]

BS.

That'll be because they're trained salesman....be cautious of strangers offering gifts.

[woftam]

15 people?
They certainly weren't swamped with interest then.
Were there more people at any of the other venues?
Time for Oz bases I reckon!!!!! :ok:
THAT will get some interest !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

[MrWooby]

I was at one of the roadshows in Brissy, probably about 50-60 including a few spouses. Questions were asked re second officer time and turboprop time. SO time is counted but only up to a mximum of 500 hours and at THIS stage heavy turboprop time (P3, HERC) doesn't count toward the requirement for 2000 hours multi crew jet. But that may change.

[fistfokker]

I attended the Brisbane recruitment seminar.
25 Direct Entry Captains required by October this year. No more expected after that. This is inspite of 160 pilots wanted this year and 500 next year. Work that out. DEC's only required for B777. No waiver on 3000hrs above 55 tonnes.
I have 4500rs jet command time but only 500hrs above 55 tonnes. I would only be considered for an F.O. position. This does not sound like a Company running short of crew, to me. That may well be the case.
Nor would I take it away from the many F.O.s aspiring to command in Emirates, understandably, they should have first go.
I was amazed at the low remuneration on offer. Less gross than a J* pilot. The only differences being taxation treatment and accommodation supplied. And people put **** on J* salaries. A Jet* pilot actually costs the company more than an Emirates pilot in pure salary terms. I do understand that accommodation and school fees etc' combine to form an expatriate enticement. But seriously, why would people leave Oz to work for that small difference.
Especially when considered along with the recruitment process.
Yes, there is a shortage of experienced pilots emerging, but it still has along way to go and will require the collective will of all pilots to ensure that real benefits flow to pilots as a result of that shortage.

[fistfokker]

F/O Bloggs, I do understand the point you are making. That is, irrespective, there is more money in the pocket.

However, that is simply a result of the tax free environment. Naturally as an end user (recipient) we tend to care only about the nett worth, but we still cannot escape the gross cost to our company. I do not deny the right of those who would take up employment on the best possible nett terms to themselves.

All I am suggesting is the looming shortage of pilots is not yet influencing the employers to offer sufficient nett remuneration to attract the experience levels that they are demanding, in numbers sufficient to meet the demands of the expanding operations they seek to crew.

The end result is my overall impression from the EK seminar was, we want you to apply, but don't be surprised if you do not meet our stringent requirements.

[Defenestrator]

Gentlemen,

On the Fragrant Forum it is quite easy to obtain info as to the 'standard' one can expect of life in HK. I am very aware that some of you have put it in black and white before. Seems pertinent to me that one of you lads should post a neutral (Yep Neutral) view of what someone can expect when joining EK. Forget all the nonsense about house maids and the like. Just what it costs to work here. I'm here a lot but not based and to be honest it's bloody expensive. Would love to know if there are less expensive options. Please give it some thought before posting, and please, no vitriol. If any of you are in a position to 'further the interest' I, for one, would appreciate it.

With Thanks

D

[Bypass ratio]

I have been with Emirates for about 1 year now and my average pay packet is around $8000 Aussies dollars in the hand/month. This month alone I have 2 Aussie trips and a JFK which is 92 stick hours and I have earnt close to$9000 Aussie dollars with around another $1000 in layover cash. If I wanted to I could pick up another trip from the crew portal and push my pay packet over the $10000 mark. I have no other bills except for mobile/internet/cable tv/car/fuel. I am so far ahead from what i was earning in Australia it isn't funny!!! By the way, the above figures aren't indicative of the 20% payrise and flight pay which doesn't kick in till next month!

[atiuta]

Please give it some thought before posting, and please, no vitriol

What did your last slave die of?

I have no need to entice you to Emirates. Try the search function next time.....

[phantom menace]

Atiuta,

Are you EK management ?

[atiuta]

That would be "no" and I fail to see your correlation.

[Defenestrator]

Not one to disappoint are you Atiuta. I simply wanted some insight. I trust that you're not the calibre of pilot at EK that I was hoping to hear from.

