No Shortage, but continuous Employment

[AllInGoodTime]

Ok, I think we have established never has been, never will be shortage of Pilots in OZ, but does anyone feel that with O/S demand and pilots leaving, that over the next 5 years or so there will be continuous opportunities here in OZ, with a steady flow of jobs, I say this as there seems to be a shortage of Instructors in OZ at present and people claiming that this will get worse.

Your thoughts?

Cheers

[Continental-520]

I'd agree with that.

If you look around a little, it will be clear that a lot of companies minimums' are coming down compared to what they used to be, and the turnover is higher than ever!

I can think of one company who lost over 20 pilots in 12 months...mostly to regionals or airlines, etc.

A good stage for the industry, I reckon. We just gotta hope that:

a) The economy doesn't go through another depression
b) Some rag head doesn't go flying 767s into buildings
c) Another SARS type plague or similar doesn't emerge

...and all being well things will stay as they are, if not improve more so.



520.

[Aussie]

Yeah agreed!!!

Instructors are running dry, perhaps not grade 3's, but grade 2 and above for sure!

Aussie

[Schmoostyler]

Yeah, I've read the news reports too, and forgive me if I'm wrong. But I don't know any instructors that bust their hours because they are so busy working because of the 'instructor shortage'.

Does anyone know of a flying school which can't meet demand because they don't have enough people to instruct?

[Chadzat]

I can name two here in Adelaide!

[Pin Head]

well someone tell immi and the government and then I can get a visa to come and work!

[ravan]

And I can think of another one in Brisvegas.

[pilotezulu]

well someone tell immi and the government and then I can get a visa to come and work!

i'll second that ...:E

[RENURPP]

What sort of $$$ are schools paying for M/E grade 1 with plenty of hrs, bth instructing and other?
Is it on the way up if there is a shortage?

[areal]

I can name two here in Adelaide!
I Know of at least one grade 2 in Adelaide who is not getting nearly as much work as he would like!

[Keg]

Does anyone know of a flying school which can't meet demand because they don't have enough people to instruct?

There are two sides to this as well. Not only is the industry suffering a shortage of flying instructors but there are less people training which means the demand for flying instructors has dropped off as well. So less demand and we're STILL short of flying instructors tells me that the industry is headed for a very drastic shortage in a few years time.

Bring it on baby because QF will be the last place to feel it and the first place to get out of it so I hope it cuts deep. :E

[Aussie]

I Know of at least one grade 2 in Adelaide who is not getting nearly as much work as he would like!


Well perhaps this Grade 2 should find work elsewhere where he will be getting as much work as he would like!

Aussie

[bushy]

So why don't you tell him where.

[Aussie]

Well Pacific Flying school in FIJI advertised for instructors, and they fly max hrs.... theres a start :)

Ohh but maybe this grade 2 is too confy at home in Aus? :{

Aussie

[schoolboy]

From what I have just read, there are 2 Grade 2's in Adelaide, another in Brissy, and possibly another comfy Grade 2 also in Adelaide. Thats 4 in the whole country looking for work!
Where are all the Grade 1's and the rest of the Grade 2's, or all of the rest of the Grade 3's who want to work there butts off and get somewhere in their flying future?
Experience tells me that most of the Grade 3's that I have come across just use this step to put on their resume. Then they pack up and p**s off as soon as you think you can build some sort of a client base around them. Oh, and just in case some smart a**e wants to question the $$$$ aspect, I am talking about the Grade 3's who get paid properly for their services, not ripped off as is the usual complaint made on this forum.
Maybe the reliable instructors are all Grade 1 & 2's, and don't want to move to another position. Sure would like to see some of them get out and about, that is if they exist!
Nah, on second thoughts, there aren't any Grade 1 & 2 Instructors out there, it's all a myth!

[schoolboy]

Well as I said..................

In silence lies the truth!

Not one comment either for or against my assumption.
:rolleyes: :confused: :ugh:

[schoolboy]

Well here we are many months later, and I reckon I must have been right.

THERE ARE NO GRADE 1/2 INSTRUCTORS OUT THERE!

It's really interesting how threads start and finish on PPRUNE. As soon as a topic hits home and the truth sets in in posters minds, they curl up in front of the TV instaed of the computer. We all know that this thread didn't run it's course because it was a given.

THERE ARE NO GRADE 1/2 INSTRUCTORS OUT THERE!

