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Serenity
30th Jul 2006, 14:47
Wow, yet another riviting Grand Prix with huge amounts of over taking and excitement!! NOT!! I`m sure i`m not the only one thinking this.

I used to be a huge fan of Grand Prix and have been to several races, but am getting very bored of the predictability of it all. :zzz:

Moto GP on the other hand is fantastic. :ok: No idea of the race outcome other than it will be hugely exciting with numerous passes and crashes as man and machines are pushed to the limit and beyond. :D

Lon More
30th Jul 2006, 19:33
Watched the German Grand Prix, and apart from DC getting a flying lesson from Scummy !!, found it rather boring.
Much more entertaining was the BTCC which followed it on ITV. Close racing right down to the line, especially in the last race.

Mercenary Pilot
30th Jul 2006, 23:22
BTCC is a shadow of what it was in the late 90's. I mean, what exactly is a "touring car" these days? :confused: (I agree though, the "racing" was good to watch)

After all the major manufacturers pulled out of the BTCC (on cost basis), the series nearly collapsed. Bernie and Max have taken steps to prevent this happening to F1 but it has become so incredible dull. Question is...Will we, the fans still be watching by 2008? After 8 years of increasingly boring GP's and ill thought out rule changes do we really believe the new regulations will work anyway?

Top 5 things that I would change...

1/ Return to wide slick tyres (one manufacturer)

2/ Standardised ECU's + Wings

3/ Ban TC and electronic differentials

4/ Allow a standardised sized Nitrous Oxide tank to be carried and used during the GP

5/ Scrap Parc Ferme after qualifying (I want to see cars going flat out, not running race fuel. With the current “2 races per engine” regulations I don’t see the point of it anyway)


Credit where its due though, Saturdays qualifying was the best for years. :ok:

frostbite
31st Jul 2006, 13:05
In some cases, qualifying has become the best bit!

phnuff
31st Jul 2006, 13:36
Mercenary pilot. For what its worth

I agree on tyres
Disagree on ECU's and Wings
I agree on TC and electronic differentials
Disagree on a standardised sized Nitrous Oxide tank to be carried and used during the GP - why not just allow turbo's again
No real opinion on Park ferme


Martin Brundel, a man who knows his stuff, made the suggestion a few weeks ago that ground effect should be brought back as it sticks the cars down well, but does not stir up the air for cars behind and therefore should make overtaking easier.

Well its a thought !!

spekesoftly
31st Jul 2006, 15:28
I thought that one of the reasons for originally banning ground-effect F1 cars was safety. I understood that it took very little to upset such cars, which at high speed could then fly uncontrollably off the track, due to instant loss of downforce. But far be it from me to contradict Martin Brundle.

Mercenary Pilot
31st Jul 2006, 17:18
Disagree on a standardised sized Nitrous Oxide tank to be carried and used during the GP - why not just allow turbo's again

IMHO The reason for the introduction of Nitrous Oxide...It adds a short sharp blast of BHP for overtaking purposes. Also it would add a new element of strategy for the driver...Does he use it off the line to make some places early on? Set some hot laps before the first round of pits or maybe save it until an opportunity develops later on?

Turbos would be harnessed best by the richest teams and give them an even bigger advantage.

I think cars that go 2 (or 1:E) laps down should be black flagged, traffic ruins so many GP's. I hate seeing drivers pit for technical reasons only to emerge 6-7 laps later to use the GP as a test session:*

phnuff
8th Aug 2006, 14:04
Well, after this weeks race, I waited for the usual 'ain't F1 boring' posts but there weren't any. I thought it was fantastic and I think Bernie needs to learn a rain dance for every race

Well done Mr Button

Minty Fresh
8th Aug 2006, 14:14
Really pleased for Jenson - hopefully now some pressure will be off and he can string some results together.

I'm disappointed that Villeneuve and Montoya have gone - two of the real characters of F1. I feel we're just left with the corporate robots and they'll be little controversy now.

I remember one wet race it was Villeneuve who stood upto schumy when he wanted to start the race behind the pace car, and taking one particular corner in Portugal flat because he'd bet his mechanic he could ! Old school racers and unfortunatly not many left.

phnuff
8th Aug 2006, 14:57
You are right.

In the Indy/champ series (delete as applicable), I recall one of them (villphnuff I believe although it could have been Montoya), overtaking someone on (and off), the Corkscrew at Laguna Seca. An almost suicidal move. They are sure missed. I wonder if montoya has a sense of unfinished business with F1, because he is better than his record will show.

woolyalan
8th Aug 2006, 15:22
As serenity says, F1 has become mind numbing, but im not a big fan of its 2 wheeled sibling.
How does anyone rate the A1 races?
Its supposed to be like F1 but, every car is the same as the last, its driver skill which wins the race. Sounds really watchable, but is it?

phnuff
8th Aug 2006, 15:37
I watched a couple of them on tv, but generally found it less interesting that watching an F3 race. There was too much hype and it delivered nothing special, plus the drivers were not really up to much. I certainly would not go out of my way to watch one live

Minty Fresh
8th Aug 2006, 15:54
Maybe the GP Masters will provide some entertainment of the four wheeled variety.

