Jeremy Clarkson in The Sunday Times

[Sidney Harberbridge]

Comment lifted from Sunday Times - Sunday 12 August 2001.

You can fly an awfully long way on patience

"I knew, of course, that a charter flight from some low-rent Spanish holiday resort to London's Stansted airport was never in a million years going to take off on time.

To make matters worse, it had a scheduled departure of 11.30pm which meant it would have had an entire day to get out of sync. And sure enough, when we arrived at the airport we were told it was still in Hertfordshire.

So what's the problem this time, I inquired with the world-weary resignedness of someone who has heard it all before. Technical problems? Wrong type of air? Leaves in the sky? No, said the rep. The captain got stuck in traffic on the M11.

I see. Because the hopeless git did not set off for work on time, I now have to spend four hours in an overheated, understaffed departure lounge with 70 children under eight, none of whom is mine. Great.

I don't know who you are, captain, but I sincerely hope you have a penchant for Thai ladyboys and that your colleagues find out. I am not a vindictive man but it is my fervent wish that from now to the end of time all your itches are unreachable. And that someone writes something obscene in weedkiller on your front lawn.

To keep us all happy and to help to while away the hours, we were assured that free soft drinks and snacks would be provided.

They were not. What was provided was a Styrofoam cup of hot. Hot what, I'm not sure. It could have been tea or it could have been oxtail soup. The snack was a sandwich filled with a piece of pink that was thinner than the paintwork on a 1979 Lancia. Then I discovered that the batteries in my Game Boy were flat.

To my left, a fat family clad from head to foot in Adidas sportswear had managed to find some chips. An amazing achievement this, since all the shops were shut. But you could put people like that on the fourth moon of Jupiter and within 15 minutes they would find a sack of King Edwards and a deep-fat fryer.

To my right there was a much thinner family, also clad in Adidas sportswear, attempting to get some sleep and using their Manchester United football shirts as pillows. Sleeping was difficult because every five minutes King Juan Carlos himself came on the Tannoy to explain very loudly that by royal decree smoking is prohibited.

Then it got more difficult still because a team of heroically lazy Spanish cleaners finally woke up from their afternoon siesta and decided that the floor needed a damn good polish, using a squadron of machines that were designed by the Russians in the 1950s and had been in service with the Angolan air force ever since.

By 1.30am I was reduced to reading the instructions on the fire extinguishers and contemplating starting a food fight. I decided against it because the bread in the free sandwiches was hard enough to kill and the filling was too light to fly properly. It would just sort of float.

At 1.45am we were asked by the king again to board buses which would take us to the plane. Yippee. At long last, Captain James T Berk had arrived. We were on our way.

Oh no we weren't. After 15 minutes of standing on the stationary bus, we were forced to endure 50 minutes of sitting on the stationary plane where there was no air conditioning and, worse still, no explanation or apology from the flight deck.

Only after we had become airborne and fallen asleep did Captain Fool come on the PA system to explain what had gone wrong. It had been too hot, he said, for the plane to take off and as a result, some of the bags had been removed from the hold.

Oh, that's marvellous. So you get us home four hours late, you separate us from our luggage, you never say sorry and then you come up with the worst excuse I have ever heard. How can it have been too hot, you imbecile? Because of your shoddy timekeeping, it was three o'clock in the bloody morning.

The thing is, though, that I (mostly) kept my temper because I knew I could come home, write this and therefore make his life as miserable as he had made mine.

What staggered me was the patience of my fellow passengers. They never complained. They quietly sat at the airport eating their meat veneer. They quietly stood on the bus, sweating. They didn't even squeal when the stewardesses poured boiling water into their laps, told barefaced lies about the luggage being on board and generally treated us as if we were a nuisance in the smooth running of their aeroplane.

The problem is that we are used to all this, and more. We expect the tiny bit of road that isn't jammed solid to be festooned with speed cameras. We expect the train to be late and the Tube to explode. We know that the plane will make an unscheduled stop in Bogota and that if we complain we'll be taken off by the police, arrested and shot.

Naturally, we expect a charter flight to get us back to Stansted four hours after everyone else because, of course, this particular airline is the sponsor of the spectacularly hopeless Minardi Formula One team which, last time I looked, was just finishing the 1983 French Grand Prix.

[ 13 August 2001: Message edited by: Capt PPRuNe ]

[Capt PPRuNe]

Naturally, we expect a charter flight to get us back to Stansted four hours after everyone else because, of course, this particular airline is the sponsor of the spectacularly hopeless Minardi Formula One team which, last time I looked, was just finishing the 1983 French Grand Prix.
http://www.minardi.it/images/foto/2001/20010409m.jpg :eek:

[Yak Hunt]

Whilst Mr Clarkson is a most witty, humourous and entertaining writer, the truth may be a little overstretched. For example the Lightning which he placed in his garden 'as a monument' is no longer there and was only ever on loan. Is he really that good a driver? etc etc - very amusing guy though.

[BigRab]

Whilst it was unfortunate for Jeremy Clarkson and his fellow travellers to have been delayed, his piece does serve to illustrate that Joe Public is rather demanding.

