Gold Air becomes Air Partner

[Daifly]

http://www.advfn.com/news_Acquisition-of-Gold-Air_17179831.html

Interesting. So, what do we all think then...?

[Phil Brockwell]

Well it's another exit startegy. Would suspect it will be to enhance the block / fractional wing of AP?

What do operators of similar aircraft to the LR45 think? If AP ring up LEA for an XL quote what will the response be?



Phil

[Monkey Boy]

Well I expect they'll see a reduction in business from the other brokers that's for sure but I guess Gold Air / Air Partner won't miss it.

[Bus_Bar]

Well I expect they'll see a reduction in business from the other brokers that's for sure but I guess Gold Air / Air Partner won't miss it.

Indeed. Most brokers would be loathed to expose their clients to one of their direct competitors. Furthermore, unless the 45's are marketed at rates more inline with their competitors similar aircraft (always overpriced), the ad-hoc broker link for GA/AP will cease to exist.

[Monkey Boy]

I hear that Mr Curtis has been doing the rounds to the brokers ensuring them that all flights booked through Gold Air will be confidential and that Air Partner will not get hold of any passenger manifests. Hmmm. Not sure about that - With Mr B as Commercial Director I can't help but feel that the temptation would be too great to send accross any interesting "names" to the AP HQ! Sorry, I just don't trust em :suspect:

All my Lear 45 & Hawker 800 business ex UK will be heading FAB from now on!

[V12]

doesn't every brokering agent give his client details to the air operating company on every flight, so surely the jet companies know who everyone's client is, during the flight? And especially if going to USA they need to details for security.

[LGW Vulture]

I posted something to this effect back in April. However, whilst I knew they were up for sale, I didn't think Air Partner would buy "Dirty Books"!

See here....:ooh:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=121990&page=3&highlight=gold

[Monkey Boy]

doesn't every brokering agent give his client details to the air operating company on every flight, so surely the jet companies know who everyone's client is, during the flight? And especially if going to USA they need to details for security.


Well, yes they do, but there is an understanding between operators and brokers that the operators will not chase after a brokers clients directly, partly down to a gentlemans agreement, but mostly (I suspect) down to resources and time. However, when the operator in OWNED by a brokerage you can bet details will be passed back for a marketing department to research and target at their leisure.

[Monkey boy's daddy]

Well guys,

I have to use Bookajet, Twinjet,TAG and LEA..even the London City Jet Centre to name a few and they are all brokers in their own right,so theres another to this list AP,

So why are we getting our knickers in a twist, i have use all of these guys and this so called gentlemans agreement still stands,

Lets just face it lads this is the way the aviation industry is moving...
:ugh:

[JetKing]

I say good luck to Airpartner and Gold Air. I am sure that both companies will benefit from this new partnership. I am also sure that the Gold air serivce will remain at its high standard and will continue to offer their aircraft as they have always done.

[Monkey Boy]

Welcome JetKing and Dad! Both interesting first posts, probably from the "inside".

I have to use Bookajet, Twinjet,TAG and LEA..even the London City Jet Centre
:ugh:

Well, that's not true! You have a thing called "choice" in today's market so no one HAS to use anyone! Whilst I appreciate that all the above do broking, they are first and foremost operators who broke - this new alliance is now a broker who operates. A small, but notable difference IMHO.

Knickers is a twist? Not really, just find the whole thing a wee bit hypocritical. AP spent a long time telling us that people should approach brokers for impartial advice as there's no operator / manufacturer tie in, and now they're own Gold Air and provide Bombardier products. It seems that in the last 6 years they're policies have done a complete U-turn.

[SiTurn]

I tend to agree with MB. AP have spend years saying that going direct an Operator is not the sensible thinig to do and that block hour programmes dont work - I remember an ad of theirs that read "it's smarter to charter" in an attempt to sell against the netjets product.

Yet now they are offering 25 hour blocks and operating their own aircraft.

