GF Pay rise (since debunked - morphed to ID seat-priority cat-fight)

[gulfair_sexy]

Hi every one.................... is any one heard any news regarding a pay rise......................soon in gulf air????????:ugh:

[point8four]

Hee Hee, and the punch line is.......??????

[Heleheleyani]

Yes I heard the new CEO is not happy with his salary and requesting a payrise so he is probably gonna get it

[Trader]

How about some fairness in rostering along with that payraise!!!????? STill the favoritism goes on with those connected ones getting the cream.

[ironbutt57]

happens everywhere mates, read the news...American Airlines manages somehow through amongst other things furloughing and pay cutting crews,,,to post a 240 million or thereabouts profit....and the management bonuses...the guys that ran the place into the sewer in the first place....exactly that amount the entire year's profit out the door as bonuses....go figure:ugh:

[Panama Jack]

Where there is a lot of profit, you take a lot of money.

When there is little profit, you take everything.

[boeingdriverx]

Ok here is the latest rumour i heard from a senior management guy:

increase in housing allowance by something like 100 BD

better than nothing ?

I heard also from a friend of a friend (so don't shoot the messenger) that we might get some extra % on the basic. Me HOPE 10-15, me usually GET 3-5...

BD

[Trader]

Another rumour - new CEO not coming now due to a clause in his old/existing contract.

Fact: CSM's now receive an upgrade to First Class on a leave ticket (subject to availability) while the FO's get Biz class!!!!!Isn't that a gem!

Not that the leave ticket is all that valuable. Over the last month I have witnessed 2 families getting bumped off our flights on CONFIRMED leave tickets. The one case was a friends wife who took 3 nights to get on a flight and when she did she got a jumpseat -- she is preganant and was travelling with a 2 year old.

I am sorry to sound like a complainer BUT THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE. Not only does it breach our contract but it is dismal treatmnt of employees in general.

[ironbutt57]

The "confirmed" leave ticket bumping is a problem no doubt....many many of the CSM's finally get the first class ride they deserve it used to embarrass me to sit in first while a senior 20 yrs+ CSM rode in the back...

[Trader]

They may well deserve it but I think the FO's do as well. Not forgetting that many FO's have been here longer than many CSM's.

[LDG NO BLUE]

Hello Trader,

If a company sits the chief purser on First and the First Officer on biz, this should tell you a lot about how important you/we are for them.

There is a clear chain of command and there cannot be that the the flight attendant sits in the first class, regardless of service time.:ugh:

GFA may as well chose to put the CSM to ride on the right hand seat, lots of empty seats lately and the resignations are keeping up the pace.

LNB

[Heleheleyani]

LDG NO BLUE, I cannot agree with you more, I am out of here soon so I don't really care in a way but on the other hand breaking the chain of command would be a huge mistake and IB you are talking nonsense, seniority is not an issue here.

[Panama Jack]

The so-called, "confirmed" leave ticket has always been a bumpable ticket-- it is just a non-rev ticket with higher boarding priority. Same thing for the ID50's that you or your parents/immediate family may purchase. This is why I would never bother purchasing ID50's for myself or immediate family-- there just isn't the value for the much higher cost. If you are flightdeck, just buy an ID90 for C or A class and the boarding priority should trump any Y-class standbys if airplane fills up (and take your chances, save the money).

The exception is the ID50's for your Nominees-- they are not to bumpable (although some gate agents may not realize that). So it has been explained to me.

Now if leave ticket holders get bumped while Space-Available ticket holders ride, we have a real issue.

[ironbutt57]

well hehelayni....make sure and pass that 'round to the csm's who worked so hard for so many years...nice arrogant attitude you have there....

[scanscanscan]

The reality is the whole staff travel/leave tickets/crew welfare/GF pension for expats thing has been stuffed since 1976 when new contracts were forced onto crews on a sign or resign basis...the other news worth considering is it does not get any better when you seek to use your 20year retirement travel ticket perk.

[Trader]

Panama Jack - not sure about your contract but mine says I get ONE confirmed seat per year for my family. It says NOTHING about an ID50. I understand this to mean that I get what it says - one confirmed seat that is NOT bumpable or of lower priority than other paying passangers.

SO I take HUGE issue with the fact that I may be bumped. In my opinion if I am bumped outbound my leave had better be extended - inbound I will take my family back to our family home and tell GF to organize something. I have a young family and cannot be travelling back and forth to the airport for days on end hoping to get on. Especially, as I said, when my contract says it is confirmed.