It may not be unreasonable to argue that one is entitled to get from A to B pretty much as advertised. The problem is that the product (i.e. air travel) has been so devalued that it is practically impossible for most of the cheaper airlines to deliver.
I rather loath air travel now as a passenger because of all the hassle and inevitable delays.
I think it is time the industry put its house in order and stopped trying to squeeze a quart out of a pint pot, deliver a quality product at a fair (not give-away) price.
Jeremy can afford to pay a little more; others would too given a little education and decent marketing.

What do you think?
:confused: :confused:

[Chocks Wahay]

Some people of course just like to complain. I had the (dis)pleasure of sitting next to an intensely irritated (and irritating) woman on a BA flight LGW-EDI on Friday night. The flight left on time (as near as makes no difference). The aircraft was a standard issue 737-400, nice leather seats, very comfy. Annoying woman had row 1, so plenty of legroom, and no one in front of here. She even had a nice photo of Rome to look at if she got bored. The food was hot and edible, and served on time. And free. As was the coffee and the booze. Yet the miserable b1tch moaned endlessly saying what a miserable flight she was having. Getting more and more exasperated, I pressed her for a specific complaint - get this - all she could think of was that the "waitress" didn't smile at her as she served her free drink!

Yes people have the right to expect flights to be punctual, clean etc, but you just can't please some people.

[Magnus Picus]

True,
You get what you pay for. No such thing as Airport Standby with this outfit?

[Capt Freo]

I have a friend who works with the pricing of flights and I can guarantee no drinks are free on any flight. They are already factored into the ticket price and I can tell you your paying nearly three times the amount that the local pub. Next time as a passenger and you want a few bevvies, look behind you at the rows of pax and raise your glass to all the non drinkers, as they are all subsidising your liquid indulgence.

[The Guvnor]

http://portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2001/08/13/matt.gif

[Vfrpilotpb]

That does it , anybody who is a grown up( by that I means has hairs were the sun dont reach) and plays with a GAME BOY must be a NERD, I have alway's thought the man was a Knock kneed long streak of P*$$, but now I guess we all know that, beside that he can't drive for toffee!!

[tiger burn]

Clarkson at his self righteous, egocentric & arrogant worst, honestly Jeremy,you gets what you pays for so quit the complaining. Anyway,wingeing articles such as that are simply boring & literary hot air. Someone send him on a one way back to Iceland with that other king cynic & his best buddy, AA Gill.

[Chocks Wahay]

[b[Capt Freo[/b] - obviously there's no such thing as a free lunch, especially on a flight, but given that she'd paid only a couple of quid more than travelling with Go fron STN, she hadn't exactly paid over the odds for her nosh & booze. She even got a free tour of West Lothian and Fife at low level, as we had to go-around due to the runway at EDI being occupied - never flown over my house in anything other than a spam can - that's value for money!

[BTB]

Clarkson as an individual embodies all that I loathe. But every time I open the Sunday Times I turn straight to his pieces. He is paid to entertain, shock, and satirise. I think he earns every penny. I just wish I had his talent, without the personality. Keep at it, Jez; and AA Gill really is a kn@b! :D

[rover2701]

I am sorry but if I had the problems that Clarkson had I would be complaining also. It dosnt matter how much you paid for your ticket, on time departure and information is not too much to ask. Just because he is well known and has a sharp and witty tongue and has access to a wider media dosn't give us the right to denigrate anything he has to say. Shouldn't we be putting our house in order? :eek:

[LatviaCalling]

If anyone but Clarkson had written that hilarious piece, half the PPruNers in the world would be after the poor sod because of journalistic bias. This was a tongue-in-cheek piece and he may have pieced it together from a number of experiences -- and it was funny. The guy may not know how to drive -- I don't know -- but he certainly has clout.

[chiglet]

Hey BTB, you know what they say about Shackeltons and Nimrods, don't you? :D
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy

[t'aint natural]

Clarkson's problem is that he has a column to write week in, week out, and is has to be different from the other columns he writes in the motoring press, and somewhat dissimilar to what he says on the telly. So the imperativeis to make a drama out of an everyday occurrence, lard it with some hackneyed humour and send it in with his invoice. I can just imagine him sitting on an uneventful flight, his mind playing on the possibilities...

[BmPilot21]

The Captain was late due to a traffic jam. That's because Clarkson has been promoting cars to millions of people every week on TV who go out and buy one, and cause the jams!

[beamer]

Yes - allright JC is an arrogant b*****d but
he's not afraid to make himself look a prat
on TV and his writing whilst often juvenile
is often very witty indeed. I was interested
to see the other week that his very expensive
book on Ferraris (£250 in cheapest edition)
is now being remaindered at a bargain sixty
notes. The real question of course is why
JC was flying with European in the middle of
the night - I would have thought that on his
wages he could have afforded a scheduled
carrier with business class...........

nb. Minardi may be slow but they are one of
the friendliest teams in F1.

[whats_it_doing_now?]

