Aircrew Roll necks

[DownloadDog]

Just been told by stores that there are no roll necks, other than sized XL, available for the next couple of months! Is anyone else having the same problem obtaining new ones?

Incidentally, does anyone have the same ridiculous opening hours for stores as this:

Mon to Thurs 0830 to 1000; 1015 to 1145; and 1300 to 1530.
Fri 0830 to 1000; 1015 to 1145; and 1300 to 1430.

:}

[Professor Plum]

There are probably are some available, but they're being stored in case "someone needs them"

[The Helpful Stacker]

Just been told by stores that there are no roll necks, other than sized XL, available for the next couple of months! Is anyone else having the same problem obtaining new ones?

Incidentally, does anyone have the same ridiculous opening hours for stores as this:

Mon to Thurs 0830 to 1000; 1015 to 1145; and 1300 to 1530.
Fri 0830 to 1000; 1015 to 1145; and 1300 to 1430.

:}

Quite often the problems with getting hold of aircrew clothing (and most other clothing) is down to those hardworking civil serpents at DCTA who are supposed to monitor such contracts and ensure they are replaced before running out not doing their job.

As someone who used to run a clothing stores I often received the "the contract has run out" response when hastening demand inabilities, believe me its not much fun being the middle man when the CS staff hindering the system are so untouchable.

BTW, yes those timings are quiet bizarre, considering that most non-supply staff can only get away from the workplace during their lunch breaks its pretty poor show not to have some sort of cover during this most convenient time.

Of course you could at the other end of the scale have the system that has been put into place at RAF Odious which means that you can't even visit Clothing Stores anymore. Instead you have to send an email to Clothing Stores requesting an item (you need to know the NSN) and they deliver it, though only at set times and only to you or your sqn supplier (how many of them are still around eh?)

[HeliAviator]

Hmmmmm, funny that, there are no aircrew sock in the most convenient sizes at my local Q&M either. Must be saving all that money to buy the shiney new helos that Tony siad we could have. Or am I just being cynical?

[indie cent]

By coincidence I was just told the same...

I was actually amazed to find the stores open as every Bl***y other time I'm passing they are not.

And another thing... Why do the new roll necks stretch to fit the neck of Mike Tyson as soon as you put the blinking things on? Where's the splatter protection when you've a scoop hanging down at the front?? I find I'm always digging for one of my older, thicker ones to do the job!!!
:confused: Grrr.

[Radar Muppet]

What's the snag. Aircrew rollnecks shrink so blaady much the first time you wash/dry them that XL is the only way to go if you are taller than 5ft!

(Obviously this is inapplicable if you are a truckie mate. 'Laundry - that's just for the imprest isn't it?'):)

[Fg Off Max Stout]

At an RAF station near Liz Hurley's birthplace, stores doesn't open at all now unless you have an appointment, as alluded to above. Thank you 'lean team'. It did make me wonder what the suppliers did all day now that their time wasn't being wasted by people coming in wanting items of kit - something task orientated and mission focussed no doubt. Not quite, on peering through the window of the locked front door (crazily, at a time somewhere between 0830 and 1700) a few days ago, they were all sitting round playing cards, eating jaffa cakes and drinking tea. When I finally got someone's attention the reply was "Sorry Sir, we can't help you right now but if you'd like to make an appointment...."

[diginagain]

Sounds not unlike the hours kept by Reg, civvy flying clothing hoarder at MW. I wonder how much training time was wasted awaiting his pleasure.

There was, however one morning when the usual poor service was absent. A young Airtrooper was holding the fort. On enquiring, the throng was informed that Reg was in hospital.

A long-suffering SNCO QHI at the back piped up "Nothing trivial, I hope".

[The Helpful Stacker]

At an RAF station near Liz Hurley's birthplace, stores doesn't open at all now unless you have an appointment, as alluded to above. Thank you 'lean team'. It did make me wonder what the suppliers did all day now that their time wasn't being wasted by people coming in wanting items of kit - something task orientated and mission focussed no doubt. Not quite, on peering through the window of the locked front door (crazily, at a time somewhere between 0830 and 1700) a few days ago, they were all sitting round playing cards, eating jaffa cakes and drinking tea. When I finally got someone's attention the reply was "Sorry Sir, we can't help you right now but if you'd like to make an appointment...."

