Appreciation

[Black 'n Yellar]

Having just returned from a 6 month deployment as a UK exchange pilot with Uncle Sam, I just wanted to make a few points about the different conditions under which we serve!
I will start by saying that the grass is definitely not greener, and I never thought I would say that I would miss HMS Invincible, but it certainly beat life on a USN LHD (no bar and no ramp).
However, my observations are more on the financial side. As soon as we deployed, everyone on the boat received a monthly seperation payment (except me) which I think was around $100 or so a month. As soon as we passed through the Suez Canal everyone received their salary tax free (except me) for the next 5 months and 2 pilots that flew into The Balkans (can't spell Sarajevo!) for 2 hours got 6 months tax free. Everyone also was paid $250 a month 'Imminent Danger Pay' for 5 months (except me), oh and by the way they also get paid an allowance for housing instead of having to pay Married Quarter Charges.
Well what about me as the only Brit on the boat - Pusser kindly cut my LOA as I was no longer in the US (despite still paying MQ charges on our house there) and LOA (or whatever it is called now) of 6 pounds a day.
As I said, the grass is definitely not greener on the other side, but there are Marines volunteering to keep deploying because there is a huge financial benefit involved. I don't think that Brown's 2 grand for 6 months is really on a par with that!!
One of the biggest difference over here is the support that the Armed Services get from the American public. Wherever we go we are constantly being thanked for serving (even over the radio by Air Trafficers) and it gives some satisfaction for the sacrifices we have to make with our families. The American Forces Network is constantly broadcasting messages of support from the US public and sporting and Hollywood stars. You could describe it as the 'typically American', but it certainly made me feel appreciated. All I get from my Mother is emails asking when I am going to get a real job so I can spend some time with my family!!

[ZOFO]

B and Y,

Nice post makes you think really on why so many people are now "Voting with their feet" and leaving the services. It would seem we are now not "Investors in People" more like "Investors in Pensions"

Mrs Zofo has been on at me for ages to pack it all in she saw the light with the way her father was treated in the Forces, But with only a year to push to my 22 year point, I am stuck between a "Rock and a hard thing" (and I don't mean a RAF Regiment Gunner in that Phrase !!:} "

[timex]

Welcome back mate great post, not thinking of staying there then............?:eek:

[Olly O'Leg]

It is amazing over there - no matter what someone's political inclination is or what opinions they have on current ops, they ALL have the utmost support for their armed forces. I've visited there and had drinks bought for me by a total stranger because "We're all in this fight together, dude". Wish I didn't have to make sure my SD hat isn't on the back seat when I park the car.....

:D

[Talking Radalt]

I've visited there and had drinks bought for me by a total stranger because "We're all in this fight together, dude".:D
Likewise, although do Hooters girls count as total strangers? :E

[airborne_artist]

BnY - One of the replies from Gordon's team I've seen made about UK mil not getting tax free when deployed is that they get a higher basic wage than some other countries.

Taking cost of living into account (and it's often reckoned that USD1 = GBP1 in spending power), do you estimate that your US equiv was as well paid as/better paid than you?

[ancientaviator62]

When I was stationed in Singapore on 48 Sqn our LOA used to cease as soon as we left the island despite the fact that wife and family were still back there.
As for US bonuses when we were doing Op Vigour (the Somalia 'relief' op ) with our fleet of 2 Herks the US ground 'troops' used to come and fly wiyh us. We thought they were very keen on flying until we discovered that every time they crossed the border into Somalia they collected a $50 bonus ! A rumour when I was in GW1 was that the Saudis wanted to pay us all a dollar bonus but HM Govt said no. Pity ! I see nothing has changed but MOD cicil servants have been paid £141 million as bonus' for providing 'outstanding support' to the Services. Still they do outnumber the forces two to one.

[LateArmLive]

I may be wroong here, but don't NATO pay all of the troops working on ops a bonus of about 10 dollars a day? All very nice, but those c-units in the british government take the money for themselves. It's nice to feel appreciated :mad:

[PPRuNeUser0211]

I believe the UN do a similar thing, paying a nation for the use of their troops, and the yanks pass this on to theirs accordingly! Ours hang on to it!

[VFW49tpm]

Not 10 dollars a day, but 94 euros a day. That's what NATO troops get on duty in Afghanistan at present. I know that they were also on similar amounts in the Balkans a few years ago. No wonder they are all so keen to stay in the relative comfort of Kabul airport compound and other northern areas of Afghanistan eg Mas e Sharif and ignore all invites to join us in the south.

[Spurlash2]

...and talking of appreciation and pay (I feel thread drift coming on...)
I was looking at my take home pay from Jan 03 and compared it with my pay for Nov 06. After nearly 4 years of slog, I am now better off by £116 per month.
So all those 'pay rises', all those exams to get promoted, all those ticks in boxes to move up a scale... Gordon gets richer whilst I have remained static.
And I concur with pba-target about the UN payments, I well remember Bosnia in the early 90's, watching the French and Dutch get their UN cash and tax breaks whilst UK bods got diddly.