Also, it should be noted that our contract says a FULY PAID confirmed ticket!! The taxes I have been paying break the contract as well so I am hoping to get them back.

I can take a lot of things and, in general, my family and I are happy here but what I will NOT accept is these breaches of our agreement. If I am expected to comply with the contract (and bond) then so is the company. Integrity on both sides is not too much to ask.

I had to fight for a year and half just to get my joining freight sorted etc etc etc. So, basically, I am tired of being taken advantage of, and, while I don't believe that GF is purposly trying to do that I do find that no one wants to take responsibility for any of the above issues and we go round and round and round. Untill someone forces the issue in some manner.

[gulfair_sexy]

WHY CHIEF AND CSM offered first class leave ticket, while our F/O business class..... is that fair? and how about Captains when traveling....are Chief's and CSM had pirority over them if they are junior captain ? VPO wake up:mad:

[Panama Jack]

You have a very valid point Trader, and you've expressed it very eloquently. :D

[gulfair_sexy]

WHY CHIEF AND CSM offered first class leave ticket, while our F/O business class..... is that fair? and how about Captains when traveling....are Chief's and CSM had pirority over them if they are junior captain ? VPO wake up

[Heleheleyani]

well hehelayni....make sure and pass that 'round to the csm's who worked so hard for so many years...nice arrogant attitude you have there....

IB; you try to have an opinion about every subject and whey you have an opinion you close the doors and think that you are right and every other opinion has to be wrong, (this is the attitude of G.W.B) I have nothing against the CSMs I respect their seniority and their work over the years to the company I wish everyone travels in the economy class, I wish there would be no classes in the airplanes. That's not the point the point is the chain of command would be broken, besides you can imagine of a scenario of a CSM who work just over 3 years for the company traveling in the same flight and there's an FO who joined 10 years ago. I suggest that you try to think rationally if that's possible. Have a nice day.

[Deutscher]

Pay rise for Gulf!? On the contrary, they're going to take away from the pilots to give to the CEO! Ok, now for reality, I would like to know what a Captain on the A320 earns at Gulf. Who can help me?

[skywaytoheaven]

mmmm.... CSM in company 20 years, f/o 6 months, and will probably be in another airline this time next year, this doesn't seem unreasonable, and I'm one of the f/o's!

[ironbutt57]

The chain of command applies to operating crews...when we are not operating, or deadheading for for operational reasons, and are in civvies I cannot possibly see what the "chain of command" has to do with anything...has anybody questioned this "f" class policy, or just complained about it on Pprune?? Are you a 10yr f.o. heleheleyani? Take it up with the appropriate fleet office maybe the policy will be reviewed...sure it's a bit disappointing to see "junior" csm's getting a better seat than a flight deck, but my friend leave "chain of command" out of the picture...or do you roam the streets of Manama in your uniform because "chain of command" has nothing to do when not on duty...and as far as your comment on opinions, this is what the forum is for right?? feel free to disagree...

[Bombay HF]

Just curious Ironbutt, as a four year DEC are you as embarrassed sitting in First Class while your 10 years plus FO is down the back?

[Stratosphere6000]

Ha ha good one Mumbai...was waiting for some1 to pose that Q to the master.........

[ironbutt57]

Yah dont think it's really fair at all...asked many times when I first joined what it was all about, but recieved the same glum answer..."not knowing"...but relax, on my leave ticket I was bumped from first as a senior CSM was seated in first....so I will put my money where my mouth is...are you able to do that, or just your feet instead?? Have a nice day children...go complain where it counts ...if you have the spine to do so:hmm:

[LDG NO BLUE]

Good morning Ironbutt,

I don't expect you to know the subtilities of leadership, but you are so wrong when you think that putting the senior flight attendant in F, while the FO flies in business does not affect the chain of command.

I'm not complaining about the J class, I love the skybeds and ID travel makes travelling on business financially palatable.

If you look into other organisations, you will not find that a Section Chief, will travel FIRST, while the Vice-President sits in business.
Our aircraft is just like a little working cell having its own CEO, VP and Supervisors. It has to have a chain of command, like it or not.
In the military, you will not see an Officer riding with 2nd Class tickets while the Sargeant is on 1st Class. They are off duty, like we are.

