RAF Historical Property being allowed to waste away...

[Dundiggin']

So what I want to know is:

Why are the pongoes letting historical ex-RAF land and property waste away and fall into rack and ruin?? For example and there are lots of 'em:

RAF Upavon - 1st Central Flying School in the World! - Have you seen the state of the hangars? These are listed buildings for christ's sake!! What are you doing about RAF heritage??
RAF Abingdon - RAF Para school - now a dump for bloody tanks! Donkey walloping & jogging is now a priority!! WTF!! Motor bikes are banned!!! What about the rally cars?? Tw@ts!
Let's face it you Army wallas are really a bunch of complete self centered Tw@ts or can you tell me that you really care about the RAF/UK history and in fact, co's you ought to..................co's we are really p'ssed off that you are letting our history go to rack and ruin.

Why???? :sad:

I would love to stay friends but this is stretching the limits somewhat......

[XL319]

There not the only places going to rack and ruin. Although the RAF are still in Scampton the accomodation blocks are condemned. All personnel have to travel from Kirton in Lindsey which is a good distance. Considering this is one of the most important and historical bases in the RAF it has been left to go to ruin while it was in "care and maintenance".

RAF bases which are listed can be found on the heritage website. Absolute disgrace IMO:{

[Oggin Aviator]

Banter mode on ....
co's we are really p'ssed off that you are letting our history
err - history ?? :confused:
What history?
When you have been around or more than half a dogwatch you may have some semblence of history :E
Banter mode off ....
Oggin

[WIWOWessex]

Banter mode on ....

err - history ?? :confused:
What history?
When you have been around or more than half a dogwatch you may have some semblence of history :E
Banter mode off ....
Oggin

Banter mode on..... the fact that a couple of thousand navy wallahs kept out the froggy hordes has kept the RN dining out for centuries and deservedly so. The fact that between 1940 and 1944 the RAF stopped people in this country from loving sausages and pickled cabbage is also a fact and is HISTORY. The Navy has HMS Victory and a load of other historic sites, the Army has untold numbers of "historic sites". The RAF has just as much right to claim ownership of mileposts in history as anyone else.


Stop being so anal!!!

[Oggin Aviator]

hook, line and sinker

lol

[WIWOWessex]

hook, line and sinker

lol

What a surprise...you missed the point. We all have things to be proud of and to commemorate. But once again some have to have the last word and to denegrate the contribution of others.

[Kitbag]

Oggin Aviator

Quick reminder: aviation, powered flight started on the land, naval aviation followed on and will always be behind aircraft based on land. Too many compromises to being on boats. I think, nay I know, that land based aviation history and tradition is longer than that of any naval aviation history.:)

[Oggin Aviator]

I thought this thread was about the RAF (and its history, or lack of), not about land based vs maritime aviation. And BTW, have you actually been to Kitty Hawk in North Carolina cos I have and it is pretty bloody near to the sea - the Wright brothers obviously had a premonition of where aviation would eventually go .......

You all need to chill out, it is clearly obvious that you cant take any banter from the Senior Service.

[Dundiggin']

Apology mode ON:
Sorry if I sounded a bit heavy in the original post - it may have been alcohol induced :rolleyes:
Apology mode OFF
Now where was I - It may not be history to some of you but it is to us AND more specifically to the Nation!!

So is not the Army honour bound to keep the buildings standing and looking nice? Perhaps DLE own them and I am unfairly slagging off an innocent party(!)?:hmm:
Or are they waiting for the buildings to collapse so they can bulldoze the land to give themselves more space for donkey walloping, jogging or playing polo? :sad:

[airborne_artist]

DunDiggin (a misnomer if ever I heard one)

WTF is historical about RAF Abingdon? So PTS was there for a while, but parachuting wasn't invented there and while some RAF are para trained, parachuting is largely the preserve of the pongoes you hate so much.

Suggest you think more and drink less, or at least don't try thinking when you've been drinking :E

[XL319]

I think the point he was trying to make with Abingdon was the fact that so many RAF bases are left to go to rack and ruin without spending to keep them in ship shape. Although it is now Army i can see where he is coming from.