To be fair to the lads and ladies in the RAF Odious clothing stores LEAN joined operatonal kitting and normal clothing stores together but cut their personnel by quite a bit, meaning that the operational kitting side (which is very busy for some reason) takes the lions share of their time.

God bless LEAN and all who suffer under it.:rolleyes:

[HeliAviator]

Diginagain. Is that old git Reg still there? I left the Corps for light blue 8 years ago and he was tight as a duck rear end then, must be having the brown coat surgically removed of his back. Still glad to see that nothing ever changes at the largest grass airfield in europe.

[diginagain]

Couldn't tell you, mate, I departed the Corps 10 years ago from somewhere else, and didn't have to stand in line to have Reg count it all back in again. They'll know where he is over on the Army Aviation site, I'm sure.

[SamCaine]

Diginagain. Is that old git Reg still there? I left the Corps for light blue 8 years ago and he was tight as a duck rear end then, must be having the brown coat surgically removed of his back. Still glad to see that nothing ever changes at the largest grass airfield in europe.

He retired a number of years ago, to be replaced by ......

... his son. And, so the line goes; like father, like son.

I don't blame Reg or his offspring, in those days there was no LEAN, just a tight-arsed LE officer out for his OBE (other buggers' efforts).

[diginagain]

Good to see that the home of the Corps is maintaining its tradition of bu99ering people about.

[CARVE111]

:ugh: It would appear that all the flying clothing in Sunny Aldergrove is issued to the RAF Police, because they obviously need to stag on the gate, so bad that aircrew gloves are now a 1 for 1 swap.
Hey we all know stores are for storing anyway, unless you are the friend of a friend of a QM/copper.

[Arclite01]

and a full shelf is a happy shelf >>>>>>>>>>>>:}

Shawbury used to be terrible for kit issue too !!!

Arc

[Gainesy]

Honington 1976: "You can't have that pen till you've signed for it". :confused:

[mutleyfour]

Can I suggest you try the Brize store as they seem to be abundant in everything that everyone else so desperately needs.

[Blodwyn Pig]

Honington 1976: "You can't have that pen till you've signed for it". :confused:

Honington 1987 : " you can't have a new pair of shoes in that size as we've only got one pair left, and if you have them, then we'll be out of stock" :ugh:

[Gainesy]

Probably the same civvy tosser Blodwyn.:)

[PPRuNeUser0172]

It is funny how there is often the odd shortage of kit whether it be flying gloves, boots, etc etc but when you get looking around the stn, the amount of bowser drivers with sparkly pair of flying gloves or MT drivers with flying boots and pretty much anyone seems to be able to get their hands on an "aircrew" watch!! :mad:

Always makes me laugh how stores think they have got one over on you if they manage NOT to give you something, how cr@p their lives must be if that is their source of satisfaction.

Lets hear it for the REMF's

Hey we all know stores are for storing anyway, unless you are the friend of a friend of a QM/copper

Carve old chap have you taken leave of your senses? Who would want to be friends with a copper????? (apart from Fido)

[The Helpful Stacker]

....Always makes me laugh how stores think they have got one over on you if they manage NOT to give you something, how cr@p their lives must be if that is their source of satisfaction.


Ok, I'll bite.

In my career as a Supplier I have never, to my memory, set out for a day at work with the soul intention of letting someone down when they've asked for something. I actually feel pretty crap when someone comes in for something and I can't help them. I usually try offering some alternative even if they aren't scaled for that item (when I ran a clothing stores Magnums instead of out-of-stock CAB boots was a regular) if I can cover it.

I can count the number of miserable sods in my trade who I'm met in my time who would happily leave a customer with "its out-of-stock" and no alternative offered on one hand. Most Suppliers will, if treated with a bit of politeness and manners, go out of their way to help you as what goes around comes around and folk often remember a section they've done well from in the past when thinking about who to give that spare pack of biscuits to.