They're at Silverstone 12-13 August I think, they've been drubbing up some publicity at London City Airport recently.

Have agree that the two wheeled scene is more exciting these days - World Super Bikes for me though (James Toseland is from a village a few miles away so I support the local hero)

phnuff
8th Aug 2006, 16:40
Yes, the GP masters looks good. Were I not doing something else, I would be there. The chance to Mansell etc. again would be too good to miss.

Mark Blundell is frfom just down the road from us, and so I always used to shout very loudly for him. Come to think of it, so miss Steve Parish, ex bike, now of Truck Driving fame.

chuks
8th Aug 2006, 17:41
There is no such thing as 'a free lunch.' The engines used in Formula One are so highly stressed that giving them a shot of nitrous would cause them to explode from the extra stresses generated, I bet.

If you really wanted more exciting racing then going way back to steel brakes and very limited aerodynamics would be a better way to do the job for a lot less expense.

Steel brakes would make for much longer braking distances, giving more opportunities to overtake under braking. Today's brakes are so good that the distances are miniscule. One slight misjudgement and you collide with the guy in front or else merge with the scenery. The Indy-type cars use steel brakes, in fact.

When you need downforce, getting too close to the car in front spoils that, another factor limiting overtaking.

Of course it might be worthwhile to think about getting M. Schumacher a personality transplant, except that it probably wouldn't take.

White Bear
8th Aug 2006, 19:16
A little thread drift, and showing my age but,
I’ve followed Formula 1 for many years.
The most thrilling race I ever saw was James Hunt winning the British GP in 1976 after that frightening accident at Paddock. Then the disappointment later in the season, when that victory was deleted from his record.
(I still want to shout at the FIA “I saw James Hunt Win the British GP!”.)
A wonderful moment occurred at the end of the race as James climbed onto the victory car, he bent and spoke to a fan standing at the back of that vehicle, asking him for his cigarette, surprised the fan took it from his mouth held up to James who took it and thanking him, immediately started gratefully puffing. It seemed to me to be the mark of a man who had, ‘not lost the common touch’, and one reason he was so well liked.
I remember well the incredible events and competition of the rest of that season between James and Nikki Lauder.
Nikki’s stunning recovery from his terrible accident at the ‘ring, and his extremely brave return to racing.
The satisfying end of the season with James gaining just enough points to win Drivers Championship in the last race of the year at Fuji in the rain.
A wonderful year to follow the Formula one circus, full of tension, tragedy, recovery, and redemption.
A good Champion, great character was James, I still miss him.
Regards,
W.B.

G-CPTN
8th Aug 2006, 19:22
Although 'the powers that be' don't agree, MY point of view has always been that Motor Racing is the practice-ground for development for the Motor Industry (disc brakes being the prime example). Fuel injection being another.
I'd like to see modifications restricted to those which would have a possible use in everyday motoring (traction control, anti-lock brakes), especially those which would (albeit in a simpler format) contribute towards safer general motoring. Fuel cells (by which I mean rubber bladders or foam-filled fuel tanks).

Mercenary Pilot
8th Aug 2006, 22:55
chuks
There is no such thing as 'a free lunch.' The engines used in Formula One are so highly stressed that giving them a shot of nitrous would cause them to explode from the extra stresses generated, I bet.
Agreed, but with an "engine development freeze" coming up im sure everyone would find a way.

If you really wanted more exciting racing then going way back to steel brakes and very limited aerodynamics would be a better way to do the job for a lot less expense.
For sure!! Couldn’t agree more:ok:

White Bear

Sadly Im too young to remember "Hunt the shunt" when he was alive :( but I have seen alot of his races since...Awesome!

F1 definitely misses characters...IMO Villeneuve wont be missed, giving up race wins and a competitive team for pure greed. His manager is as much to blame and just like everyone else in F1 im glad he’s going too! :mad: JV was such a talent, a very sad waste of ability.

G-CPTN

F1 has given alot to modern automotive technology but stuff like traction control and modern aerodynamics has ruined so much that is great about Formula 1. Why should I spend my time and money just for car manufactures to use it towards their R+D funds?!?

I want to see wheel to wheel action, power slides, overtaking and ridiculous levels of driver ability and car control

reynoldsno1
9th Aug 2006, 03:28
Give me 2 wheel racing anyday ... and who can ever forget that race between Sheene & Roberts, with Bazza giving Kenny 2 fingers everytime he overtook him - classic!!

G-CPTN
9th Aug 2006, 03:39
Sadly Im too young to remember "Hunt the shunt" when he was alive :( but I have seen alot of his races since...Awesome!
:{ :{ :{ I was indirectly involved before he was famous.

Thor Nogson
9th Aug 2006, 10:38
Steel brakes would make for much longer braking distances, giving more opportunities to overtake under braking.

This came up a few years ago, and the teams said the manufacturers had got them so good there wasn't any difference in performance. The only reason they stuck with carbon was it was lighter.

Personally I'd rather they let the teams have more freedom to develop the cars. Sure, at some points one car would be dominant, but they would all catch up.

