Easyjet exposed!

[flying doc]

Easyjet today 'names and shames' three major international companies today for "for not recognising low-cost airlines in their employees' travel policy."

Well Easyjet, AT LEAST one of the quoted companies is ACTUALLY a FREQUENT customer of yours!!

It would appear that you've just named and shamed your own company and indeed slandered your own customers...

Think before you jump on your high horse and start a national media campaign..huh?

[gofer]

Doc, for those not privy to your sources - any chance of a link or direct quote. Tks.

[flying doc]

gofer,

no probs.. I forgot that. The info comes straight from Easy's site and it's plainly unfair because it just isn't true.

<a href="http://www.easyjet.com/en/news/20020206_01.html" target="_blank">www.easyjet.com/en/news/20020206_01.html</a>

FD

[ducksoup]

Once again, Easy adopts the 'I'll tell your Daddy' approach to sales when they are just as guilty in their own business empire. I refer to the use of Mercedes A class cars for their rental operation when Perdua Nippas could be available for a fraction of the price.. .To tell the truth though, I would prefer the MB to the Indian, but that is a matter of choice. Just like my travel arrangements really.. .Grow up Easy, you are owed nothing by the rest of the world, whatever you may think.

[ 06 February 2002: Message edited by: ducksoup ]</p>

[FreightNight]

I say good on-um, that is the sort of 21st century British business we should encourage.....well done Easy may the others follow your lead..

[mainfrog2]

Okay Freightnight so how are those businesses going to get their staff to Nth America, Canada, Asia , Middle East , Australia, New Zealand, South America, Russia, Africa with easy. It's going to be a Bl***y long walk. It's all very well for easy to pick which targets to shoot at but maybe some of these companies have a bigger view than just Europe.

[Sean Dell]

I would have thought that most business people would prefer to pay a little extra so that they could avoid the bucket and spade brigade and are likely to arrive at their destination on the correct day within 50 miles of it! If the ITV fly on the wall Airline programme is to be believed then ' you pays your money, you takes your chance' - a bit like Ryanair really.

[ 06 February 2002: Message edited by: Sean Dell ]</p>

[FreightNight]

I think you are missing the point last week we needed to get to BCN so we called our company travel agent who charges commission on every booking LON-BCN £215.00 per person. On quick look on the net …Easyjet £75.00, Go £78.00. If your employees need to go long haul then shop around.. .I just recon if a British company wants to make a lot of money and employ loads of workers then give them our support instead of following the good old tradition of “slating everything British”

And before you say it…YES I know the boss is from Greece

[stoopid]

so perhaps the companies should employ someone to shop around ...just so stelios can get the business........ not. .if i were a large company i wouldnt want to risk not making appointments that are potentially worth millions in contracts etc just to save a few quid........as said b4 grow up stelios its a free market and they can travel with who they choose

[Gaza]

easyJet have a market segment to cater for as do BA and the other traditional airlines. I have no problems using (and have done so many times) EZY for domestic flights. However, when it comes to European destinations I always choose traditional airlines. Why? Seat allocation and through check-in/transfer. I do not want to arrrive at EDI. Queue to checkin. Scramble for a seat. Fly to LTN. Wait for bags. Queue to check-in. Scramble for a seat. Fly to .....

I fly a huge amount on business. I am doing it because it is necessary. I don't particularly like getting up at 4:30, driving to the Airport, waiting in a crowded lounge, scrambling onto a plane hoping to avoid the middle seat, arriving at an airport no where near where I want to be, getting to where I need to be, doing my days work, heading back to an remote airport, sitting in a crowded departure lounge, scrambling....and finally getting home 15 hours after I left!

I much prefer using an airline that gives me on-line or telephone check-in, allocated seat, a nice business lounge away from the bucket and spaders, comfortable seating that means my knees are not under my chin.

Stellios has a great business and meets the needs of a particular market. At times I wish he would shut-up and thankful for what he's got. This typed of whining is very off-putting.

[Jack The Lad]

Ray Webster says, 'Shareholders have the right to know how much company revenue is being wasted on...'

