LUTON - 3

[LTNman]

The ILS was out of action yesterday as it was being calibrated with SRA’s the only option. With visibility decreasing some aircraft were asking for a NDB approach. These requests were turned down with one aircraft being told in detail that NDB approaches were no longer allowed at Luton and that permission given earlier was given in error. Anyone know why or were my ears playing tricks?

[Buster the Bear]

The straight in (Direct NDB) approach was removed from operation a number of years ago! The procedural NDB approach for a non radar environment still exists.

Rumour has it, over 500 movements at Luton yesterday! Not bad considering the lack of infrastructure!

[LGS6753]

Buster has it - over 500 in one day.

Some 54 arrived from Berlin:confused:

[Buster the Bear]

I quote: "Buster has it - over 500 in one day." I hope those female bears really appreciate me!

500+ movements from a runway with a back track issue, no high speed exits, an appalling lack of taxiway and passing areas! AWESOME! Well done to all those in the tower and all the ground staff looking after those flights!

This must be some kind of UK record from a single runway with all the inherent lack of infrastructure that Luton enjoys :eek: !

[Bumz_Rush]

I was on a MON PM departure on Monday, Capt said sorry for the delay 20mins on taxi way...due to VIP minister movement ex Northolt.

Is this a Blair Purple Airway....Not Notamed.?????


Bumz

[Buster the Bear]

I see that Ryanair have announced a (partial?) withdrawal from the Swedish market, so the flights by Ryanair to Västerås will cease at some stage soon. Ryanair are blaming an increase in Aviation Tax within Sweden.

[Powerjet1]

Buster the Bear

Wef 28 Oct. So, will we see a couple of new routes to fill the 4 daily rotations to/from VST or will LTN go down to 3 based ryans from Nov ?.

[Buster the Bear]

Ryanair are claiming that the reduction in its flying to Sweden will lower its passenger forecasts by 350,000 overall, so one could assume a reduction in the Luton base perhaps?

[Charlie Roy]

My money is on two new routes:

Luton to Wroclaw (in the morning)
Luton to Krakow (in the evening)

Both Polish destinations popular with Ryanair, and not served by Wizzair from Luton. More or less the same flying time as Luton to Vasteras.

[pabely]

Charlie Roy

Educated Guess ?
I agree that it would seem silly for them to give up departure times for someone else to pick them up and for one less based aeroplane overnight, never!

[Buster the Bear]

Ryanair 'head to head' with easyJet from Luton to Krakow, now that would be rather entertaining!

After easyJet's embarrassing foray and eventual retreat from Gatwick into the Irish Republic, Ryanair would certainly be punching hard again, this time at the home base of easyJet!

http://www.itmworld.com/cat_images/pics_itm/easyjet1.jpghttp://www.gifs.net/Animation11/Sports/Martial_Arts/Punch.gif

[Charlie Roy]

Ryanair have 4 aircraft based at Luton. All the destinations they serve from Luton are done so exclusively using these aircraft.

i.e. Luton - Dublin is done entirely using Luton aircraft. No Dublin aircraft are used. The same is true for every Luton route.

The winter timetable for all destinations is virtually unchanged (just time changes of 5 minutes here and there), EXCEPT of course the Vasteras service which will be stopped.

So, THREE of the Ryanair aircraft at Luton will do exactly the same work/routes in the winter as they do now.

Let's consider the FOURTH aircraft.
Currently it does:

Luton - Vasteras
Luton - Dublin (1-3-5-7) / Brest (-2-4-6-)
Luton - Shannon
Luton - Vasteras

In the winter this aircraft will do:

Luton - New Destination(s)
Luton - Dublin / Brest
Luton - Shannon
Luton - New Destination(s)

So I guess between 2 and 4 new destinations. Possibly:

Luton - Treviso (1-3-5-7) / Wroclaw (-2-4-6-)
Luton - Dublin / Brest
Luton - Shannon
Luton - Krakow (1-3-5-7) / Oslo (-2-4-6-)

I could be totally wrong. What do ye all think are likely routes? I wouldn't mind having the job of Ryanair's route planner though... :p

(PS - Ryanair would have no qualms in going head to head in competition with Easyjet on Krakow. They already compete with Easyjet on Liverpool - Krakow. Easyjet have made a very lack lustre entry to the eastern markets and their brand is not known. Ryanair would be counting on Poles recognising their brand and choosing their lower fares. Easyjet really missed the boat on Poland. Ryanair were late starters too, but they're making up now for lost time. Expect a lot of new routes to Poland from their existing bases, and another route explosion later this year when they announce their first Polish base.)

[OLNEY 1 BRAVO]

Charlie Roy - you mention Treviso as a possible replacement destination but Ryanair only stopped flying there from Luton in February. Granted the original flight was in the evening but even so I would have thought a relaunch unlikely.

[Charlie Roy]

Indeed. You may be correct in saying that a relaunch of Treviso seems unlikely. However, in winter there will be 2 flights less per week to Treviso from Stansted, despite it being a highly profitable route.

[Powerjet1]

Easy increasing Luton-Dortmund flights from 2 to 3 x daily wef 6 Nov 06.

[theflyingbus]

Hi all.

I am a FO at LTN with Tfly and am AOG at the moment for a two wheel change on our 738!

I would be very grateful if you could advise me of the airline setting up at LTN (?) flying a 75/6 to the states in a VIP config. One of our senior crew is taking early retirement and was intrigued.

Many thanks and thankyou for all your hard work around the airport to keep us in the air, it is appreciated, although it may not seem like it sometimes!

[Powerjet1]

The airline is "Silverjet", intending to fly 767s towards the end of the year.

[Buster the Bear]

So any truth in the rumour relating to Luton, Thomsonfly and South Africa?

Edit. Here is the link: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=227670&page=4

[Powerjet1]

So any truth in the rumour relating to Luton, Thomsonfly and South Africa?
Where did that one come from then or have I missed something ?

[LTNman]

ATM’s
7075 up 5.1%
year on year 77,975 up 10.8%
Passengers
881,773 up 4.3%
year on year 9,305,719 up 10%

It’s now starting to look unlikely that 10m will be reached this year.

Maybe not a bad thing, as the dual carriageway section of the A505 to the M1 has been reduced to single file due to the road works with the queue at 2pm disappearing into the tunnel.

So not only is it a challenge to get to the terminal at peak times, once there you can’t get away. As for the queues to join the M1, less said the better.

[BIZBOY]

Noticed Easyjet winter schedule now bookable(except for GLA and EDI) which will be added later.
Grenoble is back and the previously stated 3rd daily Dortmund is good to see.
Appears the new routes with the exception of Lisbon and Bordeaux are summer only destinations.
Poor old Istanbul ,starts late,eventually goes daily from end of august,then dropped for winter?Thought this route might have carried on year round with Bratislava.Anybody know why BTS is not year round?-poor load factors perhaps.:uhoh:

[Buster the Bear]

BIZBOY how do you know all of the Luton routes for winter 06-07 have been loaded and are bookable on-line (Apart from EDI & GLA)?

[jetsetwilly]

Quite correct Buster. The release of seats onto the website is not done in one go. Releasing all of them at one go will slow down the check-in process as E-Res is linked to the booking machine. They are spreadout over a couple of weeks, hence you won't find all the routes available. GLA & EDI's are 'normally' one of the last to go on. The BTS will stay as figures are always well into the 130's & 140's.
JSW.

[CAP493]

Buster has it - over 500 in one day.Some 54 arrived from Berlin
515 movements to be precise of which 7 were related to an ILS calibration and 66 related to the World Cup and Wimbledon. This leaves 442 which still beats the previous record of 408 reached only days before.

Not quite the slumbering back yard that some people still believe Luton is...
:ok:

I was on a MON PM departure on Monday, Capt said sorry for the delay 20mins on taxi way...due to VIP minister movement ex Northolt.

Probably a Cat 'B' flight out of the RAF's London aerodrome: which of course, takes priority over everyone else; except flights from a certain large international airport a couple of miles to the south of Northolt...
:hmm: :rolleyes:

[ebenezer]

500+ movements from a runway with a back-track issue, no high speed exits, an appalling lack of taxiway and passing areas!
Those "in the know" reckon that these "missing links" will probably not be provided for 18 months to two years because Project 2030 will founder due to a lack of support from the Council which wants LLAO to develop the existing site to its maximum capacity but Abertis isn't willing to spend the money needed because the remaining length of the Concession Agreement isn't long enough to provide their required pay-back.

"Negotiations are continuing" as they say.

Another "source" says that LLAO may be intending finally, to include all corporate flights in its runway slot allocation program, mainly because of a "significant" increase in demand for 2007 from the airlines, and the impossibility of creating runway "space" for bizjet, etc, flights through an informal voluntary arrangement.

Luton could find that next year, 450+ daily movements becomes the "norm" which as Buster says, is pretty impressive when compared to 800 or 900 a day at airports that have all the necessary taxiway links, holding areas, high-speed turn-ons, etc, etc.

Pity the "bean-counters" don't seem to understand!!

:rolleyes:

[Captain_Caveman]

The winter outlook is :

Luton - Bratislava is dropped for the foreseeable future, Luton - Cagliari is dropped for the winter and will resume next spring. LTN-CDG increases to 4 daily compared to last winter and LTN-GNB has increased frequency at the weekend, 3 daily Luton - Dortmund as has been mentioned already, Ltn - Istanbul SAW is awaiting approval for flying over the winter from the turkish authorities. Another one or two routes are on the cards and will be announced in the coming months.

[Buster the Bear]

Movements (and passengers) for July and August would be even higher if easyJet were not consistently cancelling numerous flights on a almost daily basis, although Luton is not alone with this regularly occurring! easyJet have recently leased in both a 737 and 757 until September, but are still cancelling flights! Must be costing them a fortune under EU rules, let alone bad publicity/customer loyalty!

Biz Jets slotted at Luton? That would send shock waves throughout the corporate world!

I am surprised if Bratislava is to terminate? Its capital is a bit of a property 'hot spot'. Cheap prices compared to the UK, and excellent rental income. I am aware of at least one person that regularly commutes weekly to London having moved to live in Slovakia.

I think easyJet will be culling a lot more under achieving route this winter from their network now the man from the RAC has had time to understand the business?

[CAP493]

[QUOTE...if easyJet were not consistently cancelling numerous flights on a almost daily basis...[/QUOTE]
The problem for easyJet (which is similar to Ryanair's) is that it doesn't have sufficient flight crew to operate its full series of schedules. So 'culling' under-performing routes and combining flights is likely to be the 'norm' for the foreseeable future, unless a large carrier goes under and creates a surfeit of JAR-qualified 737- and/or 319-rated pilots seeking gainful employment. Just goes to show what's the most critical and essential element of any public transport business (= people i.e. 'sharp-end' staff).
:{ :{ :{ :E :ok: :oh:

[Powerjet1]

Movements (and passengers) for July and August would be even higher if easyJet were not consistently cancelling numerous flights on a almost daily basis,
Agreed. It seems the early morning sectors are very prone to cancellation, with AMS, CDG, GVA, MAD featuring high up the list. I know, I've been caught out myself, twice by this, in the last month alone. Every morning there are enormous queues at the easy sales desk with people having to be rebooked on alternative flights. It is chaos.The days it happened to me, three flights due to depart before 0700 were cancelled at short notice, and it seems to continue throughout the day on the odd intermittent flight. Obviously destinations with multiple daily departures seem to bear the brunt, single, daily flights much less so.
Probably get even worse for the next 6/8 weeks over the peak summer period.

[Captain_Caveman]

The Bratislava route is definitely chopped

[King Pong]

I know someone who was booked on an Aberdeen to Luton flight. Easyjet emailed them that the outward leg of the flight to Luton was cancelled due to operational reasons. The customer cancelled the return flight and flew BMI both ways so easyjet got hit twice and Luton lost 2 passengers from its stats.

If I had independently booked a hotel in Spain for a family holiday I sure would not be booking easyjet for the flights. And this is from a loyal customer.

[TartinTon]

Just goes to show what's the most critical and essential element of any public transport business (= people i.e. 'sharp-end' staff).


Actually, that nasty "P" word is the most critical thing. When you know you have so many aircraft coming so far in advance why on earth haven't you crewed up to operate them? Planning is the key.......