D :yuk:

[frangatang]

After reading these 5 pages, all of a sudden it aint so bad flying a 400 and living in SW England.Thank you youve cheered me up no end!

[atiuta]

If you wanted some insight, a politer way to ask would have been without the little lecture about what you expected in a response. BTW, had any luck?

[fistfokker]

Bypass Ratio, the seminar advised of a 6% payrise plus flight pay commencing 1st May. Where does the 20% fit in?

[donpizmeov]

The 20% pay rise furfy is how EK are trying to sell the latest pay rise that will come into effect on 1st May. It includes our normal 3% basic pay increment, the 6% pay rise and the newly introduced flight pay (Aed45 per actual block hour, up to the productivity threshold (76 to 78hrs) for Capts and not sure of what the FO payment is). The companies spin is that when flying 75hrs per month (for all 12 months), and if you are on the lowest pay increment for your rank this flight pay is equal to another 11%. We then get newbies, who are still awestruck at being in DXB, that round all this up to 20%. As its a fixed amount, the percentage of your salary for flight pay decreases as you move up the pay structure. It also does not take into account any months of leave, ground training, or when sick leave is taken and 75hrs are not flown.

This flight pay is also not included in any profit share payment, loss of licence payment, provident fund payment etc etc.

So in reality, we have received a 6% pay rise, if you push it, the flight pay might be called another 5-6%.

Don

[IFF]

What's the story regards a MILLON Bucks after 10 years?

[donpizmeov]

Well divide that by 6.5ish, and its what your provident fund A and B parts might be worth. Or if you banked every pay for those 10years without spending any of it, well maybe.

Don

[Vorsicht]

The million after 10 years has been achieved by quite a few astute real estate investors. Which actually is not a bad achievment given that for the first 3 years you can save F***all for a deposit, so after 3 years you can start putting a bit away, then if you are lucky to fall into a rampant dubai property market (sorry that's over) or a Rampant WA (****, i think that's finished too). Any way, if you can string a 100k together and are lucky enough to find a decent real estate bubble, a million should be a doddle. Also after 10 years your provident fund should just about buy a reasonable set of wheels to put in the garage.

[bigilla]

I have been with Emirates for about 1 year now and my average pay packet is around $8000 Aussies dollars in the hand/month. This month alone I have 2 Aussie trips and a JFK which is 92 stick hours and I have earnt close to$9000 Aussie dollars with around another $1000 in layover cash. If I wanted to I could pick up another trip from the crew portal and push my pay packet over the $10000 mark. I have no other bills except for mobile/internet/cable tv/car/fuel. I am so far ahead from what i was earning in Australia it isn't funny!!! By the way, the above figures aren't indicative of the 20% payrise and flight pay which doesn't kick in till next month!

Interesting indeed Bypass Ratio:
with Emirates for about 1 year? Your previous posts show you did your interview around Aug/Sept 06 and joined (possibly) around Oct/Nov. Which I reckon is only 6 months.
I can see with your reasoning how you came up with a figure of 20% for the payrise.......you're right, it isn't funny at all.
Don't get me wrong - it's good to see the bright side of life, but be careful with the figures.

[Mack Tuck]

Bypass Ratio will be one of the first management FOs or trainers as his figures are preposterous; they are all 'about' or 'around' or 'close to'. Knock $1000 off each and you are getting close (on the high side).
Mr Wooby interesting comment; I know a guy here who got an accelerated command with only C130 time and we all know how relevant that is to airline flying.

[donpizmeov]

The web site shows a FOs salary at the moment for a new joiner as Aed 19660. With exchange rate at Aed2.92= Aud1 (been around there for months now) that equates to $Aud6732. A wee bit under the $8000 as quoted. After May the pay goes to Aed 20840 which is $Aud 7136, hmmm, thats still below the 8 grand.

At least Bypass didn't have to pay for his type rating this time.

Don

[Bypass ratio]

Okay, for those of you who need a recap on Maths 101 then read on:
Monthly pay:19660
Exchange rate protection:1359
Overtime:3920
Telephone allowance:22
Total: $8699 Australian dollars after the conversion
I also received close to $1000 Aussie dollars on layovers!!