I'll bet he would take a different view if the shareholders of his company starting poking round in his own back yard!

He may live to regret that statement.

[AOG-YYZ]

Well I have just booked easyJet AMS-LPL-AMS for Feb 19 to Mar 6, 2002 and guess what? It is cheaper than my "Z" fare on BD or BA between Heathrow and Manchester. Go for it easyJet. Boy I wish C3K was still flying.

[In trim]

Stoopid,

Some valid points have been made in this thread, both for and against the low-cost brigade. However:

1. easyJet's punctuality generally pretty good....even publish it on the website, whether it has been good or bad, and it regularly beats the 'mainline' operations.

2. This thread is about easyJet, and you make comments about remote airports 50 miles away. Sorry, but that's Ryanair......EZ fly to Glasgow, not Glasgow (Prestwick), and to other mainline airports such as Nice, Amsterdam, Madrid, etc. Do not confuse easyJet and Ryanair as they are very different.

[Hand Solo]

So busy executives who read this site - tell me how often you can book your trip to Amsterdam weeks in advance and be confident that your schedule will not change at all, because for all those occasions you could be saving £40 pounds flying with Easyjet! Now would anyone like do to the maths on buying a flexible economy ticket to AMS with a full fare airline at two days notice, then compare it to the same on Easyjet, factoring in rebooking twice for a later flight home at two hours notice. Methinks the comparison maybe somewhat less favourable for Easyjet when they use a realistic busines travel profile. I think BA and BMI should launch a 'name and shame' campaign against low cost airline passengers who ring up for a £9.99 fare thats sold out and end up paying £80 when they could have flown with full service for less. The public have a right to know just how much money is being wasted on over priced no-frills air travel!

[Wrong Stuff]

I used to work for a reasonably large company (one of the FTSE-100 constituents). We were all once sent an e-mail telling us not to bother to shop around because although the ticket price appeared to be cheaper with some airlines, as we did so much business with BA they gave a whopping annual rebate.

I'm sure they're not alone. Most big companies have a pretty savvy travel department.

[chrisN]

So, I had a meeting (Voluntary, air sport related - talking about planning and noise problems for aviation, in fact) in Lausanne on Friday /Saturday 10-2 Feb. I went Easyjet, Luton-Geneva. What are these high cost or other options that would have cost more that £143 but got me from Haverhill, Suffolk, to Lausanne quicker, more reliably, better for dpearture/arrival airportts etc.? Tell me again, who flies Haverhill-Lausanne, and at what price?

Gaza are you there? Anyone else?

By the way I missed my booked flight at 0630 - traffic problem - and was rebooked at no extra cost on the 11.00. What are these better options again, and how do they charge if you miss you intended flight for whatever reason?

Do the full price people ever overbook, or is that a myth?

[Running for cover - but I think the Royal Aero Club, who pay my expenses, won't be too sad at paying out for an Easyjet flight . . . ]

[jongar]

my company has a simalr deal with VS for longhaul, BD/*A for shorthaul and BA for the gaps. Yep, we pay a bit more for the tickets, but if we hit targets we get a load back. The amex girls are pretty as well.

[Justforkix]

I guess the company cars should be changed to mopeds, that way we could save a bundle. Lets not travel at all, make a phonecall instead or meet via the internet, its lot cheaper!!!!

[Momo]

Working for a 100,000+ employee company, it is a bit more subtle. AMEX handles all travel and credit card stuff for us, and gives a rebate for everything spent. They can't/won't book Easyjet, and individual employees can't work around this, unless they pay for the fares themselves. (Something I have done in the past.)

In addition, employees who travel a lot LOVE to be able to fly with their familes extensively for free, based on FF miles. This takes pressure out of the system. BTW, at the moment, it is cheaper for me to fly Geneva-Dublin with Crossair than with the Easy/Ryan combo, provided I stay 3 nights. Fares go up tomorrow.

Momo

[newswatcher]

And from today's Telegraph:

"EASYJET, the budget airline, lost a public spat with Marconi yesterday after agreeing to remove the embattled telecoms equipment maker from the "Hall of Shame" in its latest advertising campaign.

