Flying for aid organisations

[keen2fly]

Hi there, I have recently taken the life changing decision to start training for a commercial licence to enable me to fly for aid organisations in Africa. Can anybody help by informing me as to what type of licence I need and how much experience in what type of aircraft? Also does anyone know if there is much demand for this type of pilot?

Many thanks all.

Mike ;o)

[Shrike200]

Go back a few pages, and/or run a search - this type of question has been asked very often here. You'll have to sift through quite a lot of 'off-topic' conversation as well, but you should be able to find what you need.

{We need a F.A.Q. for this one!}

[napoleon]

Shrikey man go to the USA get a CPL with inst rating and then talk to MAF or one of those outfits. DO NOT WASTE YOU TIME WITH A RSA CPL.

[Shrike200]

*Sigh - how do I put this...*

I don't need to do anything, actually. I've already 'wasted my time' (as you so quaintly put it) with an RSA ATPL flying for aid organisations throughout Africa for over two years - I guess all those people I flew for must have overlooked the fact that my licence was, in fact, worthless. It was fun, but it's over now.

SA licences are, in my experience, universally accepted by any quality outfit on contract to aid organisations.

[napoleon]

Ups made a mistake.was not giving that out you Shrikey it was for keen2fly. I have been through the RSA CPL and got it but in Africa generally the FAA license is the Holy Grail and as most missionary type NGO's are Yanqui's they require it.

[superserong]

Holy Sh1t's more like it, you on the some FAA School's marketing payroll napoleon?:} FAA Licenses are nice to have's, but would hardly go so far as elevating them above some of the others flying around Africa. Depending on where keentofly wants to end up concerning aid-flying in Africa or anywhere else for that matter. He should think of what he want's to do afterwards aswell, and where. Then decide wich license/'s is best Try to keep the road as straight as possible keentofly...ask me, still going in circles.:ok:
Cheers
SS

[napoleon]

The FAA route is the quickest route to get ones butt in the seat I believe. Once an airmans certificate is obtained its yours for life. Theres no lapsing and all that crap. You want to be a beach bum for 5 years and dont fly you have still got a license when you emerge from the stupour. Not so with many other "real" licenses.

[chandlers dad]

The FAA route is the quickest route to get ones butt in the seat I believe. Once an airmans certificate is obtained its yours for life. Theres no lapsing and all that crap. You want to be a beach bum for 5 years and dont fly you have still got a license when you emerge from the stupour. Not so with many other "real" licenses.

Correct and in the states the medical certificate lapses, as it should. Why other countries feel that the entire license must lapse instead of only the medical is a very good question.

I have ATPL's from a couple of European countries that have lapsed because I did not have the time/money to return there for a checkride, and that is pure BS.

[keen2fly]

many thanks all for your thoughts on the matter, looks like FAA is the way to go, and for the long term I can convert to JAA further along the line when my finances have recovered ;o)

[dyermaker]

Hi everyone! I've been interested in flying for aid organizations for a long time now, but only decided to do so now. From what I've read, most operate out of SA. I have FAA CPL and 1000 hrs. total time. I'm not SA citizen. My question is, how do I go about doing this? I have thought of just flying to SA and go in cold, start knocking on doors kinda thing. Is this a good idea? And do I go to Joburg? If not Joburg, where? Also, do I need to validate to SA license? Please help! Thanks!

dyermaker

[wheels up]

The reality is that a lot of the aid organisations have quite stringent hours requirements for co-jos and captains. Maybe someone could enlighten, but I know for instance that even Solenta has relatively high total time requirements for a Van P2. If you already have a fair number of hours then doing the SA licence or getting a validation and a type rating would be give you a good chance of landing this type of work. If you are starting from zero then you might consider doing joining one of the USA based 0 to 1000 + time building\ schemes where you work as a flying instructor in the States.

With 200 hrs I think the chances of getting a job flying for an aid organisation in Africa are pretty low. There may be jobs out there, but it would certainly help if you had some experience behind you.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Agaricus bisporus]

What in the name of heaven does a P2 do in a 'Van? The crossword? Why? Surely that is not a legal requirement? (All my caravan time was private cat. so SP but I can't imagine anything as pointless as wasting capacity by carrying a cojo in such a simple and docile machine)

[wheels up]

The P2 is there to assist with the crossword.