I am all for develping your company but I would suggest that you should never be so negative towards your competition because when you end up copying them you can look a little foolhardy.....

Anyway, best of luck to all involved, hopefully it wont affect the chaps on the groung too much.

[bacardi walla]

Can you imagine WC and Air Partner......... recipe made in heaven :ugh:

[jimbob69]

I think there is more to come on this story.

Whispers are seeping out that AP have designs on seriously taking on netjets by building up a fleet and competing on a more like for like basis.

It would only take the purchase of a few strategically placed operators to give them a foot hold.

Thoughts?

[G-TTTT]

First time post from the ‘inside’…

When an operator says to a broker “No availability”; he is effectively saying “Thanks, but I’m busy flying already; go find availability elsewhere; I can’t take any more today”

When they say that most days in most peak months, and all the quality aircraft are out flying, where do they expect us to take our business? If our clients want a high quality late model jet and the market only has a tired 25 year old, should we tell them to go away as well?

The simple conclusion is to go control our own – what’s wrong with that? It means we have our own aircraft to cover our own guaranteed card hours for our own clients. Without it, we’d have to break a commitment to a client. That’s basic strategic sense.

And as for pinching other brokers business, we just want to go flying – why start a war to own the business direct inside, when they’re giving us the business indirectly already? Everyone expects to pay commissions for 3rd party business.

Yes there’s a Gentleman’s agreement; to date ALL of our flying for the last 22 years has been flown by 3rd party operators under that Gentleman’s agreement (some more tightly than others) – brokers have no choice; so why do people think we’ll operate any other way. Let’s get real, everyone knows everyone else’s clients already; that’s sorted, but perhaps people need to remember the market is growing at 30+% and that’s where a growing company needs to focus. This is not a shrinking market with everyone gasping for their last breath to stay alive.

And on ‘independence’, I have no problem whether our client chooses an in-house or an external supplier's jet; in my experience clients are extremely well educated and quite smart enough to figure it out for themselves – if we move any more than 5% of our business in-house the Lears would be fully committed, without any external growth.

[jimbob69]

if we move any more than 5% of our business in-house the Lears would be fully committed, without any external growth.

I dont quite understand your figures, maybe you could clarify for me? Are you saying that 5% of your business would occupy all of the Lears?

Working those figures and the fact that Gold Air didnt have them completley occupied with a turnover of 10mn, that would give AP a turnover on jets of 200mn or am I missing something??

Please do correct me if I am wroing as maths never was my strong point....

[diesel862]

Now that GoldAir has become Air Partner, perhaps the AP ops boys can sort out the mess that Gold Ops were and probably are in.

WC can now spend 100% of his time flying his sukhoi and not 99.9%.

Best of luck to the crews at GoldAir - very hard working guys and girls.

D

[Monkey Boy]

Jimbob69 - The announcement to the stockmarket read: -

"Air Partner has also announced record preliminary results with turnover of £140.4m and profit before tax of £5.13m; a full announcement is available on RNS"

However, this figure would include commercial aircraft charters, cargo flights and sub charters. Given the nature of the business, I would say the majority of that turnover came from the commercial aircraft charters. Also, I'm not sure if those figures take in the group activity as a whole (world wide) or just the Gatwick office.

[jimbob69]

Thanks MonkeyBoy -

Thats exactly my point, I had seen those figures in the market announcment which is why I was confused by the data stated by G-TTTT that "5% of their business would keep all the Lears busy".

[JetKing]

I think what it probably means is that the lears at Gold Air are already very busy and adding 5% of AP business to their current schedules will mean they are maxed out.
Gold Air already run as a successful company on their own back. AirPartner will hopefully just add to this !:ok:

[Phil Brockwell]

Let’s get real, everyone knows everyone else’s clients already;

If this is the case why has AP just paid £4.4 for a relatively non-profit /loss making organisation with an AOC, a client base and an aircraft lease agreement.

surely the vast majority of this consideration is paid for the client base.