[Buster the Bear]

So in effect, easyJet are 'shafting' their VALUED customers! Lots of new planes, so where is the equal investment in new crew? You can get a massive bargain off Airbus, but they are not going to fly them for you!

No one to fly their planes is a very sad excuse! Airlines are quite happy to sing their own virtues of 'low cost', but if you pay your staff peanuts.....I guess the recent senior management departures are testimony to this?

I vividly remember Lord Stelios taking the pilots on during the late 1990's and prior to the demise of Debonair digging him out of a big hole. I also remember the countless number of sub-chartered planes whilst his 737's stood idle on the north side. Those EAC 1-11's were very noisy!

Not so long ago, I was reading about possible strike action by easy cabin crew, I guess the lack of them now is rather hurting management!

Basically, easyJet are another airline suffering from 'short termism', maximise profits this week and bury your head next.....

The axe is being wielded according to those in the know. Mr RAC is turning things around for investors, sadly, not for some of their punters this summer! A lot of summer holiday plans are going to be ruined.

I guess if you could buy pilots and cabin crew, immediately sell them off at a profit to the financial institutions, then lease them back by the hour at hugely inflated cost, crewing the new shiny planes would not be an issue?

[Powerjet1]

I am told that an announcement regarding Project 2030/Expansion will now be made by the airport later this year. A bit vague I know, but no details can be made public at this stage. Wait and see.

[LTNman]

So 2012 becomes 20??. So much for the Olympics then?

[vintage ATCO]

Luton could find that next year, 450+ daily movements becomes the "norm" which as Buster says, is pretty impressive when compared to 800 or 900 a day at airports that have all the necessary taxiway links, holding areas, high-speed turn-ons, etc, etc.

Pity the "bean-counters" don't seem to understand!!
The bean-counters will understand well enough if we can pull off 450 movements a day on the present configuration. Whay pay for anything more? Perhaps we should stop trying so hard . . . . ;)

Just back from a week at RIAT/Fairford with a sun tan and cream-crackered! :)

[LGS6753]

Surely you'll soon be able to Wizz to Bratislava??

[Charlie Roy]

Wizzair's biggest competitor SkyEurope have an important presence at Bratislava, it being their main base of operations. I believe Wizzair would want to avoid a routes war with SkyEurope in Slovakia.

[BIZBOY]

So Bratislava did get the chop.
Wonder what the yields were on those flights because if jetsetwillys figures are correct, 130/140 pax must have been paying rock bottom prices.
Shame to see it go.Like Buster i know somebody that used it regularily for the same reasons!

I am curious what the new routes for Easy may be.(Year round destinations or just seasonal).

With this summers forrays into seasonal destinations by both Easy and Wizz are they just simply running out of ideas for long term sustainable routes.If so maybe they should look at Copenhagen,Munich,Bibao,Valencia,Cork,Venice,Canaries,the list is endless-well nearly.

Ok i know Venice was a RYR route but again i believe the pax figures were good just the flight times could have been better, and cant believe the irish airlines havent looked at Cork.


I have a question ,with all the problems that easy did have with Istanbul,if you apply for a scheduled license to fly a route,are you given it on the basis you can fly it all year round ,or do you have to stipulate winter/summer seasons etc?.



Also the latest rumour from council is that an extension to the concession will be announced,maybe 10 years, but heh it is only a rumour!Me thinks there will be plenty more rumours before the announcement is finally made:ooh: .

PS Good luck to all those Easyjet staff having a torrid time of it at the moment.There is light at the end of the tunnel and we do appreciate it!

[egnxema]

Buster "easyJet have recently leased in both a 737 and 757 until September, but are still cancelling flights! Must be costing them a fortune under EU rules, let alone bad publicity/customer loyalty!"

...don't you believe it buddy! I was caught by the sleazies at ALC last month on the weekend they cancelled about 70 flights - the same weekend a big boy lost his job - the airline conveniently states "Cancelled for operational reasons" to try avoid the EU compensation of €250 per pax. Anyone caught by EZY in this way should file in the small claims court - as a company's human resources issues are well within their control - and not something that should be hidden under the "Operational Reasons" opt out claus.:mad:

[Cahlibahn]

I should be in Cannes now but the EZY2501 was cancelled again today (it was cancelled at least twice last week, too). They've fobbed me off with the 'operational requirements' bollix but I've had enough and will pursue them in the SCC. As my boss would say "p@@s poor planning on your part does not make an 'operational requirement' on my part" :rolleyes:

[jetsetwilly]

BizBoy...thanks on behalf of those @ LTN.

JSW.

[andyafc]

Air Torquoise have cancelled all flights for the future, another one bites the dust at Luton, more slots for other airlines tho :)

[Captain_Caveman]

Luton - Edinburgh will be 8 flights daily in the winter schedule. Available to book from tomorrow.

[Buster the Bear]

Air Turquoise have cancelled all thier operations, a niche for Arann maybe?

[nickmanl]

Anyone know what the Air Turqoise loads were like? Why do airlines think they can start up, do no advertising and immediately be successful! Everyone knew they wouldn't last long!

[dingodiva]

Anyone heard how Aer Arran flights to Newquay are doing?

[Powerjet1]

Ryanair have moved their LTN-SNN from an afternoon to a late evening departure with the start of the winter timetable. With the demise of the twice daily VST in Oct , some days its looks like they could almost get by on 3 based aircraft. Is this their intention ?.

Luton - Malta with easy, now a strong possibility.

[Charlie Roy]

Powerjet1

Interesting developments. Do not fear however. Ryanair's aircraft number 4 at Luton is staying put.

Currently it flies:
Luton - Vasteras
Luton - Dublin (1-3-5-7) / Brest (-2-4-6-)
Luton - Shannon
Luton - Vasteras

It winter it will fly:
Luton - NEW DESTINATIONS
Luton - Dublin (1-3-5-7) / Brest (-2-4-6-)
Luton - Shannon

It's interesting to see that the Dublin/Brest and Shannon flights have been pushed to later times.

I'm getting excited here thinking that we might be getting a morning flight from Luton to Morocco or the Canary Islands, or somewhere equally far flung... :)

[LTNman]

http://www.ladacan.org/

The final Master Plan for expansion of Luton Airport which was due to be published in early 2006 is facing further delay. Speaking at the Consultative Committee on Monday (17th), Managing Director Katherine James read a joint statement on behalf of her company, LLAOL, and the company which owns the airfield for Luton Borough Council, LLAL. The statement made clear that negotiations over the future of the operating lease for the Airport are still going on.
LADACAN regards this development as interesting as it suggests either that the Master Plan will be significantly different from the draft which was issued last October or that the draft was issued by LLAOL before negotiations were concluded. If the latter, it seems that the draft could not have been based on a full financial assessment of the proposals.

Meanwhile, none of the 6,500 respondents to the consultation on the draft plan, which closed in January, have had any response to their objections.

[Charlie Roy]

With Ryanair's cancellation of Vasteras in the winter, and their rescheduling of the Shannon, Dublin and Brest flight times, then here are the rough times for which Aircraft 4 remains thusfar unscheduled:

Mon, Wed, Fri
0630 - 1430 (Time to Luton - Marrakesh return, for example!)

Tue, Thur
0630 - 1600 (Time to do 2 routes)

Sat, Sun
0630 - 1200 (Time to do 1 route)


So, I envisage 3 new routes:
New route #1: Long distance (1-3-5--)
New route #2: Medium distance (-2-4-6-)
New route #3: Short distance (-2-4--7)

Any ideas?

[Powerjet1]

Luton - Edinburgh will be 8 flights daily in the winter schedule. Available to book from tomorrow.
Now bookable but seems to be 7 x daily, not 8, apart from a couple of fridays when there are 8. There is now an early morning dep ex LTN at 0645.

[Buster the Bear]

Malta eh? Is that why Air Malta announced recently that they are binning their Stansted service, only to back track very swiftly and are now keeping this route open? A sense of competition!

[Daft bat]

Heard a rumor today that the expansion of Luton airport will be downgraded significantly. I heard that what the airport calls "Option 3" is now top of the agenda.This option is no runway extension but extension of the taxiways to remove the back track's, also fast exit taxiways for both ends on the runway. The plan also incorporates a new taxiway called "Hotel taxiway running parallel with the current Delta taxiway on the side nearest to the car park with cross overs to the aprons, including the new apron to be built on the short stay car park.
New Arrival hall to be built and extension of the existing terminal onto the drop off point and next to this a multi storey car park.There is also two further piers running parallel to the existing pier serving the new apron as well.
I'll be watching the news to see if "Option 3" becomes a reality, it looks like get a lot more from the airport without the major investment first quoted in the 2030 plan.:suspect:

[LTNman]

The parallel taxiway is with taxiway Alpha not Delta as seen here. http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/8673/rotationofimage001mo2.png Just knock off the runway extension and Luton council will be happy that an expanded airport stays within council boundaries complete with 18 new stands.

[pabely]

LTNman

Not sure if Harrods would like this though....loss of South Stands, private terminal & possibly hangers!
It's going to be interesting times for the negotiators.

[Daft bat]

Yes nice picture LTNman however they were not the plans I was shown. The plans were official luton airport plans and were titled option 3. These were again same as building infrastructure on your picture for the terminal area.
However Option 3 shows no runway extension and as last quoted a parallel taxiway next to the current Delta taxiway and no apron which was shown on your photo next to the current long term car park. Due to the stalemate with the extension to the current operating licenses from LLAO this I am led to believe is top of the agenda as minimal investment required for an increase in effectiveness of the airport.

[Buster the Bear]

So if Wizz are to announce Luton-Bratislava, the void left by easyJet will be filled. With the additional oder for 20 + 20 options A320's (additional to a previous order) announced today at Farnborough, Wizz are set to dominate travel out of Eastern Europe. A fleet of around 50+ aircraft within 5 years.

Better get started on the additional parking stands soon eh!

[Charlie Roy]

Luton - Malta with easy, now a strong possibility.

Tomorrow (Friday) the Maltese Government will publish a call for proposals from low cost airlines to operate new and underserved routes to Malta.

The call, will be appearing tomorrow on-line on the website of the Department of Information and it will open up the possibility for low cost airlines to operate to Malta from Luton, the Republic of Ireland, Pisa and Mulhouse-Basel.

http://www.maltamedia.com/news/2005/tt/article_10784.shtml

Looks like the Maltese Government already have both Easyjet and Ryanair in mind by naming such destinations. Luton and Basel for Easyjet, Ireland and Pisa for Ryanair...

Air Malta reversed their plan to abandon their Stansted service as they realised it would leave the route open for Ryanair to swoop in, and even get aid to operate the route, as without Air Malta on it, it would be deemed a necessary but unserved route.

http://www.maltatoday.com.mt/2006/07/16/t3.html

[LTNman]

Joint LLAOL/LLAL Statement - Project 2030
20 July 2006
Project 2030


London Luton Airport Operations Ltd., LLAOL, published its draft Master Plan in October 2005. Since then LLAOL has been considering the consultation responses received with a view to producing a final Master Plan which meets the objectives of LLAOL, London Luton Airport Ltd., LLAL (the Freeholder), and the UK Government in the most sustainable way possible.
In parallel, LLAOL and LLAL are in ongoing commercial and technical dialogue which will take some time to conclude.
It remains the intention, if possible, to conclude these matters in time to inform the Government's review of the White Paper, expected later this year.

[Minnie the Moocher]

Just got back after few days out of the UK and I'm trying to catch up.

1) So Air Turquoise have suspended ops? Not really a shock, it just took a bit longer than I thought. I don't want to brag but Minnie was the prophetess of doom back on May 16th... "I noticed that the Air Turquoise flight to Reims didn't operate yesterday. I hear they have been getting some very bad load factors. So another 'Luton' airline about to go to the wall?".

2) Final Master Plan now delayed until late this year? - 'nuff said. Those plans to cash in on the Olympics must surely be abandoned now. Earlier speculative comments in this string regarding less ambitious plans for expansion have the ring of truth, and whatever happens the local 'anti' morons will make a PR meal out of the airport's discomfort.

3) Lastly, they must be really short of cash. I picked up a copy of the latest staff newletter off a public desk in the tinminal today, and it's awful compared to previous issues. Up until now I believe the airport have had it produced for them commercially, but the latest copy looks homemade and it has the feel of a bad parish newletter. mmmm...