BTW Don, I didn't have to pay for my endorsement this time, but I am bonded! Also, if I didn't buy my endorsement all those many years ago, I wouldn't be where I am now!!

[fatbus]

you can get the overtime for @ 8-9 months after that you hit the max hours and end up in the sim. if you take the new package and use 900hrs times the flt pay and do the math you might get a better idea of what to expect for the year

[alpine blue]

Look at it this way most of the Ausie airlines, I think there are 2, will be brought out or bankcrupt in the next few years so we may as well all go and fly in the Middle East. Lets face it unless you are an over paid and underworked Qantas pilot they are paying better than Aus, and reading through the threads about the down side of living there whats so good about living with these beer swilling Ausies, trouble is most have not left the big island but have an opinion on all the places they have not seen.

[gritandmud]

the seminar advised of a 6% payrise plus flight pay commencing 1st May. Where does the 20% fit in?

I heard 6% per year for next 3 yrs which would probably meet the 18 or 20% you might have heard of.

[max AB]

Grit and Mud, you are true to the rumour nature of this Forum that's for sure. When guys like Don tell you how it is, ie the facts, following it up with a rumour only confuses people, sorry mate. Don might like dressing up in woman's clothing now and then, hey who doesn't, but at least he has given the facts.

[donpizmeov]

Those heels are a Bugg@ when caught under the foot rests...errr, I mean rudder peddles. But a fella has to make a living somehow.

Don

[illusion]

Arguing over a few bucks here or there is irrelevant to the situation. How much more expensive is it to live there? How many $$$$$$$ do you need to spend to keep the missus and kids happy , so she won't spit the dummy and go home? I see a lot said about the indoor snow / ski centre. How much would it cost to take the family there for a few hours?
Yes the tax is lower etc but you don't get something for nothing.

[max AB]

2 hours skiing with all the gear thrown in is about AUD50.00 .... that should sway it for most.."so where the bloody hell are you?"

[Mysalami]

Here is one for the books. I have it on very good authority that a QF captain has resigned from QF, and will shortly be winging his way to DXB to become a DEC B777. Seems he may not be the only one.

Good luck to him. I hope he has made the right decision.

[Kamelchaser]

Just thought I'd bring this thread back up to see what the response was from the NZ leg of the great EK travelling roadshow.

What's the thoughts from the AirNZ guys about the package offered? Had heard some rumours that most people down there weren't too impressed.

I know when I left NZ a few years back, the FO wage looked pretty good (when the NZD was worth 42UScents). Now, I'd be looking at the wage on a NZD basis, and thinking that it's not that good.

Thoughts, comments?

[horserun]

Hey Kamelchaser (love the name!)

I don't think EK came to NZ (I could be wrong, but didn't hear of anything).
There would be guys keen to work for EK, but you know how hard it is to get 2000 hours jet time in NZ!!

Rumor has it that a few guys from Air NZ will be coming over to EK for a spell, with Air NZ being over staffed in captains and F/Os. From what I understand these guys maybe jumping straight into commands. What do the local kiwis and dingoes think of this??

[Kamelchaser]

Brief reply as I have to go to work..again!

Seems to be a general concensus that guys coming from AirNZ for a temporary contract won't help us in our efforts to get better terms and conditions, as EK seems to have its head firmly in the sand when it comes to the pilot shortage. Rather than improve the T&Cs to retain their existing workforce, they're out hunting for an ever decreasing (and ever more inexperienced) pilot pool.

When you consider that AirNZ guys coming here will really only be undermining our hopes of improvements here, one would hope that those (AirNZ) guys are not the same ones that complained a years back when new joiners were signing different contracts, thereby undermining their own T&Cs.

On top of that, with enduring links back in NZ (ie..a gauranteed position back with AirNZ), surely coming to the sandpit (especially on an FOs wage) and paying NZ taxes, I can't see it being a particularly inviting proposition.

sorry for any typos..no time to check..off on another long trip..hopefully with a cabin full off happy girls.:}

[horserun]

Seems a real shame that these AirNZ guys will stand on the toes of their fellow kiwis and dingoes, all for a holiday in the sandpit and a bit of extra coin. If the shoe was on the other foot, and EK guys were coming over here to jump straight into a commands ALPA would be screaming!


