hkg china fir co-ordination

[meslag]

was telling a mate about the details of operating over china from/to hkg - particually the requirement to get to near cruise level by the boundary. however i could not answer as to why there is a requirement for this. is it just ...because or is there a technical atc reason? why cannot we just depart from hkg and get handed over much lower at the fir.

Also, in many routes that i fly through china, they are often unwilling to state that you are under radar when it is obvious that they have that facility and are using it. as such, direct routimg is not that easy to come by. why is this? is the radar not approved?

surely radar will give decreased seperation= more aircraft = more money?

Finally. any particular reason for the china metric levels and non icao units? is it just tradition and politics?

thanks

[boocs]

Without wanting to sound like a smarta$$, the short answer is, This is China.

The metric levels relate to the fact that the military controls the airspace and their aircraft (with Soviet origins) fly in metres not feet.

Indeed all efficient (or lack thereof) airspace issues in China relate back to the fact that it is under military control.

Enjoy the ride :rolleyes:

[throw a dyce]

ATC in HK is different from Europe.There is no flow management in Brussels issuing slot times.It's usually done by Clearance Delivery at HK,trying to adhere to many letters of agreements,and basing separations on a/c requested level.Hence the requirement to be at that level.If you are still in the climb,then there maybe someone coming the other way at that level.
ATC in HK seems to sort out everyone elses separation problems for them.If you delay a/c because the letter says 10 mins in trail,then why the delay.If you offer a lower level,and they get stuck there burning more fuel,then why are they not getting higher.In other words can't win.Airlines schedule a/c to go the same way at the same time,for various reasons,so someone will lose out.
The whole system needs updating but HK ATC is only doing their best with a hopeless set of rules,restrictions etc on their doorstep from other FIR's.Bekol restrictions used to change nightly.Radar seemed to used as a backup for procedural rather than the main tool in mainland.
I'm also not trying to sound like a smart@@s and I haven't worked there for a few years,but it sounds like not much has changed.Don't forget that as traffic grows,then the steam driven separations will fall apart,and you get BIG delays.:uhoh: