AFT vs CABAR vs OAT.

[early_bird]

Hi guys/gals,
I have read quite a bit of the threads asscoiated with these FTOs however it looks as if my situation is somewhat unique.

I have been granted fATPL sponsorship by 'my' government and they have created a report depicting my 'options' along with the associated costs.
Understandably, they have brought up the issue of the large variations in overall costs between the three schools i.e. why should we pay £15000 more to school X when we could have you attend school Y and, ultimately, attain exactly the same ratings (bear in mind I will be studying full time)



Firstly I would like to know, if 'money were no object', which of these these would you use for your Zero-fATPL/ Integrated fATPL training and why?.

Secondly which of these would give me the best value for money (best bang for my buck...so to speak)? I know they all lead to the fATPL, I've also been told that with the AFT option I would gain about 60-70 hours of 'extra' flying time.

The costs came to the following:

AFT: £60,400
CABAIR: 68,800
OAT: £76,700



Thanks everyone,
Cheers, E.B

[neilia]

I'd be having a serious look at CTC Wings and Jerez (EFT I think it is). Depending on what the extra hours are flown in, I can't imagine that they're going to make the slightest difference to your employment prospects.

Out of curiosity, what's unique about your situation?

[early_bird]

Hi neilia, thanks for your views. I've added more details above.

[scroggs]

Your situation is not unique; all wannabes have to make a choice about which school to attend, and have to make that choice on the available evidence. The fact that 'your government' will be funding the process is neither here nor there. Therefore, it's not enough to have read 'quite a bit' of the threads about these schools. You must read all of them. And you must contact and, if possible, visit the schools in order to form your own impression. One of the things you must ask each school is to justify their pricing policy.

CTC is unlikely to have anything to offer you. It is relies on competitive selection against known positions at certain UK airlines, and is aimed at wannabes who will effectively be self-funding via a specialist finance scheme. By all means contact them, but I doubt you will need to take your enquiry with them any further. You should, on the other hand, investigate more of the other schools regularly mentioned on here.

Scroggs

[early_bird]

Thanks Scroggs. I have researched the threads allot, its just that I haven't been able to read every post on every thread (except for the AFT thread as this one is short when compared to the others) i.e. those dating back 4 years etc. I've mainly been looking posts which were made in the last 2-3 years as those prior seem to be giving outdated info. and therefore contradicting present posts. The same goes for the Integrated vs. Modular debate.

I also realize that training costs always have, and always will be an issue for all but a very select few. With this in mind, it's inevitable that the cost of a particular FTOs program will have an impact on the individual’s final decision. But this is not my money and therefore that aspect/ gut feeling, which has proved crucial to other's decisions in the past, is not with me.
The OAT program includes JOC and First Officer Fundamentals, the Cabair program also includes similar 'extras' the AFT program has no such extras....does this justify the added costs?

Would someone who went to OAT for instance, although having the same ratings and scores as another who went to Cabair, have a certain prestige about them? e.g. If I had gained a Msc from The University of Cambridge, and you had gained a Msc (in the same subject and with the same scores) from the University of Salford.....Wouldn't the guy who studied at the well known and well respected Cambridge get the job? I know it's not really that simple but bear with me.
Does this prestige, if any, justify some of the costs?

Basically I've been told that if all three of the aforementioned FTOs provide to same outcome, we will go with the most cost effective FTO.

So at the end of the day, do these FTOs "really" provide the same outcome?

Thanks for reading this somewhat long and mind-numbing post,
Cheers all,
E.B

BTW: I am not situated in the UK and neither is 'my' Govt, however we are a British Overseas Territory. A colleague has been calling, visiting etc with these FTOs on my/ the Govts. behalf.
:)

[scroggs]

If someone else is paying for your training, is this towards a specific airline job? Or are you and your government taking a punt on you getting employed by someone, somewhere? If so, for whom and where are you hoping to work?

Despite the protestations of certain schools, there is little implied prestige in having studied at one school over any other. Integrated course graduates are preferred by a few airlines, others are vociferous in preferring those who've had to work a bit harder to get there (this may have something to do with outdated perceptions of flying training, but that's irrelevent). The fact is, all that counts is the licence. Very few airlines even ask where you did your training.