The thing about JC is that he is at his funniest when he is complaining about something. Some of his best TV was when he was poking fun at the US on his show. No surprises that his witty newspaper pieces should have the same formula.
Got to say though, he makes me laugh, and the fact that many of his readers may have been able to identify with what he wrote suggests that occasions like the one he wrote of aren't that uncommon at this time of year. But that's aviation!

[Jack The Lad]

Maybe the guy has a point. Why does everyone jump to the defensive when someone criticizes air travel? I've had some very unpleasant experiences on airplanes even though crew...(except they didn't know I was crew).

We are paid to provide a service and should expect to get judged on that, like any other service provider....expecting missiles overhead!

[torpedoe]

Clarkson is just another 'Journo' who throws up at the slightest hint of 'g' and doesn't fit into a GT40 ( cos his head is too big ).
Any body can scribe sarcasm and make it witty
- thats his thing - but being constructive takes time and thought which he seems short of. I think his 'writing' is akin to graffiti and can be likened to chewing gum for the 'bored'
Torpedoe

[Jack The Lad]

Torpedoe, I'm not sure you contributed anything of value to justify our cause...sorry, but comments like that make pilots look stupid!

[Delta Wun-Wun]

I can just see it now in the "Fat Family in Sports Gear eating Chips" Forum...I bet they are up in arms.I think his article was a little light hearted poke at sitting in the airport in the middle of the night.....ease up chaps. ;)

[RegionalFlyer]

:confused: He didn't seem to complain too much when he was a regular passenger on the same aircraft when it was VIP service with complimentary bar!

[Blacksheep]

Shackletons don't bother me chiglet. Not anymore anyway...

**********************************
Through difficulties to the cinema

[Tool Time]

Sheer entertainment.
Can't take too seriously anyone who can leave his breakfast scattered all over the rear cockpit of a F-15.

[BEagle]

Well, personally I think that JC's prose is fine. It pokes fun at times and much of it shouldn't be taken seriously, but on the whole it lightens up a drab world - as did his TV programme. Remember the hair spray food cannon? BBC-TV's Top Gear is very dull now; someone who looks like the Ginger whinger's little brother squeaks away in an almost indecipherable accent, Vicki BH is all blokey and then there's that bloke from somewhere oop Nawth who goes on about 'Dew-katties' and other 'moaterrr-bikes'! Bring back the old team of JC, QW and TN!!

JC was also spot-on describing the chaos which would hit the M25/M11 due to roadworks this year - particularly at the Stansted exit during the peak holiday season! It's not surprising that the captain of his flight was stuck in traffic - I was the other week (but was early for the flight because, as a passenger, I didn't have crew duty time to worry about!). Next time it'll be Aylesbury, Watford, St Albans, Hertford and avoid all motorways.

[VP8]

8 Screws are better than 4 blow jobs any day!!

VP8 :)

[scroggs]

I thought it was great. Good grief, there are some sanctimonious, boring old farts here, aren't there!!? ;)

[Lord Lucan]

What is this "My Country (industry) Right or Wrong" attitude?

Aviation has some serious problems in its ability to deliver an acceptable level of service, as many of us in the industry surely acknowledge. Why all the slanging off when someone dares to criticise.

Lets face it. 25 years ago it might still have been a miracle to be able to fly to far flung places in a few hours. Now it is mostly a pretty miserable experience. I am sure I am not alone in saying that I find most of my positioning flights to be a pretty poor experience, when I am sitting back in cattle class. In contrast to when I am at work, sitting up the front of my aging freighter, which even after many years in the business, I still enjoy.

Surely the correct response is to acknowledge this, and start to fix it.

Not to shoot the messanger.

[boris]

Rather funnier than usual Mr Clarkson.
Nicely observed and wittily written although the Game Boy is slightly worrying.
On the subject of Top Gear, I agree that a return to its roots would be terrific as proposed by BEagle but not forgetting Tony Mason.

[flypastpastfast]

Very much agree with sentiments of Lord Lucan.

Any critic of air industry is effectively sneered at and a mockery is made out of any legitimate complaints. As a SERVICE industry, some airlines have an odd attitude.

If it is not possible to offer a decent flight service at low ticket prices, it is up to the industry to address this.

Mr Adidas and his shell-suit family are not told when booking their cheap flight/holiday that as it is cheap the flight will be truly awful, and you will be expected to grin and bear it.

Something I have always believed is that travel agencies have a part to play in this. If when booking, you travel agent tells you you can expect cr@p service unless you pay a bit more, most people would pay more. The general public are generally kept in the dark about these matters when booking, so airline staff should not be so 'put out' when passengers complain - no matter how cheap the ticket.

Jeremy clarkson is extremely witty - not to be taken too seriously.

[Capt.Paul Skinback]

JC is actually the only thing worth reading in The Sunday Times these days. My sympathies lie with the poor Capt.- even leaving an extra hour for the bloody M11 roadworks is sometimes not enough, and as for finding a parking spot anywhere near Enterprise House,forget it! And for another 16 months!

[Lord Lucan]

Thanks for the support flypastpastfast

My point was not just that the low cost airlines are a pretty poor way to fly, more that there is not really that much difference. At least on short haul.