Marconi is named with Cadbury Schweppes and Total Fina Elf in the advertisements under the banner, "Is your company wasting money?".

Easyjet goes on to accuse them of caring "less about returning shareholder value, and more about massaging their own egos" for not using low-cost carriers.

But Marconi yesterday denied the claims, saying it had booked more than 50 flights on budget airlines over the last three months - 18 of which were with Easyjet.

David Beck, director of communications, added: "I am surprised Easyjet thinks that this is the way to treat its customers. They should check the facts before running advertisements that are wrong."

The issue is particularly sensitive for Marconi after the embarrassing revelations last August that executives were using company jets just weeks after announcing 4,000 redundancies.

The debt-laden group claimed it made economic sense to use the jets, which ferry staff between London, Genoa and Pittsburgh, and that no budget carriers operate on those routes.

Marconi said it would continue to use Easyjet despite the adverts. Mr Beck said: "Our travel policy is to fly people, where it's critical to the business, at the lowest cost possible and if that's Easyjet, then we will continue to use them."

Easyjet yesterday said it would be removing Marconi's name from the adverts but said it had no intention of pulling the campaign.

A spokesman said: "When we contacted the travel managers, Marconi said they did not use low-cost airlines."

Last year Easyjet altered a series of posters after wrongly claiming Tony Blair was a customer."

[Desk Driver]

I advise several companies on their travel needs and the main problem are these;

Meetings can get changed and/or cancelled for a million reasons at anytime.

If you want Flexibility DON'T book easyjet.

Time is money to a busy executive. So if your flight is cancelled or delayed (Yes could happen to any airline) and you need to get where you want to go!

If you want to be looked after in the event of a cxx flight DON'T book easyjet!

Most business travel is booked shortly before travel.

If you expect low low fares just before departure. .DON'T assume you'll get them from easyjet.

And finally if your the MD of the board trying to impress

DON'T Turn up on an airline that prides itself on being cheap!!

. .And finally a personal one from me.

If you don't want poor service and RUDE ground staff...... DON'T FLY FROM LIVERPOOL!!!!!

. .Let the Slagging from you Orange Types start!

BTW why the hell do EZY think they can BLACKMAIL pax into their seats???? <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

[frazhm]

I am beginning to wonder if the highly regulated world of a/c ops and aggressive business techniques are entirely comfortable bed fellows.. .It seems that some of the methods used in generating business seem quite alien to aviation. Both Ryanair and Easyjet have recently had major spats/cockups with customers, airlines and the advertising authorities- this being the latest one, but is this spilling over into a/c ops. Previous threads have spoken about photocopied and even non-existent Jepp plates and the taking up of TOO much fuel- I accept that these could be anecdotal stories, but I wonder if I am the only one who thinks that clear delineation should be drawn between the two sides of the business. Or are we ultimately going to see a modified Air Nav Order for no-frills carriers with a highly elastic CAP 371 !!. .It is quite disturbing that almost every few days a less than positive story emerges about some new practice/idea/procedure from a no frills carriers.

<img src="confused.gif" border="0"> <img src="confused.gif" border="0"> <img src="confused.gif" border="0"> <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

. .Remember two wrongs don't make a right but three rights make a left!!

[twistedenginestarter]

I just checked on a one leg journey for next week. Its business but I don't care what class of travel I get. At this point in the run-up, Go is 232 euro, BA 243 euro and Easy showing between 107 and 187. This looks remarkably as though if I book early next week there's going to be no significant difference.

Although I have not used them I understand Easy is a good business option in some cases but no more so than BA (and that's pre-discount).

Note also most companies have travel departments to do the booking. In my experience they won't book no-frills as they get no money for it. Executives costing 100 pounds per hour can soon waste more than the ticket price difference.

[Few Cloudy]

frazhm,

Full, normal Jeppesen sets(x2) in each easyJet cockpit.

Intelligent taking of extra fuel is supported according situation.

No cheapness or skimping in the training or flight ops dept.

Desk Driver,

Many businessmen fly on easyJet and mention it on arrival - shows nouse actually.

