Nigeria condemns 'rude' airlines

[Numpo-Nigit]

Just spotted this on the BBC News website. Apologies if it's not "news".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/6234675.stm

[apaddyinuk]

This absolutely infuriates me..

First of all Mr Fani (nice name by the way), Sort your own country and people out first...your one to talk about respect and dignity when you treat your own people with such contempt and keep them back in the third world when you could easily afford to improve things with all the oil money you have.

Secondly... when your people are threatening to kidnap and kill airline staff and crew members because of some misplaced luggage you really need to ask yourself if you are rationale people with good morale values!!!

Thirdly...dont expect respect and dignity on a plane (or anywhere for that matter) when some of your people are spitting at the crew simply because they are asking politely that you sit down and fasten your seat belt for take off!!! Keeping in mind that most of your people who are on a plane are the lucky ones wealthy enough to afford an air fare and surely should know better.

THERE IV SAID IT!!! Now accuse me of whatever you like! :rolleyes:

[haughtney1]

Operated enough into parts of Africa to agree with you 100% paddy:ok:

[sevenforeseven]

"apaddyinuk", I agree with you 100%.

Could not have put it better.:ok:

[barit1]

There is a Darwinian solution to this: Ask each pax before boarding whether he chooses the section where seat belts are required, or the section where there are no seat belts (and where the pax assumes all liability). A stout bulkhead between the two, and by the way no CA service there either.

Gradually the gene pool of the latter will be wiped out. :rolleyes:

[Old King Coal]

I once had a Nigerian girlfriend and she was the epitome of good manners and sophistication; I still miss her to this day. :( accordingly, please be careful with generalisations.

[barit1]

I once had a Nigerian girlfriend and she was the epitome of good manners and sophistication; I still miss her to this day. :( accordingly, please be careful with generalisations.

Of course you are right, and I hate generalizations. Each individual establishes his own code of behavior, and deserves the right to be treated accordingly.

That's why I suggested the Darwinian solution.

[stos]

Having flown 4 sectors through LOS over the last week you have hit it spot on paddy. I was spat at in the immigration hall by one Nigerian family and told to get to the back of the queue as this was her country. One passenger told a crew member he wanted to get off during taxi because he had never been treated so rudely after being asked, quite politely (for the third time), to turn his mobile off. A passenger accused a crew member of being racist and wanting to put polonium 210 in his drink after confiscating personal alcohol.
The list goes on. Mr Fani needs to get his own house in order before starting on our crews!

[soggyboxers]

stot,

I find that difficult to believe. I've been travelling to and from Nigeria for nearly 30 years now and never seen anything like that in DNMM, especially as there are 3 queues in immigration, one for Nigerian nationals, one for ECOWAS states and one for other nationalities - perhaps you joined the wrong queue.

[Special Limitation]

Like many of you guys I have experienced most of above, and after many years of flying to Africa have come to the conclusion it is all down to ego. There, it seems to me, that ego and associated arrogance expresses itself in the manner of the above comments, rather than the more self important, as in 'dont you know who I am' attitude in 1st world countries. Hence the average people are much nicer.

[TomBola]

Lost and Found,

Thank you for putting Formally Kknown As to rights. You're correct, in expressing his opinion as he does, he demonstrates only his own boorishness.

Just to try and bring a bit of balance here you have to remember that many countries have totally different cultures from Europe and North America. In Nigeria it's not considered rude to omit please or thank you, just unecessary. Nigerians as a people are noisy, quarrelsome, queue-jumping, impatient, but just as quickly change to laughter if you make a joke of things with them. Their view on these things is just different.
However, even Femi Fani-Kayode is regarded as a boorish lout by many Nigerians. He's known as 'Yab them all' (yab = abuse) and has been highly unpopular in every job he's done since he was appointed by President Obasanjo as his adviser on public affairs. During that time he was famous for heaping abuse on journalists (and phoning them up to threaten them at night if they wrote anything he considered critical of the president). Many consider that he has never really been cured of his mental illness of 15 years ago, despite his public pronouncements to the contrary. He served a brief spell as Minister of Culture and Tourism :ooh: and managed to control his mouth for a brief spell, but since being appointed Minister of Aviation his loud-mouthed and boorish vulgarity has re-emerged. This is the man who on several occasions has refused to submit to normal airport security and caused a huge scene about it, but now says that protocol officers must not escort VIP from aircraft in Nigeria and help them avoid normal security and immigration procedures. He's made accusations of tax evasion against Lufhthansa, had a row with the German ambassador, insists that some fireworks sent as airfreight were a dangerous explosive device. He's denigrated such internationally distinguished Nigerians as Professor Wole Soyinka, the Nobel Literature laureate and insulted Professor Chinua Achebe when he declined the award of Commander of the Order of the Federal Republic in 2004.