Most of my positioning I do on the full fare airlines, mostly with national carriers, and quite honestly is is a pretty poor experience. Especially the time wasted in airports, which is usually considerably more than the flight time.

And then there is the seating on board.....
:mad:

[BEagle]

LordLucan - not all the low-costs are a poor way to fly! I far, far prefer the quality of service I get on buzz flights from STN-FRA and back than I used to get on far more expensive flights on LH from LHR-FRA! The buzz team are friendlier, the coffee comes in a cafetiere (even if you do pay for it - and why shouldn't you?), parking at STN is so much cheaper, the seats are vastly more comfortable on both 146 and 737 than on any LH airbus, you don't feel a second class citizen to some fat businessman in 'someone else paid for my ticket class', etc etc......

Low cost short-haul, if clean and comfortable, is much more appealing than full-cost free G&T travel in the cattle-class seats of multi-class carriers! Especially when it means that I can visit Ladylove more often than I used to be able to!

[t'aint natural]

Anyone who has constructive criticism of make of aviation is welcome to put pen to paper, but you have to differentiate between that and taking the piss, especially when it's done because, like a small boy trying to write a thank-you letter to his aunt, you can't think of anything to put.
Jeremy Clarkson is a one-speed operator who's stuck in a bygone era and who doesn't yet realise that his joke's gone flat. In case you missed it, Top Gear is being pulled from the TV schedules. Why? Because its day is long gone. Most motorists now genuinely want to know how much damage their cars do, how to minimise that damage, how to be as environmentally friendly as they can possibly be. There's more to motoring than phewhatascorcherbabemagnet boy racing.
Clarkson? I remember him. Used to write/talk about cars. Tried to branch out, failed. Wonder whatever happened to him.

[BEagle]

BO££OCKS!! 4-star unleaded is the smell of freedom. To hell with tree-huggers in their boring little econoboxes, I say!

If TG really is being pulled, then it's only because the idiots at the BBC made a complete ar$e of themselves by selecting presenters for the programme who, in the main, nobody could understand, nobody could name and who lacked any real personality. Except, of course, for the occasional appearance of Tiff N - and the wicked V B-H.....

Poop Poop!!

[ 14 August 2001: Message edited by: BEagle ]

[Top Loadie]

The best thing about Top Gear was the "Top Gear Live" at the yearly motorshows. QW would usually compare, most of the time taking the pi$$ out of the others choice of wardrobe, TN would do his usual "I was a racing driver", and JC would end up offending the Koreans by saying that "Hyundai designers were too busy eating small dogs to design a decent car" and get banned from speaking all week.
It was always good to see replays of them all destroying one-off supercars.

And man did they drink!!!

[BIG E]

The price of your ticket does not necessarily
guarantee an on time departure,If you spend an xtra £100 on a ticket will you get a preferential atc slot? Is the aircraft then
immune from all technical problems?Will your fellow passenger get to the gate on time,blah,blah,blah.No matter which airline you fly you are still subject to the same problems and delays.

[overfly]

well said Beagle, absolutely spot-on (from one petrolhead to another) :D

[Yak Hunt]

The BBC are probably pulling Top Gear because they want to put on some PC garb. What about a gay ethnic baby whales theatre workshop group against the bomb and racism to replace it? Might be quite nice whilst tucking into some steamed mung beans on organic rice (I bet those paddy field workers don't go to the side of the field for a p!ss) No Thanks! I'll stick to a big mac and watching boy racers come off the roundabout behind my Impreza, come back Jez all is forgiven. Up the lads. :p

[Huck]

Ask any ACMI/Supplemental freight dog. We commercial ALOT, all over the world. It is amazing how poor service is, generally. U.S. carriers, regretfully, are the worst. Where do all the flight attendants go after level-off?

And who the 'ell certified that godawful A-340 with no gasper vents in back? Satan? A Cessna 150 at least gives you fresh air....

[BTB]

I never even flew shacks - I`m a fraud.I was a dry man on Mk 1`s.

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

As a frequent user of Virgin intercity trains and occasional Manch/Heathrow shuttle or BMI passsenger I am frequently amazed at the flack Virgin get while the airlines get away with a far less punctual or reliable service.

Wilmslow/Euston first class return is about £220, about the same or slightly less than the airfare. I use the train about 3 times a month, sometimes more, and (apart from the post-Hatfield slow downs, now history) it's usualy on time or within a few minutes. Worst ever was 1hr 30mins late due loco breakdown (I've had that twice). I've never had a train cancelled, but I know it occasionally happens. And the on-board service is superb, with, on morning trains, the best breakfast I know.

The aeroplane, in contrast, is nearly always late - often very late. And it gets cancelled frequently. And it's not a nice experience - hanging around airports (I can arrive at Wilmslow station just before the train and hop straight onto it). Awful cattle-herding airport staff. Nasty cramped conditions on board.

It's fashionable to knock trains post privatisation, but IMHO the journos should put the boot into competeing short (but expensive) inter city air services, where it more properly belongs.

Whaever happened to BA's 'walk-on' shuttle service?

