Jade Cargo

[Helmut F.]

Is there anybody out there, who can give me some details about Jade ?
They offer Direct Entry Command on shiny Jets, however contract seems to be no big deal. I'm very interested in. Thanks !

[Blue-Footed Boobie]

Helmut

Have a look in the rest of the world forums, Asia, there's lots of posts there on Jade... by all accounts a shyte outfit with their heads stuck up a dark hole when it comes to recruitment practices, ie, useless tests, little or no assistance, a bad choice of partner for Luthansa.

Blue Foot

[Wador]

Is anyone out there with Jade cargo?
Does anyone knows how the tax system works in china?
I would appreciate some input...
thanks

[Helmut F.]

Hello Folks,
had interview with Jade and got through. My imprssion is fine but I would like to make sure. Could you post some information concerning roster,atmosphere,training,pay ...
Thanx!

[11Fan]

Loads over here.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=250931&highlight=Jade

[Helmut F.]

11fan , I am as well. Sorry but all I have seen is second hand info. Who is in ?

[Doug the Head]

So what´s the story with this outfit? Bases? Pay? Leave? Staff travel?

I can´t find any terms and conditions anywhere. :confused:

Seems like they ask for a lot of info on their online application form, but offer very little info themselfs.

Smells like a rat...

[11Fan]

Wouter,

Received your PM. It looks like the link that I posted is inactive. Therefore, perform a search, use the word Jade, select South Asia and the Far East Forum under Rest of the World & Non-English Language Forums. The search should reveal a thread titled Jade Cargo with over 111 replies to it. There is a wealth of information in there.

My intent was not to offer any information on Jade, as I have none, but rather to point you to a thread which seems to have an abundance.

Best of luck to you. :ok:

11Fan

[kotakota]

No , for some reason , that thread which you mentioned will not let me in , what is the problem ? Or was there some naughty stuff which caused uber-moderation ??
Shame , know a few people who would like more info on Jade Cargo DEC on 744s.

[11Fan]

Kotakota,

I just checked it again using the search function I described in Post # 6.

Worked fine.

Can't say why you're not getting into it. :confused:

11Fan

[kotakota]

Thanks 11fan , but still cannot get in. Getting notices saying I am either not approved for access to 'this page' or 'not registered' etc which is boloney , been all over pprune for years !! will try emailing the powers that be asking forgiveness for whatever I have done !
Thanks again.

[AA717driver]

Same for me. Can't get access. TC

[11Fan]

I don't know what to tell you.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=198147&highlight=Jade

I just did the search function and got right in.

I don't know if this link will work though.

If the search doesn't work, and the link doesn't work, try sending a PM to the Mods.

Good luck,

11Fan

[kotakota]

Thanks 11Fan , for some reason the new address you gave worked !!

[Gromgutten]

I have the T&C for FO if anyone is interested...

[skycircus]

The thread that was given had a last response in July of 06'. That was 9 months ago. Does anybody have any really up to date info?:)

[Utrinque]

... can you PM me the terms and conditions - or better still post them for all to see!

Cheers

[skylux2]

got screening and sim this sunday in fra.
any help will be appreciated

[Vizcaya]

Are you sure you want to go?

Any company that is so secretive about their contract is generally NOT worth working for!

What do they have to hide? is it so difficult to post some stuff on their website? :confused:

[skycircus]

That is what I would be thinking-Do you really want to go?! I was invited to the interview and after having read the contract, I had to decline as I would not have been able to afford to send my kids to school in China. The contract is written so the employee has absolutely NO RIGHTS. The compensation amounts and conditions are a joke. Long story short, it is a contarct written for a slave.
Good luck!:}

[AIRHOG]

Gromgutten, whats the scoops on the latest FO T&Cs at Jade?

[sisyphos]

Anybody willing to share there experience regarding the interview process/nature of questions etc. ??

thanks

[Willit Run]

I was offered a senior F/O slot, (whatever that is). I suppose the pay is not bad if your living in china, you get nine days off a month. you must live within one hour of shenzen. if you layover for 4 days some where, one of those days will be counted as one of your nine days off. if you layover for 6 days, 2 days count as days off. You may have to do office work. you will have to provide your own intl. heath insurance, they give you 210 USD a month allowance for that. 210 won't get you squat. if your not typed, you pay for it, then they reimburse you 3 years later.

not my cup of tea unless i was desperate.

[sisyphos]

Hey Willit,

I agree these are not very good conditions:=. However, I would like to talk to them about a few things and see what they can offer me. Would you give me some advice for the interview pls ? thanks, much appreciated.