There is a lot of bases which do hold historical importance such as Upavon, Scampton and such like which are in need of major refurbishment.

[timex]

Doesn't everything belong to the MOD? When Hospitals and schools are desperate for cash, when the Military is skint where would you rather the money went?

As far as I can see the AAC have done a very good job of looking after MIddle Wallop, most of the buildings you mention were left by your goodselves to move to greener pastures.


I do agree its a shame but the same can be said for a lot of Naval bases around Pompey and Guz.

Go and have a wander around some of the really Old messes at Tidworth left rotting away.

So its not just the RAF

[[email protected]]

As far as I'm aware none of the former RAF stations now inhabited by the Army were asked for by the Army. As I understand it some politician along with a bunch of civil servants decided to down size the Armed Forces. They also decided to 'draw down' (awful phrase/word) from Germany. That same group of politicals looked around for places to send the units returning from bratty land and spied a load of RAF bases which were going to be closed and made the decision to utilise them, rather than just abandon them. After all, there was nowhere else for the returning units to go to.

So don't go round blaming the Army for 'stealing' all your 'homes'. Blame the people who are the ones guaranteed to shaft all of us - the politicians and mandarins.

If you feel so strongly about it why don't you set up some kind of charity to preserve your heritage?

[handysnaks]

I think the point he was trying to make with Abingdon was the fact that so many RAF bases are left to go to rack and ruin without spending to keep them in ship shape.

If the powers that be aren't going to spend the money needed on more troops/aircraft/equipment/carriers.....
Then why would they spend it on old bases that are going to end up as housing estates anyway?

[FRAG7]

Why blame the Army. Are the RAF not selling Bentley Priory?

[MyEdUrts]

Unless a building gets listed status or funding to maintain it. Then these old hangars and important buildings of RAF history will just end up flattened or left to rot. An airbase is a prime source of real estate which the treasury wants to dispose of. I think RAF Uxbridge is next to go, now the footings have started at RAF Northolt to expand the base to accomodate the posties from Mill Hill and QCS from Uxbridge.
So don't blame the Army when they're strapped for cash and ask them to maintain dilapidated hangers that they have no use for.
At Gamecock Barracks Bramcote nr Nuneaton an (ex WW2 RAF airfield ) at least two hangars have been demolished this year. Why because they had been left to rot and beyond repair and the army has no use for them. But they have maintained the ATC tower which they have turned into a sports pavillion and bar over looking the cricket field that was once the apron.
If it's got real historic value then get Ghryff Rees Jones on the case. Otherwise let it go..

[buoy15]

I had the privilige to stay 3 nights in the former O Mess at Farnborough in 82 when the original sign outside said "Officer's Mess Royal Flying Corps"
The room I stayed in had carvings and graffiti dating back to 1912! - mainly wooden buildings - everything creaked, especially through the night - quite eerie!
I was lucky to have made it, because the very young civvy Mess Staff advised me it was due for demolition within months and the sooner it was gone, the sooner they would get a new build and more wages! - no sense of history
Much like Bliar and his mates who have declared they have no nostalgia with by-gone eras regarding our heritage, having just scrapped the post of Lord Chancellor, established over a 1000 years ago
Loving many, Trusting a few, Still paddling my own canoe

[green granite]

I would point out that even if a building is listed there is no obligation to maintain it, only "not alter it's structure", it may be left to rot with impunity.

[Always a Sapper]

I would point out that even if a building is listed there is no obligation to maintain it, only "not alter it's structure", it may be left to rot with impunity.


As is RAF Bicester amongst others ....

[anotherthing]

Oggin Aviator

As an Ex Naval Aviator myself I cannot see where you have gone wrong... whats wrong with a bit of banter or are people too 'anal' (to quote WIWO Wessex).


Banter on

BTW Kitbag - the RAF was formed when the Royal Naval Air Service (thats water) and the RFC merged and handed over some aircrew to form the RAF.