SSD

[Zeitgebers]

I used to like JC, when he talked about cars he generally knew what he was talking about. Having branched out he uses the same formula of sarcasm and ranting except he generally doesn't know what he is talking about and the results are articles like this. I'm bored with it now.

Someone said in an earlier post words to the effect of : if travel agents could say 'unless you pay a bit more you can expect crap service, then people would pay it.
Well guess what - they won't. We in the airlines spend a lot of money on market research and would dearly love them to pay a bit more so we can offer more legroom, more aircraft availabilty to cover delays, etc etc. However, this is the British public we are talking about. Take a look at a German or Scandanavian charter jet, nowhere near as many seats coz they won't put ip with it and more importantly ARE prepared to pay for it.
You get what you (are prepared to) pay for.
:mad: :mad:

[Hogwash]

I have read this thread the whole way through and am amazed at some of the replies.

Some people seem to believe that by purchasing a cheap ticket one should expect delays and antipathy from the company concerned. The quote "you gets what you pays for" has been used. I guess to some that entitles the skipper to be late to work and not need to make an apology!!

I think JC is funny as was his article that leads this thread.

[rover2701]

Can't agree more. No matter what price you pay service and civility is not to much to ask. If budget airlines advertise that their fares are cheaper because you might get there 4 hours after the advertised departure time, just how long do they think they would stay in business. It dosn't matter how much is paid for a particular trip courtesy and punctuality should be the norm. :mad: :mad: :mad:

[Loony_Pilot]

Some may consider this a little controversial, but I dont see why anyone should "apologise" for a problem that they weren't responsible for, I believe that a simple acknowledgement of regret for the inconvienience caused is sufficent.

Also.. its extrememly stupid singling out one person (in this case the Captain) as being responsible for the flight being late, there is a risk that some air-rage ridden idiot might attack the Captain? ... airlines DO have standby crew after all....

Anyway, I find JC quite amusing, I dont think anyone should take his rantings too seriously.

LP

[BEagle]

Top Gear last night? Wasn't it utter rubbish. Boring little microcars, an indifferent section about the Caterham 7 and V B-H driving a couple of hot hatches.

Bring back the non-PC wit of Clarkson!!

[ShotOne]

Well it is easy to shoot the messenger, especially one as big and ugly as JC, but it has to be said that the charter airlines often do NOT deliver. Every season all the operators advertise a first class service yet attempt to deliver it with fewer crews, less aircraft downtime and paying even less for ground handling.

[scroggs]

There are STILL a lot of boring, sanctimonious old farts populating this thread. And, what's more, they're probably methane-powered vegan tree-huggers as well. Jeremy Clarkson for President, I say, and BEagle for Minister of Morale and Political Correctness! :D

[Jackonicko]

More expensive tickets, if 'bearable' would merely fund improved dividends, increased profits and even staff pay rises long before a single passenger saw a single improvement in service on scheduled services, because there isn't sufficient competition to force this service industry to give its customers the service they deserve. On the charter front, it's perhaps bound to be shoddy and no frills in order to make the overseas holidays we now expect affordable, which perhaps they shouldn't be anyway, if the environmentalists are to be believed?

With regard to Top Gear, Clarkson may be an @rse - but hugely entertaining, passionate and knowledgeable, making TG great watching, while similar aviation programmes (inevitably presented by weather girls, sports presenters and other aviation-illiterate TV personalities) tend to be lowest-common denominator, anodyne crap.

[1.3VStall]

What did happen to the English Electric wonderjet that used to be outside JC's home? I flew over his pad the other weekend and noticed it had gone. It was much more interesting than your average garden gnome!

[DamienB]

It's gone back to Booker - he only borrowed it.

[tiger burn]

Sorry guys, but reading between the lines, Clarkson's article assumes a wholly negative, albeit humourous, description. Even if for eg, the fat family had generously offered to share some of their chips......or a member of crew had been extremely courteous, I doubt it would have warranted a mention. I agree that bad service is never excusable, but in this instance, perhaps events are an eency bit exagerated.

What will be the topic in this week's ST? Could be this thread? ! :eek:

[ 17 August 2001: Message edited by: tiger burn ]

[BEagle]

If it is, then JC - if you'd like to fly in something which won't cause you to throw your ring, post here and perhaps something could be arranged??

[GlueBall]

Pervasive lack of humor from many respondents.

If you had lived 100 years earlier you'd be complaining about having to ride in a springless donkey cart. Eh?

:cool:

[The Guvnor]

AIRLINE PASSENGERS' COMPLAINTS SOAR

By Peter Woodman, Air Correspondent, PA News

COMPLAINTS from airline passengers soared last year, with moans about delays more than doubling, the Air Transport Users Council reported today.

Written complaints received by the council in the 12 months to the end of March 2001 rose 45%, while telephone complaints increased 10% compared with the 1999-2000 figure.

Delays topped the list of written complaints in 2000-01, while mishandled baggage headed the telephone moans table.

The council's chairman, Ian Hamer, said today: "These statistics show yet again that too many passengers are being badly let down in these important aspects of service.