Mr Kayode should practise what he is preaching and just for once engage brain (after all he does have a degree from Cambridge University) before mouth and think.

[Phone Wind]

Mr Bernoulli,

How dare you compare Kayode to The Goons :\ . Whilst he may have had some mental problems just like Spike Milligan, he's not nearly as funny or entertaining as they were, and will probably be forgotten long before they are as he fades into obscurity after the next ministerial reshuffle :E

[apaddyinuk]

I appreciate that the LOS route is pretty much a bread and butter route for all the airlines that fly there but to be honest, ALL foreign airlines into LOS have suffered some form of bull from the nigerian government at some time or another. I think all the airlines should put their heads together and threaten the nigerian government with a ban on flights for a short period of time, I can assure you that they would cop on pretty damn quickly when their economy starts to collapse on itself!!! Unrealistic expectation I know but one can dream!

As for some of the comments, I travel all over Africa as a result of the fleet I am on. I regularly go to Nairobi, Accra, Dar, Luanda, Lusaka, Harare, jnb, Cpt, CAI and a few others and I have never experienced the same level of abuse and intimidation that I seem to get on every LOS flight I operate. All the other routes the passengers are lovely and I feel comfortable and welcome in the destinations. How can one country be so different is beyond me.

One thing is for sure, I work for one of those airlines mentioned by Fani-By-Name-Fani-By-Nature and I treat all my customers with respect and recognition, I am NOT going to treat any of my customers any differently on any route and I am certainly not going to make that extra "effort" with the Nigerian customers simply because im not bending over backwards kissing their arses!!!

Now excuse me if I seem to be generalising against all Nigerians. I certainly am not, i take individuals as I get them. I have chatted with many lovely Nigerians on the flights and the majority I would say are more than pleasant but there is still that minority (and its rather large) that do put the fear of god into us when we get rostered one!!!!

[Browright]

I guess we need to understand that being different is not necessarily bad. I have seen some HSBC adverts and i think the airlines should take a que from them by understanding the local culture. Fastrack to this is to employ locals and train them to the standards of the airline.

[MostlyModerate]

I guess we need to understand that being different is not necessarily bad. I have seen some HSBC adverts and i think the airlines should take a que from them by understanding the local culture. Fastrack to this is to employ locals and train them to the standards of the airline.


Dream on, Browright, dream on.

[Puritan]

MostlyModerate, imho Browright has got a point....

I've had occasion to point out to the Cabin Crew were I work that the apparent rudeness exhibited by some of our African passengers, e.g not saying "please" & "thank you" and / or maybe 'hissing' when trying to attract attention rather than saying "excuse me", is simply because in their local culture such behaviour is considered entirely normal.

And there's certainly precedent to employ locals, and it seems to work quite well, e.g. Ghana International Airlines use Ghanaian locals as Cabin Crew, whilst the aircraft & pilots (and some senior CC) are from Ryan International (i.e. American). Similarly, when Astraeus was providing a 'damp lease' to 'Iceland Express' we had Icelandic Cabin Crew and I suspect that Astraeus will likewise employ locals with its forthcoming Nigeria contract.

[apaddyinuk]

Not recieving a "please" or a "thankyou" or getting hissed at is not a problem. It may offend some but in this job one becomes very used to it and you get over it.

But actual abuse which crew are increasingly becoming exposed to on certain flights is not something one can just put down to "cultural differences"!!! Its not acceptable and should not be tolerated.

[Farmer 1]

I've never been to Nigeria. I've heard all the stories, mainly bad but some good, and I believe them all. I've been to one or two other African countries, and the hissing business is used there as well.

It is universally used, including between friends, and is actually a very good way of attracting attention. It is surprising how far a hiss can travel, even with high ambient noise levels, without disturbing others around. Far more civilised than shouting or whistling, or the Sinatra method (throwing an ashtray).