[sizematters]

Sure why not, Jade Air Cargo........................about the same as the old slave trade I reckon, as you say all hush hush and very secret................Thats 'cos the contracts CRAP...................I went to shenzen some time ago as they paid 4 nights hotel for free. You do an English test, then some German Twats do a Psych test on you..............Told me I was fine but I did not seem to have the required enthusiasm to work for Jade. I told them if someone would tell me what the pay was maybe I could get enthusiastic !!! Did a sim check , all very straightforward and it seems you had to at least crash 3 times to fail!!!

eventually on day 3 this German dude turns up, spends 2 hours on his mobile then says "Ah, yes, terms and conditions, ve haf very good medical insurance you know!!"

then he pulls out a bit of paper and says, "Mine Gott, this is hard to decipher"

Llike sh#@ it was................."for Captains is $9500 US a month based on flying 80 hours"..........................OK. doesn't sound like the end of the world, so how does that work ?? "Ve pay you a base salary of $5,500 a month plus ve Guarentee to pay you for 50 hour at $50 an hour"


"MMmm, sound like $8,000 a month to me"

"Vell, yes but if you do 80 you will get $9,500"

"MMmmm, start up operator, lots of training, no chance , so $8000 a month it is then

what about per Diem ??

Ve pay you $3 an hour........................."From sign on to sign off??"

"No, no, from arrival at destination to leaving destination, I mean ve are paying you $50 an hour already".................."MMMmmm, maybe I'll take that job in MaccyD's"

and 9 days off ?? in a block ??............."No, some when you are away on a trip and max 3 days block when in shenzen.......................

"so, the medical Insurance ??"..........well, we have not finalised the contract yet, but when we do it will be very good".............."Ok, getting the idea, this is a pisstake , yes??"

"Vell if you are not type rated, we will train you, and deduct $1200 US a month for 3 years to repay the training"

Ok, well, lucky for me I am type rated, but these other poor buggers are going to work for , what ?? $6,800 a month, bargain, what about F/O's ???they pay you or what ??

OK TO SUM UP, THIS LOT IS A JOKE.............IF YOUR DESPERATE FOR A 744 RATING JOIN JADE GET THE TYPE, THEN QUIT ON PAYDAY, THEY CAN CHASE YOU ROUND BUT WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET ANY MONEY OFF YOU................................KOREAN PAYS $12,500 A MONTH FOR 744 guys, LOOKS LIKE JADE HAS SET UP A NICE TRAING SCHOOL FOR KOREAN..................

[Gromgutten]

Well, not surprisingly, they now have several aircraft parked, and rumor has it for lack of crews.....go figure....

[flite idol]

Heard zee German chief pilot just quit for Emirates!!!!! True anyone?????

[repulo]

......True!:D

[flite idol]

Well good for him! Does not say much for Jade. On another note I just saw a Yangtze River Express 747-400F in Hong Kong. I have seen their 73`s Shanghai but the 400 was a surprise (to me anyway!)

[acmi48]

YZR plan operate 4 times a week pvg to lux - if you look up the registration of the b747 400f a/c operating dont be suprised if it is a CI B registration.
(ci are a major shareholder).

[stevow99]

Sounds like a real class act, this airline and it has not changed since thye first started!

And........they continue to advertise on quite a few websites for pilots. Notwithstanding their conservative expansion, this is a clear sign that not all is well and this company is shooting itself in the foot by being penny-pinching to the nth degree.

ANY decent airline would put in place a decent package to get quality personnel and KEEP them. As for $1200 a month for non-type rated guys, That works out at quite a chunk of change since a 744 rating costs approx 12-13K depending where you go and nowhere near what 3 years deductions would accumulate.

That's why I would never touch this company with a barge pole. Maybe in a few months we shall see "new and improved Ts & Cs" which alwasy tells me that their initial campaign had no takers and they were "forced" to raise the pay and bennies. They could have saved a lot of bother by doint that in the first place!

Nice observation: a training school for KAL:)!!!

[BIKKERDENNAH]

ZEE German chief pilot in Question. failed Emirates interviews a few years back as an FO. Flys for royal jet pisses off to jade cargo leaves after 6 months gets a Direct entry captain job at Emirates. Go figure :D:D:D

[sisyphos]

was at the interview recently, all facts advertised here unfortunately correct.:eek:

what a ( sad) joke.

[LightsOn]

@ sisyphos:

Can u pls give some details from your interview and contract details?

Check your p.m.

Cheers

[DeViL_AnY]

I'm with Jade. Hard to get by the interview and takes a long time to get to the AC but I like it.