:confused: :confused: :confused:

[CAP493]

Also the latest rumour from the Council is that an extension to the concession will be announced, maybe 10 years...
This is now both LLAO's and LBC's preferred option (LBC has indicated that it would not support the 'new' airport as proposed under Project 2030), whereby the existing site would then be devloped although clearly not to cater for 30m annual pax. However...LBC's lawyers have indicated that if the Concession is to be 'extended' (which in reality means re-negotiated) then it must be opened up for competitive tender. ACDL/LLAO's view is that this could open the door to others e.g. Ferrovial, and so it's unwilling to take the risk.

Without the Concession being extended the cost of the investment required doesn't stack up from a business-plan perspective. So, both parties are now desperately trying to come up with a workable solution that will facilitate:

- taxiway extensions to the runway ends
- improvements to the existing taxiway/runway access points (the site isn't big enough to construct 'proper' rapid exit taxiways)
- a terminal extension
- additional apronage
- an additional taxiway parallel to Delta running as far north as Harrod's apron providing access to the East Apron and a new Southeast Apron
- further roadway improvements
- a relocated Airport Fire Station
- a multi-story car park.

Whether (i) the funding can be made available (the cash is there - it's simply a question of "...is it worth it?") (ii) planning permission can be obtained without a public inquiry and (iii) ACDL is prepared to continue working in a 'straightjacket' remains to be seen.

Remember that Frankfurt Airport Authority - one of the original Concession contenders - walked away saying that because of the run-down state of LTN at the time, and the amount of investment required to bring it up to an acceptable standard, a Concession length of 30 years wasn't viable.

Seems like FRA's judgement is turning out to be correct!

LBC strikes yet again...

:{ :ugh: :rolleyes:

[Daft bat]

From CAP 493
taxiway extensions to the runway ends
- improvements to the existing taxiway/runway access points (the site isn't big enough to construct 'proper' rapid exit taxiways)
- a terminal extension
- additional apronage
- an additional taxiway parallel to Delta running as far north as Harrod's apron providing access to the East Apron and a new Southeast Apron
- further roadway improvements
- a relocated Airport Fire Station
- a multi-story car park
Cap 493 the list you have quoted are all on the plans I saw called "option 3" however the plans do show rapid exit taxiways at both ends of the runway.They were positioned between what is the current Alpha and Bravo entrance's to the runway and what would be the new entrance's to the runway threshold taxiways.
Hope my explanation makes sence

[LTNman]

From day one of the concession it was obvious that heavy investment could only take place in the early years to allow a sufficient pay back period for the operator. No operating company is going to spend hundreds of millions of pounds only to hand it over to someone else as a free gift when the concession ran out. The concession should have been at least 50 years.

[Buster the Bear]

I totally agree LTNman, but LBC won't be able to understand this logic! To be honest though, I doubt if anyone actually thought Luton would be handling around 10 million passengers so soon into this concession period AND the current concession holders are not the ones who signed the original concession agreement. Either ACDL have gambled taking on TBI, or have bought blindly into this situation?

What is remarkable, is just how the airport is coping with such limited facilities shifting record numbers of planes and people, but there are limits! The laws of deminishing returns, more investment is needed to take Luton to the next level and beyond. No wonder an extension to the concession is being considered by ACDL. If a longer concession means putting the place out to tender, then kiss goodbye to interim development I would guess, unless LBC pays for it, but how can LBC, as they under strict budgetry control from Westminster?

[LTNman]

If an agreement can’t be reached then the future lies in expanding executive jet movements. The operating company will need to provide additional taxiways to increase movement rates but the FBO’s can pay for everything else including new aprons and exec terminals. I assume this is the case with the new Harrods apron which opened up opposite the eastern apron. This should be outside any concession agreement with the council. It might even be the case that the airport looks for a third FBO for Luton if Harrods and Signature don’t play ball.

[LTNman]

Why a full-length parallel taxiway is needed now to increase the movement rate.

http://doug3658.fotopic.net/p31667530.html

[ebenezer]

]...the FBO’s can pay for everything else including new aprons and exec terminals.
Quite correct! And this is exactlywhat Signature Flight Support is intending with its proposed new three-story corporate aviation terminal building that will shortly be built adjacent to the Gulfstream hangar (planning permission has aleardy been received). It also appears that both Harrods and Signature are lobbying LLAO for additional apron space (easier to provide for Harrods than for Signature).
Either ACDL have gambled taking on TBI, or have bought blindly into this situation?
There must surely be an element of unawareness on the part of TBI itself, if one looks at the expenditure already undertaken and that's still needed:-

1. Recent complete runway resurfacing (at least five years overdue)
2. Various taxiway surface repairs
3. Various stand re-surfacing programmes
4. Replacement surface movement radar (current system works but is v. old technology)
5. ILS replacement (current system also works but is v.old technology)
6. Car park refurbishment
7. Major internal roads revamp
8. Major revamp of 'old' terminal
9. Construction of 'new' terminal
10. Full-length parallel taxiway construction
11. Runway lighting rennovation
12. Surface drain replacement

If TBI had been able to carry-out a 'schedule of dilapidation' back in 2000, one wonders if it too, would have shared the view taken by Frankfurt Airport (and others) and simply walked away.

Rumour has it that the 'deal' being discussed might well see LBC's holding company (London Luton Airport Limited) funding a significant proportion of the further development costs needed, on the grounds that it's this Company that continues to own the Airport and this would be seen as an investment in its own real estate thereby creating more local jobs, etc., in an area that has in relative terms, a high unemployment index and continuing 'urban deprivation' areas and which therefore, is eligible for regional grant aid.

[LTNman]

Quite correct! And this is exactlywhat Signature Flight Support is intending with its proposed new three-story corporate aviation terminal building that will shortly be built adjacent to the Gulfstream hangar (planning permission has aleardy been received).

Are you sure about the planning permission? A look at http://www.luton.gov.uk/Media%20Library/Pdf/Environment%20%26%20regeneration/Planning/Planning%20Aplications/Planning%20Applications%20for%20last%206%20months.pdf shows no planning applications for this when a seach on the words Airport or Percival is carried out. I have been checking out this site for years and have never seen anything relating to this development.

[ebenezer]

Are you sure about the planning permission?
I certainly am! Confirmed in the notes of a recent (July) Airport/Council meeting. The Council has taken the view that there's neither a change of use nor an increase in terminal capacity arising from this development. Must be one of the very few occasions that an intelligent and objective decision emanated from Luton's Town Hall!!
:rolleyes:

[Buster the Bear]

I am told that LBC stands to earn between £14 and £16 million from its concession arrangement during this financial year.

I have just discovered this:

http://www.jobsatluton.co.uk/pdf/PFC1652.pdf

[Powerjet1]

From 30 Oct, Aer Arran's LTN-IOM change, with the flight starting in LTN, with a 15.05 dep and arrival back in LTN at 18.10 Mon - Fri. Weekend flights originate in IOM as do all current daily LTN-IOM flights. Newquay & Lorient finish for the winter and Galway & Waterford both continue twice daily using a GWY bases aircraft. If the IOM flights are to be operated by a LTN based aircraft, could Liege and other routes be announced shortly?

[CAP493]

I am told that LBC stands to earn between £14 and £16 million from its concession arrangement during this financial year.
Good grief! And what exactly does LBC do with all this cash, where does it all go??? Put another way, how much more 'deprived' would Luton be if this income dried up...??
:uhoh: :confused:

[Buster the Bear]

CAP493, you really should go and visit Acacia Avenue, or is it called Bury Park High Street, I really cannot remember? Lots of money has been spent there and also in St Georges Sq by the Arndale. LBC provided a top quality outdoor shelter for all the resident wino's!

[Powerjet1]

LTN-SNN not bookable after 28 Oct. Is this another route being given up by ryan along with VST. Three based aircraft, down from four, looking even more likely, unless a whole set of new routes in the pipeline to replace those given up.

[Buster the Bear]

Ryanair downsizing at Luton? Well that would be a media coup for easyJet, the timing of which will also coincide with their move from the shrink wrapped huts into the hangar!

[Buster the Bear]

Shannon, could be a route for Arann if Ryanair pull the route?

[Charlie Roy]

LTN-SNN not bookable after 28 Oct. Is this another route being given up by ryan along with VST. Three based aircraft, down from four, looking even more likely, unless a whole set of new routes in the pipeline to replace those given up.

That is indeed very strange that Luton to Shannon is suddenly no bookable :eek: (Maybe the schedule is just being revised)

I would be surprised to see it cancelled, especially now since Easyjet are pulling out of Shannon, and Ryanair have less competition on the Shannon - London routes. Or maybe that's exactly why they would be cancelling it, having previously supplied capacity way above market demand in an attempt to force Easyjet out, and now that they are gone, reduce their Shannon - London services.

However Aircraft 4 currently flies:
Luton - Vasteras
Luton - Dublin (1-3-5-7) / Brest (-2-4-6-)
Luton - Shannon
Luton - Vasteras

For winter Dublin/Brest are still bookable but at later times (departing Luton at 1620 instead of 1140). Aircrafts 1, 2, 3 are operating practically the same schedules as summer, so have no room to do the Dublin/Brest flights.
Thus, Aircraft 4 will still need to be in Luton for the winter to do the 1620 flights to Dublin/Brest.
We know Vasteras is gone, and if Shannon is also gone, then the possibility for new routes using Aircraft 4 is immense!


PS: Even if Ryanair do cancel Shannon - Luton, I will never expect Aer Arann to take over the route. Shannon already has 2 huge players on the Shannon - London routes (Aerlingus and Ryanair), and Aer Arann won't dare go up against them. If that was the case, Aer Arann would have introduced Cork - Luton ages ago.

[King Pong]

I see that yesterday the first easyJet flight from and to Edinburgh was cancelled and today the same is happening with the Glasgow rotation. Seeing that these first flights of the day are very popular with the business community I am somewhat surprised that easyjet cancelled them.

I was going to take the family up to Glasgow for a long weekend to visit relatives but I can’t take the chance that easyjet won't cancel one of the legs so that’s another 4 passengers they have lost.

[Charlie Roy]

Well, to be more precise, it's going to be going to FEZ and Marrekech in the Winter. Check out Ryanair's route map!

[Powerjet1]

Well, to be more precise, it's going to be going to FEZ and Marrekech in the Winter. Check out Ryanair's route map!
That's to p**s off Thomsonfly who announced a couple of months ago they were starting Luton-Marrekech from 3 Nov, 4 x weekly. Fez is good though.

[Charlie Roy]

And it's official: Luton - Shannon flights have been axed.

[Powerjet1]

Charlie Roy

So with FEZ & RAK starting end of Oct, and seem to be operating on alternate days, does this still leave any gap to be filled for something else ?. I would have thought so,

[Charlie Roy]

Indeed, there is still a gap in schedule. Luton is losing 3 daily flights: Vasteras (2) and Shannon (1), but gaining only one daily Morrocan flight. Defo a gap in the scheduling. Hopefully more new routes on the way :)

Thought the would have announced them all together though... Strange.

[Powerjet1]

Charlie Roy

The block times for 1 Morrocan, LTN-FEZ-LTN(7.40hr) & LTN-RAK-LTN(7.05hr) roughly equate to 2 existing sectors, i.e LTN-VST(4.50hr) & LTN-SNN(3.05hr) Total 7.55hrs.
It would seem therefore, that a sector length of 1.50/2.00hr outbound & return to ONE new destination is poss.

[Buster the Bear]

Fez, that is certainly different!

http://www.aurigamusic.com/roster/fez%20bear%20drummer.GIF

[Charlie Roy]

So what you guys prefer?

Having Luton - Vasteras and Shannon?
Or Luton - Marrakesh and Fez?

[Buster the Bear]

I think ACDL would prefer the extra rotation the Stockholm/Shannon gave, passenger numbers will be reduced by 100,000 per annum by removal.

[Powerjet1]

Can't see the Thomsonfly LTN-RAK flights surviving, now that ryanair have announced they are also to fly the route. It is no coincidence that ryan are to operate their four weekly flights to RAK on precisely the same days as T, but with a departure time one hour earlier.

