Mid Air Collision In Carson City Area

[Zoner]

I don't know if the wave window was open or not. This area has had several near misses over the years. In addition to local and KRNO traffic many flights to and from KLAX and KSFO transit overhead. I fly gliders, my single engine, and my company"s B-747 through here quite often and keep my eyes outside all the time. I usually don't see the gliders unless their wings reflect the sun. Be sure and check out the pictures at the link. I was at the airport and had left camera at home wouldn't you know!
http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20060829/NEWS/108290055
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060829/NEWS15/608290365/1144

Collision with glider forces jet's crash-landing; none hurt
STEVE TIMKO
RENO GAZETTE-JOURNAL
Posted: 8/29/2006
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A jet made a safe landing at the Carson City Airport after colliding Monday with a glider about 3:10 p.m. No one was seriously hurt

CUTLINE WRITER IS LISA J. TOLDA/RENO GAZETTE-JOURN

A jet made a safe landing at the Carson City Airport after colliding Monday with a glider about 3:10 p.m. No one was seriously hurt

With aircraft instruments in her lap after a midair collision with a glider, a charter pilot regained control over the Pine Nut Mountains, circled Washoe Lake and landed the twin-engine jet on its belly at the Carson City Airport, passengers said Monday afternoon.

The glider pilot parachuted to safety in the Pine Nut Mountains after the collision, to the surprise of search and rescue workers.

"I'm utterly amazed that he's alive and has no significant injuries," said Capt. Jeff Page of the Lyon County Sheriff's Office.

The glider pilot, identified as Akihiro Hirao of Japan, was found by Washoe Tribal Police at the mouth of Lone Pine Canyon south of Gardnerville, Page said.

The twin engine Hawker XP800 and the glider collided about 3:10 p.m. at what the Federal Aviation Administration said was about 16,000 feet near the border of Douglas and Lyon counties.

Hirao declined to talk to news media, but Richard Mirgon, director of emergency ommunications and emergency management for Douglas County, said Hirao did what he was trained to do after the impact.

"He said he immediately did the emergency procedures and started to get the windscreen off and get out of the aircraft," Mirgon said. "He knew immediately he had lost a wing."

His parachute opened and Hirao floated to the ground, Mirgon said.

"He said when he touched the ground, he checked his watch and it said 3:15," Mirgon said.

Crews found the parachute and then tribal police found Hirao walking out at about 5:45 p.m. He underwent a medical examination and was taken to Minden-Tahoe Airport, where a group of people Mirgon described as his friends, a partner and people from Soar Minden gave him a loud cheer.

It was good news on the charter jet too, which was flying from suburban San Diego to Reno.

Passengers said the charter jet pilot, whose name was not available, suffered a cut between her lip and chin but no one else was injured.

"This woman is a miracle worker," passenger Evy Chipman of Incline Village said of the pilot.

The pilot, co-pilot and three passengers were just beginning descent into Reno about an hour after leaving San Diego, passenger Steve DiZio of Incline Village said.

"There was a loud explosion," DiZio said, and the window directly across from him cracked.

Almost immediately the jet took a right turn and dropped sharply several thousand feet, DiZio said.

Mike Chipman of Incline Village, Evy's husband, said he heard a loud noise. He also recalled the aircraft swerving hard and to the right and that the pilot was able to stabilize the jet quickly.

They looped around Washoe Lake and the crew said they would not be able to get the landing gear down so the jet would go in on its belly, DiZio said. The landing was "perfectly smooth," he said.

"I've had wheels-down landings that were a lot rougher," DiZio said.

Neither DiZio nor Evy Chipman felt panic between the mid-air collision and the time the jet landed.

DiZio said he felt anxious.

"But what could you do?" he explained.

Carson City sheriff's Chief Deputy Steve Schuette said the pilot only saw the glider a split second before impact.

Parts of the glider were imbedded in the nose of the jet, Schuette said.

The jet was made by Raytheon Co. in 1998 and can carry eight passengers at up to 500 mph, the FAA reported.

With Associated Press information.

[PorcoRosso]

Well, looking at the pictures, it's amazing no one was badly injured.