[Olly O'Leg]

Wondering - if I'm seeing correctly, I think you've deleted your post. No-one would try and tell you what you can and can't post as it's an open forum (free speech etc etc). Hopefully you're not too upset at our banter - you ARE entitled to your own opinion but it was just a little out of place in this thread. Perhaps start a totally new thread with thoughts like that??? No offence intended, anyway.

Back to the point...... It is kind of ironic that a totally different country's public think more of us than our own government. Now I'm not really politically inclined but a friend of mine has been working with the US and had his LOA taken off him (as mentioned previously) when he went on ops. BUT, he also wasn't entitled to the "packages" (such as phone cards etc etc) from either country. Nothing from the US (and, frankly, why should they when he's a Brit) and diddly squat from the Brits `cos he was working with the Americans!!! Utter Bo11ocks.

:{ :{ :{

[antipodean alligator]

Having flown on Ops with the RAF as an Antipodean Cultural Attache (read exchange officer) I can offer the following views from each side of the divide:
1. What you (Pom) guys are (NOT) paid for going sausage-side is a disgrace....I got my $AU 200 per day every time I crossed the border and $125 per day in theatre where I didn't fly as per RAAF/ARA people deployed with our own elements. (Much to the disgust of my stick-monkey when I made "ker-ching" comments every time were crossed the border!)
However,
2. The UK MOD was decent enough to allow me access to all of the perks, albeit small, such as a Paradigm card and e-blueys etc. So at least they shared their good deals with their exchange officers unlike the tight-arsed US so it would seem from some comments above.
I really hope that you (Poms) get the financial recognition that you deserve because you curretly seem to be the only mob getting rogered by your Govt for putting your lives on the line.....:ugh:
BZ & Good luck!

[Black 'n Yellar]

I just got to meet my 5 month old son for the first time - awesome. Maybe one day I could be at home for 1 of my older son's birthdays (missed 4 already and will be gone next year!).
Airborne Artist - in response to your question, I think that my US colleagues do have a much higher standard of living, despite the healthy exchange rate at the moment. They have the benefit of the Exchanges on base where they can buy goods tax free, not to mention the price of 'gas' which is about half the UK price. There taxes are also only around the 20% mark and no National Health payments, and their families all get free health treatment.
US officers also seem much more inclined to complete their service and reach their pension as it is a great deal. The biggest thing is that they get free health care for them and their families which is worth a lot.
As has already been mentioned it is hard to stay in touch while deployeds as the US system supplies subsidised mail and phonecalls. However to phone my wife back in the UK cost a small fortune as AT&T do not subsidise that. Also mail has to go from the UK out to the US before it is shipped to us which cost a lot. Pusser's LSA does not quite cover that!:cool:

[abbotyobs]

A friend of a friend of mine returned last month from the Stan and he confirmed that he was the lowest paid out of any of the NATO forces there. As already said, £2400 aprox for 6 months is by the lowest allowance out of any of the NATO forces deployed in the Stan.
Most of the Euro NATO forces are on at least 90 euros a day which is 2300 euros a month after tax or 13,800 euros for 6 months and some such as the Norwegians and Belgiums are on over 100 euros a day.
The US, Canadians and Aussies receive a tax free salary which is much more than the Brits.
The MOD claim that we are the highest paid Armed Forces in the world(apart from the Aussies), but this is simply not true.
They have put a link, which refers to an out of date survey in 2004, which if you look at, is fundamentally flawed. The Euro Nations and US Armed Forces are paid almost the same as the UK, but on Op deployments, they receive so much more.
Still the £2400 for 6 months is a step in the right direction even if it is not close to all of the other countries' allowances!

[Growbag]

Welcome back B&Y, bet it was a blast to see the new Lad for the first time! Of course instead of the monetary appreciation that you could have received if you were 'entitled' to similar bonuses as the Spams, you had the delight of serving with the USMC instead! I bet time on board was a bit different than that of in Invincible!! Well done for sticking it out, I think that I would have been divorced if I had to tell my Mrs that I wasn't going to be there for the birth of No2, a house move, a new job and 6 months on board including Op sorties into Afghanistan!:D

[Black 'n Yellar]

...and don't forget 6 months in the Desert next year as well. I don't know how Mrs B&W puts up with it. Still, at least I will be entitled to the 'full' operational bonus then so my financial worries will all be over!

[toddbabe]

I will start by saying that the grass is definitely not greener, and I never thought I would say that I would miss HMS Invincible, but it certainly beat life on a USN LHD (no bar and no ramp).
B and y I don't really undrestand your point, maybe I am missing it? you say the grass isn't greener but then spend all of your next two posts describing how crap life with the RN is compared to the USN! surely then the grass is a lot greener! as so many of us already knew.

[timex]

I think the point is that as US serving military personnel you are well looked after, compared to the shambles that is the MOD.