It was on the 1st April 1918.... longest running April fools joke??

Banter off

:ok:

[RubiC Cube]

As far as I'm aware none of the former RAF stations now inhabited by the Army were asked for by the Army. As I understand it some politician along with a bunch of civil servants decided to down size the Armed Forces. They also decided to 'draw down' (awful phrase/word) from Germany. That same group of politicals looked around for places to send the units returning from bratty land and spied a load of RAF bases which were going to be closed and made the decision to utilise them, rather than just abandon them. After all, there was nowhere else for the returning units to go to.
So don't go round blaming the Army for 'stealing' all your 'homes'. Blame the people who are the ones guaranteed to shaft all of us - the politicians and mandarins.


As I remember it, in the 70s the RAF were the only ones to close stations as cost savings measures in response to political pressures. But along came the Army to take them over because they were in a lot better condition than most of their bases, so were were the savings for the defence budget?

Similar events have occured in each subsequent round of RAF closures, including RAFG. Remind me of the threat in Europe that requires a presence there now?

[[email protected]]

Exactly my point. The Army didn't turn around and tell Whitehall to shut an RAF base because they wanted it, the base was already closed or scheduled to close.

The threat in Europe that BFG/BAOR was there for has now largely evaporated, hence 'drawdown'. What point exactly are you trying to make?

[scroggs]

The Defence Estate includes a great many historical sites and buildings, and all three services and their major constituent branches are represented. There are examples of unforgivable neglect whichever service's heritage is involved.

I have a glossy publication from the early '80s eulogising the wonderful historical buildings and sites in the then Defence Estate, produced by its then caretaker, the Department of the Environment. The book is full of expansive promises about how such heritage was in good hands and could look forward to a bright future. The truth for many sites has been quite different, sadly.

[LFFC]

Quite correct. Defence Estates (http://www.defence-estates.mod.uk/built_estate/heritage/9_point_plan.htm)looks after all MOD historic buildings and apparently they now have a 9-point plan of action.

Point 8 is as follows:
8. Disposal of surplus historic buildings

Failure to dispose of, or to re-allocate surplus or under-used historic buildings is a recipe for their uneconomic use, neglect and dilapidation. A firm commitment to the urgent disposal of all buildings for which an appropriate use by a department cannot be found is important if the best return for the taxpayer is to be obtained, and costly repairs avoided.

[lancs]

A quick search of English Heritage's Buildings At Risk (http://www.english-heritage.org.uk/server/show/nav.1426) register proves quite interesting for the intra-services debate. Using the critera 'RAF' results in 5 properties, 2 for 'Army' and only 1 for 'Navy'. Interestingly, of the five RAF results, 4 are at Biggin Hill.

[REF]

RAF bases which are listed can be found on the heritage website. Absolute disgrace IMO:{

Can you provide a link to this website please?

[XL319]

See above!!!!!!

[soprano54]

So what I want to know is:

Why are the pongoes letting historical ex-RAF land and property waste away and fall into rack and ruin?? For example and there are lots of 'em:

RAF Upavon - 1st Central Flying School in the World! - Have you seen the state of the hangars? These are listed buildings for christ's sake!! What are you doing about RAF heritage??
RAF Abingdon - RAF Para school - now a dump for bloody tanks! Donkey walloping & jogging is now a priority!! WTF!! Motor bikes are banned!!! What about the rally cars?? Tw@ts!
Let's face it you Army wallas are really a bunch of complete self centered Tw@ts or can you tell me that you really care about the RAF/UK history and in fact, co's you ought to..................co's we are really p'ssed off that you are letting our history go to rack and ruin.

Why???? :sad:

I would love to stay friends but this is stretching the limits somewhat......

What a complete and utter chopper! You have no idea what you are talking about, there is only one organisation you can blame for the sad demise of your history and thats your own. Don't blame the Army! The only 'battle Honour' the RAF celebrate is the BoB on the 15th of Sept as I seem to recall, then answer me this why has your organisation seen it fit to disband front line sqns that actually took part in that conflict?
I for one (Pongo) do care passionatly about our forces history and do get my arse in my hand when such ill informed poeple such as you blame us.
Tell me are you going to blame the Army as well for the sad demise of West Raynham & Coltishall etc!!!

TTTTTTTTTTTTTTTWWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTT:ugh:

[Wrathmonk]

Soprano

Spot on :D :D :D . Me thinks Dundiggin' doesn't like you chaps in brown and green judging by his other thread on JHC!

Standby for Bentley Priory to become a "Health Club" for the rich and lardy, Uxbridge to be handed over the US Armed Forces (Navy if rumour is correct!). Instead we keep Valley ...

W (not a pongo!)

[Number2]

I was shocked by the state of Gutersloh after the AAC/RLC were there for a few years. They put up fences on the dispersal and then moaned about the RAF when there was no room for the trooping flight to park! Several go-arounds because of grunts running across the threshold when an aircraft was on finals. At least the RLC could park their trucks in straight lines - very important job that.
I made a point of moving a fantastic Battle of Britain portrait from some dark, deserted ante-room to the reception on the day I left!!!

[Dundiggin']

I wonder if you would ask the Regiment reader to re-read the post to you so that you may understand it better!!

I didn't mention 'battle honours' at all!! I'm talking about property ie buildings and estate...National heritage which remains yours, mine and the Nation's heritage.

'National' heritage dear boy, things like the first Central Flying School in the World at RAF Upavon formed by Lord Trenchard, RAF Gutersloh Officers Mess with its' bending beam in the tower etc etc.

So get him/her to re-read it to you there's a love:ok:

[green granite]

Hmmmmm I think it was Bomber Harris who once said "that to get on in the army one needed to look like a horse, think like a horse and smell like a horse". I note things, in essense, have not changed. :hmm:







rapidly exits stage left putting on tin hat

[JNo]

Less bases -> less money. The days of having to spread assets out to prevent the Russians from taking them out in a one-er are over. It's the only way we can afford the brilliant future assets of the RAF, like the Typhoon. Oh, hang on a minute ;)

[FRAG7]

Number 2
With reference to Gutersloh, the AAC tried to tell the RLC NOT to use the hangers for vehicles as they would crack the floor. But they took no notice. They tried to tell them it is an active airfield but still they wander onto the runway. They almost turned the tower into an office for the RLC Brigadier, because he wanted to have a nice view, but they were talked out of it. The AAC is the minor unit at Gutersloh and is fighting an uphill battle with the Truckie Ludites all the time.

[JHC Wilton]

Damn those pongoes - just look at what they did to Kenley, Tangmere, Biggin Hill, Manston....

[The Helpful Stacker]

It was on the 1st April 1918.... longest running April fools joke??
:ok:

Actually the Royal Air Force came into being on the 2nd January 1918 with the appointment of Trenchard as the RAF's first CAS although it could also be argued that the RAF came into being on the 29th November 1917 when the Air Force (Constitution) Bill, providing for creation of an Air Force and Air Ministry received Royal Assent.

Oggin Aviator,

"In any future conflict it must be recognised that the RAF is the senior service. Today, the effectiveness of air power shows this to be true."

Winston Churchill

The Royal Navy ceased to be the senior service the day captial ships became the ones that a/c flew off rather than the boats with all the big guns.:ok:

[South Bound]

Crikey we do all spend lots of time worrying about trivial stuff don't we?

If a building is part of the Nation's heritage, let the Nation fund its upkeep. Base Commanders cannot afford to look after the essential buildings they have (look at the state of the troops' single accommodation), let alone maintain relics for posterity. The Forces, and hence the MoD budget, must be focussed on the future and improving conditions. The Nation must take responsibility for anything of historical interest. To blame another Service for letting our 'heritage' rot is just complete and utter tosh and a waste of a posting on here.

[oldbeefer]

As far as I can see the AAC have done a very good job of looking after MIddle Wallop, most of the buildings you mention were left by your goodselves to move to greener pastures.


You have GOT to be joking !

