Caa Atp To Jar Atp Rumour Again?

[red8]

I am hearing this again....

That come end 2006 anyone with SACAA ATP subjects will miraculously be exonerated from writing the JAR ATP subjects. Anyone who hasn’t….well, according to the rumour…you are :mad:!. You will have to write the JAR ATP subjects and from what I hear it is not pretty.

So, is this true…..CAN it be true?

[Bucket]

It is not true; it is utter c*"p. You have to write the JAA exams.

Here endeth the lesson.

[Deskjocky]

I saw an ad in a recent SA Flyer for a flight school called ATS at Grand Central. In it they specifically mention the change over to a "JAR" style of exam for ATP and how they are ready for it. Either they are hoping against hope or there is some grain of truth to this. Hope its not true…having just finished the com exams I really don’t need things to get more difficult in the future:ugh:

[Bucket]

Would be interested to know what a JAA 'style' exam actually means. Perhaps a return to paper exams or a much wide range of exmasto encompass the full spectrum of knowedge at ATP level which the JAA system does well, too well in fact. A total of fourteen exams are sat for the issue of a JAA ATPL. They split what we know as ATG into four separate exams. What is interesting to note is this. Both systems have produced perfectly competent pilots for years but the JAA system seems to lean far too much towards in-depth acedemics. Generally speaking the JAA graduates appear to be acedemically superior. Perhaps this is why they continue to suffer fewer of the problems when coverting onto jet type after training. Remember these folks routinely graduate with around 250hrs and go straight onto B737, A320, A319 etc etc. We really do not have anything that is comparable to that in SA and you cannot count the politically flawed SAA cadet scheme since that represents the exception rather than the rule.

The SA system is more than satisfactory given the more traditional streaming route that aspirant turboprop/jet pilots go through. ;)

[chuks]

The JAR writtens comprise 14 separate exams:

Principles of Flight

Airframe/Systems/Power

Mass & Balance

Performance

Instruments/Electrics

Operational Procedures

Flight Planning

General Navigation

Radio Navigation

Meteorology

Air Law and ATC Procedures

Human Performance & Limitations

VFR Comms

IFR Comms

A full-time residential course at London Metropolitan University costs about GBP 2 500. To that you must add the costs of living in London for about eight months.

We started our course with about 25 students. At the end 5 or so had passed all 14 exams on the first take. That might not be representative of the level of difficulty but it's not easy! Too, they rig the rules so that you are only allowed a certain number of attempts; if you don't get through by then back you go to re-sit all 14! That costs GBP 60 per exam, by the way.

It might just be that the European authorities have set this JAR thing up to bar lots of perfectly good 'stick-and-rudder' types from entering the market. Or perhaps you really need to know how to figure out the convergence at 60° North on a Lambert chart when the standard meridian is at 38° 30' N. Not knowing that never stopped me from finding Nasko in thick 'harmattan' but what the heck!

[Hot Shots]

If this changeover rumour is true, what about the guys that have their ATP? Will they basically have to rewrite all of those subjects? Even after fighting through the current CAA exams? I can imagine a lot of :mad: off people! :ugh: :ugh: :{ :{

[putt for dough]

It will never happen.

So sleep tight my boys/gals.
It's just a dream.

Peace out......


Schweet:suspect: :suspect: :ouch: :eek: :eek: :p

[Shrike200]

Well, they may want to change to the JAA 'style' of exams, but I can't imagine any form of actual JAA accreditation in the near future, thats for sure! And I can only imagine that all current ATP holders will continue on with ATP licences, as has been the case in the past where exam/experience requirements have changed.

[petesevenseven]

Hey Guy's,


There is no other way around it 14 subjects 2 flight tests!!!!!! And thats it!!!!!

I still dont get it mind you. Why on earth over in South Africa do you guys aspire towards the JAA ( Just Antagonising Aviation) its a European system based on European Regs its not suited to the African environment. If they were to implement those aviation regs in southern africa the thriving GA industry which is over there would die out very quickly because of the sheer cost of maintaining such regulations, as JAA regs themselves are not GA oriented but rather European Airline oriented? Is that what you guys want to see? Or is it the opportunity to get out of Southern Africa to go and work in Europe ie is it "the grass is greener syndrome" happening here? I just dont get it.

I believe Southern Africa is better off siding with another set southern hemisphere orientated aviation Regs that are compatible to GA as well as the Airlines. That is a far better system!!!!!

Thats my 5 shillingi's worth for the day!!!!


Happy Landings!!!!!

P.S if anyone is considering doing a JAA Licence conversion I would Recommend Bristol Groundschool they get the job done right first time!!! I did mine through them Awesome!!!!!!

Enjoy!!!!

Pete!!!!!

[Gilksy]

I seem to be hearing alot of rumours about the JAR syllabus being adopted by SACAA from many sources ranging from flight school ads to bar room chatter very little from CAA itself. Last I heard it had been "approved", but when it's going to be implimented, no one seems to know. Has CAA actually released any info on their intentions? Exactually how will it affect someone like me with a frozen ATPL? :sad:

[SkyPirotTah]

ok so the rumours are out again, heard about this a while back but didn't give it much thought as it seemed insane.

what i want to know is exactly what are the CAA thinking of doing. as far as i understand they want to change the current CAA licenses so that we all hold JAR licenses!! WHY??? where's the benefit.

and also, what i hear is that we all may have to write exams again!! not to mention like 500 hours of groundschool or something.

so do i understand this correctly, all of those pilots in SA holding a valid COMM will suddenly no longer have a license until they write the 14 exams?? and for for those with ATP's or at least holding their subjects, well that's a whole new story.

if CAA want JAR accreditation, then surely that just means within the running of the CAA, not our licenses!!! we aren't even a part of Europe!!

anyway, we'll see what comes of all this, nothing i hope for all of us.
over and out

[petesevenseven]

If thats the case SkyPirotTah can I currently obtain a SACAA CPL/IR on the basis of my JAA CPL/IR fATPL?

I dont think so!!!!

I cant see the logic in what the SACAA are playing at that means all South African Licence holders would effectively be grounded!!! I don't think the national carrier SAA would like it if all their planes were grounded on the basis that their pilots who have been flying them for years are no longer qualified to fly that same aircraft, that wouldn't make sense!!!!

I dont think that CAA would go that far there would be a massive legal battle going their way from the various airlines in the country!!!!! again they would look like real idiots if all planes in the country were grounded coz thier pilots don't have licences!!!!

Thats Crazy talk Bwana!!!!!!


Happy Landings!!!!!


Pete

[SkyPirotTah]

sorry, think my point has been missed, i was asking the question as to what CAA actually had in mind.

coz i can see the obvious disaster of going the JAA way.

100% of GA would come to a halt
90% of instruction would have to stop and about 95% of contract work would have to stop.

so i couldn't agree more that it's crazy talk, but what i'm trying to find out is what exactly do they have in mind??