Scroggs

[ATPLwhoops]

Hi,

Honestly the comparison should be between the four recognised CAA Integrated schools:

OAT
Cabair
FTE
WAAC

Which should u go for if money was an object and if money was not an object!

Going for the school with the most multi engine hours should be more valuable!!


What you think?


ATPLWHoops

[Katherine Alexandra]

It is a tricky one- my personal choice was between OAT and FTE. I didn't feel Cabair would suit me as a person. In the end, we (myself and my mother :rolleyes: i'm only ickle really) decided upon OAT, assuming the Skills Assessment would go ok, which it did, due to my not having to live abroad for the whole 15+ months.

Go visit them- I know people who have been to FTE and they're pleased with the training they received. Ditto OAT, although with both there were obviously little things that individual students didn't like. Choosing a FTO is such a personal thing really!

[early_bird]

Hi again,
So basically I'd have a better chance of going with either OAT or Cabair if I am to maximize my chances of getting employed with low hours?

This is probably going to sound strange to most of you but here goes.

My Govt. has awarded me this sponsorship on the basis that an airport will have been built in my country, actually it's a very small tropical Island in the middle of the South Atlantic, by the year 2012. They are also working on having me employed by the operator/ airline which will eventually serve the Island - I cannot say which airline as there is currently a short-list and my employment is therefore likely to still in the early stages of negotiations.

I've been awarded a 'Delayed Bond' in that I will be free to seek employment in the UK or elsewhere until around 2012 as my 'skills' will be of no use to me on the island until said time arrives. Routes are likely to include South Africa, UK, Europe etc depending on which operator gets the contract.

The airport will only have provisions for an aircraft of around B737 size, so hops will be the order of the day, although at least one operator has expressed interest in using aircraft with extended rang to allow direct flights to the UK.

As mentioned earlier, I have been given a 'choice' of these three FTOs. I cannot attend WAAC as the bulk of my training has to be done in the UK. I cannot attend FTE for the same reasons as well as I haven't got the necessary quals required for entry i.e. one A-level, three AS-levels etc. I'm not stupid; there's only one secondary school and they are severely under staffed hence I could only take a single A-level. :E No, really!

I'll have to look into which of the above FTOs provide the most multi hours.

Thanks again guys,
I really do appreciate it :ok: :D
Take care, EB

[scroggs]

I assume you are from St Helena?

I would advise you and your sponsor to talk directly to the schools you have shortlisted. You may well find that you (or rather, your sponsor) can negotiate better terms than the advertised commercial prices. Remember that you will need to factor in accommodation and other living expenses for the 18 months or so that you will be under training.

You will also need to consider the selection procedures you may need to undergo for some of the courses on offer at OAT and Cabair. Have you undertaken any aptitude testing so far? What criteria did your government use to select you for training? Did they talk to the experts first? If you don't know, or you haven't been tested against established criteria, you may wish to consider carefully your next step. I would suggest, at the very least, you undergo a CAA Class 1 medical and the GAPAN aptitude tests. This will require you to travel to UK, I imagine, and will be an additional cost, but you can't leave too much to chance here.

Given your particular and unusual circumstances, it may be that CTC could in fact help you. I would strongly advise you - or, rather, your sponsor - to talk to all the potential schools and learn something about the requirements, the training, and the potential help available.

Scroggs

[early_bird]

Thanks Scroggs, my sponsors have undergone extensive talks with these three schools along with said experts; they just wanted my thoughts on the short lised FTOs.
Its not like the blind is leading the blind:) and I serrously doubt my thoughts will have any influence what so ever on the outcome.

I'm off to the UK within the next 2 months to take the Class 1 Medical and Apptitude tests (if I am to attend either OAT or Cabair) along with interviews etc. Accomodation etc. etc. etc has already been factored for, the projected costs have been calculated and I'm awaiting their decision.
Also, I'm paying. the sponsorship dosn't begin until I'm offered an unconditional a place on which ever course they finally decide on (assuming I pass the Class 1 Medical and, if necessary, apptitude tests) Should I fail either - it's all off.

thanks again, EB

[African Drunk]

early bird by AFT do you mean Airways Flight Training Exeter?