So, please don't take offence, it's a different culture at work.

[barit1]

I've never been to Nigeria...

Nor I, althugh I've been to a couple dozen other countries.

...So, please don't take offence, it's a different culture at work.

Yes, and my employer always insisted I try to elevate my sensitivity to foreign culture when I'm on his turf.

Is it asking too much for foreign pax on my airline to reciprocate?

[KeMac]

Having read the comments of Mr. Fani-Kayode, you would have to have a heart of stone not to weep with laughter. I grew up in Kano by the way and could speak fluent Hausa by the age of eight before I am lauded as a racist redneck. My father worked in Comms at Kano airport.

[Bokkenrijder]

Well, I have to agree with Mr Fani on this one!

Many of us frequently receive very nice emails from caring Nigerians asking our banking details in return for us large amounts of money and what do we do for them? NOTHING!

We even have the guts to ask them to put on their seatbelts for their own safety!

Such rudeness...! ;)

[Phone Wind]

All of this from a Minister in a government which has managed to do nothing about the atrocities being perpetrated on expatriates (and his own people) in Nigeria on an almost daily basis now. I refer to the kidnappings, not only of foreigners, but Nigerians. In 2006 72 foreigners and 53 Nigerians were kidnapped. As of today 4 foreigners kidnapped from the Agip residential camp at Brass are spending their 41st day in captivity. Maybe it's time that all the foreign ambassadors in Nigeria called the government to task for having signally failed to do anything to stem the tide of lawlessness in their country which is leading to most areas of the Niger Delta being not so much different from parts of Somalia and Sudan where warlords rule and the gun and bullet are the only law. Nigeria is the most populous country in Africa and rapidly detriorating into one of the most lawless and least safe places on the continent despite its huge oil wealth :mad:

[barit1]

Well, I have to agree with Mr Fani on this one!
Many of us frequently receive very nice emails from caring Nigerians asking our banking details in return for us large amounts of money and what do we do for them? NOTHING!
We even have the guts to ask them to put on their seatbelts for their own safety!
Such rudeness...! ;)

ROFL!

(psst Bokkenrijder: I have a client looking for a comedy writer, and if you would like the job, my talent agent's fee is only a few thousand quid - payable up front of course - but don't tell anyone or you forfeit my fee...) :)

[AVSEC]

oooohhhhh come on.Isnt this behaviour universal,and yes i must say that you guys are being a little over zealous in the insults.
European,particularly English,German,eastern european travellers can be violent,get drunk easily,abusive,and have no qualms fighting in the streets and maiming perfectly innocent bystanders for wearing the wrong football club jersey.
Be real,and notice the difference,and just this once I will help by educating.
1.If the Nigerian is a labourer in Europe working below minimum wage,and has not travelled back for quite a few years,he/she will not be rude enroute to Africa,but will possibly do the things you have claimed on his/her way back because they suddenly realise they made a mistake spending too long at a dead end job,just to be able to claim to their relatives they live in Europe.

2.Most labourer european/north American Africans resent being spoken down to in a patronising manner,which they deal with on a regular basis in their dead end jobs,so want to lash out on their return journey to Africa or when they have to return Abroad.

3.Quite a few Africans cannot handle effeminate male air stewards/bored stand offish air stewardesses and lash out when spoken to in what they consider a patronising tone.

4.Like their caucasian counterparts,some African travellers are prejudiced and just cannot be nice to people they believe are not as educated or of their social class.

You guys do a real difficult job,but you are appreciated.I hope understanding what lies behind it may help.

[barit1]

So - It's not the pax's fault he takes out his frustrations on the CA? They aren't responsible for their own behavior?
And we should therefore hold them to, and tolerate, a lower standard of behavior?
:rolleyes:

[apaddyinuk]

AVSEC...I dont understand your point.

So are you trying to say that we should let people do all of the above to us just because they have had it tough??? Im sorry but I refuse to agree with that. Im friendly on all my flights always but I wont let someone take their personal frustrations out on me...if they do they get the book thrown at them! They need to take responsibility for their actions.
After all, Im not going to get away with assualting or killing someone just because I feel I have diminished responsibility as a result of the stress caused by my management wanting to cut my pay, destroy my pension, increase my work load and take my off time away from me!!!!

