Aberporth

[teifiboy]

I doubt if anyone out there has even heard of the place, but here goes anyway.
Suggestions in local papers that there are major developments planned at last. Any info anyone?

[mathers_wales_uk]

i know that there is rumours of a wales air link. I know RAF Valley was mentioned and base being at CWL but i'm not sure if aberporth is mentioned. The WAG will be funding a private company to operate the routes.

:ok:

[Barnaby the Bear]

I could see see a shuttle type service from there to BRS or CWL. But not a great deal more.
They would need a longer runway, instrument approaches, full ATC etc.
UAV development is where Aberporth is cashing in.

[teifiboy]

On the back of the UAV industry, QinetiQ seem to have big plans for the airfield talking of bringing the airfield's facilities up to the standard of London City Airport and yesterday, the local paper revealed a £5 million development of the terminal and other facilities

[AlanM]

But there are full ATCers there already!??

[flower]

NATS mans the ranges not the Airport at Aberporth

[Barnaby the Bear]

Thats right. Its only A/G radio at Aberporth Airfield.

[AlanM]

I know that they don't man it - and it is FISO... but is not at the same place? (ie NATS has people there already?)

Wouldn't be that hard would it?

[Barnaby the Bear]

I stand corrected...FISO.
And you are probably right. The Radar used for the ranges is just outside the aerodrome boundary on the cliffs.
However as I understand it, the NATS controllers aren't permanantly on sight and practically work under another company. I believe they move around the country operating various ranges. Would it be viable for NATS to operate a Radar service for Aberporth airport as well as the ranges on a full time basis?
Anyone from NATS Aberporth?

[AlanM]

They would probably need twice the staff!!!
Seriously, I know one from my course, an ex RN pinger - and he is always up in Scotland etc.
Good contract to step into for NATS??!?! :)

(Barnaby - he TOLD me FISO - but he is Welsh so who knows........you maybe right)

[Barnaby the Bear]

I'm Welsh too!!!!!!!!!! :}











Ok I lied........ OOpps is that racist!? :ugh:

[teifiboy]

Details released today

A £5m scheme to redevelop West Wales Airport at Aberporth has been unveiled this week.

Hailed as the "next step" in the development of ParcAberporth, the scheme involves the building of a two-storey 48-bedroom hotel, a training centre, new terminal building and control tower plus two large hangers and a new fire station.

A new access will also be created off the main A487 road.

Local councillors and residents have already been briefed on the plan by airport boss Ray Mann, and now an exhibition on the scheme is open to the public.

The plan was submitted to Ceredigion planners this week.

It will mean West Wales Airport will be on a par with City airport in London and become the main airport for west Wales, outstripping Haverfordwest and Swansea.

Advertisement continued...
"This is a huge step forward," Ray Mann told the Tivy-Side.

"The airport needs this infrastructure to move it along, to make it grow.

"With the Assembly's investment in ParcAberporth this is now all coming to fruition.

"We are all in it for the long term and are committed to the project. You have to set your stall out and be very patient."

The scheme for the airport was first mooted along with the tech park back in 2002.

Since then Mr Mann and his company have withstood a lot of criticism.

"We are still here five years later. It is a huge investment for us and it's for the long term. We are not like a call centre that's going to hive the jobs off to India - we are here on the ground," he said.

His comments were backed up by airport manager Barrie Forster.

"Since 2002 we have been building up a reputation. This airport safeguards what is already here - the range at Aberporth. Any development has to be of benefit to the community."

Peter Tanner, managing director of QinetiQ's system evaluation services division, said: "The plans for the airport to increase its capabilities, facilities and services are excellent news. QinetiQ is currently investing in the west Wales UAV Centre at ParcAberporth and these plans provide the basis for further business investment in the region and ultimately could provide valuable employment opportunities."

And Dr Sue Wolfe, the Assembly's strategic aerospace manager, said: "ParcAberporth has always worked closely with the airport, we are mutually dependant on each other.

"This development will be the next step, bringing extra capabilities to the parc and Ceredigion."

[AlanM]

Anyone know what they mean by "on a par with City airport in London"?

320+ movements per day??

[xtypeman]

All been herd of before. There was a group called Wales Airport Net that included Haverfordwest, Swansea, Aberporth and Pembrey. This was about when the WAG started to look at the PSO route hoping for lots of WAG cash to bring the airfields up to minimal standards. You need for schedule services Fire Cover, Security, Nav aids, published approach procedures and full ATC. Swansea was just able to do all that at quite a cost Pembrey had the published approach but took two years and lot of money for surveys etc. Haverfordwest has looked at a procedure but again has come up with the cost angle. Then just look at the economics where are the passengers comming from where is the industry that needs the service even the PSO proposed for Valley Cardiff is based on a need for a reasonable passenger load.

[teifiboy]

I think the plans are more to do with the UAV developments especially since Qinetiq's £308 million MOD Combined Aerial Target Service contract was secured. Aberporth certainly doesn't have a catchment to start scheduled operations (except maybe an annual Smithfield Show charter for Dai and his mates from the Young Farmers Club)

[TCAS FAN]

Time for a reality check!

West Wales Airport (WWA), Aberporth, as is its correct name, is privately owned by West Wales Airport Ltd.

Depending on the current traffic requirements it provides AFIS or A/G.

The owner is looking to develop it, both for manned and unmanned aircraft operations. In the case of the latter, WWA is on course to be the UK's centre of civil UAV development. My own understanding is that this will be in parallel with development of manned aircraft operations.