Why doesn’t ALPA do anything?

All the best to the boys in the sandpit.:ok:

[aircabbie]

gents i have personally lived for 6mths in Dubai , and traveled through the UAE and i reckon its a **** hot place to live and comes second on my list of places in the world . Try it before you knock it . You will have no problem with your partners going there regarding religion . i assure you that that Dubai is much much more westernised that most care to imaging .... Each to there own of course gents .

[MinimaNoContact]

Aircabbie, a mate of mine left QF for EK, and after 5 yrs in the sun he reckons that it is a ****ty and hot place also! ;)

[Wiley]

I suppose the ANZ people going to EK - (that's if they're going - has it been confirmed yet?) - are either the same people who owe their positions in the ANZ hierarchy to being... shall we say 'followersoftyler' (hopefully, that won’t be too cryptic for most pilots in ANZ), or if they're too young to have that dubious label around their woebegone necks, would have been if they'd been on the scene in ANZ at that time.

[max AB]

Aircabbie, I agree with you, don't knock a place until you have tried it...after 6 months you have hardly tried it now have you. If Dubai comes second on your place in the world, what place comes first ?..every where else?? Enjoy the fishing.

[ShockWave]

I don't think ANZ guys comming to dubai for three year contracts will decrease our T&Cs, in fact it may have the opposite effect.

I was in AKL when the recruiting guys were doing their thing re- roadshow and they said most of the interest came from S/O and F/Os.
At best it is a short term recruiting goal with the slight possibillity that some of them might decide to stay after three years.
It would then follow: that it would be in the best interest of EK to make these guys want to stay and the only way to do that is to pay and treet us all well. They will not be captive and all have good jobs to return to after all.

It is a great opportunity for these guys, we all would have liked the same offer when we came over here. Most pilots in EK enjoy the first few years of life style in the UAE, after that it can get tough for some. Great aircraft and flying with a job back at home when your time is up! or perhaps stay on for the command? :D If things are tough in ANZ and you can't see an end to it any time soon then you really should consider the offer seriously.

[NO LAND 3]

Yeah, I can't see a problem with FO's coming. Captains? Well I'd like to see the reaction if I turned up in AirNZ as a DEC on the 777!

[galdian]

Well I'd see this as one of the greatest opportunities available to a Command Pilot - IF IF IF you put a price on your head and see what happens.
Correct me if I'm wrong - Emirates are coming to see me and not vice verca ??
Emirates decline - you still have a job.
Emirates accept - they pay YOUR terms.

The F/o's in Emirates - NO it's not correct, NO it's not fair but that's the ethic of the airline you joined, their ability to recruit the best (THEIR PR crap, not questioning personally) but not have the best training system to upgrade their (selected best!) pilots should be puzzling to anybody of reasonable intellect but seems puzzling to the Emirates management team.
Management and leadership - do not get me started. :( :mad:
Regards to all.

[MMSOBGYTAST]

Galdian- What the??????

Emirates does have a good training system, but not enough trainers at the moment apparently.

[xkred27]

Galdian, please come you sound like a great bloke......:mad:

[galdian]

xk
rest assured I am not on the way, the sandpit has never attracted me, others think differently and are happy to work there - I hope they enjoy their time and make the most of it. :ok:

MM - no point having a great training system if you do not have enough trainers.
I wouldn't have thought it was rocket science to match up the numbers but appears too difficult for the (your?) management to achieve.

The point is there will be increasing movement of experienced pilots around the world, some airlines will use tactics such as DEC's to "divide and conquer" the troops or because they are just plain incompetent.
You want to shoot the guys who take up opportunities available to them by all means go ahead, I just think you are aiming at the wrong people.

As a PIC you screw up bad enough you will be thrown in gaol.
Management screws up and they........................get promoted. :ugh:
Just doesn't seem right.

xk apologies if I raised your hackels, admittedly I went fishing a bit and got a bigger bite than expected.