[Curious Pax]

At the risk of taking words out of AVSEC's mouth I think he is trying to give you background information on WHY people might act in those ways, not excuse them. After all it is easier to deal with people if you have some insight into the triggers for particular behaviour.

[AVSEC]

curious pax,thanks for recognizing my intentions.:D

[apaddyinuk]

I understand now.....But, still doesnt make the situation any simpliar to resolve...at least not when it appears as if its an entire aircraft full of mentally imblanced passengers!!! :ugh:

[flyblue]

I can see good points on both sides. Understanding what is considered "normal" in a culture different that our own certainly helps accepting some kinds of behaviour that we would consider less acceptable in ours. I believe all airlines (some already do) should form CC (and pilots) on interculturalism, and brief them in particular about the cultures covered by the network of the company. That surely would help the business (happier pax) and the personnell to be less frustrated about their rosters.
However, I can also see the point of finding it hard to deal with objectively "difficult" behaviour of pax of certain nationalities (especially when not trained to it by the company! Don't forget we use the tools we are given for the job). Even CC made aware of the problem and used to dealing with some "difficult" nationalities' pax can have an incident sometimes. I personally witnessed a few crew-pax exchanges that still have me scratching my head wondering what could have been done differently by the crew:
-A CC asking a pax the choice between two menus, to which the pax replied by grabbing the CC by the shirt, shake him and yell "just gimme food!"
-A CC asking a pax who was standing during taxi to please remain seated, to which he replied he would surely not comply with an order given by a female. Only when a fellow pax intervened telling him to "stop being an a***e and sit the f**** down" (sic) would he comply, adding: "only because he's asking me, not her". (That one had the crew in stitches, to be honest :E )
-A pax threatening a CC with a broken glass bottle when he was politely asked to please switch his mobile off for landing.

Add to this the fact that crews have to be escorted to the hotel (which you cannot leave during layover for fear of kidnapping or worse) by 2 minivans of armed escort, and it is easy not to be that enthousiastic about the place :( Oh, well, it's a short layover anyway ;)

[apaddyinuk]

Brilliant post Flyblue....

But my airlines have one or two 48 hours night stops so your last sentence doesnt help!!! LOL!

[Al Fakhem]

As pax a TG flight from BKK to BLR recently (in C-class), I was seated beside a man dressed in a suit who obviously hailed from South Asia. During the flight, he was conversing with an acquaintance seated across the aisle in Tamil. However, every communication with the very polite and anxious-to-please FA was monosyllabic and delivered as a command (as in "Water!", "this!", "Tea"!) or a grunt. I came to the conclusion that his English and his upbringing were both extremely limited.
To my surprise, he tried to strike up a conversation in rather fluent English with me during final approach, inquiring as to where I was going, etc.
I explained to him in two or three words that with Mrs. Al Fakhem being Thai and given the obvious disdain he had for Thai women there was no scope for any communication between us.

[barit1]

...So, please don't take offence, it's a different culture at work.
Yeah, right. :ugh:

[srs what?]

I guess we need to understand that being different is not necessarily bad. I have seen some HSBC adverts and i think the airlines should take a que from them by understanding the local culture. Fastrack to this is to employ locals and train them to the standards of the airline.

VS employ Nigerian crew who make up around about half the cabin crew on-board. I can't say that it helps matters greatly.

[AVSEC]

I believe that religion may make some pax more hostile.A member of the crew if female cannot shake a devout sharia practising Muslims hand,and by his cultural standard he is not being rude.

In some cultures,they are irritated by camp behaviour,and it is not a homophobic action but within their cultures Males are seen in one dimensional stereotypical view point.

Some crew members are unapproachable,and I work within the industry.Pax are refused bottled water and are offered tap water.I am not making this up.
many are great,but you must understand that many pax have a nightmare of a flight which is only helped by buying bottled drinks so you are not totally dependant on the service within the aircraft.
Whether you believe it or not,Nigeria is one of the best routes,and unlike Europe,paxs in economy are paying over $500 for a ticket.
The customer is always right.

[Al Fakhem]

Clearly, the answer to the good minister's problems is to have a functioning, safe and reliable flag carrier, then all his compatriots will be able to deal only with their own kin when travelling. :D

[KeMac]

Clearly, the answer to the good minister's problems is to have a functioning, safe and reliable flag carrier, then all his compatriots will be able to deal only with their own kin when travelling. :D

Very nicely put:p