I certainly don't want too much control so the cars all end up exactly the same.

TN

spekesoftly
9th Aug 2006, 11:46
IMO Villeneuve wont be missed, giving up race wins and a competitive team for pure greed.....
Could you expand on that? I'm not disagreeing, but I got the impression that JV had effectively been dropped by BMW due to injury/lack of fitness. Looks like I've missed out on some of the detail?

Mercenary Pilot
9th Aug 2006, 12:21
Hi

What I meant was JV gave up a competitive team after winning the world championship. He could have moved to basically any team he wanted but chose to go to British American Racing because of the massive (tobacco company funded) salary on offer for him and his manager . When it was apparent that BAR weren’t ever going to be competitive, JV still stayed for the money. Eventually David Richards (Owner of Prodrive, who will join the F1 padock in 2008) came in to manage BAR and set about getting rid of the ridiculously overpaid Canadian and his nasty little manager.

JV's seat for 2007 was under threat from Kubica anyway but his "injury" has only speeded up the process. It was likely that he was going to be relegated to a test role for the rest of the season then get dropped so he they both decided to mutually terminate the contract.

The official line from BMW motorsport director Mario Theissen:

Jacques has performed well for us this year, scoring the team’s first grand prix points in Malaysia.

He has made a significant contribution to developing the newly formed BMW Sauber F1 Team and the performance of the car.

However, after Jacques’ accident in the Hockenheim race the team decided to review its options for next year, including assessing Robert Kubica in a race environment.

Our decision to look towards evaluating our driver line up has naturally impacted Jacques’ position for the remainder of this season.

We fully understand that it is difficult for Jacques to maintain his natural level of commitment in circumstances of uncertainty.

We respect his position and wish him well for the future


What is interesting however is that there is nobody officially signed to the 2nd seat at Renault for next year? Now it is very likely that Heikki Kovalainen will get it but JV could be in with a shout. If he doesn’t get it, im sure that it WILL be the end of the 97 world champion’s unfulfilled career in F1.

spekesoftly
9th Aug 2006, 12:41
Ah, I understand now, thanks - a reference to JV's departure from Williams.

On the subject of Kubica - shame to see his BMW was subsequently disqualified from Sunday's GP, due to being underweight. So MS, now placed 8th, gains a point after all!

Thor Nogson
9th Aug 2006, 12:47
What is interesting however is that there is nobody officially signed to the 2nd seat at Renault for next year? Now it is very likely that Heikki Kovalainen will get it but JV could be in with a shout. If he doesnít get it, im sure that it WILL be the end of the 97 world championís unfulfilled career in F1.

Fissi let the cat out of the bag a few weeks ago when he signed. When he was asked if he knew who his teammate was going to be, he said something along the lines of "No, but I do know he will be Finnish".

I guess it is all up for grabs, but it seems like Renault are trying to lure Raikkonen over, and if they can't get him, then Kovalainen will get the job.

I wonder when and if Lewis Hamilton will get a drive with McLaren?

TN

Mercenary Pilot
9th Aug 2006, 13:13
I wonder when and if Lewis Hamilton will get a drive with McLaren?
If I was Ron, I would try to keep Kimi to pair up with Alonso giving me the best driver line up in F1 by a large margin :E !

However, I think Kimi has signed to Ferrari so the question is...Who partners Alonso? On current form, I would go with Pedro. I would bring Lewis Hamilton AND Gary Paffet in as test drivers then monitor their performance and bring them in for 2008 or 2009.

The reason I say this, IMHO Nico Rosberg is a possible GP winner but I think he should have spent a year in a testing role. I feel that the rookie mistakes he has made this season are starting to damage his confidence.

I have no idea why Renault signed Fisichella with so much quality available for next year? :confused: They should have gone for Webber and Kovalainen.

Minty Fresh
9th Aug 2006, 14:57
Be interesting if Raikkonen has signed for Ferrari to see if they will be the same team as in previous years. If Ross Brawn decides to leave I think that'll be just as big a loss as MS

G-CPTN
9th Aug 2006, 15:36
IF Michael Schumacher wins the GP Championship he WILL retire.
Not certain what'll happen if he DOESN'T win . . .

Thor Nogson
9th Aug 2006, 15:43
If I was Ron, I would try to keep Kimi to pair up with Alonso giving me the best driver line up in F1 by a large margin :E !


I agree. I suspect that Kimi has got hacked off by the unreliability of the McLarens though. If they'd been as reliable as the Ferrari and Renault, he'd have had two titles by now.


I have no idea why Renault signed Fisichella with so much quality available for next year? :confused:

It was a timing thing. They really need at least one experienced driver, and his option was expiring. They couldn't guarantee getting anyone better, and would rather have him (who they know) than whoever was left. If they get Kimi, though, it will certainly be the last year at Renault for the Roman.

IF Michael Schumacher wins the GP Championship he WILL retire.
Not certain what'll happen if he DOESN'T win . . .


But they've said they will announce next year's driver line up at the Italian GP. It probably won't be decided by then...

TN