I guess this Hawker will need a serious paint job ! ;)

10 years ago we had a collision in France betwen an A320 and a Glider. No one was hurt. A bit of the glider elevator went missing, and the Airbus had some paint chip here and there along the wing.
It was nobody's fault (!) but they never see each other until the last second.
Hopefully the story end well.
The name of the Glider pilot rings a bell , I wonder if he was not flying in France a couple of years ago (He had no Banzai tendency, as far as I remember ;) )

[Scurvy.D.Dog]

.... let me guess .... Class E airspace?? :hmm:

[DesiPilot]

Most of the new gliders carry all the gizmos these days, I have seen more glass in glider than some of GA planes. I am sure a mode C transponder wont hurt either. At least commercial aircrafts can see them on their TCAS/ACAS.

[pilotbear]

Glad to see that the aircraft I fly can withstand such punishment. Yet another example of why you should fly an aircraft that is built like a 'Brick Sh1thouse'.
Serious respect to the Captain for landing safely despite her injury.:ok:

[Wizofoz]

I am sure a mode C transponder wont hurt either.

The problem with that is finding the juice to run it. All the other "Gizmos" are low drain and a glider (Which might be doing a ten hour flight) can run them with a couple of 12V batteries. TXPs are much higher drain.

There are moves to develop low-drain mode S TXPs for gliders, but they are not on the market yet.

[ATC Watcher]

The low consumption transponders for Gliders are avail already (e.g. Fielser) and you only need an extra battery or a solar panel on top of the instruments to feed it for 8-10 hours. Not a problem.
The real problem is that it is not mandatory , (but will be from 2008 in EU (2009 in France ) do not know the US mandate date, and it will be Mode S , not A+C.)

TCAS is only mandatory for transport a/c above 19 seats in the US so the bizjets are exempt, so no such luck in that case , even if the glider had an SSR. .

As far as the eletronic on board gliders, our club has just ordered the last LX model with GPS moving map and the lots, nice stuff, but I find it keeps you heads down far too much and not looking outside enough.

Class E airspace and small class D CTRs are growing everywhere in Europe to so call " protect " low cost jets operating into small provincial airports.
But this is a false impression of security. While in Class E ( having left the airway and before entering the CTR is the most dangerous part.
Having seen the number of " misses" so far in Germany and France , It is only a matter of time before we get something serious.

For the IFR jets, Avoiding bases of Cu , seriously reducing speed and looking outside in that part should be the strict norm, but seeing the speed at wich certain LCC 737s operate, I wonder if the message is understood.

[keepin it in trim]

I think you'll find that the Hawker DID have TCAS, don't know if the glider had ssr though

Meant to add, big hand of respect to the crew for getting it down safely in pretty "challenging" circumstances, well done! (As a Hawker driver it is reassuring to see the strength of this fine aircraft demonstrated again)

[Zoner]

http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20060830/NEWS/108300064/0/FRONTPAGE

Glider pilot says he didn't see jet before collision


by Susie Vasquez
Nevada Appeal News Service
August 30, 2006

Glider pilot Akihiro Hirao said he didn't see the jet that tore his wing off and sent his craft into a spin, according to Jim Braswell, airport manager at Minden-Tahoe Airport.

"The jet took part of the wing off, but the fuselage and other wing were intact," Braswell said. "He was able to stand, pull the canopy off, and bail out."

Flying a Schleicher ASW 27, Hirao, 57, parachuted to safety over Douglas County after 3 p.m. Monday, according to Tom Mezzetta, spokesman for the Douglas County Sheriff's Office.

A Hawker XP800 jet collided with the glider as it was making its approach into Reno. The jet suffered minor damage and was able to make a successful emergency landing, without landing gear, at the Carson City Airport at 3:18 p.m.

A representative from the National Transportation Safety Board arrived Tuesday to start the investigation. The plane will be returned to managing company NetJets once this is complete.

The jet pilot received minor injuries, but the co-pilot and three passengers were unharmed, said FAA spokesman Ian Gregor. Pilot Annette Saunders was treated at Carson Tahoe Regional Medical Center and released the same day, according to the hospital spokeswoman.

There are no airspace restrictions over the Minden-Tahoe Airport and gliders can be difficult to see. The transponders that could alert aircraft to their presence are not required in gliders, Braswell said.

"A glider has the right-of-way for landings or during an approach, but in any other circumstance the rules are the same as any other aircraft," he said. "Our jurisdiction is the ground space. Once a pilot is off the ground, it's the (Federal Aviation Administration's) responsibility."

