EZY or CX

[BluPilot]

Hi,
which would you choose if you consider senior FO (TRSS) living in the home base with EZY and DESO based somewhere (commuting??) with CX?

Thanks

[Buzzy]

Are you serious?...:confused:

[BluPilot]

Yes, completely serious!!
Please explain me...as much details you can give me.
I'm really confused, and I don't know much about.
Thank you again.

[SmokeAndNoise]

I'd (In fact I did) choose the EZY option..

At the end of the day only you have the answer to your question. Are you -and your family- cut out for commuting? Do you want to fly big birds? If this is the case you'll be better off with CX..

The best of luck!

[Aussie]

Either way your in a good position if ya choosing my friend.....

good luck


Aussie

[BluPilot]

I'd (In fact I did) choose the EZY option..

At the end of the day only you have the answer to your question. Are you -and your family- cut out for commuting? Do you want to fly big birds? If this is the case you'll be better off with CX..

The best of luck!

I agree with you. :ok:

But is still not clear.....
How many hours generaly is one working day in EZY?
And when you go home, do you still have energy for your family??
And if you want to go 10 days out with your wife, do you get leaves together with your days off? And can you request leaves any time or is scheduled? If your son is going to the doctor or for his first day at school can you organize to have that day off? Is there any difference in the roster or in the salary between the different bases around Europe?

The problem is I don't have any idea of the lifestyle in both company.:confused:

I like so much both of them, but they are so different, and if I consider only what I know (home base and aircraft) for sure I'll prefer EZY, but there are many other factor (benefits, life's quality, days off, leaves, organizzation, travell staff, money, stability and much more) which I don't know.
For many many years I will be the happiest person in both company, but
I just want to avoid one day to say why I was so stupid!!!:}

Anybody knows if after while CX force you to go Hong Kong or you can have a steady base in Europe? And when they tell you wich one will be your base?? Is commuting hard or if you are CX pilot you just jump with your company badge on the first flight available with any company?

[Rod Eddington]

At EZY you can request leave whenever you like, you just wont necessarily get it. It can be attached to your rostered days off (so if you book 5 offf, you get the 3 and 4 either side giving you 12 consecutive days) or not, whichever you prefer. I'm pretty flexible and got every day of leave i wanted this year, however some are less satisfied (obviously its more difficult to get leave at xmas and in the summer holidays).

Hope that helps

[Doug the Head]

But is still not clear.....
The problem is I don't have any idea of the lifestyle in both company.:confused:
A lot of question marks in your previous post. Have you done any assesments for either company? I know lot´s of (very capable) people who have tried the CX interview and failed to get the job.

For as far as your initial question goes: it´s really a no-brainer.

CX is a career airline, whereas EZY is a nice steppingstone to get a lot of jet hours very quickly so you can join a career airline.

If you´re willing to move to Hong Kong (I assume you are, otherwise you wouldn´t consider it) then go for CX!

[spannersatcx]

Anybody knows if after while CX force you to go Hong Kong or you can have a steady base in Europe?

As a DESO I believe you will be based in HKG anyway. Have a look at the Fragrant Harbour forum this question has been asked a few times before. After all it is a Hong Kong based airline.

[outofsynch]

CX is a career airline, whereas EZY is a nice steppingstone to get a lot of jet hours very quickly so you can join a career airline.

Doug - I disagree. Easy is a career airline, and may people in easy see it that way. It most certainly is the qickest way to a jet command, (in the world??) Some people are unfortunate and get some extreme rostering, and moan about it here. Many, like me (about 700hrs p.a.) just amble along on a cruisey roster enjoying the orange life.

For BluPilot, it is a great family life. Home every night, sure, not always full of energy, but home anyway. The fixed pattern (5/4/5/3) roster is best of all, because you can plan life around work rather than waiting for roster publication before knowing days off etc. Ther are far worse jobs if spending time with family are important to you.

