Qantas Cadetship Testing - PATS increase prices

[Cadet QF]

Excuse the user name it is just the ambition.

I will get to the point I have testing in a few weeks and want to pass thinking seriously about doing PATS course. When I called I was told the cost is now $2995 plus GST for two day Melb course. PATS told me that the cost increases because each month hundreds of hours are spent developing and improving the course, and that the old price was not viable for them and out of step with real world commercial practise. Also told that it has been some time since one of their students failed.

Basically is it worth it are you given that much of an edge? , could someone who has done this course recently please PM me.

I have heard stories from my flying school that all the Qantas senior managers send their boys to do this course - as they know it works. On the other hand a lot of money what to do ? Thats my whinge anyway:ugh:

[Erin Brockovich]

He you tried here…….

Qantas Cadetship? PATS Course? (http://www.pprune.org/advert.php)

Personally it is a blatant rip off now. It just amazes me how people like this clown and the Fortress car salesman can keep operating. Guys – Karma will catch up to you both!!

Just use the web and search. It takes a while but your $3000 better off with the same preparation. If you can afford it, hey, take the easy route.

[Fourotwo]

PATS is the biggest waste of three grand i have ever heard of.Spend the cash on sim hours in the 76, read the books and do the study, there is more material out there amongst your peers, amongst ppruners.

[Pilbara Bloke]

The course when I did it a couple of months ago for a Qantaslink test was very good. You were shown pretty much everything that would be on the test and methods to score high. Erin it sounds like you have a personal issue going on are you trying to blame someone else for your own failure? It was expensive but I would have had no chance without this course. The question you should be asking is how much you loose if you don't pass testing ( like the vast majority) max of two goes for mainline - if you don't pass you are down millions - but wait you can go to VB and enjoy career earnings of 50% less. The rumours about the sons and daughters of check captains and managers doing this course are true as a couple dropped in when I did my PATS course.

Grow up Erin maybe you should actually do some work for your next attempt and perhaps you will pass. Then again perhaps there will be no more attempts for you and that is why you blame other people for your failure on an anonymous BB - what a big man you are.

[Sunfish]

The reason the PATS course exists is because testing techniques can be learned so that performance improves. There is a huge industry in the USA trainingkids to sit the scholastic aptitude tests and the GMAT (general management apptitude test) to get into a good business school for that all important MBA.

WHatever you do, don't tell anyone you've done the PATS test or QF or other potential employers will discount your marks.

PS do the bookwork as well and know the secret handshake.

Good Luck

[Joker89]

I think if you need to do PATS to pass the testing for QF or RAAF then you don't have whats needed to actually pass the course.

Waste of time and money, Just spend $30 on a Pilot aptitude test book for a few practice questions.

[carro]

Hahahaha 3 GRAND!!

The guy is a joke... It was $2000 a month ago, $1000 a couple of months before that, $800 before that, and less than $400 about a year ago...:D Hours of work that have been put into the course.. pffft! He sits you in front of his computer to do practise questions (so I'm told) and walks out of the room!

If he charged a reasonable price i would have nothing against the bloke, but when the guy can see some people's weakness and just rip them off for it, I have no respect. For those of you who have done the course, I am not having a go at you, and I hope you all do well with your testing.

Safe and Happy flying

Carro

[Pilbara Bloke]

Well I think the reason he does that is because he knows that you have to actually practise his questions to improve your test score. What would you like him to do , give you a rub-down , pour some French champagne for you , or better still actually sit the test for you.

I did one of the earlier group courses (for $400) well over a year ago and then the two day thing . I can say that they were two completely different courses. The spatial training package is excellent as is the commands and enabled me to get over 90% for each of these sections , instrument interp now using the actual QF one and exact phraseology , maths all on computer and excellent with full worked solutions - I saw all the data sets that I would be seeing on my tests at the course. I am not a computer graphics person but I would say a very big amount of work.

Personally I am now looking at the ADF but it is a good feeling to know you have a current stage two pass that is good for two years. The negativity of some of you guys amazes me - do you expect a free ride into the cockpit of QF1.

[EngineOut]

Sounds like Pilbara bloke might be the PATS bloke, nice advertising that you now do the ADF courses as well. :ugh: $3K is a bit absurd.

At the end of the day you can nail the test, but if your psych profile doesn't fit what they want, then the tests don't help.

[Pete Conrad]

Qantas don't give you access to your scores, so how do you know you got 90% in two tests? Get your hand off it Pilbara.

[Hugh Jarse]

Qantas don't give you access to your scores, so how do you know you got 90% in two tests? EXACTLY.

I was of the understanding that QF also conduct a brief 1 on 1 interview, concurrent to the stage 2 S&P :confused:

Therefore, you have to pass both to move on to stage 3. If you blow one or the other, you'll never know which one. And you'll NEVER know your overall results :)

[Bendigo]

It does sound pretty expensive but maybe you have to see it in context of benefits you obtain. Certainly more expensive than when I did it but then how much does your accoutant or dentist charge per hour and what benefit do they deliver. How much is a test result that puts you at the top of the hold file worth ? How much do you think a top 10% or 5% result worth. Is it worth $500 or is it worth $ 5000 or is it worth $ 20000 ?

I did a trip some weeks back with a fleet supervisor type of person and this whole matter was discussed in detail by a number of people. What I can confirm is that many senior flt opps people are sending their kids to Melb to do said course before sitting cadetship tests. Perhaps that should tell you something.