John Morgan, a glider pilot and Douglas County resident, said gliders are almost impossible to see when they are coming either toward or away from other planes.

There is no speed limit at 10,000 feet as long as planes don't exceed the sound barrier. At those high speeds, gliders can easily remain undetected until it's too late, Morgan said.

He is constantly on the alert for gliders when flying powered aircraft, Morgan said.

"You can see gliders from a mile away, maybe two," he said. "If the sun happens to shine on their wings, maybe three. It's not the easiest thing."

Braswell said many glider pilots in the same situation don't get a chance to bail out due to the plane's attitude as it descends.

"It all depends on what kind of accident and whether they can get out or not," he said. "This time, he was very fortunate."

The glider was flying at an altitude of about 13,000 feet, and the pilot was on oxygen. He was part of a group of gliders flying that day, Braswell said.

Once on the ground, Hirao waited by his glider for almost two hours, but no one picked him up so he started walking.

Hirao had hiked about three miles before he was picked up at the mouth of Lone Pine Canyon in southeast Douglas County at 6:50 p.m. by Washoe Tribal police.

His general location was determined by Care Flight, who spotted the parachute on the ground. Lyon County Search and Rescue and six private aircraft joined the search, Mezzetta said.

The Carson City Airport reopened at 2 a.m. Tuesday after the plane was removed from the runway, said manager Yvon Weaver.

"It was a big job," she said Tuesday. "I give kudos to everyone who stayed until 2 a.m. to make sure that airplane was secured."

Using cranes to lift the front and back ends, the landing gear was lowered and the plane could be rolled into the El Aero hangar. Weaver Aircraft employee Jess Edwards constructed a tow bar attachment and a lifting mount to assist in moving the jet.

Morgan said he has a transponder in his glider, but installation can cost about $2,000, and a power source in these unpowered planes is a challenge.

"The way FAA rules are currently written, they don't allow gliders to turn off their transponder in flight, but gliders often don't have the power capacity to run them constantly," Morgan said.

The rules need to allow a glider pilot the discretion to install a transponder and turn it on only when it's deemed necessary, Morgan said.

"This sort of thing has been a concern for the gliding community for some time," Morgan said. "We tried a couple of years ago to get an announcement on (Automated Weather Observation System). We're supposedly getting a super AWOS, with a caution warning of heavy glider traffic."



• Becky Bosshart at the Nevada Appeal contributed to this report. Contact reporter Susie Vasquez at [email protected] or 782-5121, ext. 211.

[av8boy]

Lucky they only hit one. I was putting fuel in the car in Carson City at the time and saw five or six gliders in the area (including what appeared to be a flight of two--I assume it wasn't the Hawker/glider flight). Vis was really good, but then again, I was stationary on the ground...

Dave

[FullWings]

There is a device made for gliders and light aircraft which gives warnings of proximate traffic, is cheap and requires very little power. It also has an obstacle database.

http://www.flarm.com (www.flarm.com/index_en.html)

It has a high take-up rate in the alpine regions of Europe and is mandatory for many competitions in this area. It doesn't interact with current ATC or TCAS installations, however.

I've got a mode-S transponder fitted to my glider but I do have 40Ah of batteries plus solar panels as the current drain can be substantial in a busy environment. I'm interested to see how someone can produce a 'low power' XPDR and stay within the SSR specifications for output...

If you don't know, the CAA are keen on mandating the carriage of mode-S on ALL aircraft in ALL airspace in the UK, as opposed to the rest of Europe where it is only required in certain classes that are usually close to major airports. The consultation period for this has just closed, so we'll have to wait and see now. The cost of installing, checking, licensing and maintaining mode-S kit could run to almost the value of some of the gliders it would have to be fitted to, not to mention the problems of getting an adequate power supply onboard.

[Check 6]

Here are some photos:
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/2000Flyer/My%20Aviation/dscf0034vm0s.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/2000Flyer/My%20Aviation/bildes.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/2000Flyer/My%20Aviation/14nx6s.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/2000Flyer/My%20Aviation/11dy6s.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/2000Flyer/My%20Aviation/5oy9s.jpg

[Farrell]

They did a great job landing that!

I could start to complain now about low wages etc, but a picture speaks a thousand words.