What you should understand though is lack of trade experience and knowing how to get things done can often be mistaken for un-helpfulness. The unit I'm at has a lot of very young SAC's who due to the tempo of the unit haven't had the opportunities to 'round robin' and learn the entire trade section by section, rather they just learn the basics in the first section they are put into from trade training and are left at that. Over my many years I've learnt how to use the system to the customers advantage, built up a well-stocked 'good numbers' book for all those hard to come by items and most importantly learnt that happy customers often have spare slabs of beer at Christmas.;)

Lets hear it for the REMF's

Yep, lets here it for the people that keep the big flying club going.:ok:

[PPRuNeUser0172]

Careful chap that hook might go rusty;)

Most Suppliers will, if treated with a bit of politeness and manners, go out of their way to help you as what goes around comes around and folk often remember a section they've done well from in the past when thinking about who to give that spare pack of biscuits to.


I accept that manners maketh the man, however if I am entitled to something, then I don't need to be sycophantic or excessively 'nice', just give me it!!!

What you should understand though is lack of trade experience and knowing how to get things done can often be mistaken for un-helpfulness

fair point, but why as was suggested earlier in the thread can you guys set such pathetic 'opening' hours, you are paid to work the same hours as everyone else on stn? I may misunderstand your chronic lack of manpower or some other policy but why can't you just be open from 8 til 5?

Give and take mate, you give us stuff and we take it, that after all is your job

[Blodwyn Pig]

Probably the same civvy tosser Blodwyn.:)

sorry to say it was a snotty SAC stacker.

in line with what others are saying about the wrong people getting the kit, we had quite a battle to get the new fangled gortex wet weather gear to wear on the line, but were constantly getting told that it wasn't available, not in stock etc. this kind of grated as you walked round camp and noticed most of the stackers wearing spangly new gortex, along with MT drivers, and even PD staff!
this coincided with the annual visit from command of all the big wigs asking if there was anything that needed sorting, how was morale etc. the gortex was mentioned, and a amazingly they tacked the subject with unusual zeal, and within a week or two, we had plenty of gortex! (and quite a few upset stackers etc.)

[Confucius]

Can I suggest you try the Brize store as they seem to be abundant in everything that everyone else so desperately needs.

What, A-10s, C-130s & SHs?

[Pontius Navigator]

Still want an aircrew shirt?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/RAF-Aircrew-Roll-Neck-long-sleeve-top-Large_W0QQitemZ260044869857QQihZ016QQcategoryZ67580QQrdZ1QQc mdZViewItem

Flying Suit to match Sir?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150051872316&fromMakeTrack=true

[Faithless]

Just been told by stores that there are no roll necks, other than sized XL, available for the next couple of months! Is anyone else having the same problem obtaining new ones?

Incidentally, does anyone have the same ridiculous opening hours for stores as this:

Mon to Thurs 0830 to 1000; 1015 to 1145; and 1300 to 1530.
Fri 0830 to 1000; 1015 to 1145; and 1300 to 1430.

:}

Christ these Normal office hours are a killer arnt they?

[225Turbo]

Why not pop into the squippers? they can usually get everything I need at Brize:)

[anotherchopride?!]

Arclite, agreed on SY stores...

Witness my attempt to procure a new nav bag (my eye was on the smaller, easier-to-open-and-reclose-whilst-airborne variety which had been issued, admittedly after some protracted negotiations, to many of my colleagues)

Please note this exchange is edited in the interests of brevity (stores and brevity, that's a laugh...)

Me: Can I please have a new Nav bag?
Storeman: Well..........why?

Me: My old one has broken and won't stay closed
S: Ok, bring it in and I will swap it.

Me: It's not on camp, and besides it's one of the older, bigger ones. Can I not get a small one as additional issue please?
S: Ooooh no, the small ones are only for observers and navs. (How many navs and obs at SY???)