Rudeness in Liverpool - that's Liverpool generally but report it anyway.

Don't expect low fares at short notice - true and openly stated ( though they are still often cheaper than what else is available.)

[Buster the Bear]

Plenty of suits and briefcases checking in with easyJet this morning, business travellers obviously use the routes from Luton.

As an aside, I know of one company that books dozens of flights for its staff on easyJet. Most of the time staff do not use the tickets, but booking in advance means that this company can buy over 10 flights (5 returns) for the cost of a single from Heathrow on a 'major'! This company also uses the facility to change a booking for £10, plus the cost of the difference between the 2 fares. Flexibility!

[christep]

To add some specific data, large companies with high travel frequencies will normally get 3-4% back from the travel agent (from the 6-9% that the airlines give them in commission) and up to 40% discount from the airlines.

My employer is a large French company, and we get at least 40% off from Air France. I guess TotalElfFina (named by EasyJet) gets even more since they are such big travellers that Air France even runs a special frequent flyer club more or less just for them.

[flypastpastfast]

I do hope stelios uses charter flights when crossing the atlantic, as he would not want to waste his company money!

This really is utter bolloc*s from easyjet.

I do hope he also:

has the cheapest house possible

the cheapest car possible

the cheapest travel arrangements (By bus only, as rail is more expensive)

Flies on the very cheapest fares by booking months ahead.

Surely he would practise what he preaches. Likewise for his senior staff members.. .

I'm starting to think that some budget operators are becoming more and more desperate in their aproach. Is this because growth has peaked.

Think about it, the budget operators have seen massive growth in the past, but logically, that cannot continue. When the growth starts to slow, even if the airline is still profitable, then the share prices will 'get real', as they did following the hysteria with Dotcoms.

Maybe it will not be long before the 'smart money' starts to re-assess the growth potential for these businesses. A very large element of growth in recent profitability for Ryanair has, by their own admission, come from cutting costs, but again there is a limit to growth generated in that way. It is such a classic business experience with very rapid growth, rising share prices, the growth slows and investors start to question strategy for continued growth, the share price falls, and business confidence drops.

And business confidence is ABSOLUTELY critical in aviation.

I don't want to see any business fail, but bolloc*s like this just annoys me.

[Gaza]

ChrisN

Not sure what your point was but as I said I have flown EZY many times. In fact, my company positively encourages us to fly low-fare airlines if it is convenient. For about 18 months I was working very close to LTN so it made sense to fly EZY. Goinf down was fine but coming back in the evenings was a lottery. The EDI-LTN route is a godsend for my parents. My brother lives near to Watford so my parents can get cheap trips to see their grandchildren! At the moment I am working near Terminal 4. There is no-way I am flying to LTN when LHR is much, much closer. The difference in price is minimal. Our company have very good deals with BA and BD. At the moment a fully flexible Economy tix with either is £180. A business tix with BD is £189. With both of these I get lounge access, meal (breakfast is very welcome at 06:30 <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> ) and an allocated seat. A few weeks ago I tried to book at EZY flight on a Monday morning. The fare was £129.00 outbound and £109.00 inbound. £238 to fly EZY? I don't think so.

As mentioned above, FF points make up for the inconvenience of constantly travelling. I have done well over the years out of various schemes with trips in Biz and Eco payed fully with points.

EZY really need to get their facts right before they go accusing companies of avoiding them. Rubbishing your customer, unfairly, is not good for your relationship!

[jongar]

Whether it is good governance or not, I will not fly with Mol or Stelios. I support british business even if its owned by germans and scandinavians or the singapore goverment. More importantly, they support me. As one of their better customers they pull out stops to help me when I need it. If I need to be on a particular flight, they will deboard someone. If I cant make that flight they will put me on the next one, without fee. Oh, and they massage my ego. bollocks. business class on a euro route is economy with a bagel. Also, I fly with BD/LH/SAS 50 times, they give me a first class ticket anywhere in the world. Stelios, I admired your adverts encouraging business to use you, but until you let my travel department make the arrangment and you offer fully flexable, refundable tickets and pay the girls to do it - screw you. I will not be cajoled, blackmailed or threatened. I will be encouraged. I see I get double miles to FRA/VIE next month - who can I see in FRA (not Hahn <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> ) When I go to TLV next month, can I go through FRA/VIE ??? Thats how to put revenue on seats

[Shanwick Shanwick]

Completely in agreement with Desk Driver.