[nickmanl]

Powerjet1

I don't know, there might be untapped potential for this route considering the lack of low cost between the two countries. It's not as though every Ryanair route has been a runaway success at Luton is it!?

[Charlie Roy]

Ya, i don't think Ryanair have launched a route to RAK purposefully to spite Thomsonfly.

Ryanair have been preparing their Morocco strategy for a number of months. Luton (/London) to RAK was definitely on the cards for Ryanair anyway.

It is also their policy to operate to RAK on early morning 1-3-5-7 and FEZ early morning -2-4-6-

This is already how they fly their Moroccan routes from Frankfurt Hahn and Marseille.

I think Ryanair didn't even consider Thomsonfly when planning it's Luton to Morocco routes.

[Buster the Bear]

I understand that with a proposed re-design of the London TMA to be implemented within 3 years, movement rates could increase to well over 40 per hour assuming the infrastructure on the ground has been upgraded to cope.

For that movement rate, the days of the back track would be numbered. Parallel taxiway to both ends and rapid exits off the runway would be required (together with somewhere to park all the planes)!

[vintage ATCO]

Time to farm the old boys off, then. :eek:

[CAP493]

Time to farm the old boys off, then
Tut tut - not exactly PC are we?
Just as many reluctant youngsters; those who might not want to risk being burned out at 40...
:8

[airhumberside]

BA connect will axe IOM from the winter timetable. Are Aer Arann still doing this route?

[Charlie Roy]

airhumberside

In the booking engine Aer Arann are reducing IOM - LTN from 12 to 5 weekly.
In winter it'll be an afternoon flight 12345--

The route will also be operated with a LTN based aircraft, and not an IOM based aircraft, as now.

In fact I can't figure out RE's aircraft usage. With IOM - DUB currently done with a DUB aircraft, what does the IOM aircraft do all week? Just 12 LTN flights?! Not going to bother to try to figure it out. They do so many W's its boggling. I remember before an RE aircraft used to finish its day flying EDI - ORK. But used then take off from ORK empty to fly to I don't know what base :suspect: to start the day there the following day!

[Buster the Bear]

How I miss those Manx Shed's that inaugurated the route back in the late 1980's!

Will Arann increase their frequency now they have removed the competition. BAcon must have problems if Arann have struck a death blow so soon on this route! 4 jet engines against 2 props, Jet A1 is so expensive now, I guess this outcome was a foregone conclusion if BAcon loads were poor at times?

[JDB1052]

RE's IOM Luton is in on Sunday evenings too. I presume the Saturday will follow.
Luton to Newquay and Lorient have also (not suprisingly) gone for the winter,so it looks like just two each on Galway and Waterford and one on IOM.

[pabely]

RE's IOM Luton is in on Sunday evenings too. I presume the Saturday will follow.
Luton to Newquay and Lorient have also (not suprisingly) gone for the winter,so it looks like just two each on Galway and Waterford and one on IOM.

Can't currently book Sunday on their booking engine for November:confused: kills my plans!!

[PAXboy]

Buster regarding IOM ...Will Arann increase their frequency now they have removed the competition. BAcon must have problems if Arann have struck a death blow so soon on this route!I am not surprised. BA only bought MANX to get the LHR slots by moving them to LGW. I could see no other reason for the acquisition. Since then, the Manx routes have been slimmed and sold. I expect us to see it reduced by the traditional English method of 'a thousand cuts'.

Last winter, BA cut the route to four rotations in the week (I think) and the total cut for winter will please them greatly. Once Aer Arann step up the route BAcon will be able to withdraw, whilst presenting suitably long faces about how sad they are about it, of course. :hmm: :ugh:

[Charlie Roy]

Can't currently book Sunday on their booking engine for November:confused: kills my plans!!

pabely, location: IOM and Luton.

I feel your pain today :\

[Powerjet1]

Can't currently book Sunday on their booking engine for November:confused: kills my plans!!
You can book Sunday's from Jan 07, although at the moment it seems to be IOM-LTN only, with no LTN-IOM in the booking engine. I'm sure this is just waiting to be loaded. Also, a few odd saturday's are in, so it is beginning to look as if it will become a daily service in the winter.

Also Liege is raising its head again, twice daily ex LTN. This would tie in quite nicely with the LTN based aircraft operating the route morning & evening, and doing the IOM in the afternoon. Would still leave a gap from mid-morning to fill somehow?

[22/04]

Believe I read somewhere BA Connect are stepping up IOM-LCY. Is this why they are axing LTN

[JDB1052]

BA dont do LCY - they are adding a fourth to IOM-Gatwick. Yugomanx do LCY so now its RE for the northwest, BA for the southwest and Manx for the east.
RE's Luton aircraft was an ATR72 this summer so if this stays, the IOM will be on it so they are probably getting rid of the double daily ATR42 to concentrate on a single ATR72 so. Still a mystery about what else the Luton aircraft is going to do?

[Buster the Bear]

BAcon flight will land at Gatwick not Luton from the winter.

Twice daily LCY-MAD with BAcon. No mention of IOM flights from there.

[JDB1052]

RE's website is now offering a daily service on IOM

[Powerjet1]

RE's website is now offering a daily service on IOM
The Luton based aircraft appears to operate this service in the afternoon, immediately followed by the second LTN-WAT rotation of the day, which was previously operated by a GWY based aircraft. As the LTN-IOM does not depart until 15.05 each day, there is big chunk, say 0700-1430, available for something else.

[pabely]

RE's website is now offering a daily service on IOM

Extra 1.5 hours in IOM for me at the weekend with Sunday timings. :cool:
With the loads I experiance, I'm sure double daily would be justified year round again now BACON is going south. Many PAX are all year round commuters. I can but hope.:ok:

[Buster the Bear]

London City is likely to be sold for between £450 & £500 million (ironically a Spanish consortium leads the chase), so what is the value of Luton if LBC were ever to decided on a sale!

I see Malev are pulling off the Budapest-Heathrow route and code sharing on the existing BA flights. Does this mean that Wizz and easyJet have triumphed?

[Charlie Roy]

Buster the Bear

Ya, and SkyEurope no longer fly from Budapest to Stansted either, so Wizz and Easy will defo see their market share on London to Budapest route rising this year!

[Powerjet1]

Charlie Roy

This summer Wizz currently fly in excess of 250 weekly flights into/out of LTN, but this will fall to about 190 in the winter as some summer destinations finish. Luton-Bucharest starts 15 Jan 07 and two brand new destinations are earmarked to start in March 07 with another two due to be added in May. Wizz could then be operating between 15/17 routes from LTN by S07.

[Buster the Bear]

Gee-Wizz! that is phenomenal! I wonder if Wizz intend to utilise the extra capacity that winter will bring compared to this summer, or will they just fly less overall on their route network?

[King Pong]

I see that LSG Sky Chefs have set up an in-flight catering unit at Luton via its subsidiary City Net Catering and have won the catering contract for Thomsonfly. Alpha are feeling the pain particularly that they now have no food outlets in the departure lounge and only Bewley’s landside.

[Powerjet1]

Anyone heard how things are progressing at "Silverjet" in their quest to launch a business class airline from Luton. I note from another thread, that cabin crew interviews are starting next week, being held at an airport hotel.
Anybody have any other news?.

[Buster the Bear]

All gone quiet since they raised the launch capital via the 'Alternatives' market.

Where will they park?

[LTNman]

I see that a large area around stand 16 has been dug up again despite it only being dug up last year and given a new layer of tarmac. This time it is going to be block paved. The airport must be awash with money if they can afford to change the surface after only a year. :confused: :confused: :confused:

[LTNman]

I see that Thomson are showing some massive delays today. Their 23.55 Friday departure to Alicante has a 14 hour 40 minute delay. It was due back at 5.50 but will now not be returning until 20.00. Their 5.50 Ibiza arrival now not due until 11.40, which in turn is putting back their Paphos departure by nearly 6 hours. I wonder how many other flights are going to be delayed today until they can catch up?

[CAP493]

Where will they park?
On any South Apron stand(s) nose-in/push-back.

The Airport must be awash with money if they can afford to change the surface after only a year.
I think you'll find that Signature F/S contributed significantly towards the original cost and in any case, the previous Contractor involved is likely to be hit with a bill for these repairs as the surface put down is alleged to be of substandard quality.
:{

[LTNman]

CAP493

Hope they are not the same contractor that did the runway then. Maybe they are the same contractor that laid the floor tiles in the terminal.

[Powerjet1]

See that the conversion of Hanger 89 into easyjet's new HQ seems to be progressing well, with small amounts of orange paint now starting to appear on the roof structure. Big advertising board pushing their new Luton-Istanbul service on the the builders perimeter fence at the front.

What will be happening to their present portakabin offices when the transfer to the new building takes place early October?. Are they being pulled down to make way for something else.

[King Pong]

I think you'll find that Signature F/S contributed significantly towards the original cost and in any case, the previous Contractor involved is likely to be hit with a bill for these repairs as the surface put down is alleged to be of substandard quality.
:{

If the surface was duff then the contractor would have skimmed a layer off and done it again with a new layer of tarmac and not replaced it with block paving.

[LTNman]

Helvetic has just arrived from Zurich. Have they started operating again into Luton?

[Powerjet1]

It is the last of a couple of heavily booked flights, which Helvetic decided to operate rather than cancel. This should be the last you will see of the "pink pencil" at LTN for some time. No further flights are scheduled to operate here.

[ezpz]

See that the conversion of Hanger 89 into easyjet's new HQ seems to be progressing well, with small amounts of orange paint now starting to appear on the roof structure. Big advertising board pushing their new Luton-Istanbul service on the the builders perimeter fence at the front.
What will be happening to their present portakabin offices when the transfer to the new building takes place early October?. Are they being pulled down to make way for something else.

The portakabins are going. The only thing staying in the old easyLand is the call centre, everthing else is moving across to H89. However, all plans are subject to change, so until everyone starts the move, who knows.

[Powerjet1]

The portakabins are going. The only thing staying in the old easyLand is the call centre, everthing else is moving across to H89. However, all plans are subject to change, so until everyone starts the move, who knows.
Cheers for that. Would have thought everything would be going over to H89 including the call centre, but as you say, everything can change between now and the move in October.

I was under the impression that the whole area which easyland sits on, is required for airport redevelopment, so everything would be coming down. Having said that, because the airport are still considering which way to go as regards expansion, immediate vacation of that area may not be required.

[Powerjet1]

Understand that new destinations for Wizz, linking LTN further into their network for 2007 are now likely to include Belgrade, Varna, Dubrovnik, Skopje, Sarajevo & Bratislavia. If they all came to fruition and S06 seasonal return in S07, that would give a total of 20 routes to/from LTN. Not bad for an airline that doesn't base a single aircraft at the airport.

[LTNman]

1001 facts about Luton Airport for 2005 at http://www.luton.gov.uk/Media%20Library/Pdf/Environment%20%26%20regeneration/Planning/Regional%20Planning/AMR%202005%20for%20pdf.pdf

This PDF file is 4.5 meg

[Powerjet1]

Hmm.....Interesting to note that Wizz has just overtaken Monarch into third place, for the number of flights it operated in 2005 into the airport. The position is likely to be repeated in 2006 & 2007, despite Monarch basing a fourth aircraft at LTN next year.

[LTNman]

Interesting that Britannia / Thomsonfly come in at a lowly 6th position. I can remember the days of 6 based 737-200’s.

[Minnie the Moocher]

Anybody know what going on over the last few days at LTN?

We've had passengers complaining about huge queues and having to wait over an hour to get through security, and two days ago when I came back there was someone who was definitely 'non' security sitting outside the baggage reclaim hall?

:confused: :confused: :confused:

[PAXboy]

LTNman, thanks for the link to the annual report. I see that they make a classic mistake of using an acronym without explanation. In the Preface, (v) 'The Leq contours are produced...'

Whilst I can understand what they are talking about, I should like to know the acronym. Convention (and politness :hmm: ) says that an acronym should be stated in full on the first occasion that it is used in a document. So this is irritating and makes me doubt the rest of it. Does that seem over the top? This is a document that has been produced to communicate and if the staff cannot follow the basic rules of established practice, then they should not be doing this!
(end of mini-rant)

[andyafc]

Minnie moochie, i work as security at luton and recently theyve stepped up secuirty duno why, and this has brought massive queues throughout the airport, cant see why management cant see why this dont work or they could try and employ more people, that mite help

[Pain in the R's]

andyafc

For the first time ever I had to put my shoes through the X-ray machine despite my airside pass. I have now had to buy new socks due to holes.