"We are particularly concerned about the continuing increase in complaints and inquiries about lost or damaged luggage. This year's increase follows a similar rise last year.

"We have called repeatedly for publication of airline mishandled baggage statistics. Publication will not in itself make the problem go away. But we believe that the `name and shame' effect will provide a strong incentive to airlines and their agents to do better."

On delays, the council said extensive media coverage of held-up flights might have prompted more passengers to complain.

On baggage, the council said there was "a particularly worrying and continuing trend" in bags being lost on connecting flights.

The existing regulations meant there was "little incentive for airlines to seek to ensure that the bags actually make the connections with their owners".

Complaints about cancellations rose 124%, although this was partly explained by the severe disruption caused by the London air traffic control computer breakdown in June 2000.

However, the council added: "There appears to be mounting evidence of airlines cancelling flights for commercial reasons, often with little obvious concerns for the effects on passengers' travel plans.

"When they cancel flights, carriers are obliged to offer refunds or alternative transportation. But we consider cancelling flights for commercial reasons, with no further redress for passengers, to be a serious abuse of the conditions of carriage."

Mr Hamer ss "highly regrettable" that firm proposals to improve European air traffic management as a whole had not been put forward.

He warned: "Passengers will meanwhile continue to suffer delays arising from congestion in the skies."

The top 10 written council in the 12 months ending March 31, 2001 (with the 1999-2000 figure in brackets) were:

COMPLAINT NUMBER

1. Delays 311 (148)

2. Mishandled baggage 238 (155)

3. Cancellations 160 (71)

4= Reservations 90 (89)

4= Overbooking 90 (60)

6. Tickets 72 (36)

7. Seating ules 66 (51)

9. Ground services 63 (55)

10. Safety 46 (57)

The top 10 telephone complaints were:

COMPLAINT NUMBER

1. Mishandled baggage 631 (437)

2. Delays 460 (232)

3. Cancellations 293 (146)

4. Tickets 274 (228)

5. Reservations 193 (318)

6. Overbooking 169 (141)

7. Schedules 149 (157)

8. Special needs 90 (107)

[THE FIXER]

:mad:

So whats it take to say sorry, obviously too much for some. I have looked at most of the thread and the majority of you are moaning about Clarkson...he was doing his job, its a pitty that the same cant be said about the Captain. Those passengers pay our wages..lets look after them and not treat them with contempt!

[twistedenginestarter]

Mr Clarkson made two separate complaints - airlines and airports. Well to be fair, as usual, he was also having a go at his fellow countrymen. (Why do English people look and behave like complete prats?).

I was recently delayed 2 hours by Brtiannia. In fact the first hour was to wait for passengers to arrive after a major Motorway blockage. The second was to get baggage off to remove lighters.I have no complaint with this.

I do however have a complaint with the pathetic lack of facilties at the airport concerned. They'd got a lounge, cafeteria, toilets and a couple of shops. That's just not good enough for killing 3, 4, 5 etc etc hours.

Aviation just totally lacks creative thinking...

(I was sufficiently occupied on the plane though. It took me the whole 3 hours of the flight to work out where I could put my legs...)

[Mover & Shaker]

One good point raised by Mr Clarkson was the contact from the Captain, i.e lack of it. Whatever you say about pax we must all remember to keep them informed whenever possible. There is nothing worse. A Captains voice over the PA is always soothing

[E cam]

I wonder if he'll be able to fill next weeks column by taking the piss out of these replies?

[Matt Vinyl]

Isn't it amazing that a quote from England's answer to John McEnroe(mummy's little soldier)can generate so much response from a professional forum. Jeremy Motormouth is a spoilt brat who always winges when life isn't perfect for him. :rolleyes:

[BEagle]

What a bunch of BOFs! JC is a gloriously non-PC chap who adores fast cars and aeroplanes. His piece about speed cameras and the tree-huggy North London 'sandalistas' was well written indeed.

I understand that both Top Gear on TV and Top Gear magazine are being re-formatted; I hope they return to traditional values!

Now I'm just off to burn lots more petrol, run over a few pedestrians, knock a few cyclists off their bikes and take the favourite local bends rather quicker than the local miseries would like........POOP POOP!!

Some of you probably think I'm being serious....

[Harry Erman]

Hey Matt, That's a bit heavy for a "first" posting! The motormouth is generally an amusing author and it would be a very boring world if writers couldn't have the odd dig at professions. Everyone has a go here at beancounters, managers and SLF and I don't think we should be so delicate when someone has a light-hearted crack at us! Too many posts like yours, and we could become known as arrogant and prima donnas! (no change there, then!)

[trytofly]

so....that infamous jc wrote that piece ?
fantastic

the number of times he has pi**ed me off with his lack of any professionalism cannot be counted

did I write anything about it to anyone...no..because it ( he ) ain't worth it

I don't tolerate vindictive people though

jc...... let he who has not erred....etc etc

the capt. got it wrong, he should have said sorry ( though I doubt you could have done so )...but wind your spoilt neck in !!