Me: Ok, can I get a bigger one to replace mine then?
S: No.

Me: ??!!!???
S: The older ones have been removed from stock because they have failed a safety review and aren't allowed to be issued for carriage in ac anymore.

Me: Errr??!!! So, you won't give me a small bag cos it's for observers, and you won't give me a big one cos it's unsafe?
S: Yes.

Me: So, what do i do?
S: Bring in the broken (older, bigger, unsafe) one, and I will exchange it.

Me: FOR WHAT??!!
S: One of these (and flashes the Observer bag under my nose)

Me: well, can I not just get that now because I NEED a bag to go flying with, and then it will be on my Kit record, as will the old bag?
S: Ur, well....Um....Um....Ok then.

Best 10 minutes of my time at SY.....To55er

[Vifferpilot]

RAF Chivenor, 1986..."I can't let you have the last one sir (Aircrew Information Folder), someone might need it" :ugh:

I've been waiting nearly 8 months for new shirts/lj's and socks so I'm happily puttiing up with baggy (slack around the neck) shirts, holed lj's and too-small socks! :mad:

[Back in the Barrel]

Still awaiting a Size 8 Cold Weather Flying Jacket 4 months since placing the order. 24 other aircrew at my Stn awaiting same item, some since Apr. Lapsed contract is the cited reason. Estimate for delivery of new stock? Not known. Apparently, this was not seen as being an important issue over the summer, because it isn't cold in the summer. Except if you depressurize at 30K....

[Roland Pulfrew]

Chaps/chapesses

Given the wonders of e-mail etc have any of you complained direct to, or asked your boss to complain to the Defence Clothing IPT with regard to shortages/poor quality clothing?

If they don't know there is a problem how can they rectify it? If everyone complained direct when there was a shortage of an item or something of lesser quality was being issued (and I agree the roll necks do sag after a couple of washes and aren't as thick or as good quality as they used to be) they might get the message.

If you have access to the Defence Directory do a search for 'clothing' and hey presto 62 potential points for complaint. :E Don't expect much though only one of them is military.:ugh:

[Ballast]

Now that Amazon can list hundreds of thousands of items, many obscure and held by "partners" and not in their own warehouse and can still get the item to you next day- and are "open" 24x7x365 from any location in the world why does a base in North Hampshire require kit orders to be in by the end of the first week of the month for delivery in the following month.

Perhaps Amazon should take on the contract.

[Mr C Hinecap]

chopride - I believe you identified yourself as the throbber there. I believe your 'want' and 'need' requirements were a little far apart there.

If you needed a bag RIGHT NOW for flying but your other one was not there to exchange, yet your need for the new shiny thing was so urgent, I see a bit of a stampy foot strop at the counter. Prima donna and no doubt. I hope you got your issue handbag for the next time you need to slap someone down with it. :rolleyes:

[XV277]

Now that Amazon can list hundreds of thousands of items, many obscure and held by "partners" and not in their own warehouse and can still get the item to you next day- and are "open" 24x7x365 from any location in the world why does a base in North Hampshire require kit orders to be in by the end of the first week of the month for delivery in the following month.
Perhaps Amazon should take on the contract.


And there lies the difference between Commercial and Public Sector IT and procurement projects. In the private sector, if it doesn't work, no profit, you won't get paid. In the public sector, if it doesn't work, then they just shovel more money at it until it does - or doesn't.

[Mr C Hinecap]

In the public sector, if it doesn't work, then they just shovel more money at it until it does - or doesn't.

Where is this 'more money' you speak of? I've not seen it. You also sound quite the expert on procurement my dear chap. Perhaps you'd be so kind as to pop along to the DPA and share your wisdom - they obviously need it.

Or do you just know how to do everyone elses job better? The same goes for everyone else who throws stones and compares what the miltary does to industry. There are some similarities, but they are few. The differences are rather critical.

[Touchin' Down]

Surely JPA must have a button you can press that makes clothing magically appear! I'm sure it would only take a mere 46 hours to do too. Right, back to my expence claim I started filling out in August.