[Stone Cold II]

I agree with outofsynch. easyJet is moving in the right direction I'm happy with the new 5354 system and that will be replaced by the start of summer07 with a improved pattern which I think will probably be 5454 or 4354.

The flying is great with new aircraft and the crews are fantastic on the whole. Yes we work hard but don't most airlines these days. I did 790 hours last year and there is some serious money to be made. It could take years and years to earn the same money you could earn in easyJet within 3 or 4 years. Yes the 7% pension may not look good on paper but if you are young when you get into easyJet you should get a command within 3 to 4 years and that 7% may look small but the way to look at it is that 7% is over a much bigger pot of money over a long period of time, however it's not as good if you come into the company and you only have 10 years left of your career. You get loyalty bonus as well, I flew with a Captain the other day who just had his and I nearly fell off my chair when he told me how much he took home.

I know people say the likes of Thomsonfly and First Choice etc are career airlines and easyJet isn't but I don't think I could see myself going to these airlines, I could not afford the pay cut.

At the end of the day it all depends on what you want to do, if you fancy long haul go for it. If you want to do the bucket and spade brigade, be home every night, know your days off for the year and earn some bloody good money well easyJet is a bloody good airline to work for.

[Kraut]

I'm happy with the new 5354 system and that will be replaced by the start of summer07 with a improved pattern which I think will probably be 5454 or 4354.



Easy my friend! No rumours that will set our CC under pressure before negotiations have even started!

5354 will defintly be over the wintertime. Nothing else is written down!! Lets wait, how the recruitment is going! Without the correct Aircraft/crew ratio, there will be hardly a significant improvement!
Why dont we stay with facts!? And if you are inside, you know that 4354 is NOT a real option. (covering early and late flights!)

[Stone Cold II]

Well we were told we would have a improvment for the summer next year. You are right a lot of it will depend on the recruitment as most things do, some keep saying 4 on 4 off is possible but we all know that's not likely to work. Balpa have done a grand job this year, Kraut is right without the correct Aircraft/crew ratio any improvment next year will only be minor. Things are improving but it's not going to happen over night, it will take a lot of hard work.

I wouldn't say the expansion will be over in 3 or 4 years it might slow down a little. The low cost model works by expanding, launching new markets and having a high number of flights on routes.

easyJet is a good airline with good career prospects it's not perfect but find me a airline that is.

It all depends on what's best for you.

Good luck with what ever decision you make.

[endofeng]

Guys,

Quick question(s)!

Lots of people have told me Easy are desperate for pilots. I have 1300TT, 1000+TP. I filled out the Easy online app (TRSS), and heard nothing. Rang them up, got answer phone, left message explaining hadn't heard anything, then within 2 days got email inviting me to assesment day in near future!:O

Didn't hear from them for nearly 3 months:bored: , then out of the blue an email asking me was I still interested in Easy, if so send email back to re-register interest. Did this, over a month ago, and STILL haven't heard anything!:confused:

Now, is it me, or is this kind of treatment a little amateurish.....???

I have always thought of Easy as a reputable company, but after the messing around of the last 6 months beggining to think otherwise.

What is going on? Do they need people?, are they struggling with recruitment?

Who do I need to speak to?


Cheers
-------------------
endofeng:ok:

[dragon501]

Have the funny feeling the topic starter doesn't know much about either company(=does not have job offers either) as you can't compare the two. It is TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

For easy's amateurish recruitment, CALL THEM and CALL THEM AGAIN!!!! Especially if you have had emails etc. Don't let go and make sure you speak to the right person, now, who that is?? That I can't tell you... Sorry. Just get through to the reception desk (if there is such thing in the orange shed) and ASK. No. it won't be taken the wrong way.

Good luck!!

[petitfromage]

...but have friends in EZY (some like it, some hate it with a passion). Not everyone's happy at Cathay but I dont know anyone who's even thinking about leaving.

If you're focused on hand flying a jet about and counting take-offs/landings then Cathay is not for you!
As an SO you get no sectors as PF (obviously), As a JFO 15 landings/mth, as an FO 3-8/mth.
There are few visual approaches, a couple of VORs but by and large its fully controlled and fully automated monitoring of the jet!