[Solid Rust Twotter]

UN requirement. Got to admit, I do feel for the okes logging C208 P2 hours when they explain this at interviews but I think most SA companies know about the UN requirement and accept it.

[Gerund]

This old chestnut of P2 on the Caravan keeps coming up. I wish some people would just show some understanding of the CATS and CARS under which they operate. I am assuming South African air law here as most posters on this forum are concerned with Caravan P2 on ZS aeroplanes.

Part 135.02.1 subpara 6 states:

For operations under IFR or by night in a small commercial air transport turbo-propeller or turbojet aeroplane, an operator shall ensure that the minimum flight crew is two pilots: Provided that in the case of a turbojet......

There are other provisions elsewhere, but the above is the core of the issue. Most Caravan operations are conducted IFR, and two pilots are required under South African law regardless of the fact that the Caravan is certified for single pilot operation, just like the 1900 in certain specified circumstances. Two crew equals P1 and P2...hence South Africa issues P2 ratings on the Caravan.

I wonder how long it is before this one comes up again!!

[dyermaker]

Thanks for the input everyone!

Wheels up,

I have 1000 hrs. TT and I assume that's probably enough to be a co-jo on Vans or B1900s. You said that with 1000 hrs., my best bet is to get an SA validation and a type rating. Where is the best place to do that in SA? In Johannesburg?

[poorwanderingwun]

There are a number of schools around offering validation training... you could try 'Simuflight' (NOT to be confused with 'Simuflite' which is a large international org. )Simuflight are based at Grand Central A/P... I would imagine that you could find someone nearby Lanseria A/P which would have the benefit of being close to most of the contract companies...

[Solid Rust Twotter]

...Part 135.02.1 subpara 6 states:
For operations under IFR or by night in a small commercial air transport turbo-propeller or turbojet aeroplane, an operator shall ensure that the minimum flight crew is two pilots: Provided that in the case of a turbojet......
There are other provisions elsewhere, but the above is the core of the issue. Most Caravan operations are conducted IFR, and two pilots are required under South African law regardless of the fact that the Caravan is certified for single pilot operation, just like the 1900 in certain specified circumstances. Two crew equals P1 and P2...hence South Africa issues P2 ratings on the Caravan.


Thanks Gerund.

Good old job creation then.:rolleyes: Still propping up the complexity of turbines myth. Can't see the P2 having much to do in a van, likewise a 1900. At least the 1900 P2 gets to play with the bleed air switch occasionally and read the odd checklist. At best it readies inexperienced crew for multi crew ops so I guess it's not completely pointless.

[Ingwe]

to all those 'save africa' wannabe's, here's a thought why, don't you commit your time and money to sorting out your own countries problems before coming here and telling and lecturing us on all our problems?

Just a thought. ;)

[Solid Rust Twotter]

Whoaaa!! Simmer down, Mr Leopard...:ok:

I'm guessing it's about the flying more than anything else and I'm pretty sure Africa needs help more than the UK or Canada.

[Gerund]

Sorry if it's a bit off topic, but since the P2 issue on Caravans has come up, it might be worth clarifying something else. And it will hopefully clarify things for would be contract pilots like keen2fly who get conflicting advice on the topic.

It is often mentioned on this site that no P2 is required on Caravans flying on the N register. I have already referred to aircraft on the ZS register.

If a Caravan is operated under CFR14 part 135 (most African contract operations) it must have a second in command if there are ten passenger seats or more (135.99) or when carrying passengers under IFR (135.101). The only exception is where an autopilot is fitted and working (not often on contract) AND the PIC has more than 100 hours command time on make and model (very often not the case).

So, Caravan, ZS or N reg, on contract under part 135, either law, in practice, two crew legally required.

[dyermaker]

Thanks poorwanderingwun!
I guess Lanseria it is! Thanks also to everyone for clarifying the P2 issue.


Forgot to ask, when is the best time to go to SA to look for contract work?