[Mango]

You can always do a Steve Holdings course in Bisbane. He only asks for $440 for a 2 day course and gives you notes?

Sounds financialy logical to me :ok:

Mango

[carro]

Guys... sounds to me like bendigo = pilbara bloke = jonathon (PATS)... Woomera, get this clown out of here... thought you weren't allowed to advertise!
Jonathon, your kidding yourself. If you really want the advertising, why dont you just pay for it in some magazines... your surely making enough money out of the suckers!! Stop wasting our valuable time...
For those of us legitimate ppruners, have a search of pilbara bloke and bendigo's posts.... All PATS advertising:eek: :ugh: :=
"The pats course was great, i got 95% in everything, top of the pile, now im in eastern, QF and going for the ADF" ... Wank wank



I apologise for the free advertising but I'm going to allow this one ....... you really should click on the link by Erin Brokovich above. :E

Here's another excellent and valuable link (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/Woomera/gullible.jpg)! :}

Tail Wheel

[Tidbinbilla]

People, we are watching this thread closely. So far there is no evidence to suggest that anyone is posting under dual identities. We do have access to considerable resources, such as IP tracing, and at this stage I am satisfied the persons are seperate entities.

Investigations are continuing :cool:

[PPRuNeUser0163]

Double post.

[Bazzamundi]

If you want and need to be spoon fed, this is not the job for you. Talk to people who have done the process, buy a book for about $29 at the shops which has many similar practice tests with worked answers at the back, and just go and do it. Several friends of mine also have children considering a career in possibly QF and nobody has said they would pay for one of these courses (then again with morale in QF the way it is, I can't imagine anyone who would pay hard earned dollars to get their kids into the company - pay to keep them out more likely).

I remember a very senior management person sometime back explaining how it was extremely obvious after the interview people who had been to these courses. Suffice to say, it was not the real person they were seeing, rather a pre-programmed robot and generally this was more unfavourable in selection.

The other thing is QF are changing their recruitment process slowly, and from what I believe there is much less emphasis on the first stage testing currently when compared to previous times.

In my opinion, a total waste of time and money. Seems more like hype and marketing in this thread to me. Finally, anybody who claims to have their scores from the process is completely full of $H!T.

[aircabbie]

gee tailwheel maybe you tidbinbilla are running pats courses!!!:ok:

[Charlie Hotel Xray]

Lol, Cabbie. Not true, but funny!

[havick]

Joker89, I couldn't agree with you more. Many people have got into Qantas and the ADF in the past without having done this course, seems to me that it just makes the job for the recruiters that much harder.

[brisbane03]

So what books exactly do you guys recommend instead of a PATS course?

Also where could I find more information on Steve Holdings?

thanks.

[havick]

I got one called military flight aptitude tests a few years ago, I think you can order it off Amazon for about 20 dollars

[aircabbie]

There are guys who do the pats course and bitch about it on Pprune , and then there are the guys who do the Pats course and are now flying in the Airlines who reckon it was a great course . Guess the PATS course aint enough for some guys to boost the general knowledge and pattern of thinking required for the entry exams!! And then blame everything but themselves

Brissy 03 Mate ask a pilot who is in the Airlines ( there usally offer the best info , cause NOT ALL though some guys here washed out and think there ****in know everything .. )

[ovum]

Hey PB Jonathan,
Can you explain this? Just seems a little sus to me.

"I spent a few days doing PATS courses and was briefed on every question that was on the test . The exam technique ideas were spot on . By the time I sat the QF test I knew every cube possibility and had practised them hundreds of time - PATS taught methods that made these easy. I knew every command , and every command question and practised them hundreds of times - the PATS method of doing these command problems is bulletproof." - Dated 3rd November 2005

So you did the course prior to 3rd November 2005. Fine

"The test just got a whole lot harder. The three data sets from the introduction of the maths test no longer appear in the actual test. I already had ten answers ready after spend a good hour in the intro period." - Dated 7th April 2006

Ummm, so when the test 'got a whole lot harder' around April 2006, you had another go at it 5 months later? Weird

"I wanted to complete two more year 12 subjects to be eligible as a RAAF pilot, but wanted to complete ASAP. Does anyone know places where you may be able to do them full time in three or four weeks -anywhere in Aust that are accepted by RAAF? I don't want to wait until the end of 2007?" - Dated 14th August 2006

So now it's time to look at the ADF, even though you've already sat the psych and skills twice in 5 months - better do the PATS course again right?

"Personally I am now looking at the ADF but it is a good feeling to know you have a current stage two pass that is good for two years. The negativity of some of you guys amazes me - do you expect a free ride into the cockpit of QF1." - Dated 9th September 2006

*drum roll*.....

"I do work for QF and some of the seniors from HR/Flight Ops did as my course who had done said course. Anyone who can has the contacts to find out from KT, JM , or AE will find this said course has skewed their selection data fairly massively." - Dated 12th April 2007

WHOA!! Now you work for QF? 5 months after looking at the ADF? Even though they haven't recruited between the date of that first post (November 2005) and now..AND in the meantime you sat the Psych and Skills twice (and apparently scored over 90% in most sections) but then decided to look at the ADF? On top of that, you don't even realise that 'JM' is no longer in the recruitment department and hasn't been for some time.

It's actually pretty funny that you think people are that stupid on this forum!! :D