Sure the odd Grade 3 is about, and sure most of them are chasing a dream and need hours, but if some of these instructors don't step up to the plate soon, there will not be any follow through of pilots in the not to distant future.

Don't come back with the "not enough $$$$$" and "work to many hours for no pay". You have to start somewhere, and every proffessional starts somewhere. Be it a pilot, plumber, nurse etc. the first few years of your training are not and never will be well paid. But stick with it and the rewards will come! Well to those who havn't got a chip on their shoulder and want to have a crack any way.

So you Grade 3's, hang in there. Some of you may just want to fly and not persue what many on this forum perceive to be the ultimate flying job,i.e. 747 etc etc. Some of you might really find that teaching others your skills is the 'bees knees" and will give you the fulfillment you want out of your career.
Gee, I and many others certainly hope this is the case, or we are in DEEP S**T real soon!

[The Voice]

What sort of $$$ are schools paying for M/E grade 1 with plenty of hrs, bth instructing and other?
Is it on the way up if there is a shortage? you considering your options or something?? :E

[Ozgrade3]

My place has advertised several yimes and the response has be rather small, a handful of grade3's and mabye3 grade 1's sent resumes. Some grade3's have turned down offers I hear, and thats for a salaried full time position.

From what I hear not many grade 1s around.

[thinking pilot]

I'm a grade 2 with approx 4000hrs total, both Instruction and charter.

I was offered a flight Instruction position paying 35k, I presently earn that much as a storeman.

Therein lies the problem.:ugh:

[schoolboy]

Dear areal

Couldn't agree more, but will those who wish to cross get a visa or approval from CASA to ply their wares?

[schoolboy]

Ozgrade3
Agreed, and so obviously true!

[schoolboy]

thinking pilot

Well I wonder if you are a thinking pilot. That figure for a person of your experience seems a bit strange, and was it only one position you applied for?
If you have the experience you say, and a work history and ethic to match, you should try a bit harder for a flying job. They are out there (many many many!) but you have to hunt in the right places, and that isn't in a store!

[russianthru_thesky]

Noone seems to be able to hold onto pilots past a year these days...often not even that long!! Its not just instructors, all the charter companies in WA are struggling to get anyone that isnt straight out of flight school. Surely they could stretch to paying at least a $40K starting rate. Then pilots may want to stay a little longer!!
Theres plenty of specialist GA jobs out there paying twice what charter will!!

[Roller Merlin]

Unless the industry adapts to pay a skilled oz wage for a skilled aviation job in this country then there will be few contenders for training. Especially when the cost to the trainee is so high, and the security and conditions of employment are so low?

When the alternatives are straight out of uni as a teacher on $45K, or Info Technology $50K+, accountant $50K, living where they want to live, or work in north WA unskilled starting on around $60K, why should Gen-Y choose aviation? Aviation skills cost time effort and money, and should be rewarded as such.

[plucka]

Dear Russianthru the sky.

'Theres plenty of specialist GA jobs out there paying twice what charter will!!'

Could you please give some examples?

I have 3000TT nearly all Ag. The Ag. industry is pretty stuffed at the moment due to the dry conditions so I am looking for something else. I don't want to fly for the Airlines so I never got a MECIR or an instructors rating for that matter.

Cheers.

[arnellis]

As a Gen-Y considering a career at this moment, fresh out of high school i can let alot of you know that most Gen-Y's no longer would consider aviation, and most of them are not prepared to work for the low wages GA and regionals provides, I studied aviation from yr8-12 at high school, the class started with over 40 in our 1st year, by our last yr meerly 2 graduated still contemplating a career in aviation out of a class of 6, i was one, and the other cant due to medical reasons continue in aviation.

Considering my first full time job out of school is driving a container handler for a major freight company in Perth, i earn $60k + super + overtime, im not keen on taking a 50% pay cut and working in GA with minimal conditions and pay for however many years before a jet job emerges. I am going to give aviation a go but if it isnt rewarding within 3-4 years i will fall back to the railways as a train driver where i can expect to earn up to $180,000 fifo with BHP. (My old man drives them)

People are going to consider aviation less and less especially Gen Y's unless there are major changes. (just my 2 cents worth but i think it gives the perspective of most younger people considering aviation)

[Towering Q]

Plucka, if you get the MECIR completed you could aim for an RFDS job, the pays not too bad and seems to be on the up.