[NURSE]

it isn't just the armed forces leting historically important buildings rot fall down or be bulldozed in the name of progress! most Govt departments do it, Local authorities do it and buissness certainly does it. We as a nation haven't got the mentality to adapt buildings the first thought is always build new preferably on a green field. why do you think programmes like restoration are so popular!

[Strictly Jungly]

Oggin Aviator,
The Royal Navy ceased to be the senior service the day captial ships became the ones that a/c flew off rather than the boats with all the big guns.:ok:

(Un) Helpful Stacker............you really cheer my day up!

For info: A boat in the Royal Navy is a submarine.

By the Way.................We have never ceased to be the Senior Service despite the design changes(or numbers) of our surface fleet.

Theres a good chap.......now scuttle off back to your stores and don't release any to those who need them...............

[JHC Wilton]

Middle Wallop is a perfect example of how the Army have strived to preserve the RAF heritage. The buildings remain preserved in the state they were in when the RAF left - even the hydraulic gun turrets remain (If you know where to look). Nothing's been touched, apart from absolutely necessary minor repairs - it's just like putting the clock back 50 years!
Mind you it's a crap environment to live and work in...

[soprano54]

I wonder if you would ask the Regiment reader to re-read the post to you so that you may understand it better!!

I didn't mention 'battle honours' at all!! I'm talking about property ie buildings and estate...National heritage which remains yours, mine and the Nation's heritage.

'National' heritage dear boy, things like the first Central Flying School in the World at RAF Upavon formed by Lord Trenchard, RAF Gutersloh Officers Mess with its' bending beam in the tower etc etc.

So get him/her to re-read it to you there's a love:ok:

I think Upavon was allowed to decay long before the Army took over! The Army is'nt going to pay for the upkeep of disused hangars when it could be spending money on living accommodation. As for the beam in Gutersloh Officers Mess thats long gone, you're using it as a 'Chip' for your shoulder, its big enough!

[Dundiggin']

Have the beam and the tower bar disappeared from Gutersloh?

Any chip I have has been the product of your type's anallity matey!

But think about the original reason for this thread; surely if the current 'owners' of property which was once proudly held by others, lets that property fall into gross disrepair, then people of my pursuasion are not going to be happy with it.

It may not be entirely the Army's fault but if you're in the chair and supposedly looking after the place, then who can blame us for thinking it's down to an unsympathetic and uncaring tenant?

[Brain Potter]

I heard a story recently from someone who has been to Bruggen since the Army took over. This chap saw that some kids playing football had been provided with a board with various holes cut in as a target through which to kick the ball. He though it was a great idea and went for a closer look. It turned out that the other side of the board was the roll-of-honour of the former Stn Cdrs of RAF Bruggen that had been discarded from SHQ!!

[L-H]

Gentlemen of the Naval Services, I seem to recall that the Royal Navy is still referred to as the 'Senior Service' not because of it's longevity in comparison to the other two fine fighting arms of Aunty Betty's finest, but because of the emergence of the east India Company and the creation of it's own navy (and Army) in the late 17 century.:E

Anyway it's all a load of hoop frankly people getting all hot under the collar over triv!:ugh:

For my part, it's a virtual impossibility to maintain all the sights of significant and historical interest. A 'C' type hanger is a 'C' type hanger regardless of where it is, similarly so is a Romney, a Nissen Hut,......................! Further I cannot agree that Scampton should be regarded as special on the basis of a single bombing raid, although THAT is important. Lovely, lovely RAF Coltishall, my home for nearly 14 years on and off, also significant in that it was the last OPERATIONAL BoB station, clearly too has served it's purpose. I suppose my point is that we must move on and look to the future, but what should be done is records made, plans drawn up, photographs taken etc so that future generations can study these places in an historical context.