[rhovsquared]

WOW!!!:ok: I'm Speechless and w/o Comment:E
all of the pilots both Jet and Glider were Lucky and Amazing and Quick witted :D :D :D :D :D


It's Unbelievable :}
rhov :)

[Capt Pit Bull]

Ouch!

Not sure that qualifies as "minor" damage !

pb

[LD Max]

"A glider has the right-of-way for landings or during an approach, but in any other circumstance the rules are the same as any other aircraft," he said. "Our jurisdiction is the ground space. Once a pilot is off the ground, it's the (Federal Aviation Administration's) responsibility."

Sack 'im I say.... He'd obviously fail the "air law" exams.

[matt_hooks]

Just trying to work out what the glider was doing at the time and where the impact was. Judging by the angle of the gash across the nose he was at a fairly high bank angle, maybe circling in a thermal? In that attitude it would be extremely difficult to pick him up visually!

If the jet hit the outboard end of the starboard wing then the fuselages must have been fairly close together, everyone involved was extremely lucky!

The pax reported a heavy bank to the right. Would the moment arm with the engine out be enough to cause a rapid uncommanded roll at descent power, or is this a technique for losing height rapidly? I know some a/c call for high AOB to lose height rapidly in the case of rapid decompression. Anyone fly these birds know whether this might be the case?

Seriously good job to land the aircraft with the instruments popped out like that, the impact must have been pretty large to penetrate that far into the fuselage!

A reasonably happy ending to what could have been a very sad incident!

Reminds us all to keep an eye outside the aircraft!!!

[RatherBeFlying]

I spend a lot of my time looking for other gliders. They're easiest to see in a turn. Coming straight at you or away, they can be next to invisible, but if they're turning, the aspect is changing and they come into and out of view.

In this case the glider was climbing with several others -- when a glider finds lift, others join in.

It might be a good idea to put glider symbols, maybe even the frequency, on the low altitude IFR charts where there's mountain wave lift.

[PorcoRosso]

Looking at the last pic Check6 posted, the least we can say is that stdby Instruments are wisely installed on the Hawker panel ;)

When am descending below the Cu, especially during holydays or Week-end, I try to keep a good look out, especially in areas known for glider activity.
Being a glider pilot myself, gives a clue where to look .

[cwatters]

It might be a good idea to put glider symbols, maybe even the frequency, on the low altitude IFR charts where there's mountain wave lift.

Wave lift can sometimes be found very long distances from away from the mountains that cause them. You would have to mark very large areas.

[RatherBeFlying]

Wave lift can sometimes be found very long distances from away from the mountains that cause them. You would have to mark very large areas.Yep. If there is good wave lift, there's strong up and down drafts plus rotors in between. Flying through that stuff at 500 kt. can be hard on the airframe and pax even there's no glider traffic about.

[av8boy]

Just noticed that the NTSB prelim on this one is wonderfully verbose...

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20060906X01297&key=1

[green granite]

There's nothing more wasted than power left in a battery after a collision. :hmm:

[mgTF]

just performing the initial training on the 800, nice to know it is strong as it looks!!!

[MNBluestater]

Ouch!

Not sure that qualifies as "minor" damage !

pb

Any more 'minor' :mad::mad::mad: damage to the right wing , right engine (detaching from the fuselage), and nose/cockpit, and there would have been 'minor':mad::mad::mad: fatalities.

Given the increase in use of personal aircraft, gliders, advertising blimps, etc, and increases in general and commercial aviation, I would think it wise for FAA to mandate transponders on mostly everything. There is too much going on in the cockpit for pilots to be worrying about mid-airs near major airports.

Hats off to the crew for holding it all together. A crew who gets the instrument panel in their laps and manages to land a plane safely are damn lucky to have survived. :ok:

[RatherBeFlying]

The big problem with transponders in gliders and other a/c without a generator/alternator is the heavy current drain. A glider battery fits in your hand.
There's some 5000 Flarms installed in European gliders. They cost some 650 Euros and only require 52mA. http://www.flarm.com/product/index_en.html
This is a far more practical way to go for g/a than mode S transponders for everybody, especially considering how long it will be before mode S capable radars are put into operation -- 20 years or so.

[Ignition Override]

Well done to both pilots.

How much wing drag and pull to the right did the Hawker pilots experience? Without the radome and consequent airflow changes to pitot tubes, the airspeeds must have been amost useless.
It looks like combat damage.

Maybe there was a small hamlet near them named Midway, Nevada.;)