[Bourbon-on-the-rocks]

Trytofly, what a pathetic, spoilt little brat you sound, much more so than the one you criticise. At least Clarkson makes us laugh, whereas your effort at writing is an incoherent embarrassment.

[Flap 5]

What Jeremy Clarkson said was what any one of you would have said in the same situation. That is as a passenger who has little or no knowledge of what goes on at the sharp end (and why should you?) and having been kept waiting with no explanation in a foreign airport with little to do.

When the (tactless) explanation is given as the pilot being late due to the M11 how else would an ordinary passenger react? The subsequent lack of communication from the flight deck would only reinforce that opinion.

[trytofly]

BOTR

well excuse me !!!!

never have I tried to pass myself as a literary master.

I say again....I don't tollerate vindictive people, and although jc had good reason to complain ( accepted in my last posting ) he went just a little too far.

Everyone cocks up at sometime. He( jc )is unaware of the reasons for someone being late to work and simply does not know the character that he has chosen to assassinate.

You BOTR are guilty of the same, so why don't you wind your neck in too, before your high stress levels suppress your superior
writing and self expresion skills !!! ;)

[Seat 32F]

Surely the point is: is it acceptable to have a situation whereby in the event that one of your key personnel is unavoidably delayed, an entire planeload of passengers is held up for hours, with all the resultant knock-on effects. It does sound a bit amateurish.

People can tolerate delays when it is a matter of safety and a clear explanation is given. They understandably get highly frustrated when it is obvious that the cause of their suffering is plain old bad management.

[t'aint natural]

Oh, come on, you Clarkson lovers. He's only got one act and he's been living off it since he was hack on Autocar. He's about as funny as piles and he's as "gloriously non-pc" as the next jeans-and-cowboy-boots, bouffant-haired seventies refugee. To be accused of being po-faced for not laughing at the antics of this antedeluvian dunderhead is a gross insult, and probably actionable.

[Bourbon-on-the-rocks]

..and how many acts have you got?

[rover2701]

Its got nothing to do with "one act". He had a legitimate reason to complain, and he had a very public forum in which to do it. Good on him I say. The more people that bitch the better our industry will respond to problems like these. Its time this industry provided the service that the public pay for.(and just because its low price doesn't mean bad service)!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

[CaptainCarpet]

Gentlemen, in general, I couldn't agree more with your sentiments. Nobody likes to have his profession and professionalism questioned. However, I think that the majority of us agree that the neverending price war, as always, not only brings us cheaper services, but the inherent problems associated with trying to work with miniscule margins.
The Captain on this flight started out by being delayed travelling on the motorway. That always makes us happy before a night flight. Was he called out from standby or was it just traffic. Either way, have some sympathy. I'm sure that he didn't drop in somewhere for a Big Mac! A delay, a night flight, and probably having to endure the wrath of the outbound passengers as well as the Company.... great! And the same to look forward to on the return!
However, always be sympathetic to the passengers. We know what it's like to be left in the dark, and they are paying (albeit economically) for a service, so lets try to keep them informed, hopefully with the truth.
As for Mr. Clarkson. A well written story! And that is what it must be treated as. The trouble is that he has a wide and varied public, who, for them, his writing is gospel, and hr has portrayed our business in a bad light! (OK, I know!)
If possible, lets not give him any more opportunities. ;)

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

t'aint natural - JC was a hack on Performace Car not Autocar actually. His back page column was/is hilarious.

Ratings of Top Gear slumped after he left, he is a top paid columist in the The Sun and The Times, has his own BBC TV series, and is a self made multi millionaire family man.

JC also does more than the average amount of charity work but you never ever hear anything about that. I consider him to be a gentleman.

And you are...?

I thought JC's piece on his airline delay was fair enough. Just because *we* understand the technicalities of why it can easily happen doesn't mean the public will does.

WWW

[M.Mouse]

Goodness me aren't we getting a teeny weeny bit serious here? I recently had my worst flight ever as a passenger with a normally very impressive scheduled carrier. It happens. Jeremy Clarkson is paid to entertain. If I didn't find him entertaining I wouldn't watch/read him. The same way I don't watch Graham Norton or Lily Savage. Others do, fine. He probably exaggerated but that is his style and it made me laugh.

Shouldn't we lighten up a little?

Why do people feel the need to use swear words with asterix when making a post? Surely the English language has enough suitable words use? Is it to look clever or is it indicative of ignorance?

[ 22 August 2001: Message edited by: M.Mouse ]

[Onions]

It does seem a little strange that the pilot was late yet all the passengers seemed to make it on time. If the passengers made it up or down the M11 then you would have thought the crew could have.

As for JC. Well funny.

[dullcopilot]

yeah i like jc too , can be hilarious , but .
according to the number one on the flight he had been drinking and refused to remove his hand luggage from an emergency exit. he also once said that he wouldnt name and shame someone because the individual didnt really have a way to reply to the allegation . Im sorry he didnt have a great flight , but , perhaps he could have been more honest and even handed in his criticism . he doesnt really sound like a great passenger . :eek:

[trytofly]

M.M

The use of swear words is not necessarily an indication of ignorance. In fact, it could be said that those who state this are unable to find any other means of 'putting down' and sensibly criticising anothers statements. It can be an attempt on their behalf to show themselves as a more intelligent being, one that has no need to lower themselves to such standards.