3 sectors are the max per day - although like EZY - some regional patterns can see you doing 12+ hour days, 2 man.
Over 11hrs is 3-man, over 5 timezones is 4-man (pilot, woman,crew...ops)

The often touted 'fact' is time away & time off.
I have all my SO, JFO and FO rosters (A330/A340). Here are some facts:

Rank - - Av Days Off Per Month - - Av Days Away Per Month
SO - - 18 days off - - 7 nights away
JFO - - 14 days off - - 3 nights away
FO - - 17 days off - - 5 nights away

Days off can be in varying blocks. You must have 1 day off in 7 and 2 days in 14.
This month I have a 11day block, 2 day block and a 3 day block. I have 5nights away from home.
*As a JFO you'll get blocks of 1-2's & one block of 5 days.
*As an SO you do approx 4 days (3 nights away) on & then have 5 days off.

a. Permanent basings are NOT available to SOs. However you can do 2 x 2 month temporary basings each each (companies discretion). Temp basings mean you can keep your HK Expat Salary Package.

b. Commuting: Can and is done by hardy souls. A 12hr trip home after a duty is awful (esp if confined to Economy). Rosters & flights can be swapped and even sold. This helps a lot. A good core group of friends/believers is essential.

c. You can request flights, patterns, days off etc every month.

d. There is a currently a requirement to be based in HK for your JFO upgrade and consolidation (9-12mths).

e. Once in the company, even if you joined as an SO, you can apply for FO Freighter slots and take a permanent basing as soon as you are promoted (again, companies discretion).

e. Jumpseating possible on most Cathay flights & you can use a cabin crew seat if desperate.

f. Load factors of Cathay are very high. Staff travel is ID90 (with surcharges read ID80'ish). Economy from HK to Frankfurt (return incl taxes/surcharges) is HK$2210. (Euros €220)

g. After 6mths you can use other OneWorld careers and after 1year you can join the back of the queue on ZED carriers.

h. SO Salary is:
Year1: HK$32000 + HK$23450 (housing) - 16% (tax) = approx HK$46600 ( Euros €4720/month)
Year2: Euros €5100/mth
Year3: HK$40000 + HK$44000 ( " " ) = approx Euros €7100/mth

*This is after tax but highly dependent on how you use your housing allowance (rent or buy in HK). Add 15% as CX's contribution to your Superannuation Fund and add approx US$800/mth in per deims and flying pay.

[Norman Stanley Fletcher]

This is a slightly bizarre thread - it is a bit like asking people who have a choice between being surgeons or advertising executives which they would rate more highly. There is not really a right or wrong answer - it is personal preference. You could not get 2 greater extremes of aviation than easyJet or Cathay and it is not really wise to compare them. They both have huge attractions and significant disadvantages.

At the risk of disagreeing with some of my esteemed colleagues, I personally do see easyJet as a career airline. The comments made about easyJet being a place to pass through on the way to a 'proper job' and so forth are increasingly incorrect. EasyJet is for many people an end in itself - at this stage I am one of those people. As long as David Cameron does not destroy short haul civil aviation as his first act in power, then easyJet is probably one of the safest airlines in the industry in terms of likely security of employment. Like everyone else, I always read the back of Flight International every week before I read the front. I take great interest in the employment market, and I have yet to find a single airline that makes me want to jump ship. I fly great aircraft, fly to a huge range of destinations, work with some great people, earn a lot of money, have fixed pattern rostering and come home to my wife and children every night. Why would I wish to leave? There are a solid 10% of easyJet pilots, captains in particular, who loathe it - but there are a whole lot of people who do not. If I am truly honest, those who hate easyJet are the same people who hated BA, Cathay or whoever when they worked there. Are there frustrations? Of course - dismal ground handling every single day of my working life at Gatwick and having to park your car miles from where you work are two of them!