[cunninglinguist]

Yodawg, he is possibly working on the VB way of calculating wages ( super, o/n allow., working on days off, tax return etc ) :}

[MMSOBGYTAST]

yodawg,

do they change the atis- is that what you are saying, to keep the temp less than 50 deg? i dont think so.
What is the wage after May? And before you start I know its not a 20 % rise, but it is more than 19 660. (Even the 19660 is not completely true because you get exchange rate protection on top do you not?)

[max AB]

Mud or Mustard...after May the new joiner F/O will get 19660 plus 6% ie 20840dhs. That is his basic, add some ERP of about 1300 and it is around AUD 7400/month at todays rate. He/she gets that without flying so you could add roughly 78hrs of flying pay to that as well at 35dhs /hr. So we get about AUD8300 per month for around 10 months of the year then AUD 7400/mth for the other two. (You don't fly for 12mths of the year, leave, sims, sickness etc). I'm not an F/O so I stand to be corrected.... as usual. Any overtime is a bonus.

[mention1]

I went to the Show at Sydney. About 50 people including spouces. Relevant points are:

280 pilots needed this year
45 x A380 and 56 x B777 on order.
3 - 4.5 years to a command
$36000 bond for 3 years

We asked the HR lady if significant turbo-prop time was allowed and she said outright sorry, we can't help you. Asked the same question to the Captain and he said maybe.

Hope this helps somebody.
:cool:

[TurbTool]

I attended the roadshow in Brisbane. I thought they made it very clear that EK would only employ pilots who had permanently severed ties with their current employer. Even emphasising that written proof of the severed ties be provided.

It was stated that while there was an existing requiremnt for 25 direct entry captains this year, it is company policy to promote from the FO ranks if at all possible. No DEC for next year contemplated (at this stage).

i got the distinct impression that the whole recruitment drive was for Fo's who could reasonably expect promotion to command after completing the first 3 years of service. That EK were about emphasising that a career was available for suitable pilots seeking entry to such a career.

It was stated here also that only jet experienced pilots were of interest to EK.

[VH-Cheer Up]

Turbtool said: I thought they made it very clear that EK would only employ pilots who had permanently severed ties with their current employer. Even emphasising that written proof of the severed ties be provided.

Why would they insist ties are permanently severed? That almost implies some level of acrimony.

In most other walks of life, employers are happier to poach an employee from a competitor than to pick up someone who is not currently working - with all the baggage that may or may not go with their apparent "freedom".

Given the current pilot shortage and the so-called full employment in Australia, isn't it rather unrealistic to expect a qualified jet FO to be sitting around with no ties to an employer?

The whole "severed ties" thing sounds like spin to avoid EK being labelled as poachers. The next thing Darth will want is a government ban on EK recruiting in Australia.

Or anywhere else.

[coaldemon]

Would not the severed ties thing in actual fact mean that you have finished with you current employer. I would imagine they have had a few guys who took long service leave or Leave without pay tried it for a few months and then headed back to their current employer.

[VH-Cheer Up]

Would not the severed ties thing in actual fact mean that you have finished with you current employer. I would imagine they have had a few guys who took long service leave or Leave without pay tried it for a few months and then headed back to their current employer.

OK, so the severed ties might be a final condition precedent to an offer of employment being accepted?

I understood TurbTool's comment to mean they would not even entertain an application to commence the recruitment process unless ties were first demonstrably severed.

I guess that makes more sense. You can apply, and EK will make an offer, and part of your acceptance has to include proof that you've left your previous employer. If that's what it is, that works.

[Poto]

I guess that makes more sense. You can apply, and EK will make an offer, and part of your acceptance has to include proof that you've left your previous employer. If that's what it is, that works.

Most Oz airlines also have this reqiurement. Certificate of service will usually suffice.:cool:

[ShockWave]

EK require you to provide a letter stating you have terminated your employment with your previous employer only after you accept an offer of employment with them. ie. Prior to to commencing your training.
Unless EK have an understanding with a specific airline, such as the Air NZ thing.
I don't think EK has any such understandings with any OZ airlines, so you would have to provide proof of your resignation from your current job prior to starting at EK. All that is required is your letter of termination of employment.