Finally, I live in East Anglironshire which is quite literally groaning at the seams in historical locations, for example down the road from me is Fersfield, Airfield is still there as an agricultural site, the accommodation huts quietly rotting at the site of the roads hidden in the undergrowth, then there is Watton, the domestic site has gone and is now a building site for a housing development, Old Buckenham, Thorpe Abbotts, Snetterton, Bodney (now Army) it's bleeddin' endless.:ok:

[soprano54]

Have the beam and the tower bar disappeared from Gutersloh?

Any chip I have has been the product of your type's anallity matey!

But think about the original reason for this thread; surely if the current 'owners' of property which was once proudly held by others, lets that property fall into gross disrepair, then people of my pursuasion are not going to be happy with it.

It may not be entirely the Army's fault but if you're in the chair and supposedly looking after the place, then who can blame us for thinking it's down to an unsympathetic and uncaring tenant?

Dundiggin you please to hear that the the beam is still there, as for the tower bar I can't answer that.

I am currently stationed in what was an SS Tank units barracks and it suits our needs very well, being a Tank regiment ourselves. So to that end all the hangars are used and kept in good order! If say a light role Infantry battalion were to occupy the lines then I daresay in a very short time the unused buildings would become neglected.

L-H hello how are you mate?

[L-H]

Soprano 54, I'm fabulastic matey. Things out here in civvystrasse are pretty good at the mo. You got your name down for the Stn Cdrs house at Colt yet when they come up on the market?

[rudekid]

L-H

As much as I admire Coltishall and rue it's passing, RAF NORTHOLT is still operational and had a significant role in the BoB.

RK

[soprano54]

Soprano 54, I'm fabulastic matey. Things out here in civvystrasse are pretty good at the mo. You got your name down for the Stn Cdrs house at Colt yet when they come up on the market?

No not yet, but as soon as at it comes on the market I intend to stick in a bid. Best keep stum about being a 'Pongo' as they might think I won't look after it!

AUDAX:ok:

[Comp Charlie]

L-H
RAF NORTHOLT is still operational and had a significant role in the BoB.

RK

As did some of the aircrew currently wandering the camp! :p

CC

[Maple 01]

s much as I admire Coltishall and rue it's passing, RAF NORTHOLT is still operational and had a significant role in the BoB.
Naaah sorry mate, Northolt's just another inner-city civi business airport that happens to have a few blue-suiters about – no operational stuff since 1945. Now Colt? That at least had fighter squadrons there until the end - or do HS125s count theses days?
RAF Northolt
One of the key airfields in the defence of London during the Battle of Britain, Northolt became the major airport for London in 1946, until the new site at Heathrow opened. Transport Command continued using Northolt after this, and the role of providing VIP air transport is the major task of the airfield today. so non-operational flying only
Mission Statement:
"To provide a secure airfield from which to support the Communications Fleet, wider Military tasks, and act as the RAF's core strategic site in London" Can't find the vomit icon - sorted! :yuk: :yuk: :yuk:
RAF Coltishall
Always a fighter Station, Coltishall opened in May of 1940 and was initially home to night-fighter, intruder and anti-shipping Squadrons. Coltishall includes the distinction of being the first RAF Station to operate the English Electric Lightning all-weather fighter in its long list of achievements and is currently home to the entire RAF Jaguar fleet of aircraft.
oops, a little out of date, but proves a point
sources RAF Website

[L-H]

RK,

FYI I am more than aware of RAF Northolt's contribution during the BoB, particularly as my grandfather was stationed there as the IO on 303 Sqn in 1940. Nevertheless dear ol' Maple 01 has made my point for me rather well on Northolt's role since 1945, so nuff said!:ok:

Soprano 54, Knowing you mate you'll plump for the house with the best preserved camouflage paint so that it'll match yer natty tankie romper suit.:E

Blackcat, Audax; Roger.

[vecvechookattack]

Hey, this is good....a thread allowing the RN/RAF to bait each other....haven't we done this before.

This is more interesting

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/5305774.stm


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5281238.stm

[soprano54]

RK,



Soprano 54, Knowing you mate you'll plump for the house with the best preserved camouflage paint so that it'll match yer natty tankie romper suit.:E

Blackcat, Audax; Roger.

Nah 21 Hautbois will do just fine!