On balance easyJet, while not being everyone's cup of tea, has much to commend it. I can only speak for myself and say that I enjoy what I do and am not looking anywhere for another job.

[dragon501]

PF, that was def one of the most usefull posts ever on Pprune I have ever seen!!!! (and I am not being funny!!) I'm down the road and loving it!!

As for the whingers, it's a fact that some people are only happy when they're miserable....

Cheers

[Aussie]

PF, that was def one of the most usefull posts ever on Pprune I have ever seen!!!! (and I am not being funny!!) I'm down the road and loving it!!
As for the whingers, it's a fact that some people are only happy when they're miserable....
Cheers


I agree

Very well posted!

Aussie

[BluPilot]

Hi guys,
If I posted this thread it’s just because I needed to take a decision (sometimes life is strange).:hmm:
For me was not important your private decision but why you think it’s better.
This was helping me a lot, so I want really to say many tanks to all of you who gave me an answer especially PetitFromage who has used so much of his time to check is private documentations and then write a so wonderful answer.
I’m sure CX is an excellent company, but actually looks like EZY is really perfect for what I’m looking for.
Thank you again.:ok:
Cheers

[coded_messages]

Anybody knows if after while CX force you to go Hong Kong or you can have a steady base in Europe? And when they tell you which one will be your base?? Is commuting hard or if you are CX pilot you just jump with your company badge on the first flight available with any company?

You join based in HK as an SO and regarding a base you can as an SO take a temporary base at a European port every year for a max of 4 months. This can work well as a lot of SO’s tend to take temp bases in the summer and spent it at home.

Regarding a permanent base it depends on a few things, obviously you have to be on an aircraft that flies to the base. So let’s take London as an example - First you have to be a Relief qualified FO to take a base. The main vacancies in Europe are on the 400. You would have to first do your time as an SO (approx 3 years) then upgrade to JFO. Cathay do not upgrade SO's to the 400 so you would have to do a few years on the 777 or the Airbus before you could go back onto the 400. Chances are much harder of going back if you have been upgraded as a JFO on the Airbus... Actually I feel that the chances of getting back as an FO on the 400 nowadays are very slim. This is because now after 3 years the Freighter FO's become eligible to move to the 400 passenger fleet. These guys seem to be replacing those that are leaving for Command, so there is no significant void for FO's on the 400 at present so there is not a need for guys to be taken off the 777 or Airbus. You can play a 'Joker' which entitles you to one type change in your CX career to take a base but there is a lot of red tape and not many jokers are awarded each year. Also at the moment we have a lot of 777's arriving and on order so the company are not keen to lose FO's off that fleet.

You could do your upgrade as JFO onto the Airbus and that does have a small amount of vacancies in Europe but competition is fierce and you will be up against more senior guys wanting a base.

If you want a base in Europe on the passenger fleet it would, in my opinion take you about 5 years from date of joining. However you could as an SO bid to go across to the freighter fleet as an FO based in Europe but the pay is a lot lower than a pax FO and the rosters are much worse - I would be very careful before going down that route.

On the brighter side in a few years the 777 ER's will be doing most of the European routes anyway so if you’re an FO on that you could take a base when they arise.

There are also many changes to our rostering practice going on right now and in the days of old you got a minimum of 5 days off after a LON-HKG-LON pattern - Nowadays it can be just 2 or 3 which makes the job real hard. When the new rostering practices come in I think it could be quite interesting!

Hong Kong can be a great place to live, hell CX will even pay your mortgage for you out here but if you don't get on with the heavy population and pollution then trust me it can very quickly become a seriously lonely place.

After all the years on your base if you want to stay on the passenger fleet then you have to go back to HK.

I tried to commute on staff travel, nowadays ALL European flights are at capacity, so you will suffer a lot of stress getting on. All staff boarding is based on seniority so as a new joiner you will have a much lower chance of getting on. Cathays Staff travel treatment is world famous for how badly you are treated so that is all I need to say about that!

If you want to stay home then I would take EZY