NATS current operation in the Aberporth area is as a sub contractor, as an Air Traffic Service Provider to protect operations in EGD201, ie nothing connected with WWA.

WWA and Qinetiq have joined forces to set up and operate the West Wales UAV Centre, located at WWA, to promote and assist with the development of civil UAVs, which appears to be the next area of major development in the civil aviation world. NATS, as a sub-contractor may have a role to play in this, unless someone comes along and offers a better deal!

[Dysonsphere]

Well if it goes ahead thatll be another Airfield to pricey for GA I suspect

[taffman]

Jobs, think of the jobs. I can move home and work. Only just over thirty miles to the base, now it tops well over a thousand, a bit much to commute :rolleyes:

[teifiboy]

Well, preparation work under way for the runway extension. But what is it all in aid of? Why is all this infrastructure investment, including considearble public money, being spent on extending a runway that is more than capable of supporting the type of activity at parc Aberporth. Is the cart being put a long way in front of the horse here?

[teifiboy]

Now that the extension of the runway, both length and width, nears completion, are there any plans to utlilise this rather expensive expansion? Surely this money would not have been spent on a whim?

[virgin_cc_wannabe]

What exactly will this airport serve? theres nothing there apart from a few villages?

[TCAS FAN]

West Wales Airport Ltd have securred a contract with MOD to provide facilities for development of the Army's new UAV, the Watchkeeper. I understand that flying will start during the summer.

Extension and widening of the runway is a development that has been planned since West Wales Airport took over the airport about eight years ago. The current developments have been designed to permit future upgrading of the runway to support instrument approach procedures.

While UAV flying is expected to increase, I understand that development plans include manned flights also. With a new runway length above 1200 metres and 30 metre width, use of the airport by most business jets and 40-70 seat turboprop passenger aircraft is a viable proposition.

Longer term development will include relocating the apron and tower to the south side of the runway, for which some preparatory work has been done during the current runway project.

[jayemm]

Went to Aberporth (aka West Wales) today and it was well worth it.

It has that Oban feel about it: A very warm welcome from John, who drove out to the runway to clear the birds as I approached then offered tea and cake, then showed us around, then provided a map to Aberporth and so on.

Thanks John for a very warm welcome, and a great history lesson on the site and surrounds.

A great coastline to fly up, an excellent lunch in the Ship Inn making a great day.

Yes you do need to phone PPR before departing, but that's all. It is a simple and welcoming place to fly into.

[TCAS FAN]

Things certainly have moved on at West Wales Aberporth, runway extended and widened and now, as of yesterday (30 June 2016), "West Wales Radar" 126.070 MHZ went operational using radar equipment located on the airport, but service provided for WWA by Newquay ATC. Looks as if they are becoming self sufficient for flying of UAS (used to be called UAV), what next NATS loose the MOD Aberporth Radar contract as nobody wants to use their over priced service when WWA can apparently provide a much cheaper option? Well done WWA, looks as if you've taken on the big boys (apparently who are very upset about it and tried everything to stop West Wales Radar happening) and are winning.

Wasn't Llanbedr meant to become the UK's leading centre for flying UAS? Looks as if that's not now happening, despite a multi thousand pound investment by Welsh Assembly Government, after they'd previously put money into WWA!

[NorthSouth]

Where's that published? Not in AIP 28 or 56-day AIP amendment, AICs or NOTAMs

[TCAS FAN]

Its in the West Wales Airport's AD2 entry, effective 21 July, page AD 2-EGFA-5, section 4 c).

I queried the fact that its not included in the ENR 5 section with the Danger Area D202 entry, apparently the normal Danger Area Managers (QinetiQ/NATS?) thought that if it was included it would confuse people!

When has the word "or" confused people? Especially in this case where if "Aberporth Information" (although they call themselves "Aberporth Radar" if you call on 119.650) are not controlling the Danger Area the alternative manager will be specified in the relevant NOTAM.

I also queried the frequency, why an 8.33 kHz channel? To which the reply was along the line of "we've run out of 25 kHz channels, and anyway you'll have to have an 8.33 kHz radio by 1 January 2018". I'd better start saving or hope that Father Christmas is kind to me.

[NorthSouth]

OK thanks found it now. But it is very weird. The air traffic services provided by and for the airport remain A/G or AFIS only, on 122.15. West Wales Radar is only listed as a managing authority for D201 - but only one of three such authorities. I suspect West Wales radar is only activated when the D202s - the UAV corridors between Aberporth and Sennybridge - are activated, because Aberporth Information - the NATS controllers located at the Aberporth Range Control building - are the authority for any operations inside D201. And if the D202s are active, chances are you won't get into West Wales Airport anyway because it's full of UAV activities.

[TCAS FAN]

NorthSouth

West Wales Radar's primary role is to support unmanned aircraft flying at West Wales. To do this it manages D202 and as necessary others in the D202 complex, it also has the authority to manage D201 for unmanned aircraft flying, subject to MOD Aberporth not requiring to use it (which is quite a frequent occurrence).

West Wales Airport is not "full of UAV activity" and regularly handles manned aircraft flights. I can recommend flying in there, a good bunch of guys running the airport and the AFIS who will bend over backwards to accommodate you. Just ring on the day of intended flight, they'll tell you if unmanned aircraft flying is planned, and if so give you a time which should avoid, or at least minimise any delay. I have never been refused permission to use the aerodrome.

Rule of thumb is that if a UAV is airborne and working either Aberporth or West Wales Radar, an entry into/out of D202 is given if the UAV is above about 3000 FT.