A Wizz captain was having a fit the other morning as his passengers were delayed getting through security.

[Charlie Roy]

Pain in the R's

I do suggest you buy some new socks, especially if you are ever travelling to Ireland. It has been the norm (for over a year now) for all passengers to be required to remove their shoes in Shannon and Dublin :)

Security could be stepped up for a number of reasons: recent review, new regulations, specific information from the authorities of a threat, general guidline from the authorities regarding an increased London/UK state of alertness, etc.

I hope they have extra staff or something to inform the queuing passengers at the security gate to be ready to take their shoes off (as well as all the regular stuff)...

[andyafc]

yeah i agree with ya pain in the ars, they are a bit stupid coz they keep passengers waitin for ages and that means angry people and we get them full front of it aswell as them missing there flights, mayhem

[Powerjet1]

See this message has just gone on the Luton Website...........

IMPORTANT PASSENGER INFORMATION
Due to a change in passenger procedures across all UK airports the number of items allowed as hand luggage has been dramatically limited.

Passengers are advised to check in as soon as possible upon arrival at the airport. Passengers should be prepared to check in all hand luggage including mobile phones and laptops; these will not be permitted in the aircraft cabin.

Members of the public not travelling today will not be allowed within the terminal building.

Note the last paragragh. Something going on ?

[LTNman]

Members of the public not travelling today will not be allowed within the terminal building.
Note the last paragragh. Something going on ?


I wonder if the airports mosque / chapel will be closed? Will the airports taxi rank be moved away from the terminal? I think not.

No prizes for guessing what sort of passengers should be checked more carefully at Luton but no doubt mum and dad with their two children travelling on holiday to Spain will be given thorough check for political correctness.

What happens to the meters and greeters with a ban on non passengers?

As of 7:00 there has yet to be a departure

[take-off]

just looked on MAN website says nowt about it , but all over news bbc sky etc...

[Powerjet1]

As of 7:00 there has yet to be a departure
Same at STN by the look of things.

[LTNman]

7:20 and still nothing has left

[LTNman]

Airport is in complete shutdown mode with nothing leaving. Terminal is hell on earth.

edit:first push and start of the day requested at 7:33

[vintage ATCO]

Me too. I don't know why the airport chapel should be brought into this.

[c_jephcott]

Hiya guys,

due to be flying from Luton in the next few hours. Bearing in mind that the Departures screen on the airport website appears to be not displaying any information, I was wondering if somebody could advise me as to if the planes are departing or not?

Cheers
Chris

[vintage ATCO]

Departures seem to have restarted about 30 mins ago (although I am not there). A friend who got an early flight to Amsterdam has just phoned asking what is going on. easyJet said on the radio a while ago to check their website as many flights might be cancelled.

[Powerjet1]

I've seen three easy's take off but not much else. No drop off zone. Cars being directed to short term car park instead.Non flying pax not being allowed into terminal with some police road spot checks. Basically chaos.

[c_jephcott]

Thank you very much for the information guys. I'm not due to leave here for another few hours, so if you could just keep me abreast of the situation, that would be great.

I've checked and there appears to be no sign of the flight being cancelled yet. It's the 18:45 to Basle if anyone has any other information.

[andyafc]

I work as security at Luton and we recently have stepped up security we were all wondering why we were doing this but now we see why, if u travelling today expect long queues at security, check in early and go straight to departues gd luck

[c_jephcott]

Ok guys, can't get through to either the airline or the airport still and will be heading down shortly.

I take it that there is no news on the departures yet?

[vintage ATCO]

Departures are certainly happening although I have no idea how late they are running. It'll be a couple of hours before I am there.

[EGPFlyer]

There's a list on easyJet's website of cancelled flights.

[Cahlibahn]

All EZY flights from LGW, LTN and STN cancelled according to EasyJet website. Hope C.Jephcott didn't leave home yet!

[c_jephcott]

Yeah, read it about an hour ago. Trying again now for 7:15 in the morning!

Oh what a hinderence!

[LTNman]

LTNman

Quote "I wonder if the airports mosque / chapel will be closed? Will the airports taxi rank be moved away from the terminal? I think not.

No prizes for guessing what sort of passengers should be checked more carefully at Luton but no doubt mum and dad with their two children travelling on holiday to Spain will be given thorough check for political correctness".

I may be the only one - but I for one find these remarks very offensive.




Don’t know why when everyone that has been picked up by the police is English but of Pakistan origin. This clampdown on all passengers is so that a few Muslims don’t get the ar*ehole that they are being discriminated against. := := :=

Being a Muslim is not a dirty word and we all know that most of them are good people but if some of them are intent on mass murder then they should not complain if there is selective targeting with limited resources.

[SamS]

Back to an earlier subject but Arann seem to have loaded more of their Luton schedule (operated all six LTN departures today - well done).

The mystery of what the Luton ATR72 does is only partially answered though - it seems to do the Waterford morning and evening flights from the end of October at earlier morning timings whlst the morning departure to Galway is also earlier, suggesting this plane just turns around from and to Galway. With the Isle of Man in the third slot I still can't find what it does on the second slot of the day - perhaps Newquay will reappear.

[King Pong]

Originally Posted by Minnie the Moocher


I may be the only one - but I for one find these remarks very offensive.

Minnie the Moocher

Can't help but think that you are part of the problem

[LGS6753]

Still numerous cancellations this morning from EZY.
They seem to have stopped all domestic and short-haul routes (including Paris and Amsterdam) today.
Also applies to Gatwick and Stansted. Presumably the turn-round times are too long to make the service viable (and helps get other services away on time).
If this continues, it will wreak havoc with passenger number for August, which I was expecting would top 1,000,000 for the first time.

[Just_Testing]

So much for today, but does anyone know if easyJet will be flying to AMS tomorrow. I'm booked to go on the EZY2153 at 0630 with Mrs Just_Testing, and she is not going to be impressed if we miss our cruise liner which departs at 1800.:{ easy customer services are predicting a 30 minute wait to answer the phone.

[LGS6753]

JT

I'd be seriously tempted to drive.

LGS6753

[CAP493]

Monarch didn't cancel a single flight at all yesterday
Neither did Wizzair.Were easyjet departures possibly cancelled for other reasons

I remember a BMA Viscount sitting on the tarmac at a certain airport, with mechanics working on the # 3 engine, the cowling open for all to see. The departure board (well it was a few years ago before everyone went low-cost high-tech low-reliability) in the adjacent terminal said the delay to the flight was due to "weather".

Some things it seems, never change...
:hmm:

[LTNman]

From the easyjet website

Saturday 12 August: easyJet business as usual


easyJet intends to operate a full flying programme on Saturday 12 august 2006 as the situation at airports across the UK returns to normal, albeit with increased security measures in place.

[OltonPete]

Hi

As BHX has posted their third dreadful set of monthly pax figures and with Luton catching up quickly (higher in some months) I was wondering if the
July figures have been published - nothing on the website earlier.

If anyone is interested in the BHX figures the monthly press releases
on the BHX website are a good read - the excuses are lame to say the least but entertaining.

Pete

[OltonPete]

Found the answer: -

HEATHROW 6,533,164 +1.2%
GATWICK 3,720,070 +4.2%
MANCHESTER 2,422,504 +1.0%
STANSTED 2,391,507 +10.0%
GLASGOW 1,036,595 -1.7%
LUTON 959,114 +5.2% :D
BIRMINGHAM 945,264 -6.8% :{
EDINBURGH 862,523 +2.0%
NEWCASTLE 603,209 +5.9%
BRISTOL 572,487 +6.3%
EAST MIDS 525,113 +17.5%
LIVERPOOL 483,597 +9.2%
ABERDEEN 292,237 +6.6%
PRESTWICK 268,400 +0.8%
CARDIFF WALES 241,768 +14.7%

BHX has about 10000 transit pax to add usually but still pathetic.

Pete

[True Blue]

Why no reference to either Bfs or Bhd, they are also domestic points?

True Blue

[OltonPete]

True Blue

Sorry no slight intended, I just copied & pasted a few from a BHX forum.

I did notice when checking the individual route analysis BHX-BFS figure was missing, as it was in the June provisional figures.

Perhaps I should have kept the figures to LUT & BHX on this thread, as the only point I was trying to make was the speed at which the two airports are going - in different directions!

Pete

[LTNman]

Luton has also now overtaken Birmingham, Glasgow and Edinburgh on year on year figures and is now in 5th place.

Carrying on the thread about how Luton has overtaken Birmingham here are the figures over the last 10 years .

July 1997 2,933,000 5,614,000
July 1998 3,661,000 6,307,000
July 1999 4,798,000 6,819,000
July 2000 5,835,000 7,210,000
July 2001 6,462,000 7,736,000
July 2002 6,396,000 7,628,000
July 2003 6,731,000 8,543,000
July 2004 7,026,000 8,997,000
July 2005 8,619,000 8,964,000
July 2006 9,353,390 9,245,072

Birmingham up 64% over a 10 year period while Luton is up 219% which is a growth rate nearly 4 times higher than Birmingham.

[ebenezer]

Luton has also now overtaken Birmingham, Glasgow and Edinburgh on year-on-year figures and is now in 5th place.
Birmingham up 64% over a 10 year period while Luton is up 219% which is a growth rate nearly 4 times higher than Birmingham.

And if the comparative 'running' costs are examined, it's clear that LTN is around twice as efficient and therefore, cost-effective as BHX. It's only the continuing drain of Luton Borough Council taking its slice of the action (in return for doing absolutely nothing constructive or helpful :ugh::* :uhoh: ) that makes LTN less profitable for the airport operator.

BHX has about 10000 transit pax to add

This is one aspect where LTN - as opposed to for example, BHX, LHR, LGW, MAN, SOU and even to a limited extent STN - misses out and probably explains why so many airline operators have failed to make a go of it at LTN: with virtually no interlining, almost all pax using LTN are originating or terminating and so the pax figures for LTN are actually, even more impressive.

It would be interesting to compare the top six or seven UK airports' pax figures with the transit pax taken out of the monthly/annual totals.

ACDL really is to be congratulated. :D :ok: :)

[LTNman]

This is one aspect where LTN - as opposed to for example, BHX, LHR, LGW, MAN, SOU and even to a limited extent STN - misses out and probably explains why so many airline operators have failed to make a go of it at LTN: with virtually no interlining, almost all pax using LTN are originating or terminating and so the pax figures for LTN are actually, even more impressive.
It would be interesting to compare the top six or seven UK airports' pax figures with the transit pax taken out of the monthly/annual totals.
ACDL really is to be congratulated. :D :ok: :)

Looking at the May figures http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport_data/200605/Table_02_2_Summary_Of_Activity_at_UK_Airports.pdf which shows the latest transit passengers Luton is ahead of Stansted but Inverness has more scheduled transit passengers than Gatwick, Stansted and Luton combined.

What the figures don’t show are the passengers who collect their luggage who then check-in for another flight

[CAP493]

Luton is ahead of Stansted
That's interesting. It'd be revealing to know which airlines these interlining passengers are using as presumably, it isn't easyJet or Ryanair (or Wizz or Monarch Scheduled).
Luton Borough Counc...in return for doing absolutely nothing constructive or helpfu
This is an understatement! LBC has effectively scuppered Project 2030, and seems only to be interested in trying to squeeze a 'quart into a pint pot' by encouraging development of the existing cramped site. Quite how LBC envisages such an expanded airport efficiently processing 20 million annual passengers and the associated ground activity, goodness knows. The problem is that its officials appear neither commercially-minded nor aviation specialists and so are seemingly quite unable to grasp the concept of what's actually needed to move Luton into League Division 1.

A well-placed source has indicated that ACDL's Spanish management is beginning to get frustrated with the Council's approach and that the break clause in the Concession agreement in 2015 could see ACDL simply walking away before the increased business that it's struggled to generate is lost almost overnight, to the likes of an expanded Stansted.