[DeViL_AnY]

All these guys are upset that they failed the interview. Jade may not be the best but they are pretty good. If any of these guys were in a better airline, they wouldn't be posting here right? FYI, all of us at Jade are getting the hours

[DeViL_AnY]

The contract at Jade is rough but the conditions are not. I commute to BKK all the time, make better money then CAL (for 0 hr month) and have a blast in China. Get real guys

[Doug the Head]

Glad you like it Devil Any!

Perhaps you can shed some light on the Terms and Conditions at Jade since nobody dares going public?

Enlighten us! How much do you make approximately in US$? Days off? Leave? Staff travel? Flying hours/month?

Much appreciated! :ok:

[DeViL_AnY]

Since yes it is a start up, there are a few bugs being worked out. As an FO I'm making roughly $6000 without ever touching the plane. 50-80 hours gives another $1000 and 80-100 is almost $2000. The secret to this that everyone is missing is that the dollar is set to fall against the RNB (which we are paid in). If and when it does, that makes for a huge pay increase if you are working in dollars. For non-rated guys they do deduct 1200 a month since they are not allowed to bond employees but you get it back as a loyalty bonus after 3 years. You'll have lots of time off when you first start due to the time it takes to get all required licenses from China. The company atmosphere is nice, they almost seem afraid to tell you to do anything. Since we are short of guys the rostering and time off is slightly screwy and if you want to commute you may have to wait a while until things settle down unless it's a short comm like I do to Bangkok. What else? Shenzen is great if you're a single guy, tons of women. oh ya, the interview. This is the hardest part of the whole deal. They have a German company that has two guys doing the psyche. They have you have a group discussion on CRM- no sweat. Then you do one of those deals where you are stranded on the moon and have to list in order the items and their importance. Next is cards with information on them that you can't show anyone but you can discuss and you have to figure out when some outer space pyramid was built (I know right?). Finally you have to build some tinker-toy in a structured environment. This is what kills alot of people and now they have made it that you have to pass the psyche to get to the sim since the failure rate is so high. My advice is just be really NORMAL and try to have fun with it. People who are too quiet or too outspoken will fail. Sim was pretty rough and lots of fails there too. Vis approach, engine fires etc. Much harder than the one at CAL if anyone's familiar with that one. Medical check isn't that bad. Hope this answers some questions

[DeViL_AnY]

they're not a partner of Lufthansa, They're owned by Lufthansa Cargo:mad:

[akistar]

Would it be possible to elaborate on the chances of upgrading from RHS to LHS?

What are the min requirements?

Akistar

[DeViL_AnY]

hitlist, you don't pay that much tax. Most of your salary is in allowances and yes you will be providing the company with every fapio(government reciept) you can get your hands on. This lets them deduct the taxes as you mentioned. Also, be advised that the contracts are getting better all the time. I'm on my third already and the money has only gone up. Rumor has it:) that housing allowance will double soon.

For the next post, right to left seat. The deal is, upgrading is easy if:} you have the requirements for a Chinese ATPL. 500 hours and 1 year of command over 12.5:ugh: If anyone who is applying as an fo doesn't have this, I suggest you get out your magic marker.

[DeViL_AnY]

hitlist, missed the first half so... the censor is because that guy was a :mad: moron. You're right about the ownership but he called it a partner ship and anyone who knows about se asia knows that anything more than 49% ownership is unheard of. So... yes Shenzen is the majority shareholder but... they have little to do with running things.

[DeViL_AnY]

oh money... I don't have the senior fo or cpt contract but I take home about $5000 for doing nothing and 7-8 for a 100 hr month. Per diem is $50 a day (bound to change) and housing is on the way up since it is lowerthan our sister co. If I were to put it simply for all you loyal viewers... better than CAL not as good as KAL more fun than CX. Hopefully that makes sense. The biggest hint is... how much cargo comes out of China? Will the tnc's get better to meet this demand? Will the RNB fall against the dollar? Do you like shiny 744's? (oh ya, Chinese girls are HOT!). I swear, some of these guys really need it spelled out for them so here it is... if you're not with JAL,KAL,EK, or CX (for this region) than you should try your luck at the interview. On that, I got all expense for CAL int and was offered 744 but the chief pilot (nice guy) said that they would put some 200 hr cadet in the left seat before any expat. At least here we are not allowed to hire chinese pilots:= Think about it

[Flying Mechanic]

Can u do a 3 week on, 8/9 days off deal each month.Can you get Zed tickets for commuting?
Cheers FM

[akistar]

Hi Devil Any,

Could you share some light on ""500 hours and 1 year of command over '12.5'. If anyone who is applying as an fo doesn't have this, I suggest you get out your magic marker.""

What do you mean by 12.5?