It's just not right and it amazes me that you, Ironbutt fiercely agree with this policy.

As for adressing the competent channels to solve the problem. There are no competent channels in Gulf Air.

Unless you voluntarily give your FIRST seat to your FO while you're travelling, all what you are saying is just a bunch of hypocrisies and empty words.

Take care,
LNB

[Trader]

I hate to say it boys - but personal attacts show a complete lack of professionalism. You can attack an arguement or your treatment at GF but you had better do it in a constructive way if you hope to be acknowledged and, more importantly, if you hope to have your views taken seriously and with respect.

Any moran can rant and rave. Any moron can attack the messanger and not the message.

Finally, that is exactly the attitude that does NOT make a good captain. I would expect someone in the left seat to be able to coherantly explain themselves in a manner befiting the position. ANYONE can be trained to fly an airplane. The abiliy to take a command however requires, at a bare minimum, the qualities above.

Don't expect a command if you can't at least express yourself without resorting to personal attacks.

[JoeJack]

Although Trader`s rethoric is technically correct, it doesn`t necessarily apply to LNB`s post. Yes, it was definitely aimed at IB57`s post, but if you read it carefully, you might realize that there are more objective rather than subjective points.

LNB`s points are all valid regarding chain of command and stuff. And the best of it all:

"As for adressing the competent channels to solve the problem. There are no competent channels in Gulf Air. "

Bravo.

Trader, have you ever tried or actually got something useful out of your CP? HOFO? VPO? PCE? Well, we barely have one now! Although he will only take the helm on the April Fool`s Day... another joke perhaps?

Safe Flights:ok:

JJ

[Trader]

I was actually replying to Turtles post - which was a personal attack.

THe problems at GF are systemic. One part doesn't know what the next is doing and this can only be resolved at the very highest levels. The current HOFO and the last did their best to do what they could but I can see how their hands are tied.

IMO, any new CEO will need carte blanche from the board to completly overhaul this company. It is bloated with too many employees and corruption (just look at the favoritism even as far down as rostering). That is the ONLY way to make GF financialy viable.

But I am not holding my breath and simply fight each battle I come across one by one. I can either accept that or leave. For now I accept it - but with complaints ;)

[tbaylx]

Congratulations for your excellent post. Especially some of these DEC's on the 767 seem to be utterly useless. "The" Deputy Captain ;)

That has certainly not been my experience on the 767, most of the expat captains are quite proffesional, least all the ones i have worked with.

[Trader]

Yup came from Jetsgo. Chopped enough wood in my day too.

[Panama Jack]

All well put Trader. I guess we'll see what flavor André Dosé brings us in the Spring and what level of backing he will have from the Board to do what is necessary. Fingers crossed.

[ironbutt57]

LNB...(likely no balls)

1) If you like the military style join the military..GF is civilian.
2) I dont seem to recall having any compunction (look it up) to the f.o.'s riding in "f"
3) I was merely espousing my approval of the CSM's chance now to do so
4) I have ridden in y class many many times while deadheading and "junior staff" f.o.'s s.o. whatever rode in y, of f...they were already there I am not chicken**** enough to make a point of it...
5) If nyone posting here nas operated as an operating crewmember with me, and feels I didnt support them in one way or another...then pass that info along to me at the time...we can all learn something..
6)If I ever have the misfortune of flying with a crybaby like LNB (likely no balls) pls speak up, you can have my seat in F class...

have a nice day children...byebye

[Albergineman]

Hi there!

Hey "Guythatstandseverythingfrombehind57" do not take it as a personal issue! You seem to be a very receptive guy but you need to learn how to accept the things that comes from the opposite side.
Speak seriously! Nobody deserves it!

:}

[ironbutt57]

I accept the opinion..even agree with him..to a point...but I was referred to as a hypocrit...I dont percieve myself to be...when complying with a company policy...if these folks want a change it is up to GF to change the policy...if an f.o. senior wants to ask me for my f class boarding pass when travelling...i'll gladly hand it over...if they want a change in policy allowing them to obtain "f" class staff travel priviliges...then I would have no problem with a senoir to me f.o. csm whatever bumping me out of class...I have no control over it..i enjoy the "f" class privileges..many times i staff travel with my "friends" that are not entitled, i relinquish my seat up front to a random passenger and sit in y class...it's not an ego problem with me, as it seems to be with others here....case closed...see y'all later