Alas, it seems that only then - and too late - will LBC perhaps wake up to the realities of running an international airport in an aggressively commercial airport environment.:{

[LTNman]

That's interesting. It'd be revealing to know which airlines these interlining passengers are using as presumably, it isn't easyJet or Ryanair (or Wizz or Monarch Scheduled).
{

Could this figure include aircraft that have called in to pick up or drop off passengers while keeping the remainder on board. I think Wizz has done this on route to Liverpool.

[Pain in the R's]

Thought I better check the airport out today as we are flying tomorrow and have a diabetic son.

The drop off area is closed with all traffic being directed to the short-term car park where the first half hour is now free. As the machines still charge for the first half hour a person has been put on the entrance barrier to pass on this information and to tell drivers not to put the ticket into the pay station. There are three entrance barriers but only one person so the other two are closed off but this single person can only process 5 cars a minute. I know this for a fact as I was sad enough to get my watch out. This explains why it took so long to get into the airport at lunchtime.

Easyjet passengers have to queue outside, as they have to be processed first in a marquee in the drop off area before they are allowed into the terminal to join another queue at check-in.

Once checked in all passengers have to have the contents of their plastic bags examined at the bottom of the stairs before they can head upstairs to security. One woman had to throw away a clear see-through glass case. I asked one of the members of staff who were checking bags whether I could take a couple of digestive biscuit airside as they are needed as emergency food for my diabetic son. No was the answer. So there you are, I have established that terrorists can make a bomb out of a digestive biscuit. :confused: :eek:

As a side note M&S store was all but empty while the World News shop was empty with no one at the check out.

[ebenezer]

As a side note M&S store was all but empty while the World News shop was empty with no one at the check out.
Hardly surprising if you can't take most of the items to be purchased, with you on the flight. These restrictions must also be playing absolute havoc with duty free sales at LTN and elsewhwere (except Singapore and some other enlightened locations where I believe [sensibly...] you buy pre-ordered duty free goods on arrival). If the disruption continues beyond the end of August some permanent commercial damage will undoubtedly be done to the industry, which will no doubt please the environmentalists and NIMBYs. Still, the alternative is too frightful to contemplate.

[Buster the Bear]

Without a huge slice of retail income, the airports will have to re-model their business plans. Car parking, landing fees, parking charges will all have to rise massively should the current security restrictions remain in place long term!

Certainly the threatened terrorist attack was twarted, but the damage, thankfully not to human life, will remain within the airline industry for some time to come.

[LTNman]

These restrictions must also be playing absolute havoc with duty free sales at LTN and elsewhwere .


Shouldn't make a difference as once airside you can shop until you drop. In fact they will make more money as passengers can't take food with them until bought airside.

[PAXboy]

For LTN = Yes. But NOT the case for any sectors from the UK to the USA.

[cheesycol]

Hi,

Flew into Luton yesterday morning, 14th, at 0100L and there was an MEA A320 parked at the terminal. Can anybody shed any light? I believe that they are currently operating out of Damascus and that they usually operate into Heathrow?

Thanks for any info :ok:

[pabely]

As reported in the press today, Thomsonfly will receive 3 new 737-800 next year and Silverjet have entered into a letter of intent to secure two of Thomsonfly's Boeing 767-200 aircraft no later than March and October 2007.

[Cahlibahn]

The MEA bus is subbed to EasyJet. Part of their efforts to overcome crew shortage.

[egnxema]

Can I just getthis clear in my head then.

I fully understand what I am not able to take through the security area.

When I am in the Departure Lounge, am I able to buy a litre of Gin - Duty Free; a paper and a bottle of Sprite to drink on board?

:confused:

[jetsetwilly]

The MEA was a 321 operating a LIS-LTN sector. It then pos back to CDG.

JSW.

[Buster the Bear]

Any update on the proposed increase in cargo operations from Luton rumoured last spring?

[Powerjet1]

See yet again, easy have cancelled four of their nine scheduled departures, that were due to leave between 0600 - 0640 today. Staff shortages, sorry "operational reasons" no doubt!!!

[CAP493]

Any update on the proposed increase in cargo operations from Luton rumoured last spring?
Currently, commercially sensitive information but you won't be disappointed, and you won't need to burn the midnight oil to get photos...
:ok: ;) :ok:;) :ok: ;)

[Daft bat]

Spoke to some blokes measuring the building and asked what they were doing they said they were surveying the building for Harrods.
Looks like Harrods have have a new base, I wonder if this is in addition to their existing building ?

[Buster the Bear]

Any truth in the rumour that the airport TBI/ACDL have asked ex staff inc those that have retired to return back to work in order to organise the check in queues within the tinminal? £6.50 per hour was mentioned?

I thought the Copper Chopper hangar days are now numbered? Is it not to be demolished?

[Powerjet1]

Spoke to some blokes measuring the building and asked what they were doing they said they were surveying the building for Harrods.

Looks like Harrods have have a new base, I wonder if this is in addition to their existing building ?
Could this be in any way related to the proposed start of services of Silverjet, at the end of the year. They are supposed to be utilising the executive facilities of Harrods for their pax, so there may be some connection.

[ebenezer]

I thought the Copper Chopper hangar days are now numbered? Is it not to be demolished?Looks like Harrods have have a new base, I wonder if this is in addition to their existing building ?
Demolished? Dunno! But the cunning plan (when the Police and Eagle Flight Training have left which will be by the end of the year) is to bring the level of the area outside this hangar to the same level as the existing Cargo Apron.

Then to extend part of the existing Cargo Apron northeastwards to create four additional narrow-body (or two wide-body) stands. (The northerly part of this area will have 'noise bunds' built.)

Harrods will move from the existing South Apron and 'terminal' to a new purpose-built exec terminal located near to their two hangars and will also then use part of the current Cargo Apron and the Stand 62 area (which might also be expanded).

Silverjet will operate from either the South Apron stands or Stand 16L with the pax being bussed to/from their aircraft (no doubt using newly-acquired limo-style executive buses with black reflective window glass, air cons, satellite TV and an on-board bar. They're also expecting to acquire some 767 aircraft steps that have built-in canopies.) :cool: :cool:

Absolutely no mixing it with the 'great unwashed' then (except on Luton's 1950s-style internal road system that leads down towards the Cargo Apron)

:hmm: :hmm: :rolleyes:

[andyafc]

Buster you are correct, even getting staff from management offices helping out to speed up the search process, aswell as securicor staff

[Buster the Bear]

Anyone here remember this view? I think that is Luton Relic in the hat, he hasn't changed much over the years!

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/734/mh7lu1.jpg

[eggw relic]

I can honestly say that it is not me me in the hat, or one of the schoolboys although it could be vintage atco

[22/04]

I think the guy in the hat may actually be Harry King, who used to vist each Saturday in 1968 or so ( as I did). I guess the picture is from about then or a year or so later, with the AEL hangar clearly visible.

I don't think hye'll still be aound now. RIP

Mods please remove if I've borken any rules. Harry wouldn't mind though

[Buster the Bear]

DRIVERS BEWARE!


http://www.uk-airport-news.info/luton-airport-news-250806.htm

[Charlie Roy]

A Malta connection seems ever more likely after it was confirmed today that both Ryanair and Easyjet have officially signalled an interest to operate the route. The offers came in response to a call for proposals from the Maltese government to low cost airlines to operate unserved routes deemed important to the Matese economy.

http://www.maltamedia.com/news/2005/tt/article_11265.shtml
"Ryanair offered to operate to Malta from Pisa, Dublin and Luton while Easyjet Airlines Co. Ltd. offered to operate from Luton and Mulhouse-Basel."

Easyjet seem to have gotten a head start, having sent a delegation team to Malta earlier this week. They have been meeting with various top politicans and authorities. :suspect:
Ryanair on the other hand were keeping their cards close to their chest, and had signalled no intention to reply to the call for proposals (in fact a few months ago they said they were sick and tired of trying to negotiate with Malta and had given up). Then today, just hours before the deadline, Ryanair submitted it's reply to the call for proposals :cool:

Interesting to see what will come of all this... Eitherway a Luton to Malta service this time next year won't be a surprise to anybody.

[Buster the Bear]

Many years ago when Monarch introduced their Crown service, Malta was either flown for a while of was actively being considered. We are talking late 1980's though.

[BIZBOY]

Have just read the following in the September edition of "Australian Aviation"

Officials of both the UK and Australian Governments have signed an agreement to allow additional flights between the two countries.

It states "The current limit will be lifted paving the way for additional services to alternative UK airports such as Gatwick ,Manchester and Luton,from Brisbane ,Adelaide and Perth"

So any ideas why Luton is mentioned?.Is it just a fall back to the good old days of Brits 767s charters to Perth for "Austravel" or could it be a proposed Silverjet destination?

Anyway ,it is nice to hear that Luton is mentioned down this neck of the woods!!:confused:

[Buster the Bear]

Why was Luton mentioned.....very easy that one. Austravel launched low cost flights in the 1990's from Luton to Australia and New Zealand, so I guess that is why it is being spoken about?

Britannia B767 flew from Luton via tech stops in the Gulf and Singapore. Fares were at launch, massively cheaper than the 'flag carriers'.

Britannia were never really focused from Luton during the 1990's. A decline set in as the B737-200 fleet was replaced by B757's, the routes to Oz moved eventually to Gatwick, then stopped once general fares dropped and Britannia could earn more cash during the winter form the Hajj.

Amazing to think that TUI are now based just down the road!


Malta: http://www.independent.com.mt/news.asp?newsitemid=37853

EDIT: Both easyJet and Ryanair were given landing slots into Malta. Both airlines refused to fly there citing the landing/handling fees. Maltese Govt then went back to both airlines with realistic fees allegedly, rumour has it etc!

[LTNman]

So has the passenger drop off zone been permanently moved to the short-term car park on the grounds of security? Is security the real reason now or has the airport got a hidden agenda seeing that the only vehicles allowed into the drop off area are the towns taxis whose drivers would all be picked out if passenger profiling was introduced.

The move to the short term car park was previously attempted around 2 years ago by the airport authority but they had to abandon it after only a few days when the great travelling public started to use the roundabout as an unofficial drop off and pick up area.

This time things are a bit different, more manpower is being used to directed traffic, part of the short term car park has been resurfaced with the wooden posts used to segregate the old car hire area being removed to open up the dead end routes. The cost of the extra manpower would be offset by a considerable amount by cars parking for more than 15 minutes as they wait for passengers.

[Buster the Bear]

Putting two and two together. Local rag has a large advert for Ramp Agents. Are DHL increasing their presence at Luton I wonder as the ad was placed by them?

[pabely]

A Malta connection seems ever more likely after it was confirmed today that both Ryanair and Easyjet have officially signalled an interest to operate the route. The offers came in response to a call for proposals from the Maltese government to low cost airlines to operate unserved routes deemed important to the Matese economy.

http://www.maltamedia.com/news/2005/tt/article_11265.shtml
"Ryanair offered to operate to Malta from Pisa, Dublin and Luton while Easyjet Airlines Co. Ltd. offered to operate from Luton and Mulhouse-Basel."

Easyjet seem to have gotten a head start, having sent a delegation team to Malta earlier this week. They have been meeting with various top politicans and authorities. :suspect:
Ryanair on the other hand were keeping their cards close to their chest, and had signalled no intention to reply to the call for proposals (in fact a few months ago they said they were sick and tired of trying to negotiate with Malta and had given up). Then today, just hours before the deadline, Ryanair submitted it's reply to the call for proposals :cool:

Interesting to see what will come of all this... Eitherway a Luton to Malta service this time next year won't be a surprise to anybody.

As reported in Maltese Press today - within 9 weeks!
http://www.di-ve.com/dive/portal/portal.jhtml?id=246194&pid=1

[Powerjet1]

pabely

From the ryan news section of their website........
News Release
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RYANAIR PROPOSES NEW ROUTES FOR MALTA
Ryanair, today (30th August) confirmed that it had submitted proposals to the Maltese Government to fly three new routes to Malta International Airport from London Luton, Pisa and Dublin. The proposal is a response to the Maltese Government’s call to low cost airlines for offers to fly routes to the Mediterranean island.
Ryanair’s plan is to launch, on a year round basis, a daily service from London Luton starting on 31st October 2006, a three times weekly service from Pisa starting on 31st October 2006 and a three times weekly service from Dublin starting on 9th February 2007.
Announcing the proposals at a press conference in Malta today, Ryanair’s Deputy Chief Executive, Michael Cawley, said:
“Ryanair is very pleased to respond to the call by the Maltese Government to start routes to and from Malta International Airport. We have been encouraging the Maltese Government to promote the advent of low cost airlines as a solution to the declining tourism industry. The provision of a long-term, low cost regime at MIA is crucial to the success of low fares airlines and we welcome the initiatives by the Government to effectively reduce this cost over the long term. We believe this proposal is the start of a new era for Maltese tourism. The decline, which has been evident in their visitor numbers for some time, will now reverse and that success can be built upon with more growth which Ryanair is quite prepared to provide to Malta from its various bases throughout Europe in the coming years.
We commend the Maltese Government for this initiative and look forward to working with them in the future”.