[cazatou]

L-H

When your Grandfather was at Northolt in 1940 the Airfield had been a Fighter Base for 25 Years

[rudekid]

L-H/Maple 01

Alright, I'll bite! My grandfather made parachutes, but that doesn't make me qualified to spout rubbish about parachuting!

If I get your argument correctly, Northolt isn't an operational airfield because it isn't a fast jet base. Wow. Does that mean that Lyneham and Odiham aren't operational becaue they don't house fast jet aircraft. If you looked at operational sorties flown in the major operational theatres, the HS125 is doing more Op work than the Jag has done in the last 10 years...And I'm not a 125 driver!

Your quote about Northolt is as out of date as Colt's!;)

Jags been anywhere near an Op theatre since the nineties? Launched any Op missions from Colt (prior to closure) ever? I think not!


Comp Charlie- Nice one;)

PS Unless I'm similarly mistaken, the Jag was never a fighter!

Back to thread though, I believe that Northolt's BoB heritage is about to be side swiped by MODeL despite it's heritage status. This isn't the Army or the Navy, it's a light blue lead who has no interest in any form of preservation. It would be a very simple move and a minor effort to transform what exists into something which would provide a useful facility. Just needs some interest from further up the command chain...

[Roadster280]

So what I want to know is:

Why are the pongoes letting historical ex-RAF land and property waste away and fall into rack and ruin?? For example and there are lots of 'em:

RAF Upavon - 1st Central Flying School in the World! - Have you seen the state of the hangars? These are listed buildings for christ's sake!! What are you doing about RAF heritage??
RAF Abingdon - RAF Para school - now a dump for bloody tanks! Donkey walloping & jogging is now a priority!! WTF!! Motor bikes are banned!!! What about the rally cars?? Tw@ts!
Let's face it you Army wallas are really a bunch of complete self centered Tw@ts or can you tell me that you really care about the RAF/UK history and in fact, co's you ought to..................co's we are really p'ssed off that you are letting our history go to rack and ruin.

Why???? :sad:

I would love to stay friends but this is stretching the limits somewhat......

As an ex pongo that had the pleasure of serving at RAF Upavon, I can speak with some knowledge of the site in question.

Firstly, the site was only ever temporarily in RAF hands, it started as an Army camp, and has returned to being such. Like most defence sites, it is older than the RAF.

Secondly, the camp itself was an architectural disaster. There were the original buildings, (e.g. Offrs', Sgts' & Cpls' Messes, Scarf block, some MQs, and the lower two hangars (Wyvern Gliding school & MT). Then there was the 30s expansion stuff, the larger hangar (MAOTs, supply & MT overflow) and short hangar used as gym, Middleton & Nettleton blocks, Airmens' Mess. Then there was the 60s carbuncle of the HQ building, & SHQ. It was a complete hotchpotch of buildings.

Thirdly, and finally, the C Type hangar we occupied a third of, was in a terrible state of repair in 93 when I was posted out. I went back in 98 on an Army course, it had become various Army HQs by then. Our hangar was exactly the same as I left it, even down to the painted red hand on the hangar floor. As pointed out, a disgrace, though it had been in RAF hands in that state. Our block, Middleton block, had been converted into the headquarters of the Royal Army Chaplain's Department.

I suppose there is no point in investing in keeping a 70 year old hangar in pristine condition, unless you are going to keep several million pounds worth of aircraft in them. I remember the hangars at Dishforth on an exercise, not long after the AAC took over. One of them was in good order, and the Wokkas were parked in it overnight. The next hangar along was in absolute $hit state. I wouldn't have parked a bin truck in there.

Perhaps the MOD should seek to dispose of the not-so-historic sites and keep the famous ones for posterity.

RAF Driffield is pretty much a complete 30s style expansion period aerodrome, and of immense historic value for architectural reasons. But is it really as evocative as Tangmere, Scampton, etc?

Anyway, back to banter, Trenchard Lines lives once more as an Army site, celebrating one of the most famous of all Army Generals.