GA will no doubt become fractional / blockhour, but in the meantime they will want to hold on to the broker business.

Don't forget any enquiries that go to GA that cannot be dealt with by GA aircraft will be referred to AP, a healthy way of generating enquiries.

Without doubt work that would have traditionally gone to LEA, Eurojet etc will now be put onto GA, that in itself negates the "smarter to charter" slogan.

Would you use an independent IFA that was owned by the Halifax and there was no regulatory authority for IFA's?

Personally I predicted brokers buying operators a while ago, but expected it to take a while longer.

Phil

[Bus_Bar]

Their MO is simply to acquire databases, and likely where necessary to remove the staff of the company they have acquired and re-staff with their own, or recruit fresh. They may possibly try for a takeover of Sentient and get access to a good share of the US market. By all accounts JetCard is not doing that well anyway. I think you will see the LEar's running for the Govt. and Royal flying.

[Phil Brockwell]

Surely the tenders for that work are awarded because of the independent nature of the business?

[Bus_Bar]

Alledgedly

[Monkey Boy]

I think you will see the LEar's running for the Govt. and Royal flying.

The Royal Family and our Tone (or Gordon) running around on aircraft perviously owned / funded by a porn empire and "ladies toys"? I think not somehow, could put them on a very sticky wicket if you pardon the pun!

:uhoh:

[Bus_Bar]

The Royal Family and our Tone (or Gordon) running around on aircraft perviously owned / funded by a porn empire and "ladies toys"? I think not somehow, could put them on a very sticky wicket if you pardon the pun!

:uhoh:

Quite likely they will be flying them. Expect to see GA re-branded in due course.

[weneedpilots]

Do the Lears come with "variable speed" and batteries?

[Phil Brockwell]

It opens up endless possibilities for a rebranding, any suggestions?

Something loco sounding like "Vibe" maybe?
or
Rabbit Air Charter

Phil

[Bus_Bar]

It opens up endless possibilities for a rebranding, any suggestions?

Something loco sounding like "Vibe" maybe?
or
Rabbit Air Charter

Phil

How about 'Buzz'?

Now where have I heard that before......?

[Monkey Boy]

Rabbit Air Charter

Phil

Already a Swiss company with that name! And who said the Swiss don't have a sense of humor?

[MrAngry]

Now that GoldAir has become Air Partner, perhaps the AP ops boys can sort out the mess that Gold Ops were and probably are in.
WC can now spend 100% of his time flying his sukhoi and not 99.9%.
Best of luck to the crews at GoldAir - very hard working guys and girls.
D

From what I hear most of the problems at Gold Ops went away when they got rid of an incompetent Manager and an incompetent Controller back at the beginning of the summer.

It will be interesting to see what happens, now that Air Partner have the reigns. Good luck to them all.

[diesel862]

Really?

That would also mean also the Chief Training Captain too was incompetant as well as several experienced Captains that left at the same time.

Still I know AP will sort them out.

[bacardi walla]

From what I hear most of the problems at Gold Ops went away when they got rid of an incompetent Manager and an incompetent Controller back at the beginning of the summer.
It will be interesting to see what happens, now that Air Partner have the reigns. Good luck to them all.

How many Ops Managers have GDA had over the last 5 years ????

[Tequilaboy]

Having worked for an execjet operator all my aviation career, i worked for a firm that had the same setup as AP now have for a while and AP would not touch us with a bargepole. I like the people that work there and have had some great relationships with them when working in that sector but fact remains like any large organistation, the people at the top know what is happening and all the guys below just think they are on to the best thing since sliced bread when they are just a small cog in the machine.

AP seem and want to do and dictate when and what they want and i cant knock them for that, it is the sign of a dynamic company but they have now acted and others, money permissable, need to follow suit. AP have had operators in their pocket for a long time, mostly through the promise of increased business, sometimes it appears sometimes it does not but mark my words this is the first event that will change the dynamics of this industry forever......