[Buster the Bear]

In order to operate the Malta flight, what route or routes would Ryanair axe?

easyJet seem very keen to fly this route as well :eek: :eek:

[LTNman]

old news but coming soon

October 31st

Malta
Fez

November 1st

Marrakesh

[CAP493]

Putting two and two together. Local rag has a large advert for Ramp Agents. Are DHL increasing their presence at Luton I wonder as the ad was placed by them?
Well....some time ago, you heard it here first!

Various snipets being overheard: a 'significant' increase in cargo business - a lucrative new sub-contract for a 'major national carrier' - a large proportion of flights will be daytime and NOT at night - a/c will be A300s + B757s - Cargo Apron will be extended and re-vamped - timing is from late October onwards.

:ok: :ok: ;) ;)

[kala87]

The photo posted a few days ago certainly brings back memories. I think the young fellow standing on the left side of the bench is my good self. That viewing area was almost my second home from 1966 to 1969. Vintage ATCO was another regular there, and we had many a lively debate/argument on all kind of things to do with aviation. I used to ride up to the airport on a vintage green bike with my VHF radio in the saddlebag. The photo looks like 1968 or 1969, couldn't be before 1968 as Monarch's first Britannia's only arrived in that year (2 of them). You needed to be patient in those days with long gaps between any movements for much of the day. Maybe we're waiting for the Sudflug DC7C to arrive on a Monday afternoon (or was that 1967?) Happy days, life was certainly simpler then.

[CAP493]

Vintage ATCO was another regular there, and we had many a lively debate/argument on all kind of things to do with aviation.
Surely not? VA would have been in long trousers by then, probably gainfully employed and so paid to be there...!!
You say that there were 'long gaps between movements' - so when did Court Line start at Luton (thought it was about 1970)??:confused: :confused:

[22/04]

IIRC Sudflug DC 7s were Sunday afternoons in 1967. Yes there were long gaps until at least 1970- in '68 after the morning rush of 3 BY Britannias, 1 Monarch Britannia, three Autair One Elevens and an Ambassador/748/Healrd or two, and a couple of Dan Air One Elevens (all over by 09.30) there was little except a BY Britannia to Rimini (12.20) until they all started coming back (OM Brit at 12.30, but most after 13.30, (Bits took 7 hours to go to PMI and back), except for the odd Midland Viscount or two. We had to amuse ourselves with antics of Cessna 150s of LFC on the grass.

The airport got busier in 1970 with Cout Line, but wasn't really busy until they had grown ( '72/'73).

As was said earlier, happy days!

[22/04]

Oops! delete the Dan One elevens, they didn't come until 1969

[Buster the Bear]

Sudflug, just a bit before my time!

http://www.williamdemarest.com/images/German%20Charter/sudflug-dc7-1.jpg

[vintage ATCO]

The photo must be around 1968/69 and, yes, I was in the gainful employment of the Borough of Luton so not me in the picture. I certainly remember it though.

[ebenezer]

Cargo Apron will be extended and re-vamped
For once, LTN appears to be in danger of being overwhelmed with new business. Harrods are desperate to increase their handling & parking capacity, and LLAO's original intent was to allocate virtually all of the Cargo Apron to Harrods, relocating their operation there with a new purpose-built 'corporate aviation terminal'. Then came the renewed and significant interest from various trucking companies that's now going to lead to a resurgence of LTN's cargo business (although not on the scale of the early to mid 1980's). With Harrod's having signed up to handle Silverjet for example, the pressure is 'on' for LLAO to deliver - and it also needs the South Apron stands back for use from April '07 onwards because of additional routes and therefore, more overnight aircraft parking.

Against this background, LLAO continues to negotiate with Luton Borough Council over the Concession and how to pay for the further development needed on the existing airport site, now that the Council has effectively killed-off Project 2030 by withdrawing its support.

The Council apparently is doing what it's always done - procrastinating, dithering and delaying.

:ugh: :ugh:

[Powerjet1]

Against this background, LLAO continues to negotiate with Luton Borough Council over the Concession and how to pay for the further development needed on the existing airport site, now that the Council has effectively killed-off Project 2030 by withdrawing its support.
In other words, very little is likely to happen. There just isn't the space for any major expansion within the existing airport boundary and with the ongoing argument re an extension to the Concession Agreement to our "Spanish friends(ACDL)", further substantial invesment may be hard to come by. Well done LBC, yet another c**k up.

[King Pong]

The truth is that the road network in the central area is already above capacity for parts of the day and I can’t see what they can really do about it. Before the closing of the drop off area traffic would queue beyond the Ibis and down the hill. Now that all traffic is directed to the short-term car park nothing has changed despite the car park having three entrance barriers. Lets not forget that the current arrangements are what the airport tried to implement around 18 months ago as a solution to traffic congestion and it is clear that it isn’t working despite the extra manpower used in directing traffic.

At the moment traffic flows into the airport are regulated by the constraint of the single lane road from where the existing dual carriageway ends from the motorway. This bottleneck will end next year allowing a doubling of traffic rates to reach the airport. If you think that the traffic is bad this year just wait to next year.

[ebenezer]

Well done LBC, yet another c**k up.
I fear that you're probably right. Already it appears that ACDL is starting to flag up the 'break clause' that's in the Concession Agreement in 2015, and the fact that without a 20-year extension to the term (which would make it 50 years in total) there's no business case for investing a significant amount of extra cash in the existing site (unless of course, the Council chooses to spend some money on what's in reality, its own real estate :hmm: :rolleyes: :ugh: :ugh:). The most likely scenario is therefore, little or no further development at Luton followed by a gradual decline in business which, if Stansted eventually gets its second runway and enlarged terminal capacity, will migrate en-mass to Essex within eight or-so years (as did Ryanair and TNT before).

The Town Hall erks at Luton will then be left with a crumbling, rapidly becoming out-of-date edifice that'll be an ever-present memorial to their complete lack of foresight, planning and understanding of the business of commercial aviation.

In other words, a re-run of the Luton situation in 1980s and early 1990s.

:{ :{ :{ :mad:

[CAP493]

...little or no further development at Luton followed by a gradual decline in business......Luton will then be left with a crumbling, rapidly becoming out-of-date edifice
This is very depressing and makes one feel sorry for the many employees of LLAO and other companies at LTN who desperately try to stay motivated and upbeat about working at LTN and about it's future, and who daily make great efforts to give the best service possible to LTN's passengers, airlines and aircraft operators. And if the scenario proves correct, the 'rot' will set in long before 2015 as good quality staff leave or cannot be recruited and those that are left are 'trapped' for domestic & personal reasons and so become thoroughly depressed and de-motivated.:{

[Buster the Bear]

The government of Malta are meeting today to ratify, or otherwise, incentives for low cost airlines. This could mean an official launch of the Ryanair service proposed last week?

From the press: The government had offered incentives and support schemes totalling Lm1 million in a bid to get airlines to fly to underserved destinations and boost tourism in the winter months. Both Ryanair and Easyjet had submitted proposals.

[Charlie Roy]

http://www.maltamedia.com/news/2005/tt/article_11393.shtml

Minister for Tourism and Culture Francis Zammit Dimech announced that the government is accepting all bids submitted in response to the call for low cost carriers to operate new routes to Malta. ... the Minister said that Government was reacting in the fastest possible manner, conscious of the lead time required by the airlines to promote the flights.
... easyJet applied to start daily flights to Luton and five weekly flights to Mulhouse-Basel. Ryanair applied to start daily flights to Luton and three weekly flights to Pisa and Dublin. Ryanair have stated that they will increase the frequencies of the Pisa flight as demand picks up.

So what? BOTH Ryanair and Easyjet will operate daily flights to/from Luton?! :eek: Can't see that happening and if it does then it'll be one of the cheapest destinations around as both compagnies launch a war on winter sun fares :ouch:

[Buster the Bear]

The current debacle relating to the income generated via the passenger tax/charge and future further infrastructure investment is hardly surprising considering the nature of Town Hall politics. Believe me, the only interest a local politician has in the airport, it how much it will generate for the town until the next set of local elections! Looking beyond this requires in depth knowledge of the business, forward thinking and cool decision making. As I have said previously, something that appears to be lacking since the Town Hall turned a yellow orange!

Concession for a Peerage? A legacy from when the Town Hall was painted red? Income is a vote winner and something the No 10 rewards highly it would seem!.

Now here is a question and one that I cannot answer since I left the world of local politics: As the income generated by the airport grows, does LBC lose HM Govt subsidy proportionally? Or do the local politicians get to spend it all?

Look on the bright side, LBC may be left with the biggest and busiest Biz Jet airport outside of the USA when the concession expires, but not generating much in the way of concession tax from the few passengers using the dilapidated tinminal? Mr Franks and his cronies will by then, be assigned to names on the Roll of Honour plaque within the Town Hall lobby?

Based upon my comments above, if you were a local politician sitting down to perhaps re-examine the concession, would you be focused on getting the best deal for Luton folk in the long term, or be more focus on getting re-elected and spending the £millions now? I am in no way blaming the elected council, just demonstrating the driving force of local politics. I am assured that local politics in Spain is even worse so ACDL must have experience dealing with 'the system'?

So where does that leave the airport..........as old father bear once said..."BILMEY I don't have a clue"!

Are the Spanish renowned for their brinkmanship.....I wonder?

[Buster the Bear]

Malta :ok:

http://www.independent.com.mt/news.asp?newsitemid=38259

[toledoashley]

Looks like we are going to have no problem with flights to Malta!

[vintage ATCO]

We should boycott Malta . . . .

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From RSPB. Just thought I'd throw this into the pot. I wouldn't dream of imposing my views on others (oh, I just have :)) but I would never go there.

[LTNman]

Just heard that there was a ground collision at Luton tonight. Fact or fiction? Couple of aircraft called PANs due to low fuel as the runway was closed. One of those PAN’s was an easyjet that made an approach on low fire cover. The approach was then broken off as instructed by ATC and the easyjet went to Stansted as did a Ryanair.

Update: Now hearing that it was a smoking easyjet but I am still short on facts

[Buster the Bear]

I am making an educated guess that the runway was not 'closed' more like the airport fire service attended a 'ground incident' so the available fire cover was depleted/insufficient for aircraft larger than a certain size to land?

[Charlie Roy]

The local representative of EasyJet could not be contacted as he is currently abroad.
Sources close to the industry have, however cast doubts on whether the Luton-based airline will actually start its operations since Ryanair has confirmed it will also be flying to Malta. While Ryanair's deputy chief executive Michael Cawley said his airline did not fear competition, EasyJet has remained conspicuously absent from the debate. Sources said that EasyJet applied to start operations next April or May.


http://www.timesofmalta.com/core/article.php?id=236002

Ryanair's quick action may frighten Easyjet off the Luton route. It would mean Easyjet would need to go into competition with Ryanair on a route where Ryanair have already gotten a head start over Easyjet...

Which brings us back to Buster's question: what Luton routes will Ryanair axe/reduce to introduce Malta? It's going to be daily, and is quite a long sector! We'll find out soon enough I suppose...
I could imagine reductions in Reus and maybe even poor Knock :(

[OLNEY 1 BRAVO]

Buster - you are correct. I believe the Fire Cover was reduced to Category 2.