What other means are there besides the magic marker if one does not meet the '12.5'?

Ciao and thank you

Akistar

[LindbergB767]

Did the interview in Jan 2006
we had to do 3 writing test, english, CRM, and personnality
Then you were meeting 2 Germans guys for about 30 to 40 minutes
Did not go to the Sim because when I asked them if they could match my working conditions in Japan they said NO,
So I said Thank you and I left
I am still in Japan and I still have better condition

[HitList]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

DeViL AnY,

In reality you appear to be a recruiter for Shenzhen Airlines and/or Jade Cargo.

You are unable to provide specific " actual details " of any contract offered and only have danced around the issues, offering statements as to what ,someone, might think possible to occur, sometime in the future. Also, "your lure ---concerning the Chinese girls and --- Commands for FOs" is disingenuous.

But, Nobody is buying what you are trying to sell here.


............................................................ .....................................

My Comment for your post below:

Comical & Entertaining

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

[DeViL_AnY]

I'm only doing this because Hitlist is such a :mad:. ok, standard salary 38,000 per month (all numbers in RNB). Block 51-80 310/hr. block ovr 80 794/hr. office duty comp 3 blk hrs per office day. Loyalty bonus (3yrs) 345,600. Seniority upgrade 9,600 per month. Relocation 20,000 one time 8,000 per family member. Recurrent allowances: housing 4,200 (this will go up) med 1,600, out of port 16/hr. Travel and education 24,000 per year (same for spouse/child). Main base is SZX and you need a rental contract to get your housing allowance. Sick leave is standard. Transportation between residence and airport is provided. Annual leave is 37 days. Rating is paid by company, for FAA pilots you will go to Alteon and all others will probably go to FRA. So that's the jist... yes for 3 day layover they count one day off. I don't think I can be any clearer about this but this is a place for people who still enjoy this line of work:D If you are all about the money then go to JAL:ugh: Many people are talking about how hard is is to pass the interview and yes it's true (all failed last time), but if you can roll with the punches and still enjoy the excitement of draggin' jets around strange places then come. The money is NOT as great as some places but there are many things to make up for it. This is just my opinion. I've only been at Jade for a short while but I enjoy it, they are nice to me, and I am loyal. I guess it depends on where you are in your career. If you're high up the ladder then you should be at a well established airline. If you are still working out the kinks then there are worse places to be.

HitList- just for you baby... because I like you so much... I was in a rush and I meant 12,500 pounds. I feel bad for you though, I think you've lost the enjoyment in what we do:{ I am an FO for Jade since March, not a head hunter. I actually don't even deal with those types. I was only trying to help and I would give you the CPT's details if I had them. I do know though that the tax is around 16% and you are completely wrong in your previous post. Why don't you try to get along with people... have you ever heard of a concept called CRM??? Anyways, my advice is don't apply to JADE. With your attitude you would never pass the psyche and it would be a waste of your money. Happy landings though and keep the blue side up ya:mad:

[HitList]

" For The Record "


The Jade situation has been already discussed and dismissed, by many well qualified Pilots, in detail, last year, in the "South Asia and the Far East" forum, some threads are still viewable and some have been deleted.

Type Rated Captain Pay:

for a month of 0 flying = $ 5,500 USD
for a month of 50 hours = $ 8,000 USD, and almost no perdiem and housing
for a month of 80 hours = $ 9,500 USD

and then Subtract ---MINUS The Chinese IIT Expat Tax Law*.

The Law states, for the 80 hours, figure : 35% *

( 9,500 USD X 7.59 RMB = 72,105 RMB )


Accordingly Type Rated Captain Pay :

for a month of 80 flying hours = Appr. $ 6,175 USD After Tax

including the so-called allowances, which do not cover the actual expenses in Shenzhen.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


* CHINA - Expatriate Individual Income Tax Law

( Accurate & Verifiable with any Chinese Applicable Authority )

RMB 500 to RMB 20,000-----20%
RMB 20,001 - 40,000-------25%
RMB 40,001 - 60,000-------30%
RMB 60,001 - 80,000-------35% *
RMB 80,001 -100,000 ------40%
In excess of RMB 100,000---45%

There are some implicit or explicit benchmarks at local tax bureaus on what a reasonable salary is in certain industries and this could vary with your position, your education background and the country you come from. Local authorities have the power to increase your declared salary. Should this be manifestly low or inadequate to your position, they shall assume and obtain the proved confirmation that you are deliberately reducing the figure to escape from a higher IIT threshold. This can be enormously damaging for you and your employer who would be placed under far greater tax scrutiny in the future for potential tax evasion issues within the business.

____________________________________________________________ ___