Get real...we all do it and sometimes it just feels good.

Happy days

;) ;) ;)

[tiger burn]

M.M - I certainly agree with you on that one. No excuses for poor diction! As for dear Jez, is Iceland back on the agenda yet?

[M.Mouse]

trytofly

Yes we all swear but I do not swear routinely and certainly only in the presence of company where it is acceptable.

On a very public bulletin board it neither looks good nor is it necessary.

I actually think it detracts from the point that the contributor is making.

I might be slightly old fashioned in thinking that we ought to maintain a certain level of moral standards. No doubt you will disagree.

[t'aint natural]

Wee Weasly: Clarkson has indeed parlayed his minimal talent into a lucrative career, and the vast majority of his cash has come from my taxes and yours... from the £12 million a day we are required to pay to the BBC for its decreasingly interesting tripe. Don't you just love to see these raging iconoclasts - Clarkson, Deayton and Hislop spring first to mind - standing there with their hands out for the public dole.

[trytofly]

M.Mouse

No..I certainly do not disagree..at least not entirely.
Right time and place, and of course company, and even I do not swear routinely.
Personally, I think only once I saw swearing on this site that I thought was unnecessary, and somehow looked wrong / over the top. It was repetitive which made it worse.
That you think it distracts from the point I cannot quite grasp, but I wouldn't argue that with you. Opinions are just that.
Anyway.....if you see me swearing on this site again, try to take it as no more than a simple way of expressing myself. (Lazy - not thick). Never will you see me swear at or about anyone. If it still offends or upsets, I apologise and will accept another literary ticking off.
Morals ??? Not enough people have high morals and I beleive jc did not claim the moral high ground in this case. Had he kept it simple, non vindictive and to the point he would have walked it. Big mistake.
( My opinion only...see above !! )
:) ;) :)

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

t'aint - well when Jeremy took home from the BBC only a fraction of what they paid Dale Winton or Anthea Turner I hardly begrudge Jeremy his shilling.

Besides - he made the majority of his money by founding the prodution company that produced his Speed series (excellent Aviation content) plus his chatshow plus his video spin offs. Thats his own company founded with his own money at his own risk.

Have I Got News For You remains one of the best shows on television.

Last nights Top Gear underlined the lack of Jeremy effect now present - Quentin Wilson doesn't show up, Tiff gets 3 mins to rate a Proton 7/10 (like thats using his talents), Berry the Bike has dissapeared and all we get is a couple of blokes with hair gel displaying no specialist knowledge or indeed petrol-head appreciation of the cars about which they talk.

I am sure the focus groups love it but like many people and Forumla One these days - I can barely be bothered to watch.

Anyhows, I think this is off to Aircrew Notices very soon.

Cheers,

WWW

[Harry Erman]

I suspect T'aint's problem is that a mere entertainer is getting paid more than him!

[t'aint natural]

This is getting way outside the scope of this forum, but perhaps "Taint's problem" can be summed up thus:
Are there any Americans on this thread? Do you realise that here in Britain, you must have a government licence to own a TV, and if you have a TV but no licence (license to you) you can go to prison? That Big Brother detector vans go about the country tracking down people who haven't paid their TV tax? And that this licence income, some US$6 billion per annum, is given to the State broadcaster to produce some of the world's worst and most expensive broadcast media? That this particular tax supports over 24,000 freeloaders? You'd think that if the taxpayer had £12 million to spare he'd equip a hospital, or build a school, instead of outbidding commercial TV for Buffy the Vampire Slayer, or otherwise bankrolling the BBC for a single day. Mr Deayton may indeed be worth US$75,000 for a single evening's work, buy why should the taxpayer pay when, having stumped up, the taxpayer then elected to watch commercial TV anyway? Yes, I resent every thousand pounds that that monochromatic pudden Clarkson takes from me and my ilk, and I would urge him to get off the public dole and try to make a living from somebody who wants to pay for his services.

Anyway, Harry, how d'you know this mere entertainer gets more than me?

My last word on the subject (unless sorely provoked) Back to aviation, please.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

And I suppose you never listen to Radio 4? In perfect FM from the Hebrides to Guernsey... Or any of the BBC Local radio stations or indeed World Service which reaches some 92% of the World Population I believe. That is an important national asset - the only truth known behind the Iron Curtain for more than a generation.

I suppose you think all those Open University, Childrens TV that isn't all cartoons, ethnic minority/specialist interest prgarammes would happen without the license fee? How come the UK is the ONLY country in the world to have digital radio nationwide in the very near future? Is it because - like colour and FM radio - only an *institution* can afford to make such investment without answering to shareholders with their yearly dividend demand.

If you want a completely Plebian populace then go ahead and sanction US style TV. I think the BBC is the most fantastic tax investment that I fund.

However this *is* really now Aircrew Notices at the very least so I shall move it henceforth.

WWW