I use EasyJet almost weekly from Liverpool and the attitude of both the ground based staff and the Cabin Crew is appauling.

Politeness costs nothing.

[[email protected]]

One of the things that easyJet *does* do is take some of the pressure off the BA/VS "relationship"!

This may be apocryphal, but several years ago I heard that VS ops was frequently under pressure from the Grinning Pullover (now, of course, Sir Grinning, or is it Sir Pullover?) to do things that were A Bad Idea (schedules, on-board unwise activities, etc.)

Luckily for VS, the guy actually running the show could and did stand up to the Marquis of Pullover's pressure, and indeed Duke Grinning deserves credit for accepting that.

Now let's look at easyJet and Ryanair. Culturally, does it look *likely* that anyone would successfully standup to Stelios or MOL? And if they did, that Stelios and MOL would respect them?

Malc.

[nice_beaver]

Its working again and were all falling for it. The advertising people at easyJet must be falling about laughing watching and reading all the "free" additional coverage they get as a response to their carefully prepared adverts. . .Any carrier ( or any business for that matter ) who has say 10 million customers a year are fully prepared to see a few complain on telly or in the papers/internet for the exposure that it generates because the vast majority of the 10 million had good flights, were treated as they expected and got from A to B and back for what they felt was a good price.. .Lets face it the pax aren't running away in droves because of what is being said here, quite the opposite in fact, and for every one detractor their are a 100 or more who will extole the virtues of "no frills" so best get used to it!

[flying doc]

Maybe, nice_beaver, maybe....

but I am one passenger who will never fly Easyjet again. I'll pay the money, so what. I'll fly to where I want to fly and get there safely.

Last time I flew to LTN the cabin staff giggled and cajoled their way through the safety demonstration. I would never again put the safety of an aircraft evacuation in their hands.

And before retorts come through about "one off incident" or "making the journey humorous" safety isn't a joke. And it wasn't a one-off incident, my father was forced to fly Easyjet the other evening and said the crew did excatly the same thing.

[FlapsOne]

Good Lord......someone noticed what happens during a safety brief.

The amount of passengers that pay the slightest attention to the dry old safety brief is sadly very small. If there is a bit of humour injected from to time to time at least it makes some sit up and take notice. The CAA have no difficulty with this whatsoever.

The only time pax will pay full attention is if it's printed on the front page of their newspapers of given on cassette for their walkman.

Rest assured, if an evacuation were necessary, EZ cabin crew are as good as any in the business......and I speak with nearly 25 years experience.

Pax who pay no attention whatsoever will be severely disadvantaged in an emergency - and it doesn't matter whether that's with BA, FR, EZ or any other carrier.

Come on then folks.......next topic to knock EZ is...................... <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[pdashley]

Can we now expect an advert from Ford directed at EZ shareholders claiming that Stelios 'wastes' their money because he uses Mercedes A class cars for EZ car rental, when they have cheaper cars???......I doubt it.

The problem with the advert, as with a lot of Stelios's tactics is that it's subjective.

[flying doc]

AT IT AGAIN!!

Now not shaming the previous companies, 2 of which have disproved the allegations, they're shaming some others...

<a href="http://www.easyjet.com/en/news/fatcat.asp" target="_blank">http://www.easyjet.com/en/news/fatcat.asp</a>

I ask Easyjet:

I would like to know if, on the evening before the flotation of the company, Stelios stayed in THE CHEAPEST accommodation in London.. and does he drive the CHEAPEST company car, use the CHEAPEST petrol stations...

It's just plain rude.. <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

[ghost-rider]

What has this got to do with aviation ?? As said countles times before - this is a marketing thing !

Maybe Danny should start an airline bashing and marketing bashing forum !

Get a life !!!!!!! <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">