[gilesdavies]

http://www.timesofmalta.com/core/article.php?id=236002
Ryanair's quick action may frighten Easyjet off the Luton route. It would mean Easyjet would need to go into competition with Ryanair on a route where Ryanair have already gotten a head start over Easyjet...
Which brings us back to Buster's question: what Luton routes will Ryanair axe/reduce to introduce Malta? It's going to be daily, and is quite a long sector! We'll find out soon enough I suppose...
I could imagine reductions in Reus and maybe even poor Knock :(
Lets think positive!!!
You never know they might base a 5th 737-800 at the airport and see a whole load of new routes appear.
Well I can dream... ;)

[ClearLand08]

Taking a look at the Ryanair timetable for Nov-06, it looks like there is already spare capacity in the schedule for Malta - leaving LTN at around 16:20, which would put it back to LTN at some time around 23:30. It would be the same airframe that does the Nimes and early Milan-Bergamo sectors.

[LUCEYMURRAY]

Have just returned fron newquay today thurs 07/09 via Air Arann
just 19 on flight ,went out on monday only 22 on flight very low loads any body no if this is the norm if so do not see this returing next summer?(flights not in air arann's winter timetable) may be if it went 5 days a week 2 flights a day to catch the biz travellers.??:ok:

[Buster the Bear]

I am making an educated guess that the Newquay service was only introduced after Air Wales closed up shop causing Arann to change their immediate expansion plans from Luton, preferring to pick up established routes from Cardiff.

Arann were rumoured to have grander plans for Luton this summer which were curtailed somewhat. The Newquay route is a bit of a 'gap filler', only released for sale a few weeks ago. Not surprising that loads are a bit 'thin'. What you have you remember is the yield though, full planes don't always mean high yields or profit.

[CAP493]

Just heard that there was a ground collision at Luton tonight. Fact or fiction?
100% fiction!

A 737 after landing had an overheating undercarriage + hydraulic leak. Airport Fire Service deployed in accordance with standard emergency procedures. The Fire Service Category was temporarily reduced to 'Nil' whilst the incident was being dealt with and so only aircraft able to use an 'unlicensed' airfield could land. There were none, and some diverted into Stansted (which had been temporarily closed itself shortly before, for emergency runway repairs [two/three aircraft diverted into Luton as a result]). As Buster says, the Luton runway was NOT "closed" neither was the Airport.

All in a routine day's work!

:ok:

[LTNman]

Quote:
Just heard that there was a ground collision at Luton tonight. Fact or fiction?

100% fiction!

The Fire Service Category was temporarily reduced to 'Nil' whilst the incident was being dealt with and so only aircraft able to use an 'unlicensed' airfield could land.

Thanks, but was it fact or fiction that an Easyjet with low fuel and who had called a PAN still made an approach with low or no fire cover?

[Pain in the R's]

The roads works on the M1 that are also now on the airport approach road are doing my head in. It took me nearly an hour to travel from the airport to junction 9. I wonder if this is having any sort of effect on executive jet movements as passengers look for a better way into London?

I also see that there have been nighttime closures of the southbound carriageway with only a single lane open for southbound traffic on the northbound carriageway. I wonder how many passengers have been caught up in these traffic queues only to find that not only can’t they leave the motorway at the airport’s junction 10 exit they also can’t leave at junction 9 either. The diversion takes them to junction 8 where they have to travel half a mile on the slip road at Hemel Hempstead before they can turn around and start heading north again. Just to add to their misery if they are now late is the 40 mph speed limit. I guess the diversion route is around 20 miles!!!

[CAP493]

...was it fact or fiction that an Easyjet with low fuel and who had called a PAN still made an approach with low or no fire cover?
Dunno - but it's down to the Captain and the company's procedures so it's quite possible, if the Captain determined there was a greater risk in diverting and easyJet's SOPs permit this.

Many years ago, in Dubai, during a major incident with no fire cover, two BA 747's landed using "Captain's discretion" yet an Iraqi Airways Trident, a KLM 747 and a MEA Boeing 720 (yes it was that long ago...) declined and diverted to (I think) Sharjah.

[Buster the Bear]

Iraqi Airways Trident........BLIMEY, one of Hatfield's finest!

Road situation surrounding Luton is awful at times. Two major road improvement schemes running concurrently is not ideal at all. Think however, of the benefits to access in a couple of years time?

If you allow a bit of 'extra' time and avoid the 'rush hours', then access to Luton airport is not too problematical, certainly no worse than when access to Stansted was being upgraded a few years back?

As a slight 'aside', whilst in Milton Keynes today, I saw a 'raspberry ripple' Andover fly above me at around 2000ft. What a rare aircraft and the sound of the Dart engines was awesome! Busterette (aged 2 and a bit) was just excited as her Daddy, claiming that it was a "WizzJet"! She did however get two right this evening as they positioned for 08 over our Bear Palace! Sadly neither were Dart powered. If only the Spectators Area was still open, I could then educate her properly, just like my Dad did back in July 1969. I have never been the same since!

[22/04]

Buster take her to Dane End. A great place to watch Luton hapeenings since my first visit on 05/04/68

[CAP493]

...as they positioned for 08 over our Bear Palace!
Eh? So have you now extended your bear territory west of the Cheddington - Tring (West Coast Main) railway line....??

:hmm: ;)

[PAXboy]

I had not been through the airport for ten weeks or so, until this Thursday for my regular BA to IOM.

Previously, when I wanted to book on-line for the mid-term, the system told me "You cannot book for today". This Wednesday it told me "You cannot book for tommorrow". I'm sure that they DO want me to book, I just haven't found the secret door yet.

The new entrance to the mid-term park is good but cannot understand the removal of the bus stop from the turning circle.

It is reassuring to see that the new EZY building is going to look as ugly and $hite as all the other new buildings.

The security was reasonable for speed but I noticed that the fast track is to have a wheelchair from the airport with a pusher. Those that had their own wheelchair and pusher were not allowed to queue jump. So, having a person that has to complete the job quickly is useful.

They did not question the trouser belt that LHR demanded I remove but decided that the cameras (analogue 35mm + mini DV video) had to be inspected and 'sniffed'. But staff all seemed reasonable and polite.


I am not expecting the baggage handling to be quick on Monday morning. :*

[Powerjet1]

Taking a look at the Ryanair timetable for Nov-06, it looks like there is already spare capacity in the schedule for Malta - leaving LTN at around 16:20, which would put it back to LTN at some time around 23:30. It would be the same airframe that does the Nimes and early Milan-Bergamo sectors.
Booking engine shows 16.40 ex LTN to MLA, arriving back into LTN at 23.45 so looks as if you are right. Saturday flight seems to be a couple of hours earlier.

[Buster the Bear]

Nowhere near Bucks, our bear palace is positioned to gain maximum exposure to all the noise Leighton Buzzard residents successfully campaigned against. What I can confirm is that there is no actual noise, only an occasional whistle as a Wizzjet passes above. No getting jealous Mr 1 BRAVO!

Some of the 'anti noise' brigade are welcome to spend an afternoon in my garden and experience the reality of a 'new' route into Luton.

What I can confirm is that reality is FAR from the truth, well the truth that the anti Luton brigade would have you believe! The tractor in a neighbouring field makes more noise, maybe I should have the local harvest banned!

The last time I went to Dane End, the area was littered with used cond***s....YUK! Was always known as Lovers Lane and for good reason!

[King Pong]

There is no sign of the easyjet crew shortage that is having a detrimental effect on Luton’s passenger figures coming to an end. From 7:00 up until 15:00 there are 10 cancellations including the first departures and arrivals of the day to Edinburgh and Belfast. Popular with the business traveller they have no doubt cancelled their evening flights home assuming that they are actually running. Belfast’s mid afternoon flights have also been cancelled.

My sister-in–law who makes the travel arrangements for her company has now abandoned easyjet and Luton after having two consecutive bookings from Aberdeen cancelled.

[egnxema]

Well Done your sister in law!!

It is about time more started to dump easyJet - they appear to be acting blindly to the damage they are inflicting on their customer base.

Business fliers are the biggest source of repeat business!!

For crying out loud easyJet - WAKE UP to the the self inflicted problems you have and are so incompitently dealing with!!

I also have switched away from easyJet for flights to Spain since being cancelled on at check-in - of course they claim I am not entitled to EU Compensation - but I have had to write 4 letters and make 5 phone calls to "Customer Services" to even get my hotel/taxi/food refunded.

The refund is at today's EUR exchange rate - even though I provided all the receipts and asked for the GBP equivalent I actually paid.

The sums of money are obviously not vast - but the principle is that easyJet do not give a **** about whether of not you ever fly with them again - what blind blind arrogant policy!

I remember writing one comment letter to Gofly, not even a strong complaint - and they sent me a £20 voucher off a future flight! Now THAT is how to run a Customer Service department - It does not matter what mistake a company makes - it is how they recover from it that is important.

sorry - I am ranting again...............

[Daft bat]

I also agree I went to Spain last year with Monarch who were the same price as Easy jet however I could prebook my seat. By doing this I could relax and have a cup of coffee in Lutons excellent departure area and not have to stand in the Queue and get involved in a dangerous pushing shoving match for a good seat. Luton should change this condition and make airline allocate seating at a minimum when you first check in at the Airport for passenger safety.:ok:

[Buster the Bear]

Anyone know of a good roofer? I will explain, my sis-in-law is a bit daft, but she claims that departures have been either overflying her house or have been flying straight ahead on departure from 26, both yesterday evening and this morning. She lives 0.5nm North of a 1.0nm final for 08.

Apart from weather avoidance, I cannot answer her question. Living as she does so close to the climb out, any deviation on departure would be instantly noticeable.

Anyway, tiles have fallen from her roof as a result of this and she is not happy! Is she going barmy?

Well if you see someone from airport management with roof tiles shoved 'where the sun don't shine' you will know why:eek: !

[vintage ATCO]

my sis-in-law is a bit daft,

You said it . . . . :E

Can't speak for yesterday but no departure deviated from SID in the three sessions I did this morning. It was very busy and we were firing them off every two minutes or so but all the deps I saw flew the NPR.

The weather was unusual in that we had bright sun through low cloud, and then it thickened up and the low cloud stayed until late morning. I'm surprised you sis-in-law saw any aircraft as they were disappearing into clag at 300-500ft.

Wasn't some dodgy roofer you recommended, was it? :}

[Buster the Bear]

If you find a pile of roof tiles at the control tower gate, she has tried to get in!

Seriously, whatever caused it must have been noisier than normal. Last time she complained was when VR-CBQ almost did a 'touch and go' in her garden!

[Barnaby the Bear]

Her garden must be nearly as big as my cave! :}

[pabely]

Her garden must be nearly as big as my cave! :}

I think that's the public park next to the old Water Tower off Cutenhoe!! Wasn't at home that day so cannot coment as I must live around same area as Buster's sis-in-law.

[Buster the Bear]

Strathmore Road/Avenue.

VR-CBQ nearly became her garden shed. I know a lot more about that but..............

So no one can tell me why the tiles fell off her roof? Apparently a queue of Wizzjet passengers are lined up to under cut each other in order to replace them, and I am being serious!

If you turn up in Luton town centre at night during the weekend and hail a cab, the next car following will undercut the Asian driver that stops. Nice to see a market economy in full swing! Anyone actually ask if they are insured for the job though?

I mention Asian drivers only because they operate most, if not all cabs in Luton and the Poles are swiping their clients. My cab driver was polite, spoke English and assured me that there were no suicide Catholic Cabbies. Not my word, but his!

So I cannot state that a Dan-Air Comet departed, or a Trident 'went around'?

[Powerjet1]

Anyone know if there is any truth in the rumour that the upmarket(Farnborough based) charter operator, Citelynx, is going to base a ERJ135 at LTN, in the very near future ?

[Buster the Bear]

Thomson operating a twice weekly flight with a 767 to Bangladesh via the UAE during winter 2006-2007?

LTN to ZYL via AAN
WED 20:50 15:30 THU 762 TOM7847 weekly 15 23/11/2006-01/03/2007

SUN 20:50 15:30 MON 762 TOM7843 weekly 15 20/11/2006 26/02/2007


Summer 07: Prague 5 per week, Paphos and Corfu join the lo-cost schedule.

[Powerjet1]

Buster the Bear

Where did this info come from re the winter Luton-Bangladesh ops? Is it being run by a local agent or something.

Good news about Prague now going year round, although Paphos & Corfu seem to the same level as S06. More to come ?.

[TightSlot]

Bangladesh now non-ops - sorry!